Dota 2 Beta Thread V: Real Talk Strikes Back [Tutorials]

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Kreunt said:
well played.
well played.
well played.
well played.
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Those I can at least mute them to get around that...but when I see them in the safelane pushing up way too far, mid is missing, and they are at half health already, I can't help but get a bit annoyed when they die and ping everyone on the map as if to imply that we should all be TPing over to him at any sign of trouble ever, and always.

In fact, I don't think I've run into a muted player that actually plays well to date.

I don't even try and screw them or anything, I play as I normally do despite these people, but they always do crazy ass shit and end up feeding or not joining teamfights or rage-buybacking...dumb shit.

How they got into the very high level bracket in the first place, I have no idea.
 
cheezcake said:
The thing I've noticed is that people who keep on flaming other teammates tend to be the worst players on the team anyway
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Nothing is more fun than queuing up by yourself and getting put on a queued-together team where the entire team starts ripping on you for not doing exactly what they want you to.

"Rubick, go top lane, buy wards and block the camp and give us a rune ward" (not a problem...but was I not going to do this anyways if I went top?)

"Get out of my lane!" (when rotating)

"LEVITATE HIM NOW! DO IT NOW! WHY DIDN'T YOU DO IT?!" (on cooldown or no mana)

"WHY DIDN'T YOU DROP HIM STRAIGHT DOWN INSTEAD OF TOWARDS US?! IDIOT!" (when engaging and we have no targeted spells that this would matter)

...don't know why I feel like venting on these people. Probably because I ran into a game yesterday where two people on our team were muted and they both did crazy shit. Turned out the one guy wasn't muted when the game ended, he just only used the chat wheel during the game and sucked.
 
RubxQub said:
I can't help but get a bit annoyed when they die and ping everyone on the map as if to imply that we should all be TPing over to him at any sign of trouble ever, and always.
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This is the worst. You get a Spirit Breaker who charges into 4 heroes near their tier 2 when the team had no way to get there in time to help even if it wasn't just a terrible idea. But still we get ping, ping, ping, I'm dead and you're not it must be your fault somehow.
 
Dinosaur Tamer said:
The problem with a vote system is that in this context it would create pressure and/or change the chemistry of the team and the motivation of individual players as seen in pretty much every single A-RTS that has a surrender vote.
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For me just like the mute/report system ( or pause which I think isn't currently 'balanced' ), it's only a question of balance. Does a surrender vote you can call more than once on each game is the same than a surrender vote you can only call twice a week ? need to add the need for more than 3 tower difference ? 3 tower difference + 10k gold ? 3 tower difference + 10k gold + 3x time the number of kills ? etc..

For me there is a huge difference between trying to balance something ( like during a beta... ) even if at the end you give up and remove the feature because it appear you can't balance it, and simply stating it shouldn't be in the game because there is other games where it doesn't work.
 
Archie said:
I'm pretty sure Spirit Breaker brings out the #YOLO idiot in everybody.
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So much this.
I once called every death by our SB in chat, because I knew he was diving too far and the support is just bait. Hell, everyone else on their team is conviently missing. I use voice chat to tell him to stop charging, because it's a trap, but he starts yelling at me, calling me russian and whatelse. Lo and behold, he dies and blames us. The best kind of people.
 
elyetis said:
For me just like the mute/report system ( or pause which I think isn't currently 'balanced' ), it's only a question of balance. Does a surrender vote you can call more than once on each game is the same than a surrender vote you can only call twice a week ? need to add the need for more than 3 tower difference ? 3 tower difference + 10k gold ? 3 tower difference + 10k gold + 3x time the number of kills ? etc..

For me there is a huge difference between trying to balance something ( like during a beta... ) even if at the end you give up and remove the feature because it appear you can't balance it, and simply stating it shouldn't be in the game because there is other games where it doesn't work.
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You definitely have a point here. However, it is pretty obvious that Valve thought about adding at least some form of a surrender vote and their decision not to was probably based on the insane amount of data they actually have on Dota 2 matches (and we don't).

Basically I'd always take an informed decision over the shitty attitude that seems to have spawned this discussion: "Hey guys, I can perfectly judge when a game is over and have the right to end this experience for the other nine players involved by any means I can come up with, because I am just that good at reading this game. You might as well just add a surrender button and be done with it. Also, I totally did not deserve to get muted again!"
 
Nymerio said:
I must be playing bizarro dota, because I've never had the enemy team drag out a game to farm rapiers or just to waste time. The only thing that's annoying is if people go "ff pls" and then continue to defend. But even then, mostly they just throw the next fight and it's over anyway.
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I have seen it way too often. These kind os assholes even with no resistance need to get all the barracks and then instead of attacking the ancient they try to get some more kills at the fountain.

The amount of times I had to sit through 10-15 minutes of a game that was lost for sure makes me want a a surrender option.
 
SamVimes said:
Remember when 90% of GAF/reddit/wherever kept calling Spectre trash even after they fixed her ultimate?
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No because most of gaf at the time was probably crying about PL or naix. P sure no one outside of pillow/ksan/me talked about spectre before she hit the spotlight.
 
What do you guys do in teamfights when the enemy team is using a shitload of illusions in the engagement?

When Spectre pops Haunt in teamfights, I pretty much have to ignore him or spend energy trying to figure out which one is actually the right one as I'm getting blasted with other spells.

Really disorients a teamfight for me.
 
Xater said:
I have seen it way too often. These kind os assholes even with no resistance need to get all the barracks and then instead of attacking the ancient they try to get some more kills at the fountain.

The amount of times I had to sit through 10-15 minutes of a game that was lost for sure makes me want a a surrender option.
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Only 200 games experience, but I've probably seen more teams fountain camping / refusing to end the game than I've seen miracle comebacks.

I'm fine with a surrender that's stricter and only used for mercy surrenders as mentioned before. Perhaps 30+ minutes, 1+ racks, and all surrendering players must be at the in base or at fountain.

Or at least adjust the rules so that people who leave already abandoned games stll get BP so the griefers don't _completely_ ruin the experience.
 
Dinosaur Tamer said:
The problem with a vote system is that in this context it would create pressure and/or change the chemistry of the team and the motivation of individual players as seen in pretty much every single A-RTS that has a surrender vote.

Valve told PC Gamer they are never going to add a surrender option. So, there really is no point in debating this again. Personally, I am very happy with that. There simply is no place for such a thing in pubs.



I just want to point out that you have been hanging out in a Dota 2 thread for weeks spamming sarcastic troll posts about the game and you just learned about living armor being global, which is basically the core characteristic of the current flavor of the month ability.



Do you actually play Dota?

Assuming that the quoted post is actually not another sarcastic troll post, which is - admittedly - quite the stretch.
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i havent played the new major patch, whats your point? Treant was trash before and i know hes FOTM now, sure I had no clue why, but i shouldnt have to care if I dont have the the time to play. You shouldnt make your assumptions about people based on a recent change

i dont see the point of trying to discredit how much im playing dota right now when i am not trying to make representations about the game

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re: surrender

it's fine for valve to not add a surrender, just as its fine for me to think its the wrong thing to do or that they are doing it for the wrong reasons

sneakystephen condones the losing team sitting together in base waiting for a ff, while he thinks a surrender vote is terrible for the game

some people say that surrender votes promote a defeatist attitude when thats just a symptom of the trench - i.e. leavers, feeders, afkers and ragers - and these people dont suddenly become different because theres a surrender vote.

and lastly, the common rhetoric is that surrenders shouldnt exist because comebacks can happen - for a game that tries to promote skill and control over the game, the message that people cannot decide for themselves whether a comeback can happen or not or that they aren't allowed to assess whether it is worth their time to play for the chance of a comeback is a complete 180 on the ethos of dota.

the other response to the common point is that comebacks require your team to be 100% on board. If the other four people on your team think that the game is unwinnable and give up inside, then at that point, your chances of come back decrease dramatically. Not withstanding the value of four people's judgement vs the one.

A lot of people have had amazing come backs, but I am pretty certain that at some point in the game, four people didnt give up yet. And for every amazing comeback, there are four games where a team gets crushed, feels like shit and just keeps playing because they dont want to get leaver marks. And then in the trench, there are leavers and afkers who do that as soon as they give up. Imagine if there was a mechanic for them to end the game, and they waited for that because that is better than leaving.

this is all without saying that surrender votes can be designed to suit a specific intention. you could have a 25 minute 100% agree requirement if youre so worried about defeatism and the possibility of potential comebacks
 
Surrender does change how people play the game, there's a very notable difference in the vast majoirty of games. You're going to get some people that decide the game is over and then throw because they can't concede, but honestly you see people trying for much longer than they do in LoL/HoN. Where you see the concede votes being spammed after anything goes wrong.
 
Ikuu said:
Surrender does change how people play the game, there's a very notable difference in the vast majoirty of games. You're going to get some people that decide the game is over and then throw because they can't concede, but honestly you see people trying for much longer than they do in LoL/HoN. Where you see the concede votes being spammed after anything goes wrong.
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why dont you compare surrender spam to leavers/afkers/throwers in the dota trench?

because surrender spam is only a real occurance in low MMR environment
 
Then put surrender on a longer cooldown.

I don't know what it is in LoL but make it every 5 or 10 minutes in Dota 2.

Matches tend to last longer in Dota 2 so allow the vote at 25 minutes.
 
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Riot = true innovators
 
dave is ok said:
635077093417285966.png


Riot = true innovators
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whats with the jaggies? is that running on a game gear?

And i definitely dont want a concede option in dota2. I used to, but I have come back from so many games and won after we have thought it was over. Unless certain teamates (ikuu) sit in fountain 12 minutes into the game.
 
dorkimoe said:
whats with the jaggies? is that running on a game gear?

And i definitely dont want a concede option in dota2. I used to, but I have come back from so many games and won after we have thought it was over. Unless certain teamates (ikuu) sit in fountain 12 minutes into the game.
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Close: Adobe Air.
 
Boken said:
why dont you compare surrender spam to leavers/afkers/throwers in the dota trench?

because surrender spam is only a real occurance in low MMR environment
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No it's not, you see it in all tiers (in HoN atleast).
 
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