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[elmariachi]

What Toby was right in my eyes, that the teams that made it have better players and the greater potential.

I like Kaipi, they played great their last tourney but they are a 1 man team.

 

[Cheeto]

I just like to see the best play at the International and the few games I saw of Kaipi were really solid games. I don't think saying "POTM BOTTOM GOT SCREWED LAST YEAR TOOOO" is a good argument. POTM Bottom shouldn't have been screwed either rofl. Year after year, as acknowledged by pros and the majority of players alike, some solid teams are getting jipped. That's something that needs to be fixed.

Just because the gaming community has a 5 minute attention span and 1-2 months seem like an enternity doesn't mean those teams are getting jipped. You can't expect invites to go to teams or brands that are this new.

 

[Schweinehund]

Yo so Mike Ross still play this cause otherwise imma switch to Rise of the Immortals?

he was actually in my last game.

 

[bounchfx]

The Concept artist I worked with for the Lycan set has a new set submitted! Check it out, it looks great!

http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=142922514

 

[Pureauthor]

Everything about the set looks good except for the colour scheme. The nice thing about having a standardized colour scheme is that it's easier to mix and match various parts.

 

[Aselith]

What's the deal with the horn?

 

[la flama blanca]

The Concept artist I worked with for the Lycan set has a new set submitted! Check it out, it looks great!

http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=142922514

Very cool!

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

I just like to see the best play at the International and the few games I saw of Kaipi were really solid games. I don't think saying "POTM BOTTOM GOT SCREWED LAST YEAR TOOOO" is a good argument. POTM Bottom shouldn't have been screwed either rofl. Year after year, as acknowledged by pros and the majority of players alike, some solid teams are getting jipped. That's something that needs to be fixed.

I thought at the time POTM were consistently beating top teams? How many major wins does Kaipi have under their belt right now?

 

[Lotto]

What's the deal with the horn?

Looks really good though. Agreed with the color scheme unfortunately. It could look weird when wearing pieces of the set in combination with others.

 

[Anbokr]

Who would you replace with Kaipi?

I wouldn't. I'd simply expand the qualifiers or like the pros on that cast suggested, have a mini-qualifier for the qualifiers.

What Toby was right in my eyes, that the teams that made it have better players and the greater potential.

Except Tobi isn't a professional player and all 3 pro players on that cast said Kaipi had the highest chance of winning the qualifiers and the most potential down the road. Sure an opinion is an opinion, but I'll take an agreement among pros over anything Tobi has to say.

 

[ksan]

G1 League style qualifiers would have been the best imo, I really liked that format.
Then again, does it matter? None of the teams in the western qualifier have a chance at TI3, with the exception of EG on a good day.

 

[spootime]

streaming some pubs with my friend if anyone wants to watch http://www.twitch.tv/spooed

Bummed about kp not getting in as I wanted to see how arteezy would do against mids in a competitive settings. He was showing some scrim replays on his stream last night of them absolutely smashing aL, but scrims are scrims I guess. As other people have said they should have had a qualifier for the qualifier or increased the team pool.

 

[elmariachi]

I don't get the point you are trying to make because other teams that did qualify have more pros in their roosters.

The pros on that episode were just being sympathetic.

 

[Artanisix]

The only truth bomb he dropped was "scrims don't mean shit." Everything else he said was "let's oppose for opposition's sake" garbage. When you have 3 pro players from 3 separate teams and 3 separate backgrounds, 2 invited and 1 in the qualifiers, all shocked saying Kaipi was the favorite to win the qualifiers; I highly doubt that comes from not wanting to hurt EE's feelings.

I just like to see the best play at the International and the few games I saw of Kaipi were really solid games. I don't think saying "POTM BOTTOM GOT SCREWED LAST YEAR TOOOO" is a good argument. POTM Bottom shouldn't have been screwed either rofl. Year after year, as acknowledged by pros and the majority of players alike, some solid teams are getting jipped. That's something that needs to be fixed.

Potm bottom had more recognition back then than KP does right now. Majority of players? Who? Loud-mouth NA whiners? Did you even watch MAAD? It was a podcast full of, guess who, EE's friends and Tobiwan. No one outside of a few IXDL players even knows who the hell Arteezy is. He's a pubstar with ZERO tournament/competitive experience. TI3 would have been his FIRST tournament. Yeah right, as if he deserves to go to TI3 over more stable and experienced players. He's all hype and no show.

You haven't even see the current KP. No one has seen the current KP lineup. EE kicked out two players and replaced them with CWM and Arteezy 3 days before qualifiers were announced. When the new KP lineup makes some actual, tangible achievements aside from "OMG A-GOD GGGGGGG BEST MID IN THE WEST WHO HAS ZERO TOURNEY EXPERIENCE" then they can play at TI4.

 

[Green Biker Dude]

they should invite me to the ti3 as the wildcard player

i'd like to see them mute me there. cyka

 

[Ikuu]

I just like to see the best play at the International and the few games I saw of Kaipi were really solid games. I don't think saying "POTM BOTTOM GOT SCREWED LAST YEAR TOOOO" is a good argument. POTM Bottom shouldn't have been screwed either rofl. Year after year, as acknowledged by pros and the majority of players alike, some solid teams are getting jipped. That's something that needs to be fixed.

There's not enough slots for everyone, Kaipi haven't really done much, and the Qualifiers would be the first time their Mid player has even played a proper tournament.

 

[Anbokr]

Potm bottom had more recognition back then than KP does right now. Majority of players? Who? Loud-mouth NA whiners?

Didn't know Norway was part of North America.

You haven't even see the current KP. No one has seen the current KP lineup. EE kicked out two players and replaced them with CWM and Arteezy 3 days before qualifiers were announced. When the new KP lineup makes some actual, tangible achievements aside from "OMG A-GOD GGGGGGG BEST MID IN THE WEST WHO HAS ZERO TOURNEY EXPERIENCE" then they can play at TI4.

I didn't know this. I remember them doing really well in the past couple months, taking games off alliance and beating fnatic, qpad, and Dignitas; I assumed EE's talk of them having a more stable roster than the other qualifier teams meant it's been the same team beating out some big names for the last 2 months. If it's true, then I agree, they shouldn't be in the qualifiers over other teams.

Still think in general though that the qualifiers need to be more open to get the truly most deserving team in. By nature, the 14 invites make the international a pretty closed event; doesn't hurt to have pretty open qualifiers for the last 2 spots over 8 west vs 8 east.

 

[Mononoke]

Looks really good though. Agreed with the color scheme unfortunately. It could look weird when wearing pieces of the set in combination with others.

Lol @ Doug Funny. Can't be unseen.

 

[Ikuu]

Still think in general though that the qualifiers need to be more open to get the truly most deserving team in. By nature, the 14 invites make the international a pretty closed event; doesn't hurt to have pretty open qualifiers for the last 2 spots over 8 west vs 8 east.

Teams have an entire year to show that they're among the very best and deserve a slot.

 

[TommyT]

Still think in general though that the qualifiers need to be more open to get the truly most deserving team in. By nature, the 14 invites make the international a pretty closed event; doesn't hurt to have pretty open qualifiers for the last 2 spots over 8 west vs 8 east.

I could see there being a couple of spots in the qualifiers that are given to people that go through a more "open" qualifier tournament. You get your invites, invites to qualifiers, then a few play-in spots for the qualifiers.

 

[Archie]

http://www.moredota.com/Thread-DotA-Allstars-6-78-and-6-78b-coming-in-June-or-July.html

Might be fake but hey talking about it is fun.

 

[Anbokr]

Teams have an entire year to show that they're among the very best and deserve a slot.

This would fly if virtually every team except maybe every team on that qualifier list except for maybe ROX.KIS didn't have significant roster changes in the last couple months. Nobody knows how new Empire will perform, new Mouz. DD.dota changed their roster a few days ago. ICCup placed second in an insignificant tourney a few months ago and QPAD hasn't done anything. DD.dota hasn't won anything.

 

[Dynamic3]

The Concept artist I worked with for the Lycan set has a new set submitted! Check it out, it looks great!

http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=142922514

Did you create the Lich set in your avatar?

 

[Tobe]

Did you create the Lich set in your avatar?

yes he did.

 

[Gav47]

Has anyone ever had any problems with not receiving the correct amount of gold for their item on Dota2WH?

 

[Gully State]

Didn't know Norway was part of North America.



I didn't know this. I remember them doing really well in the past couple months, taking games off alliance and beating fnatic, qpad, and Dignitas; I assumed EE's talk of them having a more stable roster than the other qualifier teams meant it's been the same team beating out some big names for the last 2 months. If it's true, then I agree, they shouldn't be in the qualifiers over other teams.

Still think in general though that the qualifiers need to be more open to get the truly most deserving team in. By nature, the 14 invites make the international a pretty closed event; doesn't hurt to have pretty open qualifiers for the last 2 spots over 8 west vs 8 east.

I think all this does is highlight how subjective the whole process is and how there should've been a more cohesive league system in place to serve as qualifiers.

 

[Artanisix]

Open qualifiers to get into... qualifiers is just flat out bizarre for a tournament of this scale. The International is the biggest dota tournament. There'd be hundreds upon hundreds of teams that would sign up for the open qualifiers. I don't even want to think how ugly it would be to try and organize an open tournament of that magnitude. FGC tournaments like Evo can get away with "open" tournaments because of how short the matches are and the 1v1 format.

Nobody knows how new Empire will perform, new Mouz. ICcup placed second in an insignificant tourney a few months ago and QPAD hasn't done anything.

The difference being between then and KP is that they have players that have actually made a name for themselves.

 

[Ikuu]

Empire, Mouz, and QPAD are all sponsored teams, they've got backing and an infrastructure. Kaipi don't seem to have anything, seems like they're replaced everyone since they were founded.

 

[Anbokr]

The difference being between then and KP is that they have players that have actually made a name for themselves.

I'm not arguing that. I'm disputing Ikuu's statement that "teams have an entire year to show that they're among the very best and deserve a slot." Half these teams haven't done shit in a year; they were invited because they have well known players, not because those players have done anything with each other over the past year.

 

[F#A#Oo]

Have Valve removed the game history tab? Can't see it atm.

 

[TommyT]

Open qualifiers to get into... qualifiers is just flat out bizarre for a tournament of this scale. The International is the biggest dota tournament. There'd be hundreds upon hundreds of teams that would sign up for the open qualifiers. I don't even want to think how ugly it would be to try and organize an open tournament of that magnitude. FGC tournaments like Evo can get away with "open" tournaments because of how short the matches are and the 1v1 format.



The difference being between then and KP is that they have players that have actually made a name for themselves.

Well you obviously have to give them some type of prerequisites to be able to sign up. Come on now, I figured that would at least be a given.

 

[Anbokr]

Empire, Mouz, and QPAD are all sponsored teams, they've got backing and an infrastructure. Kaipi don't seem to have anything, seems like they're replaced everyone since they were founded.

Then say that lol. Don't pretend that "teams have an entire year to show that they're among the very best and deserve a slot." The qualifiers are basically for the teams that DIDN'T prove themselves in the past year.

 

[Schweinehund]

Have Valve removed the game history tab? Can't see it atm.

they redid the player profiles, there should be some text for recent games in the profiles that you click on..

 

[Tobe]

Have Valve removed the game history tab? Can't see it atm.

its in a corner from where the recent matches are showing.

 

[Ikuu]

Then say that lol. Don't pretend that "teams have an entire year to show that they're among the very best and deserve a slot." The qualifiers are basically for the teams that DIDN'T prove themselves in the past year.

It's for teams that didn't show enough to get an invite.

 

[Anbokr]

It's for teams that didn't show enough to get an invite.

Apparantly for teams that didn't show anything either. It's a very subjective process that seems to place emphasis on a sponsor and reputable names, trash team or not. Someone has to decide I guess.

 

[Artanisix]

Well you obviously have to give them some type of prerequisites to be able to sign up. Come on now, I figured that would at least be a given.

Then it's not an open qualifier anymore. It's just arbitrary and weird. What would the prerequisites by for an open qualifier to qualify for a qualifier be? "All your players must have tournament experience." Shit, well, KP fails that one :/

Here's a qualifier with these prerequisites. And if you win this qualifier, bam you get thrown into... the next qualifier! And if you win this qualifier, bam you get into... THE INTERNATIONAL!

 

[F#A#Oo]

its in a corner from where the recent matches are showing.

Ahh...thanks.

Such a crappy change. Ah well.

 

[TommyT]

Then it's not an open qualifier anymore. It's just arbitrary and weird. What would the prerequisites by for an open qualifier to qualify for a qualifier be? "All your players must have tournament experience." Shit, well, KP fails that one :/

Here's a qualifier with these prerequisites. And if you win this qualifier, bam you get thrown into... the next qualifier! And if you win this qualifier, bam you get into... THE INTERNATIONAL!

Exactly!

Spoiler

 

[Anbokr]

Then it's not an open qualifier anymore. It's just arbitrary and weird. What would the prerequisites by for an open qualifier to qualify for a qualifier be? "All your players must have tournament experience." Shit, well, KP fails that one :/

Here's a qualifier with these prerequisites. And if you win this qualifier, bam you get thrown into... the next qualifier! And if you win this qualifier, bam you get into... THE INTERNATIONAL!

the only prerequisite u need: gotta be thug

 

[shira]

What's the deal with the horn?

He's horny. Great set, terrible helmet

 

[mkenyon]

they should invite me to the ti3 as the wildcard player

i'd like to see them mute me there. cyka

You're quickly becoming one of my favorite posters on GAF.

No sarcasm.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

http://www.twitch.tv/neodota/b/398721137

Tobi did drop some truth bombs on dem kids.

If anything, the argument should have been to the end of extending the group of qualifiers to a 10/12/16 team qualifier. That's something everyone should be able to agree with. Doing invites like this is reminscent of the NCAA college football scene. Every year someone is bitter because matchups are decided by voters instead of on the field of play with a playoff system that affords the most likely (or even possible) teams a shot at glory. And here instead of having a large enough qualifier to let the teams decide who's most worthy "on the field", we have Valve simply picking teams based on some unknown, opaque process.

It's a game. Let the players decide who's worthy by their play. East and West, 16-team qualifiers each. Everyone with a realistic chance has a chance. Or, a straight-up 32-team qualifier, where the winner and runner-up get in, and let the West prove they're as good as the East without any separation.

 

[I H8 Memes]

Everything should be decided via competition. Anything else makes any sport that uses that method seem weak. And never should matchups be more than best of 3. And no losers bracket. Winners win by winning.


Also, some modeler should make a codpiece for Faceless Void and name "The Clockblocker". Bet it would sell like hotcakes.

 

[Captain Fish]

So I tried Elder Titan, and I'm not sure how you're supposed to use him. All of his stuff seems super predictable and easy to avoid...

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Everything should be decided via competition. Anything else makes any sport that uses that method seem weak. And never should matchups be more than best of 3. And no losers bracket. Winners win by winning.

Absolutely. Too bad they spent half the discussion talking about who didn't seem "quite as qualified", and then not feeling honest enough to NOT say KP just because Envy was sitting there on the call.

Bottom line: if there is potential for controversy, remove it by making the qualifier field larger. Most sports figured that out long ago. With the exception of NCAA College football, they all have a robust playoff system, and none of the teams that get left out can honestly say they could have won it all had they have been able to make the cut. NCAA basketball probably does it better than anyone. 65-team tournament. If you're not good enough to even be considered in the top 65, you have nothing to complain about anyway.

As for Dota...the limit of 8 qualifiers separated into East and West creates 2 unnecessary barriers to judge the skill of teams:

1.) The artificial limit of 8 unnecessarily leaves off a few teams that are good enough to compete and adds unnecessary stress to IceFrog & Co.'s day.

2.) It can punish a given region for being too good. What if the best 2 teams in either qualifier are from the West? What if the East runner-up could have taken the West winner 3-0? Put them all together and let them play it out. It's not like TI3 will be separated into East and West, so why do the qualifiers like that.

 

[mkenyon]

Everything should be decided via competition. Anything else makes any sport that uses that method seem weak. And never should matchups be more than best of 3. And no losers bracket. Winners win by winning.


Also, some modeler should make a codpiece for Faceless Void and name "The Clockblocker". Bet it would sell like hotcakes.

It's just as much about the stories and teams as it is what's currently hot though.

I've been around a lot of esports for a really long time, and there seems to be a consistent pool of people that dive in and out of teams, leading to really inconsistent play. The storied teams of CoD 1 arent the randoms that got thrown together and won a tourney or two, it's U5 who stuck together for years.

The International isn't any tournament. It's there to reward and showcase not only talent, but the teams that put in the hours and bring attention to their game. I think keeping it that way maintains a bit of class, making it the special event that it is.

You don't see a soccer club who was thrown together with all-stars win the UEFA.

 

[F#A#Oo]

So I tried Elder Titan, and I'm not sure how you're supposed to use him. All of his stuff seems super predictable and easy to avoid...

I'm pretty sure you have to get blink...

 

[shira]

So I tried Elder Titan, and I'm not sure how you're supposed to use him. All of his stuff seems super predictable and easy to avoid...

wombo to combo, talk to your team

Tobi did drop some truth bombs on dem kids.

If anything, the argument should have been to the end of extending the group of qualifiers to a 10/12/16 team qualifier. That's something everyone should be able to agree with. Doing invites like this is reminscent of the NCAA college football scene. Every year someone is bitter because matchups are decided by voters instead of on the field of play with a playoff system that affords the most likely (or even possible) teams a shot at glory. And here instead of having a large enough qualifier to let the teams decide who's most worthy "on the field", we have Valve simply picking teams based on some unknown, opaque process.

It's a game. Let the players decide who's worthy by their play. East and West, 16-team qualifiers each. Everyone with a realistic chance has a chance. Or, a straight-up 32-team qualifier, where the winner and runner-up get in, and let the West prove they're as good as the East without any separation.

Valve is paying the bills so they get to pick.

 

[JustinBB7]

I'm pretty sure you have to get blink...

I doubt it. All his spells take 3 years to channel. It wouldn't help much. What you need is some nice set up. RP/Black hole seems perfect for him. But problem is, ET is kinda the same role as those heroes.. but other heroes do it better.