ShadowkillXNA
Member
Helldivers 2 needs new factions for the new war.
I nominate the RWP (Rainbow War Pony Coalition) and the Gabenites.
I nominate the RWP (Rainbow War Pony Coalition) and the Gabenites.
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[Digital Foundry] Hands-On With Steam Machine: Valve's Beautiful PC/Console - Specs, Impressions And More
I want to like this since I'd really like a Steam console to hook up to my TV, but it's looking pretty weak. If it's over $300 for the lower-end model, I don't see it doing very well. If this would have been at least as good as 4070 with 12 GB (what I have in my PC), I'd have definitely picked one up, now I'm going to hold off and see what Microsoft offers in the next Xbox.
neocycle
Member
Paid online sucks but you can get most games cheap in sales on console.
icecold1983
Member
700$ seems like a realistic starting point for the 512GB tier. Maaaybe 600$. Expecting anything lower than that is lunacy. Considering this will perform somewhere between a PS5 and Seriex S, I struggle to understand the market for such mediocrity.
lastmessiah
Member
$700 at the lowest imo.
Pimpbaa
Member
I'd probably get this to play less demanding PC only games and last gen games that never got a current gen update and of course emulators. It definitely wouldn't be my primary gaming device like the PS5 is. Even with system reserves, ps5 and series x can use more of it's pool of ram as vram in games (probably already said in the video but I couldn't only take 5 minutes of them talking). That Xbox pc thing coming out has considerably better specs and can do the same things this can, but it will probably be double the price.
Darkness_Arises
Member
It is worse at playing games than a PS5. If it was using an Nvidia GPU, I would have made excuses for it being underpowered as DLSS4 can help a lot especially with a 200W power envelope. Unfortunately, it is a bandwidth starved anemic RDNA3 GPU. I got my PS5 for 315£ on sale last year. I am not paying more than 349£ for this.
512 GB is not enough storage for a PC. PS5 game sizes are easily 20-30% smaller than PC eg. BL3 on the Steam Deck is 83GB, while same game is around 58GB on the PS5. They could sell a storage-less or 64GB cheap ass model for 300£, I will add my own 2TB 2280 card. The decision to go with a 2240 SSD is also rather baffling as according to DF there is enough space for a 2280 SSD there. 2280 SSDs throttle less thanks to the larger surface area for heat dissipation and often come with more DRAM cache. If anybody wants to get 2 TB storage, I would recommend getting the 512 GB model and upgrading to a cheap 2280 2 TB SSD. An SD card is pretty useless for games that I want to play on the big screen, I do not put any AAA/AA game from the past 10 years on my Steam Deck's SD card. It just chokes on game start up and updates.
The RAM situation is also kind of weird. Why did they go with 16 GB system RAM and just 8 GB graphics memory? It would have been better to go with 8GB RAM and 16 GB graphics memory, especially since the system RAM (unlike the non-upgradeable graphics memory) is SODIMM and can be easily upgraded by the end user.
Sales are on par between Steam and PSN. I am primarily a single player games kinda guy. I do not pay for PS+ and the only reason I bought the Steam Deck and am interested in the Steam machine is for single player games. Most popular multiplayer games have kernel level anti-cheat and do not work on these steam machines. If you want to play Fortnite, Roblox, CoD, BF, the steam machines are an easy skip. For single player gamers, there is no meaningful cost of ownership difference between Steam and PS5.
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Cyberpunkd
Member
I'm not sure about sales - are the largest discounts still linked to PS+? If so that's what you need to factor in. On PC you got also key sites, prices there are sometimes way cheaper e.g. Rogue Trader never went below 20€ on Steam, whereas I got a key for 9€.
For the kernel anti-cheat - Linux technically supports it, it's the developers that don't want to put in the work. Still doesn't change the end result - I guess if you are a heavy MP gamer then that's an issue.
I find the Steam Deck to be the best gaming hardware probably since the DS, so having a beefier machine for TV play + streaming to Deck for playing in bed is perfect.
Kikorin
Member
How it compares to base PS5? With Sony going full multiplatform, I'd could see me selling my PS5 for this and embrace the full Steam library (and game prices). I'd only regret not using the PS5 controller, but I guess it'll be compatible? Also, we need the price in €.
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IDKFA
I am Become Bilbo Baggins
I hear you. I'm hoping the decision to go with 16GB RAM and 8GB VRAM is to make the device as affordable as possible.
I don't think it'll be as cheap as £349, but I'm hoping it's less than £500.
Mister Wolf
Member
Its weaker in RAM and GPU.
GHG
Gold Member
HYDE
Member
Stole the words right outta my mouthUSB type A in 2026
Senua
Member
All depends on the price point
roosnam1980
Gold Member
in one of the videos the dude from valve says total power draw from the system is 200 watt , that seems close to xsx/ps5
Bojanglez
The Amiga Brotherhood
But what year is that coming out? I imagine by then there will be a multitude of SteamOS certified PCs and component hardware that will allow someone to run SteamOS and have the exact same experience at whatever power level they are comfortable with.
I don't normally recommend their content but IGN's discussion with the Valve engineers touches upon this. The Steam Machine is acting as a baseline product to underpin a wider strategy of expanding SteamOS and providing an open alternative to Windows in PC gaming, who knows if they will succeed, but in my opinion it is a commendable goal.
Also in this video they touch upon how the whole key driver behind SteamOS is about the user experience, removing traditional friction (driver updates) that may be involved in traditional PC gaming. I don't know if that is the vision of Windows, although they may branch it and try and spin some kind of gaming focussed version of it, the fact that they are putting their name to things like the ROG Ally X, which based on a lot of the feedback I've seen does a poor job in attempting to solve any of these issues, mans that by then they may have lost any brand value they would have had. But let's wait and see I guess.
Radical_3d
Member
Even if this is subsidiased to 399 that's going to be wiped out by PS5 digital on sales.
Senua
Member
Radical_3d
Member
That it does not depend on the price.
Senua
Member
Oh ok they might as well change 10k for it then
Radical_3d
Member
Your point was it not the price but if it was DOA, that was what you bolder in the quote. This is a poorly thought and/or bad decision making machine. With nothing but the CPU going for it. It is DOA. But if it is a playing field to improve their OS and make it have a broader compatibility with other desktops it's very welcome. And dead.
SenkiDala
Member
People who pretend they see it at 399 (I've even seen 299) are 1) dumb, 2) pretend to expect a low price just to complain the day the real price will be announced.
Mister Wolf
Member
For what it offers compared to alternatives it isn't worth more than $400
CentralScrutinizer
Member
All comes down to price. If I can get a seamless plug and play experience for my game room setup then I'm all for it.
Senua
Member
Ok Gabe should have listened to you!
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Its success or failure or rather life or death as you wanna call it doesn't depend on selling more than PS5 Digital or whatever imaginary out of touch threshold you wanna present because you so desperately want your favorite box to have a win over something, lol, get a grip. You sound like some Nintendo fanboy troll calling Steam Deck DOA because it obviously was never going to (and didn't) sell anywhere near such numbers, except it's still very much alive several years later and serving both its users and the company exactly as was intended and advertised, as the portable mini PC it is. They're one out of thousands of options for the same open PC ecosystem (that's "trashing" every console if that's all you wanna compare, revenue/user volume, regardless of achieving that via a ton of diverse hardware options at difference performance tiers rather than a single or a few models)
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mrMUR_96
Member
At any price point 8GB vram is a ridiculous decision. It kneecaps performance in games already, how will it cope over the next few years.
Senua
Member
Lower resolutions and settings. I'm still getting by with 10gb vram you just have to be smart with settings and work around your limitations
CentralScrutinizer
Member
Radical_3d
Member
Let's see if it makes Deck numbers.Its success or failure or rather life or death as you wanna call it doesn't depend on selling more than PS5 Digital or whatever imaginary out of touch threshold you wanna present because you so desperately want your favorite box to have a win over something, lol, get a grip. You sound like some Nintendo fanboy calling Steam Deck DOA because it obviously was never going to (and didn't) sell anywhere near such numbers, except it's still very much alive several years later and serving both its users and the company exactly as was intended and advertised, as the portable mini PC it is. They're one out of thousands of options for the same open PC ecosystem (that's "trashing" every console if that's all you wanna compare, revenue/user volume or whatever, regardless of achieving that via a ton of diverse hardware options rather than a single or a few similar models)
CentralScrutinizer
Member
In the end that doesn't really matter though. 99% of steams bread will be buttered via regular PCs.
chilichote
Member
For a good price, I find this device quite attractive. But the price would have to be really good, considering that this hardware isn't future-proof. 8GB of VRAM, no AI features or dedicated AI hardware, possibly only FSR3, not upgradeable, performance somewhere between the Xbox Series S and PS5/XSX.
Sure, the flexibility regarding the operating system is nice, and the fact that you can easily connect it to the TV is also a plus.
Nevertheless, I think anything over €399 would be too expensive. At €349/€449 (512GB/2TB), it would be a no-brainer for me. But I think €499/€599 is probably more realistic, but absolutely unattractive to me.
Sure, the flexibility regarding the operating system is nice, and the fact that you can easily connect it to the TV is also a plus.
Nevertheless, I think anything over €399 would be too expensive. At €349/€449 (512GB/2TB), it would be a no-brainer for me. But I think €499/€599 is probably more realistic, but absolutely unattractive to me.
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
This has nothing to do with anything you quoted (well except the first line, I guess you moved to a new imaginary out of touch threshold because you desperately want a win in a different way this time), what are you even going on about? I don't care to see if it will sell like Deck or anything else
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SenkiDala
Member
Well maybe, show me an mini PC alternative with approximately this specs and costs 400, I dunno any and I'd be interested.
Autistic_Pancake
Member
> 8GB VRAM
> outdated AMD GPU
This isn't a PC replacement. It's a substitute for a gaming console for those who no longer want to support Sony or Microsoft...
> outdated AMD GPU
This isn't a PC replacement. It's a substitute for a gaming console for those who no longer want to support Sony or Microsoft...
Mister Wolf
Member
Anything around that price or $100 more that has a GPU with more than 8GB of VRAM I would suggest you buy that instead.
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Radical_3d
Member
You were the one imagining I put the threshold on Nintendo or Sony numbers. I put it more closely to other Valve options.
Yes but 94% or the Steam users have Windows and I want this to succeed so I can get rid of it in the desktop space quicker. And I say quicker because it's going to happen no matter what since Valve is working on it. But a better machine would have accelerated this sooooo much.
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
I imagined it? I quoted you pitting it against PS5 digital numbers and calling it dead on arrival because of not achieving that or getting "wiped out" by that as you said.
Which again have nothing to do with anything I said to present that as some counter argument. Idk what you're on about. Or are you now saying it's DOA if it sells less than Deck, like it will suddenly not function as the modest spec mini PC any # buyers expect to use after buying it if it sells less?
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Kikorin
Member
Ok, thanks. Considering the zero optimization most of PC games get at launch, I'll stuck with my PS5 then.
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Cyberpunkd
Member
Windows has more than 30 years of technical debt, there is absolutely no way they can make a generational leap without leaving the older hardware and dependencies behind. It's just not going to happen. A small tweak here and there, but nothing major.
Suprisingly enough I see PS5 Digital for 437€ on Amazon, I was shocked . As for Series S - nobody buys that even when it can probably go 249€ on sale so...
Then it will introduce all the complexities of building your own machine, which people buying this do not want, that's exactly why they are buying a pre-made PC.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Maybe MS got wind this was happening and thought, what brings us the most money. We need to just give up on consoles and pivot to try and stop this impacting Windows too much. I think the majority of gamers would move to a valve system and move away from Windows if they could and saw a performance uplift.
Radical_3d
Member
Because I was responding to someone saying it depends on the price and value wise is loosing that competition against that system. Not that it needs to sell more than the PS5. Or even a fraction. But it's not dependant on the price since the digital PS5 is already "cheap".
So, no matter what it sells it's not DOA.Which again have nothing to do with anything I said to present that as some counter argument. Idk what you're on about. Or are you now saying it's DOA if it sells less than Deck, like it will suddenly not function as the modest spec mini PC any # buyers expect to use after buying it if it sells less?
Senua
Member
Yea if you prioritize performance for modern games then that makes sense. The steam box will be a budget way to access the insane library of steam
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Pretty much, it's a PC. What do you think happens if I buy the least popular mobo or GPU, even if the company that made it goes under (lol Valve won't over SM/SD), they will stop working even if they're still using the same intel and nvidia and whatever chips and drivers and OS I'll be out of luck? The only reason to regret anything PC is if the parts blow up or the buyer's mistakes, like not checking specs/performance imagining it will outdo a Ryzen X3D + 5090 (as in playing every new AAA game for x years, it will work for many years for software for its own spec level regardless) for peanuts.So, no matter what it sells it's not DOA.
It can be a failure on Valve's expectations, but we don't know what those are (and if they even include sale numbers or just promoting more mini PC options in the market like Deck appears to have promoted more portable PC options, maybe it's already done enough just by working together with AMD and tuning new socs for such purposes), and your own imaginary PS5 Digital or Steam Deck (like what if it had sold even less, would you still present that as the threshold or skip it, when did Deck escape DOA status for you, lmao) thresholds you pull out of thin fart air have 0 bearing on it
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