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DriveClub Review Thread.

Foshy

Member
Oh I completely understand, just trying to rationalize the discrepancy between reviews and the public reception. I am sure the gameplay is fine based on fans reception (Have not tried the game yet, will do once I finish my thesis), but maybe reviewers this generation is more critical about gameplay and social aspects of a racing game? Do not yet understand why the game has mixed reception among reviewers?
It's definitely not because of the gameplay. Most mention it handles well but "lacks a soul", is "boring", "has no open-world"...

In my opinion it might be one of the best playing racing games on consoles ever with a wheel. Need to play some more but that's my first impression.
 

Hindle

Banned
Sony really need to be getting more efficient and consistent when it comes to racing games. If MS can release a racing game every year, then Sony should be looking to take influence from how MS manage Forza.
 
It's definitely not because of the gameplay. Most mention it handles well but "lacks a soul", is "boring", "has no open-world"...

In my opinion it might be one of the best playing racing games on consoles ever with a wheel. Need to play some more but that's my first impression.

The "without a soul" comment is pure ignorance. I just can't comprehend. I put music unlimited on and went straight to racing and was having loads of fun.
 

barit

Member
The problem is the level of hype fans created.

Just like Destiny.

What the fuck are people doing creating such levels of hype for a game nobody even has gameplay footage of? Or have even played a year after announcement?

Then when reality doesn't match the hype in the form of the game being okay, but nothing really special, people either can't believe their eyes or meltdown.

There isn't even anything wrong with the game being okay, but when an entire community (and many more) is already professing about what the game is going to be when probably less than 2% have even seen it with heir own eyes! let alone played it, you're fucked from the beginning.

I say this in every thread about games that have so much hype. SCREW HYPE.

No. Even if a game doesn't life up a hype, it is all part of why gaming can be so exciting. There is nothing wrong about honest user generated hype for a game (not so much for publisher and media hype a la Titanfall). Or want you end like Jeff who seems to have always pain in his ass when he must play a game ?
 
When half the potential audience has free access to a substantial "demo", review scores don't matter nearly as much I'd think.

Add great upgrade digital price and the only racing game on PS4 this year (yeah, Rivals Complete won't draw too much shadow on DC) so I don't really fear for DC's sales. It will be an easy buy for semi casual this chrismas
 

KOHIPEET

Member
Sadly people are going to skip this game because of a arbitrary number.

I hope they won't. The average Joe doesn't even know what Giantbomb is, nor does he read Gamespot. What he does though is that he walks into a store, sees the game on a big screen and says "Holy moly this game looks awesome."

Let's hope -for driveclub- that this is how the more casual gamer masses will react to it.
 
I said earlier how I felt scores got in the way of people reading and understanding reviews.

I find it even odder when people post things like "This game is a solid 8 for me." That is completely meaningless. Unless you want to supply us with some chart of your past game scoring you may as well say "this game is a solid pancake flying over a tree shrew for me".

Have things got so bad people even express their own opinions with a number rather than text. It's bad enough having the focus on Metacritic without gamers in forums being unable to at least string a couple of sentences together to say why they like or dislike something.

"Hi, how are you today?"
"Oh a solid 8, yourself?"
"A disappointing 6."
 
I said earlier how I felt scores got in the way of people reading and understanding reviews.

I find it even odder when people post things like "This game is a solid 8 for me." That is completely meaningless. Unless you want to supply us with some chart of your past game scoring you may as well say "this game is a solid pancake flying over a tree shrew for me".

Have things got so bad people even express their own opinions with a number rather than text. It's bad enough having the focus on Metacritic without gamers in forums being unable to at least string a couple of sentences together to say why they like or dislike something.

"Hi, how are you today?"
"Oh a solid 8, yourself?"
"A disappointing 6."

I'd give this post a solid 7.5 since I agree with it.
 
I hope they won't. The average Joe doesn't even know what Giantbomb is, nor does he read Gamespot. What he does though is that he walks into a store, sees the game on a big screen and says "Holy moly this game looks awesome."

Let's hope -for driveclub- that this is how the more casual gamer masses will react to it.

Anecdotes: My friend went to buy Driveclub at the local gamestop and it was sold out. He had to get it from another location. I didn't even see advertising for it.
 

OmegaDL50

Member
Add great upgrade digital price and the only racing game on PS4 this year (yeah, Rivals Complete won't draw too much shadow on DC) so I don't really fear for DC's sales. It will be an easy buy for semi casual this chrismas

There is still ProjectCARS to consider, however that game is more or less a full on racing sim. Actually may be one of the very few full out racing sims available on console.

It will be a different sort of flavor in terms of racing title that Driveclub is, which being closer to something like a hybrid between Motorstorm and PGR.
 

Tomeru

Member
The word "fantastic" as a description for handling and AI aren't universal either.

Ridge racer 5/7 is fantastic.
Wipeout HD is fantastic.
NFS HP 2010 is fantastic. So is rivals.

In terms of handling, all of them are fantastic. Can't tune in any of them.
 

23qwerty

Member
Anecdotes: My friend went to buy Driveclub at the local gamestop and it was sold out. He had to get it from another location. I didn't even see advertising for it.

Wonder if it sold that well or if they just didn't get that many in...
I can't imagine Gamestop not getting a decent amount though.
 

Tekku

Member
It's definitely not because of the gameplay. Most mention it handles well but "lacks a soul", is "boring", "has no open-world"...

In my opinion it might be one of the best playing racing games on consoles ever with a wheel. Need to play some more but that's my first impression.

Tbh, most racing games are incredibly fun with a high-end wheel. But most users will not own a wheel, so it's hard to recommend a game based on that particular experience.
 

23qwerty

Member
Can someone post a snippet of what they didn't like about the handing? I don't want to give them an extra click.

The cars have an overly grippy feel on the track, letting you get away with some occasional shenanigans by braking at the last possible moment instead of gently braking or coasting into the curves. The developers claim this is an attempt to make the game easier and fun for everyone. But this doesn't make the game feel more fun or thrilling. It just makes what otherwise feels like an attempt at simulating real cars instead feel like it misses the mark by a mile. If this were on by default as an assist for new drivers that could be disabled, potentially along with a series of additional options to let people tailor the driving a bit, maybe this would make sense. Instead it makes the game feel inauthentic to real-life racing while also not going far enough in the "fun" direction to make it an exciting, arcade-style racer.
 

Nyx

Member
Can someone post a snippet of what they didn't like about the handing? I don't want to give them an extra click.

But it's worth pointing out that Driveclub isn't an especially realistic simulation of driving, and apparently that's by design. The cars have an overly grippy feel on the track, letting you get away with some occasional shenanigans by braking at the last possible moment instead of gently braking or coasting into the curves. The developers claim this is an attempt to make the game easier and fun for everyone. But this doesn't make the game feel more fun or thrilling. It just makes what otherwise feels like an attempt at simulating real cars instead feel like it misses the mark by a mile. If this were on by default as an assist for new drivers that could be disabled, potentially along with a series of additional options to let people tailor the driving a bit, maybe this would make sense. Instead it makes the game feel inauthentic to real-life racing while also not going far enough in the "fun" direction to make it an exciting, arcade-style racer.

It gets even weirder when you throw in the game's occasional attempt at enforcing rules. It'll let you brake extremely late into turns and you can pull e-brake drifts and such, but if you get off the track at all it immediately throws up a three-second timer that compels you to get back on the track. If you cut a corner in a way the game feels is giving you an advantage, it gives you a "corner penalty" and reduces your ability to accelerate for a few seconds. Same deal if you decide to slam into another racer--or if the game's single-minded AI decides to slam into you. Though cutting corners isn't cool, the way the game handles it with penalties is the opposite of fun. This seems like the sort of thing that should have been handled on the track design end instead of slapping drivers with penalties.

Here.
 

RoboPlato

I'd be in the dick
Yeah.

That's why I never read mainstream review outlets, and just select from my trusted GAFer list to read impressions from.

I have a pretty fullproof method too. Whereas most people add people to their trust list when they see someone agrees with them, I'm exactly the opposite. I only add someone to my list when I love/hate something and then I read a poster who passionately disagrees with my stance, but clearly has a commanding grasp of what makes a critique compelling and does a grand job at justifying their position. The mark of a great reviewer is when you can respect their position even when you disagree on the absolute strongest terms.

Works for me almost 100% so far, and works waaay better than just randomly selecting from GAF as well. :D

Yep. Getting a feel for how to turn to GAF for impressions, as well as being able to have a good gauge of the type of games I'll like has freed me from caring about review scores. At this point, my tastes don't seem to match up with most reviewers anyway and that's fine.
 

Fonds

Member
Metacritic now 72

Seems very harsh from giantbomb but if they didnt like the handling, what can you do?

Well he's trying to judge the game by something its not. The constant sim comparisons are crazy.
It's like judging a regular RPG with MMORPG standards.

I truly couldn't watch the giant bomb review. The way he was driving, dear god... How can I take that serious?
Approaching a corner inside, inside, inside. Handbrake turns everywhere.
Don't even get me started on the part where they were discussing F1... just... pfff.
 

Foshy

Member
Tbh, most racing games are incredibly fun with a high-end wheel. But most users will not own a wheel, so it's hard to recommend a game based on that particular experience.
Good wheel support is crucial for me. The Crew is fucking shit, for example, and last gen TDU2 was ruined for me because of that.

Sure, I know what you mean. But most enthusiasts like me are gonna love this, I think.
 

Surface of Me

I'm not an NPC. And neither are we.
Well he's trying to judge the game by something its not. The constant sim comparisons are crazy.
It's like judging a regular RPG with MMORPG standards.

I truly couldn't watch the giant bomb review. The way he was driving, dear god... How can I take that serious?
Approaching a corner inside, inside, inside. Handbrake turns everywhere.
Don't even get me started on the part where they were discussing F1... just... pfff.

He also compares it to arcade racers, you know. It seems a lot of people are saying reviewers are reviewing the game based on what it isn't. From reading Jeff's review and watching the QL, he couldn't figure out what it is trying to be. What was wrong with Jeff's driving?
 

Jimrpg

Member
It's definitely not because of the gameplay. Most mention it handles well but "lacks a soul", is "boring", "has no open-world"...

In my opinion it might be one of the best playing racing games on consoles ever with a wheel. Need to play some more but that's my first impression.

this is really lol-worthy.

I can see their stance, but if Driveclub lacks soul, surely Project Gotham Racing does too, where is the soul in PGR? Its just a bunch of races held together by a menu. The tracks are rigid and based on city grids. You could even say Gran Turismo has lacked soul in the PS3 outings.
 

Amir0x

Banned
Metacritic now 72

Seems very harsh from giantbomb but if they didnt like the handling, what can you do?

Hope for a better written review maybe

In an era where driving games on both ends of the arcade-to-simulation spectrum deliver car upgrades and a lot of other things that players can use to tailor the experience to their liking, Driveclub's complete lack of meaningful choices makes it feel like a weird throwback to the old, dark days of console driving games

This encapsulates the problem with so many of the DriveClub reviews today. It's embarrassing that this is just the first paragraph, but the entire review is case after case of reviewing the game for what he wishes it was rather than what it actually is. In this paragraph, for example, he's not actually telling us why this so-called era of "arcade-to-simulation.. car upgrades" is inherently superior to the alternative, or why not having that impacts the game negatively. And he does not address that issue at any point in his review, in fact later going so far as to shamefully suggest that the lack of upgrades meant the game felt unfinished. This is an acceptable critical thought? This is the bullshit that passes muster these days? Instead, it's Jeff gleefully wishing right from the start that he was playing a completely different racing game with completely different goals, rather than evaluating DriveClub as it succeeds (or not) at its own unique racing goals.

DriveClub is a pure skill-based racer; it intentionally does not have those upgrades because it harkens to a time when racing games had no inhibition between the skill of the player and the competition on the road. There's no amount of hours you can play to earn an arbitrary upgrade to make your race ever-so-slightly better than the others around you. There's no skill bonus you get from playing 20 hours more than your next competitor. It's just your skills, your competitors and the finish line. And there's absolutely no reason why any reviewer worth their salt should be even implying that upgrades are now some necessary component of the genre. They're not. They're one specific path in the genre, of which we exist in an industry perfectly capable of having great entries in all types of racing games.

There are both positives and negatives to this design strategy, and the goal would be to discuss how exactly DriveClub mishandles this approach rather than wishing it chose goals which would make it a completely different racing game. These criticisms are from a position of someone who thinks it's his place to dismiss an entire subcategory of racing games simply because he's too daft to understand the many myriad of ways such things are positive. It's the very definition of lacking the ability to properly analyze a product, and this is his fucking job. He's reviewing from the premise that it's bad from the get go, because he feels since other racing games have upgrades, that means ones which don't feel empty or boring by comparison!

He ends his opening nonsense salvo with an attack of "old school" racing games, as if there was anything inherently negative with those. Some of the best racing games ever made are old school, and are as no-frills and no-bullshit as DriveClub.

So many of these game reviewers don't actually understand the concept of criticism.
 

Foshy

Member
Hope for a better written review maybe



This encapsulates the problem with so many of the DriveClub reviews today. It's embarrassing that this is just the first paragraph, but the entire review is case after case of reviewing the game for what he wishes it was rather than what it actually is. In this paragraph, for example, he's not actually telling us why this so-called era of "arcade-to-simulation.. car upgrades" is inherently superior to the alternative, or why not having that impacts the game negatively. And he does not address that issue at any point in his review, in fact later going so far as to shamefully suggest that the lack of upgrades meant the game felt unfinished. This is an acceptable critical thought? This is the bullshit that passes muster these days? Instead, it's Jeff gleefully wishing right from the start that he was playing a completely different racing game with completely different goals, rather than evaluating DriveClub as it succeeds (or not) at its own unique racing goals.

DriveClub is a pure skill-based racer; it intentionally does not have those upgrades because it harkens to a time when racing games had no inhibition between the skill of the player and the competition on the road. There's no amount of hours you can play to earn an arbitrary upgrade to make your race ever-so-slightly better than the others around you. There's no skill bonus you get from playing 20 hours more than your next competitor. It's just your skills, your competitors and the finish line. And there's absolutely no reason why any reviewer worth their salt should be even implying that upgrades are now some necessary component of the genre. They're not. They're one specific path in the genre, of which we exist in an industry perfectly capable of having great entries in all types of racing games.

There are both positives and negatives to this design strategy, and the goal would be to discuss how exactly DriveClub mishandles this approach rather than wishing it chose goals which would make it a completely different racing game. These criticisms are from a position of someone who thinks it's his place to dismiss an entire subcategory of racing games simply because he's too daft to understand the many myriad of ways such things are positive. It's the very definition of lacking the ability to properly analyze a product, and this is his fucking job. He's reviewing from the premise that it's bad from the get go, because he feels since other racing games have upgrades, that means ones which don't feel empty or boring by comparison!

He ends his opening nonsense salvo with an attack of "old school" racing games, as if there was anything inherently negative with those. Some of the best racing games ever made are old school, and are as no-frills and no-bullshit as DriveClub.

So many of these game reviewers don't actually understand the concept of criticism.
Thank you.
 
I played a few tracks today and absolutely love this. It's a game that is going back to the basics. Racing and driving. I don't miss the lack of tuning my car, and the simplicity of access makes this even easier to just pick up and play for just a few races or a few hours. It might not be for everyone, but I'm happy as can be.
 

Jimrpg

Member
The cars have an overly grippy feel on the track, letting you get away with some occasional shenanigans by braking at the last possible moment instead of gently braking or coasting into the curves. The developers claim this is an attempt to make the game easier and fun for everyone. But this doesn't make the game feel more fun or thrilling. It just makes what otherwise feels like an attempt at simulating real cars instead feel like it misses the mark by a mile. If this were on by default as an assist for new drivers that could be disabled, potentially along with a series of additional options to let people tailor the driving a bit, maybe this would make sense. Instead it makes the game feel inauthentic to real-life racing while also not going far enough in the "fun" direction to make it an exciting, arcade-style racer.


I'm about to post my impressions to my blog about my hour's worth of Driveclub. Its funny how different opinions can be. Also Jeff's comment about penalties for cutting corners, he obviously hasn't watched any formula 1! And you're not supposed to be cutting corners in a racing game!

Snippet of my blog post -
Speaking of the handling model, its definitely leaning towards arcade style. For example, I would say Project Gotham Racing Series has more sim like handling than this, but this is definitely not as arcadey as say Need For Speed Hot Pursuit or Burnout. Right now, having used just the one car, the handling is really forgiving. I can take the wrong line in a turn adjust by varying the acceleration and not lose that much speed/time. But there's no way I would be able to do that in Gran Turismo where I need to be nailing all the correct lines to get a faster time. I am sure this is going to lead to a lot of fun times around corners, changing driving lines, outfoxing other drivers. Some people may not like the too arcadey model, but for now, I can see how it does make the racing more exciting.
 

Tekku

Member
Well he's trying to judge the game by something its not. The constant sim comparisons are crazy.
It's like judging a regular RPG with MMORPG standards.

I truly couldn't watch the giant bomb review. The way he was driving, dear god... How can I take that serious?
Approaching a corner inside, inside, inside. Handbrake turns everywhere.
Don't even get me started on the part where they were discussing F1... just... pfff.

Why are the sim comparisons crazy? It's pretty obvious to me that the game is a mix of realism and arcade. To some people, like Goeff, it seems to create too much confusion. Him driving badly could be the result of that. He doesn't really know what the game communicates.
 
his hatred of the "glued" to their path AI made me post in the other DC thread. I'd like if the AI would bump me to win (even tho i hated it when it happen to me yesterday and i finished 8th b/c of it)
 

Fonds

Member
He also compares it to arcade racers, you know. It seems a lot of people are saying reviewers are reviewing the game based on what it isn't. From reading Jeff's review and watching the QL, he couldn't figure out what it is trying to be. What was wrong with Jeff's driving?

Are you serious? Did you watch the whole thing? He was choosing horrible racing lines, crashing into the barriers because of handbrake turns, braking mid corner etc.
It was as if I was looking at someone play a shooter for the first time.

Comparing it to an arcade or a sim is both besides the point. Judge it by what it is. PGR wasn't a sim or an arcade racer either and for some reason that worked perfectly.
 

Majmun

Member
The only thing I don't understand is the ciricism regarding the linearity of the game. I mean, wtf. What's wrong with linearity in a racing game? Not all racing games need to be open world. That concept won't work with all genres.

I mean, if you're criticising the linearity of a racing game, then you're criticising racing itself and I'll advise you to never play NASCAR games.
 

Amir0x

Banned
The only thing I don't understand is the ciricism regarding the linearity of the game. I mean, wtf. What's wrong with linearity in a racing game? Not all racing games need to be open world. That concept won't work with all genres.

I mean, if you're criticising the linearity of a racing game, then you're criticising racing itself.

It's the new it-thing, reviewers now get to hide behind this latest trend instead of actually doin their job.
 

OmegaDL50

Member
The only thing I don't understand is the ciricism regarding the linearity of the game. I mean, wtf. What's wrong with linearity in a racing game? Not all racing games need to be open world. That concept won't work with all genres.

I mean, if you're criticising the linearity of a racing game, then you're criticising racing itself.

Yeah, this is another thing I didn't understand with some of the Driveclub reviews, the underlying tone that because it wasn't an open world racer is somehow flawed.

Well then I guess based on this premise, GT7 and ProjectCARS will get docked for not being open world too.
 

GlamFM

Banned
Some are still caught up in the hype and find it hard to let go it seems.

Call it the denial stage or whatever.

I´m not saying it´s wrong to enjoy the game, but calling out reviewers is.
My GOTY so far is Destiny and I find the review scores to be fair....

I personally am not surprised about the reviews scores at all.

After playing DC at two Gamescoms in a row I find a lot of my initial impressions confirmed in fact.

I tried to warn people to keep their expectations in check, but got called out, had my post history dissected to prove that I was pushing some sort of "agenda" and so on..

You can tell, and I could tell watching the development over a year, that during it´s seemingly troubled development cycle DC just didn´t come together.

There are things to build upon if EVO gets another shot at it though.
The GFX engine, although it produces very inconsistent results, sure is one of them.

In 2 or 3 weeks nobody will be talking about DC anymore and I´m really curious to see where it stands when we do our annual GAF GOTYs.
 
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