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Dota 2 Beta Thread V: Real Talk Strikes Back [Tutorials]
- Thread starter Artanisix
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I was invisible (don't think there was any true sight form the other team) as Nyx, and I was behind the tree in our side shop, with someone else on my team in front of that tree. The enemy Windrunner threw a Shackleshot, and it hits BOTH HIM AND ME, going through the tree. The tooltip says nothing about this, nor have I ever read anything about it before.
Explain this bullshit.
Explain this bullshit.
Mr Touchdown
Member
Icefrog on Dev site.
you sound like a toxic player
havent you seen his streams?
That tells me nothing about why the Shackleshot goes through the tree.
I was bottom with warlock
mirana went top with crystal maiden
and sniper was mid
Yeah, it was just a pub, I was playing by myself, so eh.
I know this sounds like alien technology, but you can download the replay and check for yourself.
iirc it checks for heroes first. I remember that from one of the old changelogs. They probably forgot to add that to the tooltip
but im at work achie
can i just open the replay without running steam and dota or do i need more alien technology
Warlocks items :S
I was only kidding guys
I wish...Imagine if I called it now though? It wouldn't happen, it'd screw up the game economy but ahh well.
I'm pretty sure the spell prioritizes heroes/units over trees
I was only kidding guys
Imagine if I called it now though? It wouldn't happen, it'd screw up the game economy but ahh well.
ahhh you sonova... why I oughtta..
SteveWinwood
Member
butterfly warlock new meta
Valvo greedy companyI was only kidding guys
Imagine if I called it now though? It wouldn't happen, it'd screw up the game economy but ahh well.
I would buy that set. Goddamn.
Schweinehund
Member
Got some insomnia, nothing better to do than make up some new agh effects. Trying to make them interesting sidegrades, I feel that aghs should be a viable choice and not a necessary core item. Only thought of a few for some of my favorite heroes. Its hard to make them for carries when you're looking to add some flexibility instead of just pure damage. The second issue is that you're not looking to make things complicated or add entirely new game mechanics. The third issue is to not make them so good because aghs already gives a good wealth of stats.
These aren't balanced by any means, just looking for stuff that emphasizes what makes the hero fun, numbers could always be padded later.
Phantom Assassin:
Option #1: Coup de Grace is now 350/450/550% crit damage, 15% chance.
Let's face it, people pick PA to get huge crits. It is fun to see big numbers. This aghs aims for more fun aspect, I'm not going to bother running the math to see what would be a bigger payoff in damage increase between this and a similar priced item such as desolator.
Option #2: New spell, Memento Mori, a new ability that makes your next attack automatically crit based on your Ult's level. Doesn't interfere with PRG, has a shorter cooldown.
This option adds more control to PA, which is arguably what she lacks. Being able to focus your burst when it is needed could be a huge asset.
Lone Druid:
(re)adds new spell to true form, One. For those unfamiliar it was an old lone druid passive that split damage between the druid and the bear.
I like the idea of this agh because it encourages a more upfront playstyle of lone druid. Current builds emphasize building all your items on the bear and sitting back, even with true form.
Troll Warlord:
Reduces Troll's BAT to 1.0 while Battle Trance is active
Similar to PA's reasoning on her option #1.
Dragon Knight:
New rank form, White Dragon form. Adds a passive effect in addition to blue dragon form's effect, reduces damage dealt to those affected by the splash by 20% (both physical and magical) and attack speed by 20%.
I wanted to add a sidegrade, something that would make DK more viable in a secondary role, building up more tanky with pipe or heaven's halberd.
These aren't balanced by any means, just looking for stuff that emphasizes what makes the hero fun, numbers could always be padded later.
Phantom Assassin:
Option #1: Coup de Grace is now 350/450/550% crit damage, 15% chance.
Let's face it, people pick PA to get huge crits. It is fun to see big numbers. This aghs aims for more fun aspect, I'm not going to bother running the math to see what would be a bigger payoff in damage increase between this and a similar priced item such as desolator.
Option #2: New spell, Memento Mori, a new ability that makes your next attack automatically crit based on your Ult's level. Doesn't interfere with PRG, has a shorter cooldown.
This option adds more control to PA, which is arguably what she lacks. Being able to focus your burst when it is needed could be a huge asset.
Lone Druid:
(re)adds new spell to true form, One. For those unfamiliar it was an old lone druid passive that split damage between the druid and the bear.
I like the idea of this agh because it encourages a more upfront playstyle of lone druid. Current builds emphasize building all your items on the bear and sitting back, even with true form.
Troll Warlord:
Reduces Troll's BAT to 1.0 while Battle Trance is active
Similar to PA's reasoning on her option #1.
Dragon Knight:
New rank form, White Dragon form. Adds a passive effect in addition to blue dragon form's effect, reduces damage dealt to those affected by the splash by 20% (both physical and magical) and attack speed by 20%.
I wanted to add a sidegrade, something that would make DK more viable in a secondary role, building up more tanky with pipe or heaven's halberd.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
A couple thoughts:
-You're a bit spammy with your spells in the early game. I know Skywrath was haraasing you a bunch, and it can be a bit of a reflex to fire off a spell back, but you want to ask yourself "what is this getting me?". If the spell will get last hits on creeps, it might be a good idea. If the spell will force the enemy back to use regen also a good idea, especially if you time it so they're forced away from a fighting wave and miss out on hits themselves. Your blasts weren't really doing either. Lich is a bit more spammy then other heroes thanks to sacrifice but you're still coming up with a net negative on mana without much to show for it.
-You ran back to base early on at half health and mana. While you were taking a lot of damage out there, generally speaking its better to play cautious at half health but stick around and try to absorb XP (its got quite a long range) instead of running back all the time. Especially with Sacrifice and a Warlock in lane with you
-With that said, you did then run out with low health and get killed by Huskar. These are the kind of instincts you'll get with time, just a kind of constant mental calculation of "how likely am I to die where I am right now". Huskar and Skywrath (Huskar especially) just have such high DPS that you need to play cautious when laning against them and accept that you need to be the more defensive player.
-I don't know if it was deliberate, but if it was good job recognizing that Huskar and Skywrath were gone and pushing up to hit the tower in that opening.
-However considering the carnage in the top lane someone really should have gone to gank to keep them under control. Sniper would have had it easiest, but either you or Warlock could have done it, since you both have really high-imact ults. You just kept laning while they wracked up kills up top for like fifteen minutes
-You're actual fighting is pretty good, you have good reflexes and by 20 minutes or so you're a significant presence in fights, which is more then I can say for a lot of new Lichs.
-Okay, this is the big tip, mostly because it completely changed how I play Dota: shift click on items in the store to add their components to your quick buy bar. This is invaluable when you're learning. You can buy each component piece by piece as approprate and you're not constantly checking to see what you need.
-Also you can buy TP scrolls at the side shops.
-Your map awareness seems good in the mid game, so I'm wondering if early on you weren't thinking about doing anything up top because your instinct was just not to leave the lane?
-Ultimately although you took back the mid-game pretty nicely, you guys mishandled Ursa in two key ways that led to your downfall: ignoring his early game killing potential and letting him get fat up top, and then when he could take any one of you solo continuing to wander around as one or two people. Your teammates especially were going really far out and then getting eaten by Ursa in a matter of seconds. When you're dealing with a threat like that, group up and push (or turtle if their entire team outclasses you, but you guys had Warlock and Lich, so I'd have pushed as a group)
I'd say your weaknesses are the laning phase and understanding the flow of the game throughout all three phases. So cheer up, same issues that every new player has!
I'm no expert, but I would have focused on scepter before mech. While mech is great in team fights, scepter really powers up your ult, and if you're clobbering the other team, they're not going to be doing as much damage to your team.
Hmm, I never realized I was being a bit too spammy, I will definitely have to be more careful and keep asking myself that, so thank you
Yeah, I do have a bit of trouble with deciding when I need to head back, I don't wanna head back if it will mean not being able to help my team, but at the same time dying definitely does NOT help, so I will have to keep myself in check
Noted. They definitely drilled that into my head by the end of my game, and this only reinforces that.
Yeah, I knew what needed to be done, so I had to seize it.
I was thinking about it, but I wasn't sure if Warlock would be OK against both Huskar and Skymage, I definitely need to be more watchful next time.
Thanks
Wow, had no idea. Will definitely be using that
I had no idea, lmao! I feel so dumb.
As I said above, yeah I thought about it, but with Huskar dicking around at bot, wasn't sure if I would be able to risk it, and that was a big downfall.
Yeah, Ursa WRECKED our shit, and I tried to make sure we fought him 5v1..but sometimes people didn't listen :/
Hmm, you're definitely right!
Thank for the criticism!
Hmm, ok! I will try that out. I simply went mek before scepter because my guide has scepter under "situational" and says I should build mek ASAP unless someone else on my team is going to do it.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Someone should do one of those effectivness curves looking at how much damage is dealt in a reasonable number of attacks in the extra second versus how much damage would have come from building a different 4000 gold item
side shops generally have many laning items you will want
re mek over scept: mek is significantly cheaper, its fine to buy tbh. you shouldve encouraged your team to group up and push towers to take advantage of your mek and arcane boots + avoid people being caught by ursa.
drkirby is pretty good at meaningless analysis
I only watched the first 10 minutes.
1) When you start with Lich, stay by your lane's barracks. This way, you can deny one creep the moment they spawn, and deny another creep soon after the lanes meet.
2) You needed to be less aggressive early on. You are pretty lucky that the SWM and Huskar were scared/incompetent, cause I would've expected you to die much sooner than you did.
3) I think your starting items were Tango/Gauntlets/Ring? A better opener would've been Tango/Pot/Branches. Branches are more the more cost effective stats. And 200g worth of regen is always good to have especially if you're squishy.
4) At one point, you walked all the way back to fountain to heal, bought a tp, and then tp'd back to your tower. For 100g, you could've bought a healing pot and had the courier ferry it to you, while staying out of sight from SWM but still within range of creeps and exp (such as on the other side of the jungle).
1) Never thought of that, but I'll do that
, thanks!2) Noted, I'll be more defensive
3)Hmm, ok! I'll try that! My beginning items are: Tango, courier, wards, gauntlets, and ring. Though..I don't have enough money for all of those, lol.
4) Wow.. I am dumb. I cant believe I never thought of that, lol. Thanks!
Jinada on PA would be fun/broken as hell
Only because you were solo. If you had a partner yo could afford to be more aggressive.2) Noted, I'll be more defensive
If you're stuck with Courier AND wards duty, then you can still buy Tango/Pots/Branch/Branch.
Sure, but you only need it mid to late game, and it shouldn't be the responsibility of a new player to build one. Someone who is better at farming should take the cost hit.
Yeah, not a huge fan of being solo with Lich, lol
and awesome! Then I will do that next match I play
It's much better early game than late game.
I can see that, but when I've been support I've never been able to afford it early game even when I play well. I need at least a few items for myself first to survive.
but if you can never afford mek, why should you aim for aghs?
What? no, you need it early to mid, the itemis not good at lategame.
Not talking about playing lich, but mek in general. Seems I've been making it too late a priority. If I'm supporting, I try to get it by mid game, but maybe I should forgo some personal items to get it sooner.
bananabread
Member
Getting a buckler/headdress early is great for survivability and sustain on supports, especially in pubs where you're likely to be up against 2-3 autoattacking heroes so the extra armour will make you quite tanky. The hp aura and armour active on buckler also help a great deal with pushing, and if you can get an easy tower or two then the mek should be relatively easy to get.
It's still best bought on the support that's doing the pulling in safelane because you need some form of early game income to get it at a reasonable timing rather than someone who doesn't farm at all for the first 10 minutes, or on a utility hero/jungler that can farm relatively fast (Axe/Doom/Enigma etc).
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