NormalFish
Banned
why can't it be?
What if there was a hero that scrambled all your hotkeys, inkls? you'd ban that hero every time. You know you would. Cause that's fucking bullshit. It's like that. But somewhat less bullshit.
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DOTA 2 BETA 2 |OT10| Reborn
- Thread starter SteveWinwood
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What if there was a hero that scrambled all your hotkeys, inkls? you'd ban that hero every time. You know you would. Cause that's fucking bullshit. It's like that. But somewhat less bullshit.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
It's great in theory, but in practice 90% of players just pick the one carry in their list and call it a day.
It would honestly be fun if there was a single draft tournament in which you can't see your opponents team until everyone has picked, but there would be tons of RNG.
QoP was recking my shit mid so I just left the lane after three deaths and helped out elswhere around the map. She snowballed but fell off so hard and the rest of her team was garbage so we easily won.
Might have been a different story if I just stayed mid and got rolled all game long lol.
Might have been a different story if I just stayed mid and got rolled all game long lol.
poppedcollar69
Member
my god slardar needs a model update
D
Deleted member 77995
Unconfirmed Member
Looking at my lineup of heroes that I really want to nail down and solely focus on I got.
carry - am, wraith king (?)
mid - tinker
support - earthshaker, dazzle, oracle
jungle - ursa, enchantress
offlane - clock, earthspirit, bristleback
http://www.dotabuff.com/players/98006962
Thoughts? Maybe just focus on one hero or role at a time?
carry - am, wraith king (?)
mid - tinker
support - earthshaker, dazzle, oracle
jungle - ursa, enchantress
offlane - clock, earthspirit, bristleback
http://www.dotabuff.com/players/98006962
Thoughts? Maybe just focus on one hero or role at a time?
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
It's important to choose heroes that you actually like playing as, but I recommend holding off on trying to learn Earth Spirit and to a lesser extent Tinker as they're both completely unique and difficult heroes to learn how to play at a decent level. You might want to try some more straightforward mids like Lesh, Lina, QoP, SF, etc before learning Tinker.
I wrote the post thinking he was a newbee, but in hindsight it's still okay.
call_kotaku
Member
Playing a ton of different supports for the 10 hero challenges has opened my eyes to a lot more of the game, I think.
It also made me realize how badly most people play support heroes in my bracket. If you realize you have a lane advantage and your core understands what you're trying to do then it's a totally awesome experience, but that's so rare because chances are someone in your lane has no idea why their hero is good, and I've totally been that idiot carry that didn't understand why my support was walking so far forward and pinging furiously.
It also made me realize how badly most people play support heroes in my bracket. If you realize you have a lane advantage and your core understands what you're trying to do then it's a totally awesome experience, but that's so rare because chances are someone in your lane has no idea why their hero is good, and I've totally been that idiot carry that didn't understand why my support was walking so far forward and pinging furiously.
All Blur really messes with is your perception. I consider it more of a mental trick than anything, because it makes you have to worry about PA in a different way than you would any other hero.
There's a huge difference in just making a minimap icon disappear from the minimap vs something like scrambling your hotkeys. Removing an icon from the minimap is basically a mind game. Competitive games can be all about mind games. Lets use CSGO as an example. Flashbangs, Smoke Grenades, and Decoys, all these things mess with your perception of what is actually happening. I mean technically a Flashbang turns your UI white.
NormalFish
Banned
it's not a 'mindgame' and flashbangs don't mess with your UI in the same way. Honestly I don't play CS enough to tell you if your actual UI goes white when they hit you, but regardless, flashbangs generally make sense. They hit you and your character is blinded. Seems pretty consistent with the in-game effect. PA's blur causes your minimap to not show the player something that they expect the minimap to show them, which I think is just out of the realm of what a hero should be able to do, as I said.
For the sake of covering all the points, a mindgame is more like techies signs or playing really aggressively when your supports are off the map even though they're not nearby. Totally different.
All it means is that you have to take a special precaution to keep track of her. You don't have to buy any extra items for the minimap effect specifically (evasion is a different story), you are probably looking at other heroes around the minimap anyway, and at the same time, you would also be thinking "The other team has a PA, she's probably on that lane I see nobody on the minimap at" and you click and there she is, farming away. It's a small mindgame that isn't unfair at all.
NormalFish
Banned
Man, I'm not going to argue with what you find fun. I'm not even arguing that it's unfair/difficult to manage/whatever, which seems to be what you're arguing against.
Unless you were joking about the bolded, your argument was that mechanics like Blur shouldn't be part of a competitive game, correct?
NormalFish
Banned
those were unrelated statements, man. My preference for CSGO as a spectator sport stems from the potential for raw skill to actually win a game despite being way behind, which I think is very cool and not as true in MOBAs or RTS.
My argument about Blur is that I think the skill is outside what the realm of a dota hero should be able to do. It effects an aspect of the game that I don't think should be made at all inconsistent. Which is why I mentioned hotkeys.
poppedcollar69
Member
can a mod split this discussion off into its own thread
call_kotaku
Member
D
Deleted member 77995
Unconfirmed Member
yall have two different arguments going on
just can it nerds
just can it nerds
What exactly is inconsistent about it? It's a skill the hero has, and it has a consistent effect. There's no RNG to her disappearing from the minimap, it just happens when you aren't close to her. I mean, if you think Minefield Sign is "within the realm of what a hero should be able to do" and Blur isn't, that seems like a double standard to me.
How dare people have an argument about Dota in a Dota thread.
D
Deleted member 77995
Unconfirmed Member
yall arent even on the same page, there's no argument.
5076
Get on my level
How can blur be real if the UI isnt real?
SecretMoblin
Member
Necro messes with a core game mechanic in a very fundamental way, a way that's much more frustrating than having to move your camera around every minute and talk with your team to keep tabs on PA tbh.
I'd much rather have a PA meta than a necro one but I'm glad both are out of favor atm
NormalFish
Banned
Necro messes with a core game mechanic in a very fundamental way, a way that's much more frustrating than having to move your camera around every minute and talk with your team to keep tabs on PA tbh.
I'd much rather have a PA meta than a necro one but I'm glad both are out of favor atm
OH! necro is the other one, I knew there was another. Thank you.
Yeah, Necro is also dumb.
Isn't Vanguard a total waste on Tidehunter? I just finished a match where we dominated the first fifteen minutes. But then our Tidehunter botched a series of Ravages that cost us the game. Why? Because he couldn't get in position. He utterly whiffed three or four times. When I checked his inventory, he had rushed a Vanguard instead of a Blink Dagger. And then he bought a Hood of Defiance. Oh well.
D
Deleted member 77995
Unconfirmed Member
attacks check against his passive and then vanguard/stout shield so ye, kinda pointless.
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1610635591
Our lane gave up first blood + double kill. We did a bunch of stupid shit like solo rosh against a Bloodseeker or chasing the Aegis carrier to their T2. At least I got a bunch of counter-initiations with Earthshaker. We won before I could use my refresher orb though.
Our lane gave up first blood + double kill. We did a bunch of stupid shit like solo rosh against a Bloodseeker or chasing the Aegis carrier to their T2. At least I got a bunch of counter-initiations with Earthshaker. We won before I could use my refresher orb though.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
It's 100% wasted gold, kraken shell is a way stronger Vanguard. Tide usually goes Blink/Mek first if he's not an idiot.
Stout Shield isn't necessarily wasted gold though, it's pretty valuable until you get 1/2 points in Kraken Shell, then it becomes useless, so it can help you survive in lane until you get those levels.
How exactly is that dumb? I don't see the issue with delaying respawn time or disabling buyback. They are both game mechanics and that hero is unique for being able to interact with them. He still has to choose who he uses the ultimate on, or just blow it on someone just to ensure a kill, and not have it to remove someone that really needed to not be able to buy back.
On another note, I think 6.84c is my favorite Dota patch. I had some gripes with 6.84 and 6.84b, but they have resolved pretty much all of my issues with it. There's no heroes that are completely 6.83 Troll/Sniper levels of disgusting right now. Are some heroes OP right now? Sure, Leshrac is a pretty ridiculous mid laner right now due to lightning jump range being so absurd, but then even beyond that, he still can't completely snowball and basically win games by himself. He still has great presence elsewhere, but he isn't going to basically faceroll a team like Sniper or Troll in 6.83.
I'd say probably more of the roster than any other patch is viable right now too. Even Huskar has gotten to a point where he's not terrible and just "Eh" now (He's still not picked in competitive). No carries are straight up irrelevant right now. In some patches it used to be picking Anti-Mage, Spectre, or Medusa was usually an auto-loss, especially in pubs. Now you can roll with Gyrocopter or Spectre and have a fighting chance if you play it right. The list of "bad" heroes is so damn short right now, that I can probably list them all right now:
- Elder Titan
- Terrorblade
...I think that's it. I looked at the hero pool and didn't think of anyone else that I would not feel comfortable picking. Having all the Aghs upgrades is great, sure, there are some bad ones that definitely need tweaking. Nature's Prophet is a prime example of this as his Aghs still presents the same problem his old one did: Pushes the lanes out all the time so your team can't farm AND it gives the enemy farm. I like the idea of an "instant superpush" kind of thing, but they really need a way to combat the major downsides to it, or make it even better so the downsides are worth it, or something.
I honestly kind of hope we don't get a new patch by TI5, I like this one and want to see TI5 played on it.
Like others have said, yeah, it was a waste of money. Kraken Shell does more for you and is a freebie passive. Hero has good survivability already, and if he really needs more you can get Mek after Blink. Blink is critical though, and going for a Vanguard is generally a waste of time.
Yeah. I couldn't believe it. I didn't flame him; that's never productive. But that cost our team a few fights, and we never recovered. The Hood was defensible. Our opponents had a Sand King, so a Pipe would be beneficial. But a fucking Vanguard? No.
Been awhile since this was posted
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hzxwoZDI9s
Probably the best Dota related video ever made.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hzxwoZDI9s
Probably the best Dota related video ever made.
Imp the Dimp
Member
Not so much vs. Bloodseeker but other than that, yeah. He's really useful.
Stronghammer22
Member
Solo offlane against a Kotl maxing mana leak is a new level of hell. I was Tide, I couldn't get anywhere close to xp range. Went to stack ancients, he comes and wards them. I had to completely abandon the lane and go sap xp from other lanes/jungle (Doom was there). :/ Not ideal, but we ended up stomping them because the other lanes won hard and it was only a Troll with free farm. Still, I hate you Kotl.
In regards to 6.84, it is a million times better than 6.83. That patch was the worst I've experienced since I started playing a few years ago. This one only needs a few adjustments and it's perfect in my eyes. First and foremost, fix Leshrac's Lightning Storm. Yeah, it used to be ass and no one skilled it, but now it's ridiculous. It does so much damage, slows for an easy follow up stun and is on a super low cooldown. At least one of these need to change. Bloodseeker, Tusk and QoP need minor nerfs, Glimmer Cape is too cheap for what it gives you.
In regards to 6.84, it is a million times better than 6.83. That patch was the worst I've experienced since I started playing a few years ago. This one only needs a few adjustments and it's perfect in my eyes. First and foremost, fix Leshrac's Lightning Storm. Yeah, it used to be ass and no one skilled it, but now it's ridiculous. It does so much damage, slows for an easy follow up stun and is on a super low cooldown. At least one of these need to change. Bloodseeker, Tusk and QoP need minor nerfs, Glimmer Cape is too cheap for what it gives you.
With what lineups?
I feel like his laning stage is pretty rough this patch, and BF seems underwhelming.
Imp the Dimp
Member
Yeah, nerf Lesh, Bloodseeker, Tusk, QoP and Glimmer Cape just a little bit and boom - best patch ever.
I think I enjoyed 6.81 and 6.79 the most.
I think I enjoyed 6.81 and 6.79 the most.
NormalFish
Banned
Remember to remove ancients farming necro. For my heart.
BibleThumpPlz give next IHL, my life has no meaning now.
D
Deleted member 77995
Unconfirmed Member
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1611039082
lil salty on this one but I honestly made at least a dozen mistakes porting in and fucking up kills. My mana management with tinker late game is pretty horrid too
lil salty on this one but I honestly made at least a dozen mistakes porting in and fucking up kills. My mana management with tinker late game is pretty horrid too
Cyborgmatt
Member
Some new models in the Reborn files that people haven't noticed yet.
Desert creeps:
Vulture shopkeeper:
Meepo's father (also a shopkeeper):
Desert creeps:
Vulture shopkeeper:
Meepo's father (also a shopkeeper):
I played 1 ranked match last night. My first in months. First thing that happens the second the game loads is the Earthshaker blasting "I'm in Love With the Coco" over voice chat.
Don't ever change, Dota.
Don't ever change, Dota.
Honestly i feel quite the opposite. It's harder to get BF after the lane creeps and jungle creeps bounty nerf but once you get it it's quite noticeable the networth boom between you and your enemy's peers. My take on it is that everyone is affected by the bounty nerf but AM can counterpoint it by being able to farm faster than all carries after he gets BF (maybe gyro and max greed alch can keep up). So in the end he ends up almost unaffected by the nerf. Also, laning is slower for him now but so is for everyone else so there's less risk of being ganked by an orchid QoP or Storm as soon as it was before.
I'm currently 5-0 with AM in 6.84 and the lineups I've been with weren't that amazing, although they were decent at holding high ground which gave me time to farm enemy jungle and lanes while the enemy was 5-manning.
Another thing that really favors him is the abundance of intelligence heroes being picked.
Shuggananas
Banned
40% buff on creeps to BF was pretty strong
the strength of BF depends on the skill level of players
at my 2k scrub level where you get PAs who have a 30 minute BF and nothing else to show for it, its a really fucking underwhelming item.
at my 2k scrub level where you get PAs who have a 30 minute BF and nothing else to show for it, its a really fucking underwhelming item.
Vulture looks so fucking cool
D
Deleted member 77995
Unconfirmed Member
to be fair, you also get shit like supports rushing aghs/dagon's. mid's that are 8-0 20 mins in but still haven't completed an item and offlaners that have had every chance to kill a support or carry and simply don't know it. afk junglers or lane cutting axe's seem to do the best in the normal ranked brackets.
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