TrAcEr_x90
Member
shit.......the addiction has set in. Never thought I could get into this game because of the high learning curve. But myself and a friend have been playing 3 games per day.....sometimes these are over an hour long.
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Dota 2 |OT| To Hell and Back and Back to Hell
- Thread starter Artanisix
- Start date
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Sometime in the future, you'll wish you only played 3 games per day.
Enjoy this time while it lasts.
TrAcEr_x90
Member
What is the best site for buildouts and item buys? So far i really like using the warlock. Not sure if thats a noob character to use but I dig him so far.
Dotabuff works.
http://dotabuff.com/heroes/warlock/items
But they're contextless stats. If you're looking for actual guides you should try: http://www.dotafire.com/
Open beta or something I think.
Open beta? I think I was on that before. Not sure.
not down for me..
Don't forget Mac players with one mouse button! even more people to blame now.
Nilay disrupted a Laguna Blade, beat that son. Best Shadow Demon out there.
Head of Vengarl
Banned
Down for me. :\
Corran Horn
May the Schwartz be with you
I chuckled at that
SteveWinwood
Member
Treant is fucking broken now.
I need to go dig up my post from like 3 OTs ago about how Treant was a cool dude. Way before Milk was riding his woody.
I need to go dig up my post from like 3 OTs ago about how Treant was a cool dude. Way before Milk was riding his woody.
I'm guessing he repicked.
Liberty4all
Banned
I'm totally addicted to smite right now. Will dota feel similar?
SteveWinwood
Member
In the fact that there are heroes that level up and have gold and use skills and have towers and whatever, yes.
Dota however is not a behind the back action game. It's much more like a warcraft or a starcraft. It's also to my understanding much more complicated, but I've never played Smite so I can't say for certain. It's much slower, and much more methodical. It's a lot more punishing.
steve when are you going to carry me
pretty unlikely that it would, but maybe if you tell us why you like smite we would be more able to help you
i think bloodline champions and monday night combat are closer to smite
SteveWinwood
Member
when are you gonna move to a country with normal timezones?
Super Monday Night Combat is a lot more moba than the first one.
It's also not as fun.
Head of Vengarl
Banned
Hi Bamelin. Coming from a fellow Smite player, I was not prepared for Dota when I started playing. The point-and-click controls are way different especially if you've never played an RTS before like me and last hitting takes a lot of getting used to. It's an afterthought in Smite, but it's essential in Dota. There is no question that Dota is a much more difficult game than Smite is.
That said, I really recommend you try it! And I mean try it; I was on the verge of quitting several times before Dota really clicked for me. It takes a bit of dedication to learn the basics, but I promise it's worth it.
Yeah, I'm still getting hit with a flood of South American players that refuse to speak English. I have no idea why I randomly started getting this all in one week. I mean, when the SA servers were down, I understood it. But I thought they fixed them. Not sure why I'm getting a concentrated influx of these players now on West Coast servers.
A good fix for this though, is to just play with a 4-5 man team. Solves everything.
Legenscary
Member
After all this time, I still think most Dotabuff guides are garbage.
I would still recommend the highest rated guides on playdota.
Are you playing carries? If not start doing it. Start picking OD or Spirit Breaker for an easy way to improve your winrate.
Top left corner, click on the book, then on the small arrow that appears on the right of that tab.
GregLombardi
Member
So....I feel like Tide Hunter and Enigma are both in need of major reworks. I don't know why a player, in their right mind, would ever choose either of those heroes when Warlock is strictly better than both in every way shape and form. Warlock basically has Enigma's ult as a secondary ability (the slow), and he has his unbelievably superior ult to boot. When compared to tide hunter as well, Warlock wins on every level. It's crazy how irrelevant those two heroes are now (though tide can still give a good shake against the right team).
Legenscary
Member
The eidelons are very good at pushing/farming the jungle and you can't really compare the slow to black hole (a good hole locks the entire enemy team down). But warlock is incredibly strong right now.
Tide and Enigma are fine. They have strengths in other areas which are not relevant to the meta as it is now, but not every hero has to be relevant in every meta. Just strong enough such that they can be useful in a different meta.
Meta meta meta meta meta meta meta.
Meta meta meta meta meta meta meta.
sorijealut
Member
I'm in Seoul right now. how do I play dota here? I cannot!
Should i go to the next Nexon event thingys and wreck these kids?? huhuhu.
Should i go to the next Nexon event thingys and wreck these kids?? huhuhu.
Yes, make us all proud sori.
upheaval=blackhole? Huh.
Warlock has zero lane presence and has to go mid to be relevant unless you're just gonna cripple your tri/dual lane. Enigma farms extremely fast in the jungle and can come out with mek and is very strong for pushing due to this+eidolons. Enigma can also offlane just fine, has really good late-game scaling because of midnight pulse and the ever-useful blackhole, and can actually GANK before level 6 and isn't reliant on a 180 cd ultimate to do so.
Tide is rly good in an offlane against a weaker trilane, and can even punish melee-heavy trilanes with anchor smash. Even when he's in the trilane, he offers alot of gank potential with gush, has alot more survivability with kraken shell, and his ulti is on a much shorter cd then chaotic offering.
Honestly dude, you're trying to compare apples to oranges. Just because these heroes all have aoe disables for ultimates, doesn't mean they're all played in the same way at all.
ScepticMatt
Member
It is, albeit still only a test version, until most major issues are fixed (see here for a list of issues)
What is Fatal Bonds?
I do agree with the sentiment that there are a million better options than him.
Letterbomb
Banned
Sorry, but what? No, really--what? You're comparing Warlock to Enigma and Tide Hunter? Their roles and functions are completely separate from each other. Like, entirely. Where are you coming from with this?
In other news, I wish I knew how to make GIFs. I have all these replays saved in my recent games where I dive the fountain as Abaddon and kill 2-3 heroes while surviving due to Borrowed Time paired with Refresher Orb. It's hilarious and very, very satisfying stuff.
The problem is more that Warlock's ult is too strong, but nerfing his ult would take away his one viable ability since he has no disables to speak of, and his slow is channeled and highly situational. It's a bit like Treant - nerf his one main ability and he becomes a piece of shit.
fatal bonds is ass in a trilane and there's no reason anyone should think its better then an actual stun/disable/nuke
I was thinking more of a dual offlane situation, where you have to send two supports or something.
sorijealut
Member
GregLombardi
Member
I've been playing DOTA since Dota 1 came out so I don't think I'm "trying" to do anything. I especially am not saying that they are played the same way, that would be ridiculous. But I am saying that their AOE disables as ultimates are an important link between them, and that in theory a player shouldn't want to choose one more often than the others.
I'm making the point that when compared against each other, I'd much rather have a hero with an ult that can't be stopped with a stun, that does demonstrably more damage (if used correctly), oh and by the way keeps a demon around to do even more damage after the fact. Oh and by the way the hero has the ability to harass with 2 dot spells, one of which can heal his own teammates.
You may think that black hole is far superior to upheaval, but in most circumstances it isn't. They perform exactly the same duties except one happens to be a hard mass stun (which is incredibly hard to get off without a. being stunned out of it, or b. getting more than 2 or 3 heroes without a blink dagger), and the other happens to be a mass slow with the same drawbacks but a lot less pressure to get it right and more benefit if your demon / other heroes are milling about. Warlock regularly gets 3-4 heroes with his ult and with the corresponding demon damage afterward. I agree Enigma is a better pusher than Warlock, but I really don't think that aspect of Enigma is relevant to the discussion, especially when I'm not saying they are played the same. Tide is played differently too, but I'm still not feeling that his different play is superior play in most circumstances.
What I'm essentially saying is that when given a choice between the 3 heroes and the effect they'll have on a game, I always will choose warlock. No question. Even if I need a tanky hero, I will choose warlock and tank him up over Tide. He's absolutely crazy.
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
Maybe not in a tri-lane, but you won't see that often in pubs unless you're stacked. Versus 1 or 2 heroes, particularly melee, Fatal Bonds alone can harass people out of lane (which at times can be even more damaging than a death), even if you don't snag a kill until 6. 1 or 2 clarities and an early Ring of Basilius (and/or early arcanes if you do get kills/farm) easily sustains your mana pool.
Your reasoning kind of falls apart here because while Warlock's Ult might be preferable to Tide's or Enigma's in many cases, you're ignoring what they bring to the table with their other skills.
It's similar to the way people equate Tree to Tide because they're both melee STR heroes and they both have large range AoE ults so that justifies giving damage back to Overgrowth. While I would love to see that change, the comparison to Tide is the wrong way to go about it. They're different heroes that occupy different niches.
This is such a horrible comparison I'm having trouble deciding where to begin. The strength of Black Hole is the ability to shut down carries using BKB and setup further AoE shenanigans. Upheavel is a mildly annoying slow that is useless against any sort of blinking/interruption/BKB, and also leaves him highly vulnerable. It's not often that Warlock gets BKB because it's simply not worth it. He's a one spell hero: Drop rock and get out, or die, it makes no difference so long as the rock is dropped.
On the other hand, Enigma has two main item paths, early Mek and early Blink, each lending themselves to a different team strategy, neither of which Warlock can adequately fulfill because his farm is nonexistant. And unlike Warlock, Enigma WILL often get BKB because making sure you get the full Black Hole is worth the gold.
sorijealut
Member
As for black hole i think you are overlooking the chance of a blink engagement, which is far less obvious than a warlock walking up to the spot, standing and casting (which has some delay).
The stun from the ult is 1 second, then you have to cast upheaval slow which takes time to build up (and, your levels in upheaval will be too low for it to really count as a slow earlier on).
Black hole is a hold for 4 seconds from level 6.
The heroes serve different purposes.
The stun from the ult is 1 second, then you have to cast upheaval slow which takes time to build up (and, your levels in upheaval will be too low for it to really count as a slow earlier on).
Black hole is a hold for 4 seconds from level 6.
The heroes serve different purposes.
GregLombardi
Member
If you want to test heroes based on niche skills such as pushing skills, or whatever skills one might think that Tide has (please name a few?), I'd be happy to do so. But as you state, they are niche. I loved tide for a very long time, but I realized in the end that unless you have opponents who play poorly, he falls apart as a real game changer when the opposing players counter / avoid him.
Warlock is the real deal. He isn't niche in any regard. He's a massive problem for the opposing team no matter how you play him (unless you play him poorly!). I'd like to think that makes him superior in nearly every situation, though I know saying the word "every" and it ever being true is a fool's dream. So I'll just say most situations.
+ des0lar thanks (Idunno how to multiquote on mobile)
elmariachi
Banned
This is a lot of nonsense, I disagree completely.
Tide can roam. Warlock cannot.
Tide can tank with no farm. Warlock cannot.
Tide can suicide lane. Warlock can as well, but only with great risk.
Tide can break free of focus fire and chain stuns. Warlock cannot. Ever had one of your Warlocks get sniped before the fight even starts? Tide doesn't really have that problem.
Tide has unconditional lane presence through Anchor Smash and Gush. Warlock only has lane presence against stupid opponents that get bonded repeatedly. (Don't mention Shadow Word, it's a really shitty heal that has nothing on Purification or Healing Wave in either the healing or damage department. It is a consolation spell and the price of having his amazing ult.)
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