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[Durante]

It's 5 am here, I've just completed the

Spoiler

Fade

sequence, and I have to reiterate how awesome this game is before I finally go to sleep.

 

[FilthyLies]

There's a sidequest for 10 x Garnet. Other than that I don't know of any use. Pretty sure they're for selling.

The Dwarves will ask for donations of gems in camp once you recruit them, but they will only accept mid-quality gems or something odd like that. I'm not really sure donating to your troops even does anything actually, but it might.

 

[firehawk12]

No.


There's a sidequest for 10 x Garnet. Other than that I don't know of any use. Pretty sure they're for selling.

You can give them to the Dwarves in your camp for XP.


Also, got my full 1000 in the game. I like it for what it is, and I can see touches of Gaider all over it - especially in one of the endings - but it still suffers from a lot of the BioWare tropes.

The lack of consequences, the relatively banal text endings (which is more than the lame Mass Effect ending I guess), the shallow morality system and of course, the "visit these four places in any order you want before fighting the boss!" quest system. It was interesting in KoTOR, where I first encountered it... but they've used that for every game they've made (well, haven't played Sonic RPG I suppose) since and it's a bit played out.
At least the order you do the missions in is important... but at that point, given that there's an optimum path to play the game, it seems kind of pointless to have the options anyway - unless you want to screw yourself over on purpose.

Oh well, can't complain too much because I spent 60 hours with the game. :lol

 

[water_wendi]

Does knockdown mean dead? I have Wynn set to use revival when an ally status is knockdown, but she still doesn't use revival and it's the number 1 tactic on her list. I couldn't locate a dead status in the menu. As so I have purposely switched to her and used a magic potion to make sure she has enough magic and she still doesn't use revival.

Knockdown means Knockdown i think.. like when you use Shield Bash on someone. She doesnt cast Revive because they arent dead just knocked on their ass.

 

[Silent Death]

Knockdown means Knockdown i think.. like when you use Shield Bash on someone. She doesnt cast Revive because they arent dead just knocked on their ass.

Ok so what do you use to get her to cast revival on a dead ally?

 

[Basileus777]

the shallow morality system

What morality system? It's actually a good thing you don't get silly morality points for actions.

And how exactly is there an optimum path to play the game?

 

[untoldhero]

Just a query, anyone really far into the PS3 version? How does it hold up after xx amount of hours?

 

[bathala]

my friendlist sux

99% is MW2. 360 players wanna share their GT just to see where everybody is at

 

[Masta_Killah]

What morality system? It's actually a good thing you don't get silly morality points for actions.

And how exactly is there an optimum path to play the game?

Definitely one of the best design choices from Bioware. I love how many choices are more gray then black or white.

 

[water_wendi]

Ok so what do you use to get her to cast revival on a dead ally?

Honestly i dont know.. i dont have anyone with Revival yet.

 

[markot]

Just get her to cast it yourself >.<!

I think its better that way anyway.

 

[Masta_Killah]

I think you have to cast revive yourself. I dont believe there is an option to set it to cast revive if a teammate is dead. Also, I had one instance where revive didn't revive one of my dead teammates. It was during a dragon fight, my main tank died on me and revive didn't work on him. Luckily for me, my rogue was able to solo the dragon with my two casters constantly healing. It took like 20 minutes to kill the dragon. :lol

Edit: Forgot to mention that the dragon bugged out and would only attack my rogue if it attacked back. I somehow got it stuck in a corner and it wouldn't leave. I just continued to attack it with the rogue to allow her to hold aggro.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I really like how they handled the morality system in that there isn't some numerical morality system. Your choices actually directly affect the way the story plays out. I think it is a lot better than being forced into one direction of good or evil.

 

[firehawk12]

What morality system? It's actually a good thing you don't get silly morality points for actions.

And how exactly is there an optimum path to play the game?

The morality meter is replaced by characters that have pre-defined moral codes. Yes, you can change two of the characters, but for the most part, if you want to do "nice" things, you bring "nice" characters with you.

Why? Because having high approval means extra bonuses. It makes you play schizophrenic, depending on the needs of your party. For example, Morrigan and Leliana almost never agree and there will be times when something you do will hurt your relationship with one by improve the other. It makes no "game play" sense to have both in your party if you are collecting quests.

And, there is an optimum path in terms of efficiency I suppose.

Spoiler

The Circle is needed to do the Redcliff quest "without bloodshed" and it gives you several free bonus attribute points early in the game. You need Shale before you do the Dwarf quest if you want to open up its quest line (or so I've read anyway). Admittedly, the elf quest fits in anywhere.

I really like how they handled the morality system in that there isn't some numerical morality system. Your choices actually directly affect the way the story plays out. I think it is a lot better than being forced into one direction of good or evil.

Definitely one of the best design choices from Bioware. I love how many choices are more gray then black or white.

Okay, maybe it's because I'm an anal player, but I went into the game trying my best to get 100% approval with each character. This is essentially impossible unless you never use certain characters (I dropped Sten and Morrigan fairly early on) or you choose to be a dick in one location and a good person in another.

It also makes you schizophrenic in terms of telling the characters exactly what they want to hear. So you end up being sweet and chaste with Leliana or morally incorruptible with Wynne... while two seconds later, reveling in murder and the harsh realities of life with Zevran and Morrigan.

Now, you might argue that makes the PC a "player" who is a master manipulator, but I think that's a bit of a stretch.

It would have been much more interesting if they forced you to choose a morality at the beginning of the game and the dialogs played out themselves without any interference from the player.

You choose to be a good character? Then you always have to be good. You can't lie to Morrigan and tell her you think the Circle is full of shit just because it'll add "+10" to her approval.

 

[mattiewheels]

What the bloddy hell does the battle at Radcliffe go on for this long for? These demon zombie things are infinitely spawning it feels like....and my helper eventually die off. Is there a trick to this one?

 

[Lafiel]

Definitely one of the best design choices from Bioware. I love how many choices are more gray then black or white.

The Witcher did it far better, most of the choices and outcomes i've experienced so far. Are not as 'grey' as bioware hyped it up to be, they mostly seem to follow the same 'good / evil' as there previous games, with a extra 'renegade' from ME option.
I think the lack of 'alignment' system is disappointing, there's alot of non-quest good deads you can do like giving coins to the poor etc, but you don't get rewarded with alignment points, which make the deeds in general feel kinda pointless.

 

[firehawk12]

The Witcher did it far better, most of the choices and outcomes i've experienced so far. Are not as 'grey' as bioware hyped it up to be, they mostly seem to follow the same 'good / evil' as there previous games, with a extra 'renegade' from ME option.
I think the lack of 'alignment' system is disappointing, there's alot of non-quest good deads you can do like giving coins to the poor etc, but you don't get rewarded with alignment points, which make the deeds in general feel kinda pointless.

Honestly, I appreciated that more. It's kind of silly that "God" or "Santa Claus" would be watching every move you make in the game and keeping score for you.

That said, there's a bit of fun in giving money to the beggers in the Alienage.

 

[TheFallen]

For those wishing there was better consequences

Spoiler

If you leave Redcliffe after you first visit but before the invasion the town gets wiped out

That is pretty cool. Lotheridge spoiler/question:

Spoiler

I thought I did everything there. After a while I noticed everyone talking about how the Darkspawn destroyed Lotheridge. Saw that the icon on the map is now a skull and inaccessible. Was there a way to save them? Poor townsfolk.

 

[Gamer @ Heart]

What does donating to the armies get you?

 

[Fredescu]

Okay, maybe it's because I'm an anal player, but I went into the game trying my best to get 100% approval with each character.

Why did you go into the game with the intention of making it a chore? You should figure out fairly early on that if you're going to play your character a certain way, you're not going to please everybody. Not in one playthrough.

 

[firehawk12]

Why did you go into the game with the intention of making it a chore? You should figure out fairly early on that if you're going to play your character a certain way, you're not going to please everybody. Not in one playthrough.

Because I wasn't sure who I would end up using? And it makes no sense to have a character hate you.

I mean, it's possible to essentially alienate or not recruit pretty much every party member... but why would you do it?

 

[TheFallen]

Because I wasn't sure who I would end up using? And it makes no sense to have a character hate you.

I mean, it's possible to essentially alienate or not recruit pretty much every party member... but why would you do it?

role playing game? :lol

 

[Gamer @ Heart]

Dog always loves you!

 

[Ravager61]

Because I wasn't sure who I would end up using? And it makes no sense to have a character hate you.

I mean, it's possible to essentially alienate or not recruit pretty much every party member... but why would you do it?

Its a roleplaying game. Your actions are supposed to have consequences that alter the game. If were looking for a game to min/max, go play Diablo.

 

[firehawk12]

Maybe I've been raised on JRPGs, but I'm not going to purposely sabotage my game because I'm doing a virtual LARP or something. I need the game to force me to act in an inefficient way or I'll exploit it. That's my bad, sure, but BioWare showed that they can do better.

For example, it's why I found the

Spoiler

Virmire moment

in Mass Effect 1 so effective. It forced you to make a choice and didn't give you a way to game the system.

Alternatively, the similar moment in Dragon Age... I saw no incentive to go the other way other than to get the associated achievements.

 

[firehawk12]

Dog always loves you!

I don't know if this is a spoiler or not, but it's possible to play the game without ever getting Dog either. But again, even if you don't use him, why wouldn't you unless you were playing the anti-PETA character and wanted to "roleplay" that somehow.

 

[Sinatar]

What does donating to the armies get you?

When you get to the final area you have a new little interface item that shows all the troops you've recruited and how many of each. You can deploy them at will. I suspect the amount you donate ups the amount you have available for this section.

I cleared the whole thing without deploying any troops, spend the whole game getting these guys and I annihilate the Blight forces with my 4 man wrecking crew. :lol

 

[Aedile]

Because I wasn't sure who I would end up using? And it makes no sense to have a character hate you.

Would've been interesting if NPC disapproval led to any consequences besides the character possibly leaving. (This is assuming that it doesn't, of course. Never tried to drive down the approval scores of any of my team members; I'm not using Alistair in my second playthrough since my main is specced as a tank, but being mean to him is like kicking a puppy.)

 

[Fredescu]

Because I wasn't sure who I would end up using? And it makes no sense to have a character hate you.

Getting 100% isn't all that easy. I don't really see a point to doing that before you knew that person was going to be a permanent fixture. Even then, I've played nearly 70 hours on one character and have only bothered to 100% one character. There's some stat bonuses, but it's not that big a deal.

I ditched Sten early on too because he was boring, and Morrigan because the character that I was playing didn't see eye to eye with her. My next playthrough I intend to use the assholes, and I'll get a whole bunch of new party banter to listen to. It's not a new thing to party based RPGs to keep around party members just because you like them, and leave behind ones you don't. You can finish the game with any group makeup anyway, look at tetsuo playing on PC hard with an all melee group.

 

[firehawk12]

Would've been interesting if NPC disapproval led to any consequences besides the character possibly leaving. (This is assuming that it doesn't, of course. Never tried to drive down the approval scores of any of my team members; I'm not using Alistair in my second playthrough since my main is specced as a tank, but being mean to him is like kicking a puppy.)

I know it's possible to lose bonuses if you lower approval (I messed up my love-square with the three NPCs once :lol ), but I don't think there's any bonus for having them in the negatives... other than opening new dialog.

And part of me wouldn't mind seeing that dialog... but most of the negative options in the game are either catastrophic or relatively minor. Either you drive them away (or worse) or you just make this like you less... it's not much variation.

I suppose if you bring Morrigan along and just keep helping people, she'll be pissed off at you without actually hating you.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I had high approval ratings with everyone in my party except Sten by the end of the game. I didn't really feel like a schizophrenic at all. All I did was be as understanding as I could with my party members. It wasn't like I was plotting bloody murder one moment and preaching sermons the next. Just because I could see Morrigan's point of view all while getting along with Wynne and Alistair at the same time doesn't make the system unrealistic. Have you never been friendly with two separate people who hate each other and hold opposite views in real life? My character was the leader of the entourage and I had to listen to everyone's troubles and try to relate with them to keep morale up.

 

[lorddarkflare]

Why did you go into the game with the intention of making it a chore? You should figure out fairly early on that if you're going to play your character a certain way, you're not going to please everybody. Not in one playthrough.

I am fervently working to get everyone to 100%.

So far, it is not too bad.

Morrigan, Sten and Zevran are easy and dog does not matter.

Seeing as i play goody goody, i should not have much issue with Allister and Wynne, even if they take forever.

So far, Liliana is my only problem.

Also, i just succeeded in sleeping with Zevran and keeping my relationship with her.

I had high approval ratings with everyone in my party except Sten by the end of the game. I didn't really feel like a schizophrenic at all. All I did was be as understanding as I could with my party members. It wasn't like I was plotting bloody murder one moment and preaching sermons the next. Just because I could see Morrigan's point of view all while getting along with Wynne and Alistair at the same time doesn't make the system unrealistic. Have you never been friendly with two separate people who hate each other and hold opposite views in real life? My character was the leader of the entourage and I had to listen to everyone's troubles and try to relate with them to keep morale up.

Exactly. This is the case especially in conversation. It is conceivable that we could be telling them what the want to hear without committing to any of it.

 

[firehawk12]

Getting 100% isn't all that easy. I don't really see a point to doing that before you knew that person was going to be a permanent fixture. Even then, I've played nearly 70 hours on one character and have only bothered to 100% one character. There's some stat bonuses, but it's not that big a deal.

I ditched Sten early on too because he was boring, and Morrigan because the character that I was playing didn't see eye to eye with her. My next playthrough I intend to use the assholes, and I'll get a whole bunch of new party banter to listen to. It's not a new thing to party based RPGs to keep around party members just because you like them, and leave behind ones you don't. You can finish the game with any group makeup anyway, look at tetsuo playing on PC hard with an all melee group.

It's easy if you bring the right characters to each situation. You can bump Wynne up significantly just through interacting with quest characters.
And then there are the gifts and character sidequests, which can provide substantial bonuses.

I was only unable to 100% one character... and there's a very specific reason why I don't think it's possible to get his approval that high.

 

[Fredescu]

At this point in the game I'm kinda suprised by the lack of approval/disapproval to my interactions with NPCs. It all seemed to happen early on in the game. Maybe it's because I run with mostly the same group.

So far, Liliana is my only problem.

She's the only one I do have. If you want a hint

Spoiler

get the flowers from near the windmill at Redcliffe and on the ground in the Dalish area, along with any symbols of Andreste you find

. They give a nice boost.

 

[water_wendi]

I had high approval ratings with everyone in my party except Sten by the end of the game. I didn't really feel like a schizophrenic at all. All I did was be as understanding as I could with my party members. It wasn't like I was plotting bloody murder one moment and preaching sermons the next. Just because I could see Morrigan's point of view all while getting along with Wynne and Alistair at the same time doesn't make the system unrealistic. Have you never been friendly with two separate people who hate each other and hold opposite views in real life?

ive done pretty much the same. And some choices seem to give more points if they are closer to the persons worldview (example, saying "i agree completely" gives +3 where "i understand" would get +1). Its pretty well done i think. The only time you run into problems is if the members have conflicting views while in your party. They arent going to get along then. If Morrigan is in your camp keeping a log warm shes not going to get upset if you helped out some refugee. What she doesnt know wont hurt her :lol

 

[Tokubetsu]

At the end of the day, the pros of this system completely outway any cons (IE, being anal and wanting to please everybody). The Witcher handled it similarly (no doubt BioWare probably took a nod from CDProjekt) and that's one of the best RPGs this gen, DA probably being up there once I'm done.

I've actually removed Alistair from my party now because he's such an uptight bitch and I kinda like straddling the chaotic neutral/ lawful evil side of things. It's saying something when the old hag (Wynn) is less uptight.

 

[firehawk12]

I had high approval ratings with everyone in my party except Sten by the end of the game. I didn't really feel like a schizophrenic at all. All I did was be as understanding as I could with my party members. It wasn't like I was plotting bloody murder one moment and preaching sermons the next. Just because I could see Morrigan's point of view all while getting along with Wynne and Alistair at the same time doesn't make the system unrealistic. Have you never been friendly with two separate people who hate each other and hold opposite views in real life? My character was the leader of the entourage and I had to listen to everyone's troubles and try to relate with them to keep morale up.

It's because it's all abstracted and it's hard to be attached to fictional moral dilemmas.

I mean, instead of "Magician Registration", let's say the issue was abortion. Wynne is against abortion and Morrigan is for abortion. Could you honestly appease both if they brought up the issue without feeling at least a little morally compromised?

The Circle is a huge sticking point with Morrigan and while I never had Morrigan and Wynne in the same party to see if there was any dialog between them, I have to imagine that they probably wouldn't get along too much.

 

[markot]

I never had Morrigan and Wrynn chat while in my group >_<!

 

[firehawk12]

ive done pretty much the same. And some choices seem to give more points if they are closer to the persons worldview (example, saying "i agree completely" gives +3 where "i understand" would get +1). Its pretty well done i think. The only time you run into problems is if the members have conflicting views while in your party. They arent going to get along then. If Morrigan is in your camp keeping a log warm shes not going to get upset if you helped out some refugee. What she doesnt know wont hurt her :lol

I think I suggested this solution somewhere. Have the choices you make effect everyone in your party, regardless of whether they are active or not.

This carries over for the "important" choices you can make in the game, but it should be the same for all the minor choices as well.

That way, you can't exploit the system by just leaving some people at the camp to keep the logs warm, as it were. :lol

 

[water_wendi]

I think I suggested this solution somewhere. Have the choices you make effect everyone in your party, regardless of whether they are active or not.

This carries over for the "important" choices you can make in the game, but it should be the same for all the minor choices as well.

That way, you can't exploit the system by just leaving some people at the camp to keep the logs warm, as it were. :lol

i could see this working with large choices.. but minor ones where Morrigan shits bricks because i gave a starving child a silver shouldnt matter if shes not there. i could see news of how i single handedly saved a 100 Templars from destruction and held a parade in their honor getting back to her but her going "i heard you helped a child! Is this true?!" would be a little silly. :lol

 

[Fredescu]

Wynne is against abortion and Morrigan is for abortion.

In my group it's Leliana for birds, Shale against birds. Sometimes I just don't know where to look.

 

[Tokubetsu]

Having Morrigan, Alistair and Wynne in your party at the same time is like hell. Morrigan is pretty much always making fun of Alistair for being a boyscout, she'll laugh at me for making the occasional decent decision and she's always bickering with Wynne about freedoms and rights when we're just running around.

 

[firehawk12]

i could see this working with large choices.. but minor ones where Morrigan shits bricks because i gave a starving child a silver shouldnt matter if shes not there. i could see news of how i single handedly saved a 100 Templars from destruction and held a parade in their honor getting back to her but her going "i heard you helped a child! Is this true?!" would be a little silly. :lol

Well hey, if they gossip about who I spend time in my tent with, they should gossip about the quests as well.

"Did you see how she helped <blank>! It was so great!"
"Grrr, I disapprove! -4!"

Or something. :lol

 

[markot]

How hard is it to play all melee though >.>?

I cant imagine bosses without heals...

 

[mr stroke]

I really like how they handled the morality system in that there isn't some numerical morality system. Your choices actually directly affect the way the story plays out. I think it is a lot better than being forced into one direction of good or evil.

I almost wish they would have went that direction. While some of your choices effect the ending(nothing major IMO), its nothing that would spawn two completely different endgames/boss fights/story arcs.
(at least from what I finished in game and saw online)

 

[mattiewheels]

I kinda wished you could recruit morrigan's mom into the party, she seemed feisty :lol

 

[Deleted member 17706]

It's because it's all abstracted and it's hard to be attached to fictional moral dilemmas.

I mean, instead of "Magician Registration", let's say the issue was abortion. Wynne is against abortion and Morrigan is for abortion. Could you honestly appease both if they brought up the issue without feeling at least a little morally compromised?

The Circle is a huge sticking point with Morrigan and while I never had Morrigan and Wynne in the same party to see if there was any dialog between them, I have to imagine that they probably wouldn't get along too much.

There usually seems to be an option where you don't have to take either side or can tell both of them to shut up. Sure you might get a -3 with the parties, but it is better than taking one side and getting a -10 or something. The smaller negatives are easily made up later on when talking to them individually or giving them gifts. There are also tons of occasions where you can use your persuasion skill (if it is high enough) to convince your party members.

 

[Shouta]

I find Alistair, Wynne and Morrigan to be a hilarious trio especially after

Spoiler

you bang Morrigan[/quote]. The conversations are so amusing. I saw a conversation where Alistair basically whined about his shirt until Wynne gave in and said she'd repair it for him. Another situation is where Wynne found Alistair's dirty sock in her stuff. He puts it on right away because his current one is wet.

 

[Fredescu]

Pets are awesome. I put some ranger points in Leliana and they are so handy. My next character will be ranger/duelist I think.

 

[Tokubetsu]

I find Alistair, Wynne and Morrigan to be a hilarious trio especially after

Spoiler

you bang Morrigan

Spoiler

. The conversations are so amusing. I saw a conversation where Alistair basically whined about his shirt until Wynne gave in and said she'd repair it for him. Another situation is where Wynne found Alistair's dirty sock in her stuff. He puts it on right away because his current one is wet.[/QUOTE]

I got the sock one while in Denerim. It is hilarious. Sten and Morrigan is also funny, Morrigan is always coming onto him till eventually he goes on about how Qunarri sex is extremely violent and she wouldn't survive it.