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[zlatko]

I can't man.

Quit ducking me man. Embrace me!

 

[Dahbomb]

Made it to around half way through Act 2 Inferno. I think I can legitimately beat Act 2 with more patience and stamina but the fatigue is kicking in (still getting 1 shotted but I have learned patterns). The problem that as people have mentioned is that you just aren't getting good enough loot in Act 2 to survive in Act 2 legitimately. Over half of the stuff I have right now is from the AH and any upgrade for my equipment now is over a couple million easy. I can definitely farm a million gold but the upgrades are incremental at this point and the time it would take is really long.

The game has now forced my hand I have to go for Goblin/Treasure Chest run. I have the Road to Alcarnus unlocked so I can probably run that Goblin if needed although without much great MF/GF I don't know if I am even going to get some good stuff.

It's really crazy that you have to play through and farm Act 3 to get Act 2 gear. Even in Act 2 I am getting stuff that would barely get your past Act 1, nevermind Act 1 itself.

As fucking awful as the inflation, class balance, and Inferno are, I'm still very excited for the PvP mode in this game. Just looking through the spells for a Barbarian, I can already tell there are going to be way more useful skills I can choose (IE ANCIENT SPEAR).

Although I'm still not looking forward to bullshit DHs in PvP either. SURE WILL BE FUN FIGHTING THOSE 9 SECOND IMMUNE DHS WITH INSANE MOVEMENT SPEED

How is any class supposed to beat DH? Highest DPS in the game along with 10 seconds of invulnerability. I am most definitely under geared for Act 2 Inferno and I can cheese through most of it by spamming SS and Nether Tentacles on Sharpshooter with the help of Preparation and 2 of my items having +10 Discipline. I am pretty sure they at least have to nerf SS in PvP to where she can't attack during it.

 

[Riggs]

I can't man.

It'll be fun man, better then raging alone. Rage with us together.

 

[KKRT00]

I don't know how you guys farm this Act 2 goblin. The little piece of crap keeps running into other monsters, so I can't kill him in time...

He runs from You, so You can control where he will run and just clear mobs before engaging him.

 

[aliencowz7]

A well thought out and logical post which I sadly have to agree with, even though I liked being able to progress on my own in D2...

I'm still wondering how, especially once the RMAH goes live, blizzard will tackle things like ladder resets. A simple ladder reset, once some fixes (classes, farming spots etc.) have been tackled might already fix some problems, at least in the short term. However, once people start paying real money for items I'm not sure how agreeable they would be to ladder resets...

I don't think RMAH will have much influence on a ladder reset system. Casual players buying items off the RMAH will still have them on non ladder which will be more then enough for them and Hardcore players will either not buy RMAH items or use them to get a head up on each ladder race.

People already spent thousands of dollars on stuff like d2jsp each ladder reset trying to get up at the top of the rankings.

Some people may be unhappy but not enough to influence a decision on whether to do them or not i believe.

 

[Ketch]

Anyone else think it would be a neat idea if the NV stacks between four people in inferno were just stacked instead of being averaged? It could add more incentive to play with a group.

 

[Opiate]

As fucking awful as the inflation, class balance, and Inferno are, I'm still very excited for the PvP mode in this game. Just looking through the spells for a Barbarian, I can already tell there are going to be way more useful skills I can choose (IE ANCIENT SPEAR).

Although I'm still not looking forward to bullshit DHs in PvP either. SURE WILL BE FUN FIGHTING THOSE 9 SECOND IMMUNE DHS WITH INSANE MOVEMENT SPEED

How can I be immune for 9 seconds? I'm a demon hunter right now, and I don't know this trick.

 

[rCIZZLE]

We can't actually have a quantitative argument over D2JSP vs. Battle.net as a population, so I'm fine with discussing this point here, because it may be the crux of the issue.

Trading in D2 (and particularly on D2JSP) was something that super nerds took upon themselves. It fell distinctly outside of the core gameplay loop that was both enjoyable and effective. In D3, Blizzard have intrinsically linked this unnecessary (but for you, enjoyable) side activity directly into the gameplay loop.

You personally may enjoy playing the AH, and you may have loved D2JSP. But D2JSP wasn't necessary--as evidenced by the fact that within this thread a lot of people are claiming it had little impact on the community, or that you are exaggerating its impact. Nobody would make that same claim about the D3 AH.

You could play all of D2 on your own, or with your friends, and have an enjoyable time and be completely oblivious to D2JSP's existence. You could be effective. You could run Ubers. And it wasn't that different of an experience than running with D2JSP, or rather, it wasn't inherently unfun, which is how I would describe D3 without using the AH.

In the end, D2JSP was really just an excuse for everyone to arms race their bots for the most efficient returns over time. In D3, the same arms race will affect everyone playing and is already hurting the core experience, at least in my opinion. (See also, my Zimbabwe post.)


Or this.

I'm willing to bet most of those people who don't know what d2jsp is didn't play D2 much after release or at all. Those 200fcr FB sorcs weren't gearing themselves off drops and trade lobbies alone.

Have you ever been to the site? Sure, a lot of people there bot and it was founded for a bot however it evolved over several years to be a social hub for most of the community. Being able to turn all your stuff into the very stable FG was and is a lot nicer than being at the will of the devs/dupers/bots/etc. Several times I sold everything to quit D2 only to return and spend all that FG on new stuff. I didn't have to worry about logging in to make sure my characters were refreshed on their expire clock when I wasn't playing.

Like it or not, trading was the core experience that kept the game alive for so long. People loved trading all their shit for that 20fcr/2os skill circ with fuckloads of stats. D2 was all about trading and pvp and that's what D3 will need to have a similar lifespan. I honestly don't get all this "looting" shit that Blizzard and a lot of reviewers are clinging to.

If there's any doubt about this I'll said what I said earlier:

Topics: 56,120,320
Posts: 268,277,254

 

[Kenaras]

Do the following searches: level 60 shoulders with 150+ dex and 70+ vit. They run about 750k or more. If you change that to 150+ str and 70+ vit, they will run you about 4k. It's laughable how much more valuable dexterity items are than strength items.

Not exactly a fair comparison. Shoulders are allowed a higher strength suffix than other stat suffixes, so there will be vastly more high-strength shoulders on the market than high-dexterity or high-intelligence. (High dexterity suffixes are found on gloves and boots; high intellect on gloves and helms; high vitality on chest armor and pants.)

That said, strength-based gear is dirt cheap compared to dexterity-based or intellect-based.

 

[scy]

Because D2 is a good game, and Inferno is poorly balanced and tested beta content? Agreed.

Eh, I disagree that Inferno is all that ridiculous itself. Some classes getting that much farther than others and loopholes/exploits and other things, yes, but Inferno itself is a bit mild honestly. But I'm definitely in the minority on that.

But ... Diablo 2 didn't have progression issues because the difficulty wasn't there. There really was no progression as far as content was concerned. It was a race to the end to farm which a different design than Diablo 3.

 

[Dahbomb]

Anyone else think it would be a neat idea if the NV stacks between four people in inferno were just stacked instead of being averaged? It could add more incentive to play with a group.

15 x 20 = 300% MF/GF

I would be OK with this.

Eh, I disagree that Inferno is all that ridiculous itself. Some classes getting that much farther than others and loopholes/exploits and other things, yes, but Inferno itself is a bit mild honestly. But I'm definitely in the minority on that.

Inferno is nothing more than a gear check. You have the resistances, armor and DPS... Inferno becomes as easy as the other difficulties barring absurd Elite affixes specifically designed to beat a certain class. The problem is that the loot drop is pretty bad even with 5 stacks NV you can't get equipment good enough to beat the Act you are on. It's a race to get to the best farm spot in a future act to farm for the previous act and be glued to the AH.

 

[Artanisix]

How can I be immune for 9 seconds? I'm a demon hunter right now, and I don't know this trick.

Items with +max discipline. (Get at least ~45 total, not very difficult)
SS with Lingering Fog.
Preperation.

Sure I guess you have a .5 second opening after each SS, but if the game tooltip is to be believed, you're supposed to go invisible, which means in PvP I wouldn't be able to track where you're moving. Along with latency, that .5 seconds might as well not even exist.

And you can attack in SS.

I already do this with my DH to run chests in Keep Depths Lvl 1 without dying.

 

[Gaylord Sweetwood]

The linear gearing up process is a bad design decision IMO (and boring to boot). That's probably the worst offense of D3.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I'm probably really unlucky because I did around 10 butcher runs in the last days and did not get anything that would be sellable on the AH, only some gold - and not a lot since I can't compromise on survivability for gf/mf without being a gigantic liability to a group. In fact, I think I have only found 1-2 marginally useful items in many hours of farming act 1 inferno. Furthermore, the constant ticking down on the NV timer is horrible for the health of my heart, especially people keep standing in the fire - but I'm too weak to solo it so I have to keep cooping.

What class are you? I don't believe that any class is too weak to solo The Butcher. Just make sure you have over 15k DPS or so with Life on Hit, which isn't hard to get at all. He's actually really easy once you figure out his attack patterns.

Also, are you sure you're not getting anything sellable on the AH? Obviously coming across things that are worth 300k+ is rare, but if you price things competitively, you can make some decent cash, and that's not even counting all of the gold you pick up running through Act 1.

 

[scy]

Anyone else think it would be a neat idea if the NV stacks between four people in inferno were just stacked instead of being averaged? It could add more incentive to play with a group.

I kind of expected this to be the case. Was a little surprised to see it just add to the average.

It really feels like they wanted to focus on people playing together but didn't make any design decisions to actually encourage people wanting to do it. I guess in a way to limit the need to group to make progress but they went too far and removed any incentive from it outside of playing with friends.

 

[endresults]

What exactly happens in that case? Are you actually reset to before the fight?

Nope, it let me go back in and loot and progress the story. I would have done less posting on GAF and more stabbing had it reset the fight.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I also think inflation was acceptable until very recently. Some early inflation is normal: as a larger and larger percentage of the userbase reaches 60, a greater percentage of people will have access to more gold, and the inflation should exist at a slow and steady pace for a while.

I think prices were doing just that for a while, but the last couple days have far exceeded this. I strongly suspect that bots are the root, primary and perhaps exclusive cause of the rapid inflation over the last few days.

I see a lot of stuff about inflation and insane prices (20+ million for a weapon), but as far as I can observe, the lower-priced items (150-400k or so) are getting stronger and stronger every day as more items enter the scene. Considering how much insanely priced stuff is up at any time, I'm not even sure any of that stuff is selling at those prices. Prices may be rising on the high end, but the low end is getting populated with better and better items all the time.

To progress, you don't need to have the top-tier, nearly perfect stat items. You can get by with worse stuff that costs exponentially less and then upgrade later.

 

[arts&crafts]

I kind of expected this to be the case. Was a little surprised to see it just add to the average.

It really feels like they wanted to focus on people playing together but didn't make any design decisions to actually encourage people wanting to do it. I guess in a way to limit the need to group to make progress but they went too far and removed any incentive from it outside of playing with friends.

Or just make it like diablo 2 where the more people in the game the more items drop. The mf will still be the same but you get more chances at items

 

[rCIZZLE]

Generally speaking, games are becoming increasingly community/social oriented, with less and less emphasis on single player experiences.

I disagree. AH and random matchmaking don't feel like they add to the social aspect of things. If they kept both how they were but ramped the difficulty it'd be incredibly social with trade lobbies everywhere.

 

[BravesCountry]

I'm glad I'm not the only one getting frustrated and discouraged by the AH, I thought I was doing something wrong. I'm near end of act 2 inferno as a DH and I never find anything useful, and only have about 1 mil to my name with probably below average gear. Even though my gear is below average, any upgrade to each piece of gear is going to cost me millions, and I don't have the ability nor time to farm that much. Should I just give up on inferno for now? considering rolling a barb, they look pretty fun...

 

[SnakeswithLasers]

Right, so here's the dilemma: balancing the game around no AH -- as Diablo 2 was -- means that the game has to be relatively easy, by design. If you expect most players to rely mostly or even exclusively on items they happen to personally get as drops, then you have to tune the encounters around that. Nothing can be so difficult that only top geared people can achieve it, because being "top geared" may take years if you never trade, or only trade with a couple friends.

The consequence, for people heavily involved in trading, was that the game was far too easy. Anyone who traded aggressively for any length of time would be capable of crushing Hell Baal so easily and quickly that the only real question was how fast you could do it, to increase your farming time. It was a less-than-ideal situation, but these people were often also Diablo 2's most consistent, long term customers.

So Blizzard had to make a choice between balancing this new game around the solo/small party D2 players (who did not trade) and the social/trading/big community players (who did). Blizzard clearly chose the latter. I don't mean that to be snide: I'm just pointing out that it isn't poor design, it's just design you don't happen to personally prefer. Generally speaking, games are becoming increasingly community/social oriented, with less and less emphasis on single player experiences.

And to be clear, I'm not suggesting there is no such thing as poor design; there are things in Diablo 3, such as the limited effectiveness of summoner spells for Witch Doctors in late Hell/Inferno difficulty, that pretty much everyone would agree are bad design. But many cases aren't really a matter of "poor design" vs. "good design," but rather different designs that will please different groups of players.

They may have chosen the latter, but they didn’t do anything to fix the root issues that you quoted of mine: Namely, D2JSP was just an arms race for players to bot and inflate the economy. I am not arguing that intrinsically adding a trade interface into the game is a bad thing. It never bothered me in WoW. I am arguing that the implementation in D3 is poor.

You’re saying that Blizzard chose to balance the game around D2JSP players. Those are the players who very clearly were going to go through any means in order to manipulate the economy. Yet Blizzard maintained the same systems that allowed bots to be succesful in D2, and made it even easier in D3. Set up an economy based on gold. Make gold drop from anything, thus incentivizing tedious gold runs (which are made less tedious when you have your bot running them for you while you’re asleep).

This is just a base problem I have with the way the economy is being handled and how quickly it is getting out of reach of common players. You’re saying that the consequence of balancing a game around “aggressive traders” without giving everyone an AH takes the game out of reach of more casual players. I’m saying that this scenario is happening now, due to the “aggressive traders” devaluing the currency.

 

[xelios]

I'm really bored with this game already. Near Azmodan in Act III inferno but I don't even have the interest to go through with it even though he's easy for a wizard. Probably setting this down 'til a major patch.

 

[Opiate]

Items with +max discipline. (Get at least ~45 total, not very difficult)
SS with Lingering Fog.
Preperation.

Sure I guess you have a .5 second opening after each SS,

1.5 seconds (1.5 second duration with lingering fog, 3 seconds cooldown) So I'd be immune 50% of the time for 9 seconds. That's a pretty big distinction from what you were implying, and why I didn't even realize what you were talking about at first.

but if the game tooltip is to be believed, you're supposed to go invisible, which means in PvP I wouldn't be able to track where you're moving. Along with latency, that .5 seconds might as well not even exist.

Yes, I agree that invisibility may even be the biggest concern regarding SS. Hopefully other players can still see us while we are in SS.

 

[Ferrio]

I'm glad I'm not the only one getting frustrated and discouraged by the AH, I thought I was doing something wrong. I'm near end of act 2 inferno as a DH and I never find anything useful, and only have about 1 mil to my name with probably below average gear. Even though my gear is below average, any upgrade to each piece of gear is going to cost me millions, and I don't have the ability nor time to farm that much. Should I just give up on inferno for now? considering rolling a barb, they look pretty fun...

See I don't get this. Complaining you can't afford the gear because you're not putting in the time? Working as intended.

1.5 seconds (1.5 second duration with lingering fog, 3 seconds cooldown) So I'd be immune 50% of the time for 9 seconds. That's a pretty big distinction from what you were implying, and why I didn't even realize what you were talking about at first.

I believe he has a good point though. With the lag, and tactical advantage you could stay invis before they have time to react in that small point of time SS isnt' up. Long as you kill them before your disc wears out.

PvP will be a stupid clusterfuck no matter what though.

 

[endresults]

The AH is like the wild west right now. Some things are inflated as all hell, but you get some naive folks throwing up great items for a song. Sir Mix-A-Lot said it best: "...and I pull up quick to ree-trieve 'em". I've made a few million that way just from looking for gear upgrades for myself.

 

[Drkirby]

I also think inflation was acceptable until very recently. Some early inflation is normal: as a larger and larger percentage of the userbase reaches 60, a greater percentage of people will have access to more gold, and the inflation should exist at a slow and steady pace for a while.

I think prices were doing just that for a while, but the last couple days have far exceeded this. I strongly suspect that bots are the root, primary and perhaps exclusive cause of the rapid inflation over the last few days.

You don't even need bots, you can farm gold on several characters by weighing down a key.

 

[LordCanti]

I'm really bored with this game already. Near Azmodan in Act III inferno but I don't even have the interest to go through with it even though he's easy for a wizard. Probably setting this down 'til a major patch.

I guess you won't be needing that massive gold pile. I'd be glad to take it off your hands, if you'd like

The AH is like the wild west right now. Some things are inflated as all hell, but you get some naive folks throwing up great items for a song. Sir Mix-A-Lot said it best: "...and I pull up quick to ree-trieve 'em". I've made a few million that way just from looking for gear upgrades for myself.

Didn't someone say that there is a script out there to find underpriced items automatically and buy them out?

Relying on finding deals at this point is next to impossible I'm finding. A mil gold would buy me fifty DPS over my current crossbow. FIFTY.

 

[NaturalHigh]

You don't even need bots, you can farm gold on several characters by weighing down a key.

.... Oh rly?

 

[Lothars]

Because D2 is a good game, and Inferno is poorly balanced and tested beta content? Agreed.

D2 is a different experience and really didn't hit it's stride till the expansion and places like d2jsp became really popular around than. D3 has the AH and also has D2jsp, it's built into the game which I don't think is a bad thing. They exist because there's tons of people that want the ability to get items using them

D2 didn't really take off until the expansion in my opinion.

I honestly don't think the current implementation of Inferno is even that terrible. Obviously, some classes have it easier than others in terms of progression ability, but it's not impossible for anyone to progress with enough farming, which is the point of the game.

In the last few days, I've already moved from struggling through Act 1 to breezing through it on my Barbarian. I imagine that I'll be able to tackle Act II within a week or so.

I really think most of the complaints come from people who just aren't willing to accept a brick wall/gear check that Act II represents. They want to advance through the content and they want to do it now. I don't think this desire is entirely valid, but I'm also a long-time MMORPG player, so this kind of thing appeals to me.

The only real complain I have is that the game actively discourages playing with more than 2 people because of how ridiculously powerful the mobs gets with 3 and 4 players. You end up killing things slower, dying more, and not seeing any more or even better rewards for doing it.

I agree fully with you especially since how I remember D2 is that the expansion is what made it take off.

I agree that Inferno shouldn't discourage parties since ot should do something to encourage groups of 3 and 4.

See I don't get this. Complaining you can't afford the gear because you're not putting in the time? Working as intended.

Agreed, It's been like that in every game. You Need to put in time to get the better gear either in the AH or by farming.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I'm glad I'm not the only one getting frustrated and discouraged by the AH, I thought I was doing something wrong. I'm near end of act 2 inferno as a DH and I never find anything useful, and only have about 1 mil to my name with probably below average gear. Even though my gear is below average, any upgrade to each piece of gear is going to cost me millions, and I don't have the ability nor time to farm that much. Should I just give up on inferno for now? considering rolling a barb, they look pretty fun...

You're playing the wrong game.

Honestly, why are you playing Diablo III? Why did you play it past Normal or Nightmare? You're not going to get anything for beating Inferno besides a shiny achievement. Why do you care?

The entire point of the game is to farm forever and ever getting marginally better upgrades or doing the whole thing with a different class. It helps that the combat mechanics are a lot more interesting this time around and the sound/visuals/physics really come together to give it a visceral (excuse me) feeling that is quite enjoyable.

 

[Opiate]

They may have chosen the latter, but they didn’t do anything to fix the root issues that you quoted of mine: Namely, D2JSP was just an arms race for players to bot and inflate the economy. I am not arguing that intrinsically adding a trade interface into the game is a bad thing. It never bothered me in WoW. I am arguing that the implementation in D3 is poor.

You’re saying that Blizzard chose to balance the game around D2JSP players. Those are the players who very clearly were going to go through any means in order to manipulate the economy. Yet Blizzard maintained the same systems that allowed bots to be succesful in D2, and made it even easier in D3. Set up an economy based on gold. Make gold drop from anything, thus incentivizing tedious gold runs (which are made less tedious when you have your bot running them for you while you’re asleep).

What do you think Diablo is, exactly? People did nothing but farm Baal for hours, days, weeks, months, years on end in Diablo II.

This is just a base problem I have with the way the economy is being handled and how quickly it is getting out of reach of common players. You’re saying that the consequence of balancing a game around “aggressive traders” without giving everyone an AH takes the game out of reach of more casual players. I’m saying that this scenario is happening now, due to the “aggressive traders” devaluing the currency.

"Aggressive traders" are, again, not the problem. The problem right now are bots. Inflation was acceptable (based on increasing average player level) until very recently -- as in the last few days.

If bots didn't exist, then aggressive traders wouldn't have an absurd way to jump ahead of everyone else (they would instead just have to play a lot more, make better trades on the AH, etc, which is completely fine). We can both agree that this is a problem and that bots should be minimized.

 

[xelios]

I guess you won't be needing that massive gold pile. I'd be glad to take it off your hands, if you'd like



Didn't someone say that there is a script out there to find underpriced items automatically and buy them out?

Relying on finding deals at this point is next to impossible I'm finding. A mil gold would buy me fifty DPS over my current crossbow. FIFTY.

I got to the point where any upgrade for me is about 10-20m and even then marginal as I'm at 75k dps and survival for my class in inferno at this point is only restricted by skill/skill choice. So I decided to trade for a bunch of steam games before gold completely tanked. I don't think I'll regret my decision.

 

[Ferrio]

Relying on finding deals at this point is next to impossible I'm finding. A mil gold would buy me fifty DPS over my current crossbow. FIFTY.

So?

Who ever expected gold:stat increase ratio would be linear? As you reach higher and higher to BIS items the price would of course skyrocket.

That said you don't need BIS to beat inferno.

 

[BravesCountry]

See I don't get this. Complaining you can't afford the gear because you're not putting in the time? Working as intended.

Maybe if I was talking about not being able to get the best gear in the game you would have a point, but it seems you may have missed it. I was talking about not even being able to upgrade below average gear to just average without paying exorbitant prices, which just isn't worth it. Your snide remark is completely ignorant, excuse my assumption but you are probably one of the guys who plays all day every day and can afford the millions it takes to have good gear and scoff at those who don't. If you aren't then that's fine, but that's how you are coming off.

 

[rCIZZLE]

.... Oh rly?

Act 2 spider generating towers + thorns + life regen + ferret. Need high gold fine gear and NM seems to be the best.

 

[x3r0123]

well am i the only that is getting bored of d3? farming for items in d3 just doesnt feel the same as d2

 

[tuxor]

I would like this game more if it wasn't just looking for more green numbers than red numbers. Still playing D2 since release and it just seems like without skill or stat allocation, all I'm doing is hoping for a weapon with a little more DPS. No game-changing +cskill or +oskill items to pick up. If I knew where that "game developer" post was I'd quote it, but I'm feeling really lazy and I'll assume anyone that's talking about these things has read it. The whole bit about the reward response being greatly decreased. If I'm a sorc in A2NM (D2LOD), and I find a v-magi I'm really happy, more mana, res, skill, fcr, etc. If I'm anywhere in D3, I find a new weapon and it's "Oh, 200 more dps, little more life, little more int/dex/str/whatever," even with legendaries.

It is certainly worth noting that I'm still in hell with a barb and nostalgia-goggles may be on, but as I said before, I played D2 earlier today, it's not like I'm remembering something crazily different.

 

[LordCanti]

I got to the point where any upgrade for me is about 10-20m and even then marginal as I'm at 75k dps and survival for my class in inferno at this point is only restricted by skill/skill choice. So I decided to trade for a bunch of steam games before gold completely tanked. I don't think I'll regret my decision.

I don't blame you. I should probably do the same, but there are no games I want at the moment.

So?

Who ever expected gold:stat increase ratio would be linear? As you reach higher and higher to BIS items the price would of course skyrocket.

That said you don't need BIS to beat inferno.

That's why I'm not spending the gold. I could beat Inferno Diablo right now if I wanted but...what's the point lol. Buying loot so I can loot farm is....

Well, it's Diablo-treadmill-tastic.

 

[Fragamemnon]

I'm glad I'm not the only one getting frustrated and discouraged by the AH, I thought I was doing something wrong. I'm near end of act 2 inferno as a DH and I never find anything useful, and only have about 1 mil to my name with probably below average gear. Even though my gear is below average, any upgrade to each piece of gear is going to cost me millions, and I don't have the ability nor time to farm that much. Should I just give up on inferno for now? considering rolling a barb, they look pretty fun...

Get a waypoint to siegebreaker and farm 5NV then the siegebreaker boss with Tyrael. I literally did it at the rate of once every 30m (and I completely suck, got to 60 yesterday) with an initial outlay of 550k and my MF set from my Monk. I've already recouped that money and am up even more after four runs. Later on you can start running Act IV for even better gear.

DH has zero right to complain about cash and being jammed by bad Act I/II drops. You can do something about that. Melee on the other hand= .

 

[Ferrio]

Maybe if I was talking about not being able to get the best gear in the game you would have a point, but it seems you may have missed it. I was talking about not even being able to upgrade below average gear to just average without paying exorbitant prices, which just isn't worth it. Your snide remark is completely ignorant, excuse my assumption but you are probably one of the guys who plays all day every day and can afford the millions it takes to have good gear and scoff at those who don't. If you aren't then that's fine, but that's how you are coming off.

I was farming act IV elite packs with only 35k dps as a DH. You can easily buy that dps with the gold you have.

It was tough, frustrating even, and I died alot.. but I did it.

 

[BravesCountry]

Get a waypoint to siegebreaker and farm 5NV then the siegebreaker boss with Tyrael. I literally did it at the rate of once every 30m (and I completely suck, got to 60 yesterday) with an initial outlay of 550k and my MF set from my Monk. I've already recouped that money and am up even more after four runs. Later on you can start running Act IV for even better gear.

DH has zero right to complain about cash and being jammed by bad Act I/II drops. You can do something about that. Melee on the other hand= .

This is true, it pains me to think melee are even worse off.

 

[Arment]

Been farming Inferno Cydea/Azmodan with 5 stack NV for days on end. Barely making money. At about 10 million gold now, and that's enough to buy like one upgrade. I can do Act 4 just fine, but the difficulty level there versus Act 3 is too bothersome. I get two bosses and about 8 elite packs done in 50 minutes whereas Act 4 it would take much longer. I found a 1,050 dps hand crossbow that sold for around 2.5 million, but the rest of the items I find are worth maybe 100k if I'm lucky.

Sure am not digging this as much as I did Diablo 2. I think the AH was a huge mistake.

 

[Cagey]

I'm getting to the point of boredom and tedium with Diablo III softcore that I've been browsing for means to just cash out. Ugh. At least I've gotten this game's initial addiction out of my system before the bar.

 

[zlatko]

Been farming Inferno Cydea/Azmodan with 5 stack NV for days on end. Barely making money. At about 10 million gold now, and that's enough to buy like one upgrade. I can do Act 4 just fine, but the difficulty level there versus Act 3 is too bothersome. I get two bosses and about 8 elite packs done in 50 minutes whereas Act 4 it would take much longer. I found a 1,050 dps hand crossbow that sold for around 2.5 million, but the rest of the items I find are worth maybe 100k if I'm lucky.

Sure am not digging this as much as I did Diablo 2. I think the AH was a huge mistake.

I couldn't image how undergeared people would be without the AH at all though.

 

[BravesCountry]

I was farming act IV elite packs with only 35k dps as a DH. You can easily buy that dps with the gold you have.

It was tough, frustrating even, and I died alot.. but I did it.

I admire your determination but that just doesn't sound like fun to me Like someone said earlier maybe this just isn't my type of game, which is sad to me because I loved playing D2. Maybe I just had more time on my hands back then. For me now it takes way too long until I can afford a slight upgrade on just one piece of equipment. I'm trying to remember if D2 was any different in this regard because I played it so long ago it is a bit fuzzy in my memory, but I played that game for countless hours and actually had a pretty good character. I'll give the act 4 farming a shot and we will see from there.

 

[SnakeswithLasers]

What do you think Diablo is, exactly? People did nothing but farm Baal for hours, days, weeks, months, years on end in Diablo II.

Huh?

"Aggressive traders" are, again, not the problem. The problem right now are bots. Inflation was acceptable (based on increasing average player level) until very recently -- as in the last few days.

If bots didn't exist, then aggressive traders wouldn't have an absurd way to jump ahead of everyone else (they would instead just have to play a lot more, make better trades on the AH, etc, which is completely fine). We can both agree that this is a problem and that bots should be minimized.

That's my point exactly? At this point, I'm not sure what you're arguing with me about: Bots are bad, and they are fucking up the economy. This is a bigger deal now than in past games because the economy is so intrinsically linked to progression.

However, bots existed due to D2JSP (by definition), and for blizzard to design around D2JSP, but not account for bots breaking the economy, well, that's poor design.

 

[Fragamemnon]

This is true, it pains me to think melee are even worse off.

Melee have the advantage of being able to turbo through Act I at breakneck speed with zero risk. I had 5NV+Warden+Butcher down to about 14m a run on my Monk, and the returns weren't terrible. But the EV per unit time spent was literally getting worse and worse. Given a sufficient amount of gear, running near the 75-80m mark, I can see a Monk cleave through Act 3 the same way.

I think crafting will help tons with the "can't afford act 2 gear" problem, but not until the RMAH is out and the commodities market is restored on the US auction house.

 

[xelios]

I'm getting to the point of boredom and tedium with Diablo III softcore that I've been browsing for means to just cash out. Ugh. At least I've gotten this game's initial addiction out of my system before the bar.

Anyone considering this better do it soon because gold is becoming more and more worthless by the hour. Not an exaggeration either.

 

[Ferrio]

I admire your determination but that just doesn't sound like fun to me Like someone said earlier maybe this just isn't my type of game, which is sad to me because I loved playing D2. Maybe I just had more time on my hands back then. For me now it takes way too long until I can afford a slight upgrade on just one piece of equipment. I'm trying to remember if D2 was any different in this regard because I played it so long ago it is a bit fuzzy in my memory, but I played that game for countless hours and actually had a pretty good character. I'll give the act 4 farming a shot and we will see from there.

I'm sure that's a big part. I remember doing runs over and over again. I don't have the same drive/time to do it. I look back fondly on those memories.. but I know i was a different person back then.

As for act IV, if you need any tips just ask.

 

[Cagey]

Anyone considering this better do it soon because gold is becoming more and more worthless by the hour. Not an exaggeration either.

I know, what was $30 this day 10 days ago was $20 and is now $10. Finding legitimate ways to do this is problematic.

EDIT: regarding the discussion of grinding and Baal runs, my D2 experience the past 7 years has been running D2C or D2X hardcore untwinked on players 8 with the same playgroup of three to five people, seeing how far we can get with themed character combinations based on one character's skill and everyone synergizing off that. I quit B.net D2 about four months after D2X launched, because the hardcore side became too easy, so I never did succumb to the endless MF runs.