Support NeoGAF

[danowat]

Did the first 3 league stages this morning, man, they were sick if I do say so myself!!!, was sitting 2nd in the standings till I rolled about 100m from the end of stage 3, grrrrrr.....

edit: I also redownloaded the demos for Seb Loeb Rally and WRC 5 this weekend, and played them back to back with Dirt Rally, graphically it's night and day, DR blows them out of the water by a long, long margin, that and the fact that DR is 60fps, and the others aren't mean that they can't even come close.

That said, driving DR and Seb Loeb back to back seems to show that the physics in DR feel a little bit arcadey......

WRC5 is just bad all round.

 

[gingerbeardman]

I didn't mind WRC5 despite it feeling arcadey to me, and obviously less responsive at 30fps

SLR I thought was worse, though.

 

[danowat]

I didn't mind WRC5 despite it feeling arcadey to me, and obviously less responsive at 30fps

SLR I thought was worse, though.

Both are a huge comedown after playing DR, if SLR ran at 60fps (on consoles), I reckon it could be a contender, I think the physics feel really good, and I prefer the car list in SLR.

Has there been any news on DLC for DR?, I know I read that they weren't, then someone else said they were, would be nice to know, I am really hankering for some course DLC, as well as the filling out of some of the car classes, no Celica GT4 is a travesty!

 

[gingerbeardman]

Latest I read was that some online events had been planned to coincide with the real rally season.

And the DR team were going back to work on the game for reasons currently unknown

https://www.dirtgame.com/blog/5561

 

[danowat]

Latest I read was that some online events had been planned to coincide with the real rally season.

And the DR team were going back to work on the game for reasons currently unknown

https://www.dirtgame.com/blog/5561

We’ll be running our Special Events to rather conveniently coincide with some pretty significant weekends of the motorsport season, and we’ve planned them right up to March 2017 so far

That's pleasing to hear, always nice to see an intention of support.

Really cool meeting up with @Rushy33, @PhenomEvolution and the gang to chat about all things @Codemasters and to see what lies ahead.

That tweet they link too on the same page is intriguing.......

 

[Oneself]

SLR is great despite being 30fps on PS4. Physics are very well done and stages are very faithfully and closely reproduced. It's been a long time since we've had two great rally games during the same year. Too bad SLR seems like a financial failure.

 

[danowat]

SLR is great despite being 30fps on PS4. Physics are very well done and stages are very faithfully and closely reproduced. It's been a long time since we've had two great rally games during the same year. Too bad SLR seems like a financial failure.

I might pick it up when it's discounted, but yeah, doesn't seem to have sold well, at least at retail, DR sold 5 times more.

 

[jdw_b]

How do I join the PC league guys?

Just got the game over the weekend, very impressed with how it feels so far

 

[Lima]

SLR and WRC kinda deserve to fail on console when Dirt Rally looks better than both of them while having double the frame rate.

 

[Curufinwe]

I think I'm about done playing. The AI times are stupidly fast outside of Germany.

 

[danowat]

I think I'm about done playing. The AI times are stupidly fast outside of Germany.

Whilst I think they are extremely inconsistent, and has some weird rubberbanding, I haven't really had too much trouble coming 1st or 2nd on all difficulties, infact, I'd possibly go as far as to say that the AI isn't actually any harder on Master than it is on Open.

 

[Curufinwe]

I came 2nd or 3rd on Clubman, but on the tough surfaces I can't get anywhere near the #1 guy.

 

[danowat]

I came 2nd or 3rd on Clubman, but on the tough surfaces I can't get anywhere near the #1 guy.

Coming first doesn't really matter (nice guys don't come first ), consistency is the key, you only need to finish 3rd overall to get promoted to the next division.

 

[NHale]

The problem is that he doesn't really matter how much fast you are because the game is rigged at the core. Career mode is a complete fake competition.

AI stage times are not defined by some simulation but decided by what time you do adjusting the times of the AI competition based on your own time. You do 4.45, AI 1st does 4.20. You do 4.20, AI 1st does 4.00, so basically Codemasters decides which position you will end up if you are remotely decent at the game. Then of course for some reason your main rivals always have some big issues in the last stage of the championship losing 10 minutes in a 6 minute stage when you did them to lose positions so you can win a championship or reach 3rd place. I was so pissed the 2nd time in a row I won a championship not because I was good but because the AI lost more than 5 minutes (it even happened to the 1st and 2nd place on that particular rally in one occasion lol) on the last stage of the championship. It completely takes all the gratification out of this career mode.

Someone calling this the Dark Souls of racing games don't really understand what Dark Souls really is. It's difficult but it isn't fair on career mode (online without restarts is Dark Souls indeed). While I still believe they completely nailed the handling and stage design, they should be ashamed of trying to fool people with fake AI times. Remember they did this on some F1 games as well. In qualifying you could spend the entire qualify ahead of some car but in the end they would go 1 second faster than you. Why? Because like they admitted those qualifying times were predetermined and not the actual AI racing on track.

It's no question they should have created a simulation where AI actually "run" the stage and which you would always determine their times based on that regardless of how well you've done. If you do fantastic, you should lead by 1minute in a clubman rally. But if you do poorly there is no problem being 14th...

 

[Lima]

The fastest guy on masters is almost just as fast as the fastest guy on open. Coupled with the horrible inconsistency between car classes. At that point why even have difficulty setting in the first place. Makes getting the achievements annoying as hell. I have no problem owing he AI times in certain classes on master, rallycross or hill climb now but damn R4 which is actually one of the easiest classes in the game and even on Open I can't manage to win. No matter the stage I'm green first sector with at least 6-7 seconds to spare and then second sector is red.

Not only did I somehow lose my 6 second lead, I am now also 10 seconds trailing. All without making an error of course.

 

[danowat]

It's no question they should have created a simulation where AI actually "run" the stage and which you would always determine their times based on that regardless of how well you've done. If you do fantastic, you should lead by 1minute in a clubman rally. But if you do poorly there is no problem being 14th...

Anyone know if it's ever been brought up with the developers?

 

[Sini]

Rubber banding bs was brought up very first time about a week ago by someone here and now some people are so sure AI is rubber banding? DR had been out for a year before and no-one else noticed it before?

For Dirt Rally we have changed how we simulate the virtual AI times you see as split times and in the results table. Rather than using an automated system to generate AI lap times over a variety of difficulties we now run a simulation per driver to calculate each split section factoring in ongoing damage events and punctures. This simulation is also used to complete finished rallycross events, and the other group and semi-final events you are not racing in.

We start with the best possible split time per section for every track and car combination. This is called the Bogey Time and we use our fastest racer on the team, Michael Robson (who you might have seen demonstrating the latest cars and tracks in our Dirt twitch shows!). This gives us a consistent starting point for calculating each driver’s split time throughout a rally/hillclimb/rallycross competition. The generated AI driver split times will always be slower than the bogey times, so we know they should be beatable by skilled Players.

For Dirt Rally we currently have 75 levels of driver skill, and these are used to setup the spread of driver abilities you see in the various championship tier and custom event difficulties. As you have already figured out, our designers include a higher skilled AI driver in each tier but the spread of difficulties should vary enough to challenge you to reach a podium finish. When setting up a championship each AI driver can further modify their skill level with a bonus to reflect a specific country they are good or bad in.

Each driver skill level consists of 8 variables that can be tweaked by a designer:

Min variation – Minimum percentage variation of Bogey Time.
Min variation – Minimum percentage variation of Bogey Time.
Max variation – Maximum percentage variation of Bogey Time.
Wet percentage – Percentage change for wet stages.
Night percentage – Percentage change for night stages.
Damage probability – Probability per split section of a damage event.
Puncture probability – Probability per split section of a puncture.
Min damage level – Minimum damage level event that can be rolled.
Max damage level – Maximum damage level event that can be rolled.
Once we have the final skill level for every AI driver each stage is simulated as follows:

If in service area
Check to repair punctures (Checks if driver has any spares available)
Check to repair damage (Not all damage events can be repaired fully in the time available)
For each split section in order:
If not retired and no current damage event then roll against damage probability to see if driver has damaged vehicle
If damaged
Roll a damage level between min and max from driver skill table.
Roll a random damage event type (This is the description you see in the results screen).
A retirement damage level will end the race for the AI driver here.
If not damaged then roll for puncture against the puncture probability from the driver skill table.
Calculate final split time
Set split time to current Bogey Time for that section based on car and track combination.
Add a random percentage to split time between min and max variation from the driver skill table. (This is the main difficulty modifier)
Add a percentage to split time for any wet race bonus, if applicable.
Add a percentage to split time for any night race bonus, if applicable.
Add a percentage to split time depending on number of punctures and any penalties for carrying unused spare tires.
Add a percentage to split time for any current damage event level.
With this system we can balance both the speed and the risks of higher level damage to AI drivers of different difficulties. Having a simulation for generating virtual AI driver times allows us more flexibility to model opponents over a full championship, and to add in future variables which would not be possible with a more basic database of times approach.

https://www.dirtgame.com/blog/5313

 

[danowat]

Rubber banding bs was brought up very first time about a week ago by someone here and now some people are so sure AI is rubber banding? DR had been out for a year before and no-one else noticed it before?

https://www.dirtgame.com/blog/5313

Maybe that is for the PC version, and the console versions use a different type of AI due to computational restraints?, could also answer why it hasn't be brought up before.

 

[dsmoke1986]

I'm trying my best to get into the flow of Dirt Rally, but it's just too simmy for it's own good; it is just not a fun racer, I'm sorry.

Hoping the game opens up a bit as you play more, but I'm about 3 hours in, and bored to death.

 

[DrGonzo615]

I'm trying my best to get into the flow of Dirt Rally, but it's just too simmy for it's own good; it is just not a fun racer, I'm sorry.

Hoping the game opens up a bit as you play more, but I'm about 3 hours in, and bored to death.

Eh it doesnt really. What you see is what you get. Its a shame too, the game has a friggin amazing physics model but I just wish there was a bit more of a carrot to keep playing other than just buying cars and redoing the same season over and over.

 

[danowat]

Eh it doesnt really. What you see is what you get. Its a shame too, the game has a friggin amazing physics model but I just wish there was a bit more of a carrot to keep playing other than just buying cars and redoing the same season over and over.

It's a common complaint with sim games, there is usually little gamification when it comes to games from the genre.

I am happy enough just to drive, I don't really need a carrot, just give me a load of cars and a load of tracks and I'm happy.

 

[DrGonzo615]

It's a common complaint with sim games, there is usually little gamification when it comes to games from the genre.

I am happy enough just to drive, I don't really need a carrot, just give me a load of cars and a load of tracks and I'm happy.

I really do wish there were more tracks. I would gladly pay for a track DLC package.

 

[Lima]

It's a common complaint with sim games, there is usually little gamification when it comes to games from the genre.

I am happy enough just to drive, I don't really need a carrot, just give me a load of cars and a load of tracks and I'm happy.

I also really like their approach of not starting out from 1960's and then basically just going through all the classes. You can just try out something new if you want or stick to what you are comfortable driving with.

 

[jediyoshi]

I'm trying my best to get into the flow of Dirt Rally, but it's just too simmy for it's own good; it is just not a fun racer, I'm sorry.

Fortunately those things aren't mutually exclusive

 

[Bedlam]

Latest I read was that some online events had been planned to coincide with the real rally season.

And the DR team were going back to work on the game for reasons currently unknown

https://www.dirtgame.com/blog/5561

Man, I hope they are working on DLC that contains Australia and/or Africa.

 

[DD]

Man, I hope they are working on DLC that contains Australia and/or Africa.

Or Argentina and/or Mexico. :3

EDIT: and New Zealand.

 

[danowat]

Finished 3rd in the league (so far) and actually got the (current) fastest time on the night stage.

That Lancia Delta is a cracking car to drive, so neutral.

 

[jdw_b]

How do I join the PC league guys?

Just got the game over the weekend, very impressed with how it feels so far

guys pls

 

[HueyFreeman]

I'm trying my best to get into the flow of Dirt Rally, but it's just too simmy for it's own good; it is just not a fun racer, I'm sorry.

Hoping the game opens up a bit as you play more, but I'm about 3 hours in, and bored to death.

The goal of the single player mode is to race at higher levels, earning more money and buy the best cars. So the ultimate goal of someone playing the single player is enjoying the feel of each new car they buy and progressing it through a rally. Given how incredibly different the cars can feel, I definitely enjoy that - but if you don't, then no the game won't get better.

I probably would have preferred they expand the career structure more, but the racing is so good it is overshadows everything, particularly for a game clearly developed under constraints.

 

[DavidDesu]

Had the game a couple of days and played it properly today. Now I think I have my control settings where I want them to be it's a joy. Couple of things that are disappointing.

I've really noticed the lack of vibration feedback in this game. It's so muted as to be almost non existent. I'm blasting down a straight bit of track going over bumps and moving around and the vibration motor is literally whirring so pathetically once or twice and that's it. Games like PGR and Driveclub did such a great job delivering that second to second detailed feedback of the road surface and making you feel far more involved, AND delivering vital information straight to your subconscience, this kind of feedback is sorely lacking here!

Another thing, I was just doing the second stage of the German Rally, my first time there with my Mini and I got told "crest" "immediate 5 left", so I coasted over the crest and steered left expecting a nice gentle corner. Nope it was more like a 2 and there was bricks and a spectator at the other side that I drove straight into. Great! Some of the calls are just a bit off. A lot of 4s on a Monaco stage were definitely more like 2s to me!

Other than that great game.

 

[Lima]

I've really noticed the lack of vibration feedback in this game. It's so muted as to be almost non existent. I'm blasting down a straight bit of track going over bumps and moving around and the vibration motor is literally whirring so pathetically once or twice and that's it. Games like PGR and Driveclub did such a great job delivering that second to second detailed feedback of the road surface and making you feel far more involved, AND delivering vital information straight to your subconscience, this kind of feedback is sorely lacking here!

I assume you went into options > controls > vibration & feedback and upped all values there to 150%?

 

[Robaperas]

guys pls

NeoGAF League PC, just click Join League or Request Join, I don't remember what it says exactly. Good luck!


So my Dualshock 4 died a bit, so I'll be out for a week or two... I'm using an old PS2 pad for now and it feels terrible.

 

[Sarcasm]

What are the suggested controller settings? (XB1 controller here)

 

[xrnzaaas]

I finally had the time to finish the league event. I'm happy with my results on stages 1-4, 5 could be better and that cost me a couple of places. I didn't have a lot of prior experience with the Lancia Delta, but it feels like a perfect car to drive.

 

[danowat]

What are the suggested controller settings? (XB1 controller here)

IMO, there is nothing wrong with the default settings

I finally had the time to finish the league event. I'm happy with my results on stages 1-4, 5 could be better and that cost me a couple of places. I didn't have a lot of prior experience with the Lancia Delta, but it feels like a perfect car to drive.

What is your tag on racenet?

 

[jdw_b]

NeoGAF League PC, just click Join League or Request Join, I don't remember what it says exactly. Good luck!


So my Dualshock 4 died a bit, so I'll be out for a week or two... I'm using an old PS2 pad for now and it feels terrible.

Thanks buddy! Joined

 

[xrnzaaas]

IMO, there is nothing wrong with the default settings



What is your tag on racenet?

It's strangerGOL. Like I said I was doing fine (for my level of skill ) until the last stage. I often lose a lot of time in the section with the two water splashes - I either crash when I'm going blind after driving through water or I hit the pole in that 180 degree turn.

 

[danowat]

It's strangerGOL. Like I said I was doing fine (for my level of skill ) until the last stage. I often lose a lot of time in the section with the two water splashes - I either crash when I'm going blind after driving through water or I hit the pole in that 180 degree turn.

Ahh, yeah, I see you now, 9th ain't bad!, I love that final section of Bidno Moorland, that tight corner around the pole and the following tight corners just feels so, so good when you nail it just right.

 

[DavidDesu]

I assume you went into options > controls > vibration & feedback and upped all values there to 150%?

Oh dear... I'll look into that. Embarrassed now.

 

[DryvBy]

Amazon DOD is $44.99 FYI

 

[H3rTz DoNuT]

Subaru or Mitsubishi for R4? Can't really decide myself, both seem ok. Which one do you guys prefer?

 

[Makikou]

Subaru or Mitsubishi for R4? Can't really decide myself, both seem ok. Which one do you guys prefer?

Mitsubishi. More power, less weight. Make sure to notice that you don't need to max rev the Mitsubishi for full power. You'll notice quite a difference in acceleration response if you shift closer to the max power/rpm value.

 

[danowat]

Subaru or Mitsubishi for R4? Can't really decide myself, both seem ok. Which one do you guys prefer?

Subaru for me, seems much more balanced and stable.

 

[Lima]

Subaru or Mitsubishi for R4? Can't really decide myself, both seem ok. Which one do you guys prefer?

The Evo. Little less weight and better acceleration. Plus the gear ratio is all fucked up on the Subaru with the default setup. You will never even reach 5th gear on most stages much less 6th.

 

[danowat]

Man, today's wager event is TENSE.

 

[H3rTz DoNuT]

Do I have any chance to win Masters Rally Championship with Hyundai? I though I was buying VW Polo, but I bought a freaking Hyundai by accident, so now I have no money, a Hyundai and Masters to win.

 

[op_ivy]

Subaru or Mitsubishi for R4? Can't really decide myself, both seem ok. Which one do you guys prefer?

evo x. its a better car. yes i'm biased :O

 

[Lima]

Do I have any chance to win Masters Rally Championship with Hyundai? I though I was buying VW Polo, but I bought a freaking Hyundai by accident, so now I have no money, a Hyundai and Masters to win.

Don't see why not. It's a very easy and forgiving car although slower than the other 3 in its class.

Do you have hillclimb on master unlocked? Set up a custom championship with 4 events/1 per stage and if you get lucky and don't get the full course that is 400k in like 20-30 minutes including loading times and stuff.
Also abandon the first run and only do the second. It's what I do when I need money in this game.

 

[Shambalakan]

Does thie game have a solid career mode? I want lots of events and races and motivation for playing career, not like Project Cars.

 

[danowat]

Does thie game have a solid career mode? I want lots of events and races and motivation for playing career, not like Project Cars.

In a word, no.

If you didn't like the career in PCars, I doubt you'll enjoy this one, might be wise to steer clear if you need motivation in the guise of gamification.