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[Sebastian1295]

That's retarded

That like saying that PS5 was maxed out because From software Elden ring had shut FPS

Nintendo has never been a juggernaut of tech

This game started out as a switch 1 game and is struggling badly on the switch 2. The cpu inside the switch 2 is insanely weak and DLSS is too costly to use because the system isn't powerful enough to withstand the cost. The performance we're seeing in this video is flatout atrocious.

 

[Robb]

Retro won't let us down.

True, those guys are wizards as well. Hoping we get a date for Prime Beyond soon.

 

[PauloRoberto]

That's retarded

That like saying that PS5 was maxed out because From software Elden ring had shit FPS

Nintendo has never been a juggernaut of tech

Zelda BOTW day 1 had FPS problems

I'm sure you recall.

So you are admiting that FROM software is a Sony First party studio ?! :-|


Trolling apart... it's a little bit unfair using FROM and 'technical' at the same sentence :-D

 

[Darkness_Arises]

XC definitive edition, XC2, XC3, and XCX look like ass in handheld on Switch 2 thanks to the sub 720p rendering resolution and Monolith have not bothered with a simple resolution/framerate upgrade patch. Why place hope in them?

 

[Robb]

XC definitive edition, XC2, XC3, and XCX look like ass in handheld on Switch 2 thanks to the sub 720p rendering resolution and Monolith have not bothered with a simple resolution/framerate upgrade patch. Why place hope in them?

They used WiiU and Switch to their fullest.

I'm sure they'll get to updating their older titles at some point. I'd be very surprised if they didn't.

 

[Baemono]

The cpu inside the switch 2 is insanely weak and DLSS is too costly to use because the system isn't powerful enough to withstand the cost

Okay now that the bar of your technical knowledge has been settled, we can read you with the proper eyes

 

[winjer]

Wait.. Why would they use FSR1 when they have DLSS at their disposal?

A temporal upscaler requires to rewrite a part of the game code to expose color and depth buffers and motion vectors.
FSR1 requires almost nothing.
Nintendo went for the quick, lazy and cheapest upscaler to implement.

 

[Baemono]

XC definitive edition, XC2, XC3, and XCX look like ass in handheld on Switch 2 thanks to the sub 720p rendering resolution and Monolith have not bothered with a simple resolution/framerate upgrade patch. Why place hope in them?

They still have a lot of 1st party games to update, Metroid Prime Remastered didn't even get a 4K or 120Hz update yet (that would make sense since MP4 will run at 120Hz)

 

[PeteBull]

I thought FSR was AMD tech? Can it run on Nvidia?

Older version of fsr can run even on older nvidia cards that didnt have dlss support, even old af maxwell archi cards, so gtx 9xx family series:

Thats a midrange gpu from sept 2014 with back then msrp(and actual streetprice) of 329 usd

NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970 Specs

NVIDIA GM204, 1178 MHz, 1664 Cores, 104 TMUs, 56 ROPs, 4096 MB GDDR5, 1753 MHz, 256 bit

www.techpowerup.com

 

[Sleepwalker]

Rendering cost could be one, DLSS is heavy to run on the Switch and could maybe drop the internal resolution too low. FSR 1.0 is basically free to run.

Or they didn't get time to implement TAA into the engine, and thus no DLSS.

7 years of development, no time to implement TAA into the engine.

Nnitendo never changes.

 

[Buggy Loop]

This game started out as a switch 1 game and is struggling badly on the switch 2. The cpu inside the switch 2 is insanely weak and DLSS is too costly to use because the system isn't powerful enough to withstand the cost. The performance we're seeing in this video is flatout atrocious.

And BOTW was a Wii U game



So I guess that was it for switch 1 progress, day 1 BOTW

You peoples have never tried to code have you? Even with free graphic engines?

You can kneecap any hardware. What is their effort to look at the destruction part and optimize it on new hardware for data streaming or if they said "this is fine" and moved on? You don't know.

also let's go with the drama that all following 1st party Nintendo games use massive voxel destruction from now on as the benchmark of performances to come.. yeah you got it Sherlock.

 

[winjer]

And it gets dumber when we consider that Nvidia has it's own spatial upscaler, similar to FSR1, but optimized for Nvidia hardware: NIS
It would look as bad as FSR1, but at least it would be a little better optimized for the Nvidia GPU that the Switch uses.

 

[Buggy Loop]

A temporal upscaler requires to rewrite a part of the game code to expose color and depth buffers and motion vectors.
FSR1 requires almost nothing.
Nintendo went for the quick, lazy and cheapest upscaler to implement.

But with SMAA the r/FuckTAA will rejoice

I can see Nintendo not being that enthusiastic about TAA form of upscaling when it can so fuck up your presentation like particle effects and such

Cyberpunk 2077 when I disabled DLSS on PC I suddenly noticed that when it's raining there's water droplets on ground surfaces, with it enables it's almost completely invisible

 

[Nvzman]

The fact that a switch 2 first party game is struggling technically when the system just launched is a very very bad sign for the rest of the generation.

Motherfucker, what??

Nearly every console starts with significantly worse performance optimization than it ends with, do you not remember the PS3?

Even BotW launched with messy performance on the Switch and TotK was a nearly locked 30fps minus the master hand abilities.

 

[Chuck Berry]

If any of you miserable queers are going to trash your Switch 2 over this stupid, seriously irrelevant FSR shit, hit me up. I'll gladly take it and play DK for you.

 

[RAIDEN1]

I don't have a Switch 2 and probably won't for some time but seriously frame rate issues on launch window games is very annoying to hear.

I cannot take another generation where people are asking for a pro version of their console within months of the thing being released.

Nothing said here would personally bother me too much overall but I don't like hearing about performance issues on a console that's only feature is that it IS a more powerful version of the last. It's the only thing going for it.

It's the Switch Pro in all but name...

 

[PeteBull]

 

[mhirano]

I thought FSR was AMD tech? Can it run on Nvidia?

FSR 1.0 os a open source and vendor agnostic tech, so yes

 

[Bonfires Down]

dude has to go through a 5-page vague tech praise to get to the actual issues the game has, to not attract full frontal cult-assault.
you'd be depressed too.

I doubt even the more dedicated Nintendo fans know or care about DF. More likely it is those with another primary system plus a Switch for Nintendo exclusives who will complain.

 

[kevboard]

I see people still don't know that FSR1 isn't comparable to DLSS and FSR2... yet they try to compare it to it

 

[Horseganador]

Graphically it's pretty average (you can tell it's coming from the Switch) to have those framerate drops, they need to patch it.

 

[scydrex]

Nintendo being Nintendo... nothing new here. They don't even care. Their games will sell a lot regardless of how it runs or look. Pokemon ran like crap and still sold a lot of copies.

 

[kevboard]

I doubt even the more dedicated Nintendo fans know or care about DF. More likely it is those with another primary system plus a Switch for Nintendo exclusives who will complain.

dude, there have been multiple youtubers grifting ahead of the Switch 2 launch, by making videos "disproving" digital foundry's Switch 2 videos.

that retard Super Metal Dave 64 being the spearhead of the retard grifting brigade.

 

[winjer]

But with SMAA the r/FuckTAA will rejoice

I can see Nintendo not being that enthusiastic about TAA form of upscaling when it can so fuck up your presentation like particle effects and such

Cyberpunk 2077 when I disabled DLSS on PC I suddenly noticed that when it's raining there's water droplets on ground surfaces, with it enables it's almost completely invisible

SMAA is a much better AA form than TAA.
It's coverage is far from being perfect, but it's good enough and it's very fast. It's also easy to implement.
But most important, it doesn't introduce all the big problems of TAA, such as blurriness, disocclusion artifacts and other temporal artifacts.

 

[Robb]

7 years of development, no time to implement TAA into the engine.

Nnitendo never changes.

 

[Represent.]

Absolute trash. Japan needs to get a fucking grip. Make some good looking games again, holy.

 

[Skifi28]

Bad bad image qualities

 

[Buggy Loop]

SMAA is a much better AA form than TAA.
It's coverage is far from being perfect, but it's good enough and it's very fast. It's also easy to implement.
But most important, it doesn't introduce all the big problems of TAA, such as blurriness, disocclusion artifacts and other temporal artifacts.

Which is what John says the game is using at 11:18

FSR 1 is probably used more like a sharpener here while SMAA does the heavy lifting

But DF is always pushing for TAA like solutions

Imo SMAA with the kind of particles we see in this game with destruction make more sense than DLSS/TAA

Peoples hung up on FSR, but really, think of it as a sharpener, they probably use the RCAS part of it as SMAA is typically less sharp than other solutions

 

[tkscz]

Had no idea Nintendo had access to FSR.

DLSS too heavy on the system?

DLSS is built into the Switch 2 and several games have used it (Cyberpunk, Street Fighter 6, and Fast Fusion to name a few). DKB was originally created on the Switch 1, which means the use of FSR 1.0 and SMAA is built into the game's engine.

From their interview, they were about three to four years into development before they went from Switch 1 to Switch 2 and I don't think they wanted to go back and change this.

A temporal upscaler requires to rewrite a part of the game code to expose color and depth buffers and motion vectors.
FSR1 requires almost nothing.
Nintendo went for the quick, lazy and cheapest upscaler to implement.

But it's not that simple. You're saying it's lazy to go back and change years of work for something that most people won't care about.

Changes to the engine were done years ago, why extend the amount of time just to swap over to DLSS when FSR 1.0 + SMAA has gotten them image quality they are happy with?

 

[Matsuchezz]

Time to sell this crap, I will sell it after Metroid. And after I finish totk

 

[Matsuchezz]

M

 

[proandrad]

Using FSR 1 is wild for a game coming out in 2025.

 

[viveks86]

I saw "There Are Some Caveats" in the timestamped index before reading the opening paragraph and knew it had to be John Linneman

 

[keefged4]

No DLSS. Prease understand.

Why are you like this Nintendo

 

[Thief1987]

SMAA is a much better AA form than TAA.

It doesn't provide temporal stability, so it's garbage, like any other non-TAA solution.

 

[Buggy Loop]

I saw "There Are Some Caveats" in the timestamped index before reading the opening paragraph and knew it had to be John Linneman

Always

John HAS to say that word in every videos

 

[Gonzito]

And the game costs 80 dollars?

 

[RodriGames40]

Absolute trash. Japan needs to get a fucking grip. Make some good looking games again, holy.

Making a real Switch 2 game to begin with would certainly be a good start...

 

[Buggy Loop]

Fucking hell peoples

Its not FSR1 vs DLSS

It's SMAA+FSR1 (RCAS sharperner likely) vs DLSS

This is not the L you think it is

DLSS with so many particles around constant destruction would be a fucking disocclusion pixel soup. DLSS is fine for certain games and the slower the game and less interactive it is the better, DLSS like any TAA alternative likes stability above all.

SMAA for basically spamming the screen with particles and objects flying around while constantly the game mechanics is destruction makes more sense.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

This game started out as a switch 1 game and is struggling badly on the switch 2. The cpu inside the switch 2 is insanely weak and DLSS is too costly to use because the system isn't powerful enough to withstand the cost. The performance we're seeing in this video is flatout atrocious.

I'm just gonna go with what tkscz said.

dude, there have been multiple youtubers grifting ahead of the Switch 2 launch, by making videos "disproving" digital foundry's Switch 2 videos.

that retard Super Metal Dave 64 being the spearhead of the retard grifting brigade.

TBF, Digital Foundry aren't a bastion for information these days anymore, either. A lot of people who wrote them off after their constant belittling of PS5 for multiple years in multiplat comparisons with Series X, are suddenly vouching for them again simply because they're taking a (potentially overextended) critical perspective on Switch 2?

Well it's not like DF changed much in their perspectives on PS5 relative Xbox, it's just MS's constant screw-ups and dying market share make it harder to be as bold with the spin compared to 2021 - 2023.

Motherfucker, what??

Nearly every console starts with significantly worse performance optimization than it ends with, do you not remember the PS3?

Even BotW launched with messy performance on the Switch and TotK was a nearly locked 30fps minus the master hand abilities.

Yeah some people are on strong kool aid juice this morning.

Not that I'm excusing Nintendo for what should be easy technical performance lay-ups that they're somehow botching. It's embarrassing and could cost them a lot of 3P support if the problems are at a SDK/API level. Yes Nintendo doesn't "need" 3P the way SIE or Microsoft do, but they'd be stupid to intentionally make things difficult for them, to the point of turning them away.

But, I think tkscz 's explanation is pretty rational and fair, as to why this specific game is having some framerate drops. Which, hopefully, Nintendo can patch a clean-up for in a few weeks.

 

[winjer]

It doesn't provide temporal stability, so it's garbage, like any other non-TAA solution.

TAA has almost stability, with all the temporal artifacts it causes. From ghosting to disocclusion artifacts.
The moment the game moves, it's a shit show of bad image quality.

 

[viveks86]

I wonder how Jensen feels about this.

 

[LordOcidax]

And the game costs 80 dollars?

70

 

[Ma-Yuan]

Saw it today in motion and picture quality is nice.

 

[Chuck Berry]

Saw it today in motion and picture quality is nice.

Oh gross man. Seriously how can anyone stomach that image quality.

 

[Thief1987]

TAA has almost stability, with all the temporal artifacts it causes. From ghosting to disocclusion artifacts.
The moment the game moves, it's a shit show of bad image quality.

Well, if you are prefer this kind of "image quality" then more power to you

 

[winjer]

Which is what John says the game is using at 11:18

FSR 1 is probably used more like a sharpener here while SMAA does the heavy lifting

But DF is always pushing for TAA like solutions

Imo SMAA with the kind of particles we see in this game with destruction make more sense than DLSS/TAA

Peoples hung up on FSR, but really, think of it as a sharpener, they probably use the RCAS part of it as SMAA is typically less sharp than other solutions

FSR1 is a good spatial upscaler. And it does improve image quality.
But it's not as good as a temporal upscaler using AI, such as DLSS4 or FSR4.
I'm not sure it's using RCAS. This game is not using TAA, so adding a sharpening filter is not really necessary.
If it's being used, it's a very mild amount.

DF really has no taste for image quality. It's obvious that TAA is a terrible form of AA, that causes too many problems, while solving only one, pixel crawling.
It's difficult to take them seriously, when they say such stupid nonsense.

 

[winjer]

Well, if you are prefer this kind of "image quality" then more power to you

You are not comparing TAA in that video.

 

[Tg89]

Super positive overall. Sounds like he absolutely loved the game.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Thats another 15-25 million sales right there.

I cant stand that drop to 30FPS though, they need to fix that or they are going to ruin my entire vibe while playing. I can deal with the lurches if the game is doing something new and innovative but dropping to 30FPS for prolonged sections is rank!