-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Dota 2 |OT| To Hell and Back and Back to Hell
- Thread starter Artanisix
- Start date
- Status
Gully State
Member
Personally I think even a normal jungling prophet that doesn't attempt to gank lanes is just as worthless. You can be anywhere on the map at a moments notice and you choose not to utilize it?
Are we getting a patch tonight? Or will there be no patches this week? I can't remember what happened the week after last year's international..
You know, once you get the hang of him clockwerk is pretty damn fun. Still having trouble estimating when I can pick someone off by myself vs when I need help but I'm making progress. I suppose I should start looking at similar style heroes so I can play more than just him. I imagine this will lead to more 'standing around with the shop page open' related deaths. Honestly, trying to remember which items I need and from which shops they can be found/ where those shops are is one of my biggest problems.
If you are getting decent levels and max battery assault first you can pretty much solo kill most heroes.
Green Biker Dude
Banned
1.09 playing against merlini lmao what a nerd
there's a pl picker in his team too. merlini was talking shit
edit: someone dodged the match it seems. must've been him
there's a pl picker in his team too. merlini was talking shit
edit: someone dodged the match it seems. must've been him
my purple player dodged cuz potm was apparently a bad choice for offlane
Low Tier for realz
Ahh, I tend to be maxing flare first. Then when I hook + cog my opponent they often escape with a sliver of health just to taunt me. I'll try maxing assault first next game ^-^ .
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
Just had a frustrating game where my teammates apparently didn't know how valuable towers are. They let the opponent destroy both the tier 1 and 2 and get the tier 3 down to half health. We were better the entire game but with NP on the opponents side it gets really hard to even push out a little bit before you have to retreat again.
I really like Naga Siren though, so versatile.
I really like Naga Siren though, so versatile.
Haunted
Member
That feeling when a rude Russian on your team calls out REPORT NAGA in allchat at the end of the game... and both your own and the opposing team comes to your defence. I even got three commendations out of this regular game (didn't play great, but not super shitty either), because everyone else was so nice. <3
You better win, guys.
woo!
You better win, guys.
Can't really speak for weaver but Furion on the other hand;
Item Build:
**************
Start with either:
Ring of Basilius + 2 Clarity potions
OR
Gloves of haste + 2 Clarity potions.
I've only used the 2nd build a couple of times. It allows you to get Midas up faster, but with the RoB you can stay in the jungle for longer and deal with tougher creep camps (and early tower pushes) because of the armor aura and the mana regen it provides.
The armor aura allows your treants to tank up more damage (useful for tougher creepcamps + tower pushes) and the mana regen allows you to stay in jungle longer cause you can use Nature's call more often before having to tp back to base.
I normally rush Midas on him first, then go for Power threads (normally I keep that on Strength).
From that point on it REALLY depends on the enemy line up / your farm / how the game is going on what kind of items to get.
I'll present you with a couple different options:
Carry/pusher
This is probably my main build seeing as people really underestimate the damage prophet can dish out and you can literally melt towers/buildings with these items.
I've won my team a decent amount of games just split pushing / backdoor'ing while the enemy 5 man team was trying to push down our base.
In the shit tier I am in, half of the people forget to get tp's late game (seeing as they 6 slotted their items) so normally only 1 or 2 people TP back to defend but you should be able to handle those on your own.
Else just tp back to base and help defend (the attackers are now 1 or 2 players down so it's 5vs4 or 5v3 in your advantage).
- Shadowblade - In my eyes this is a must have for every game where you want to do some solo split pushing or ganking. Prophet does have a build-in escape, but his default running speed (even with boots/threads) is pretty shit.
The extra speed + invisibility will allow you to get the F out of dodge when the shit hits the fan (It even allows you to walk through other units).
Not to mention that the additional damage + attack speed complements this carry/pusher build. Don't forget that if you hit someone while invisible you gain 150 bonus damage.
And the biggest selling point: You can TP while staying invisible, this also works with just the shadow amulet component (that's why I always pick up that component first).
I even pick this up when BH,Slardar, and SB are on the enemy team, because even if they can see you, the additional movement speed will save your ass in a lot of situations.
Shadowblade is a must, the rest of the following items can be picked up in whatever order you prefer.
- Desolator - Like melting faces? Get this badboy and watch those solo enemy heroes run like their lunch money just got stolen. Especially those weak supports will melt + Good luck getting away when sprouted.
Provides 60 damage and removes 7 armor for 15 seconds....
- Assault Cuirass - Always a good idea to hit fast and hit hard. Really useful in teamfights (before building this item, make sure no one else is getting it) because combined with other right click items and a Daedalus you will be a one man wrecking-crew.
What's not to like about +35 attack speed, +10 armor, attack speed and armor aura's + an armor reduction aura for the enemy team.
- Crystalys into Daedalus - Want to be that one hit wonder that takes out enemies like they are lane-creeps?
Get this in combination with another right click item like Deso/MKB/AC and even Dragon Noob melts like a snow-cone when you start laying the smack down.
Can you say 1000+ crits?
- Maelstrom into Mjolnir - Wonder what the P stands for in NP? Profit
Especially once you get mjolnir this will let you farm those creep waves / camps / enemy heroes even faster.
Picking this up when your farm has stagnated a bit can bring you right back into the farming game.
I usually forgo this item for something like AC because that also provide you with the additional attack speed and it has those awesome Aura's
The following items are also good for a carry/pusher build, but I rarely get them seeing as I've had a lot of success with the items mentioned above;
- MBK
- Butterfly
- Skadi
- Dagon (I never ever get this even though I see a lot of prophets going for it. I just don't see the point)
- BKB - I don't get it a lot since I mostly use hex/orchid to silence the enemy and if I need to get out or dodge I use shadow blade.
- Etcetera (stuff like heart, satanic and abyssal are all options but I've never actually gotten any of those)
Disable/support/utility
- Mekanism - If your team is low on support heroes, getting a Mek is your responsiblity, seeing as you can manage to use it all the time because of your big mana pool and you can tp in to save people with this badboy.
And ofcourse the number 1 reason to get this: It's great to keep your teammates alive during a teamfight.
- Scythe of Vyse - This item can actually be build in any situation seeing as the mana regen is amazing and Hex can be used as either a ganking tool or means for getting out of pesky situation like a failed gank or getting caught while pushing a tower.
I personally prefer this item over an Orchid.
- Orchid Malevolence - Same story as with the Scythe of Vyse, this item can be build in all of the different roles that prophet can fulfill.
The mana regen is great, the attack speed increase + soul burn ability are great additions for a gank build or to be able to tp out freely (seeing as the silence is 5 seconds).
- Shiva's Guard - Great team fighting / chasing item.
Tp'ing into a fight, deploying the slow and sprouting some people will keep the enemy team busy while the rest of your team lays down the ass-whoopin'
More items that can be useful;
- Force staff - if shadow blade is not an option, or you need more maneuverability (great for moving in and sprouting an enemy)
- Necronomicon (great for extra pushing power, I've never used this on prophet though)
- Aghanim's Scepter - Great item if you expect you'll have problems with split pushing on your own (strong enemy gank lineup, like SB, BH, Slark, etcetera) or if the enemy team has some good split pushing heroes themselves.
Pop your ult halfway through or at the end of a teamfight and see those kills roll in.
- Maybe pipe, drums, vlads and urn are options, but I've never used those on prophet.
Skill build
**************
Most of the times I go for the following build;
1. Nature's Call
2. TP
3. Nature's Call
4. Sprout (at this point you are ready to join the lanes for some ganks, it's possible to do that even earlier, but the sprout basically ensures your team the kill since it'll take the enemy a second to realise they can't get out or use their quelling blade (check their items before tp'ing in and setting up the gank).
Another tip: Enemy mid heroes rarely go for a quelling blade, so I suggest trying to go for a gank mid first if the situation arises (overextending or low health)
5. Nature's Call
6. Ulti - (watch the map when using this, it can net you some easy kills when enemies are fleeing a fight in one of the lanes)
7. Nature's Call
From that point on I max TP over Ulti over Sprout since 1 level of sprout is enough anyway and having that TP mobility up is a crucial element in your skill build.
Jungle start:
- Summon treants at 50-45 secs before the start of the match.
- Have each treant walk to a different rune spot to scout out/deny runes.
- Resummon the treants at 00:01 - 00:05 (make sure you leave the base with full mana)
- Walk to easy camp and start clearing it at 00:30. If you're lucky; you can clear it and have it respawn at 1:00 or just pull the camp at 0:53 and take out the stack with 4 treants (the 2 summoned at spawn and a new summon at easy camp)
- I either go and check out the other camps (only the Ursa bears are something I avoid at level 1 nature's call, the rest are fair game with another resummon of treants)
- Then just farm up in the jungle (maybe help stack the pull camp for save lane)
- Keep an eye out for tp opportunities to gank or save a teammate
General observations/tips:
- LOOK AT THE MINI MAP!! I can't stress this enough. This is like an ability you need to train and it's vital for prophet.
# See a rune spawn and you can secure it for your mid or steal it from the enemy? TP IN
# See an enemy hero on low health or he's overextended? PING/CHAT --> TP IN
# Enemy team charging up to your tower? SPLITPUSH
# Your own teammate overextended? TP, SPROUT AND SAVE THE DAY
# SPLITPUSH SPLITPUSH SPLITPUSH
# See the enemy courier dropping items? TP in half way and snipe it!
- Make sure to bring a TP scroll
Use your TP skill to split push, gank, snipe a courier, etcetera and use that TP scroll to jump out or tp to another lane.
When TP'ing from the fountain to a location on the map; I usually IMMEDIATELY use nature's call or other spells I need, because the fountain regen lingers for about 2 seconds after TP'ing (like a normal TP scoll). Basically giving you a nature's call for about 40 mana instead of 160...
- Sprout is one of the most underestimated spells in the game. It can save teammates, hold enemies in place, block off ramps, setup nature's call in a places where there are no trees in the immediate area.
Some sneaky tips:
# Enemy Faceless Void time walks in and chronospheres one or more teammates? Get in there and sprout him.
Even if he's already laying into a teammate, sprout will actually push him back and he's not able to attack your teammate. You won't believe how many times I've saved people from a 4 man chronosphere.
# Getting ganked and you don't have shadowblade or force staff and you need get out ASAP but the enemy is closing in?
Double tab sprout and immediately double tab teleport to get back to base. Sprout blocks vision, so most enemies can't do shit while you TP out to safety.
Level 1 sprout is just long enough to allow you to tp out without enemies seeing you. Quelling blade and other items/skills that remove sprout can ruin this for you though, but it's better to try it than just give up and die.
# Wanna Solo roshan? Even though your still squishy as hell? Sprout him, nature's call and you've got 5 little tree shields to tank up his damage.
- I don't care what people tell you; CLIFF FARMING SUCKS
It's gonna severely hamper your farm-rate, not to mention making you susceptible to early ganks and your TP will probably be on cool down, so you're not able to help the lanes out with a gank or a save.
- Wrath of Nature (Ulti) - It's damage increases with every bounce, so in order to inflict the maximum amount of damage deploy it on the opposite side of the map (near the enemy creeps). It's useful in a lot of different situations;
# Use your ult for split pushing (look at the minimap and make sure the enemy creeps on the lanes are visible to do the max damage)
# Enemy hero on low hp and running from your teammates? Drop that ult on the other side of the map so that the damage increases from the number of bounces.
# 3 Enemies planning to dive a lane? Ult up and see them hesitate or even retreat instead of tower diving your teammates. This sounds stupid, but a lot of people seem to realize your team has vision of them and that you (the prophet) might tp in to help your teammates.
Awesome guide, thanks for taking the time to write it! I've been playing more Furion lately and start off with those exact item builds (Usually basi + 2 clarity). What is your general jungling route? When I jungle I barely have enough to sustain myself in the first 10 minutes just using nature's call, how can I gank other lanes with a tp + sprout (and maybe a nature's call after the gank)?
Also, what's your average midas time? I usually hit it around 6-7 minutes.
No problem.
As in regards to the midas; It kind of depends on how the jungling goes and if you manage to get an early gank or not. I find the timing on midas not to be that important for prophet since he can bounce back from a rough start pretty quickly.
I think the average time is between 6-8 minutes, and even faster if you start with the gloves of haste build and get a gank off early game...
About the mana issue: I usually either get a tp or walk back to base to completely fill on hp and mana if I get low so that I'm ready to tp in and sprout.
Also one more general tip:
When tp'ing from the fountain to a location on the map I usually IMMEDIATELY use nature's call or other spells I need, because the fountain regen lingers for about 2 seconds after tp'ing (like a normal tp scoll). Basically giving you a nature's call for about 40 mana instead of 160...
I should've probably added this:
Jungle start:
- Summon treants at 50-45 secs before the start of the match.
- Have each treant walk to a different rune spot to scout out/deny runes.
- Resummon the treants at 00:01 - 00:05 (make sure you leave the base with full mana)
- Walk to easy camp and start clearing it at 00:30. If you're lucky; you can clear it and have it respawn at 1:00 or just pull the camp at 0:53 and take out the stack with 4 treants (the 2 summoned at spawn and a new summon at easy camp)
- I either go and check out the other camps (only the Ursa bears are something I avoid at level 1 nature's call, the rest are fair game with another resummon of treants)
- Then just farm up in the jungle (maybe help stack the pull camp for save lane)
- Keep an eye out for tp opportunities to gank or save a teammate
Technosteve
Banned
Hmmm. I don't know if Midas Doosuh is worth it. That would require you to move away from the ancients every now and then. It also means that your Helm might be delayed as well (aka being able to stack while you are farming the jungle). I might give Midas a try though sometime and see how it compares. I feel like as long as you don't miss a stack it could be worth it?
Maybe Dreams can give us some input.
In that example, I missed one stack and still had the 6 minute Midas.
Whats the difference?
Oh wow, thank you very much F!ReW!Re
No prob, now go and show them Nature's fury! ;-)
There is an actual guild you can join ingame, I can hop on and send some out in a bit. There might be other officers on atm though.
Pureauthor
Member
Dota 2 Dressup PSA:
The couriers gotten from TI3 cards are now Unusual. Prices have already skyrocketed.
Items from the Luckbox are now Genuine, so feel free to pay rip-off prices for those on the market.
Items from promotional t-shirts are now also Genuine.
Lockless Luckboxes have been confirmed to keep getting sent out with the relevant Valve Store purchases.
The couriers gotten from TI3 cards are now Unusual. Prices have already skyrocketed.
Items from the Luckbox are now Genuine, so feel free to pay rip-off prices for those on the market.
Items from promotional t-shirts are now also Genuine.
Lockless Luckboxes have been confirmed to keep getting sent out with the relevant Valve Store purchases.
Sigismundo
Member
I've never really gotten into NP, which is odd because I love heroes with a lot of flexibility in item choices (Doom is my favourite hero).
Maybe I need to give him another try.
Maybe I need to give him another try.
Cool, I'm off Sunday, will be on to watch!
You can do the same thing on dire without wards. Just gotta be a logger.
Balmung421
Member
It is a known bug. My fezzle-feez unusual courier will have the green glowing effect randomly work in some games, while in other games it won't show up at all. Annoying bug, so I hope that it is fixed soon.
http://dotabuff.com/matches/274625917
Care to critique? I screwed up a lot early game..but later on I think I did better.
Are you sure it is just a bug though? Because it doesn't have a colour listed either like other unusuals.
Gully State
Member
Well that explains why the prices for the fezzle courier all of a sudden tumbled by $100
Likely because it only has one color it can be so there is no reason to put the identifier.
DivineRage002
Member
So I guess we get no patch this week?
Where has this been said?
Balmung421
Member
Actually now I am not so sure. Because the couriers from the trading cards at the secret shop became unusual tonight, it looks like there are now 2 types of unusual international couriers. For example, the ones with the actual green particle effect will have this in their description:
Color: 0, 0, 15
The International 2013
Apparently the newly tagged unusual couriers from the trading cards won't get the fancy international particle effect, while the unboxed couriers from chests will still have the effect. This could potentially change.
tl;dr lots of confusion and hopefully valve updates soon.
Oh my god why did you curse me with the burden of wanting this but never getting it.
Dreams-Visions
Member
IT'S NOT A BUG.
NOBODY BUY ANY TI3 COURIERS FROM ANYWHERE UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE.
People are getting scammed thinking something about the normal TI3 couriers has changed, when they only got a name change. They always had unusual effects, but for some god forsaken reason, Valve gave them all the same grouping on the Steam Marketplace, so people are buying "Unusual" TI3 couriers expecting them to be the unboxed versions, which were the only ones to have that name for the last 3 weeks.
Wait for Valve to figure out what they're going to do about the mess they've created.
- Status