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[kyoji]

Yeah someone pointed out dragon quest. Can't think of anything else really

Theres alot more than that in there backlog, this is actually one of the more favorable timelines for square if they can correctly reshift their focus -which it seems they plan on doing to some extent.

OG squaresoft fans know that the studios they let go of today is not what made square into the prominent name that they had become in the past, or the kickass jrpg dev from the 90s, 2000s. They lost focus chasing western appeal. And this is not to shit on the studios they sold off or the ips like deus ex etc. but again these titles are not what made square on top of there game in the first place, and really had minimal impact on there success.

 

[Kadve]

Wait a second, now i get it.

Their not buying Crystal Dynamics + "Eidos" (who turns out to not exist anymore beyond being Squeenix European branch). Just Crystal Dynamics, Eidos-Montreal (the Deus Ex development studios) and associated IPs.

The 300 million makes more sense then. They've just bought a few (in Squeenix mind probably) unprofitable studios and IPs that they could go without. Not an entire publisher + associated contracts. Hell it doesn't even seem to be any European stuff involved in the Purchase. Just American.

Oh and BTW. Can anyone find a list what those "50 other" IPs in question are?

 

[LordCBH]

If this means Crystal Dynamics stops making content for Avengers, then it’s a good ass $300 million.

Also, can we get a new Thief game that doesn’t suck big floppy donkey dick.

 

[adamsapple]

Let's go!

 

[Robb]

Sounds cheap relative to all the other deals that have been going down.

Hopefully this means we’ll get a new Deus-Ex.

 

[YCoCg]

I guess people didn't pay attention the most recent Tomb Raider and Deus Ex selling like absolute dogshit. Sure, there is strong nostalgia with those IPs and other held by the studios but they don't sell and don't make money.

Because Square-Enix handled them TERRIBLY and had too high expectations. Deus Ex Mankind Divided was an utter mess in how it was advertised, remember the pre-order bullshit? And the forced tacked on multiplayer mode they didn't want to work on? And the fact that the game is great until it just literally ENDS without a proper ending as it's used a sequel bait and dev time was cut short only for SE to shout "Well it under performed we expected like 25 million copies and it only sold 7-8 million".

 

[Ghost of Caelid]

MS has their hands tied with ACTI right now. I think they would have been all over this otherwise. Regulatory pressure. Can't afford to look like the big bad right now.

Crystal Dynamics seemed obvious for them...but like you said can't afford to acquire anything with Acti going on. Surprised sony wasnt on it.

 

[balls of snow]

Food for thought, I'm planning on double dipping for guardians during a steam sale just to have it in my steam library. Who gets the cold hard $$$ then.

 

[Furball]

So shitty Final Fantasy games left?

Oh and DQ, which has been consistently better than FF for like 20 years now.

They dont own Dragon Quest IP . Yuji Hori and His company own that IP , SE just has developer and publisher right to it

 

[spartan30gr]

And microsoft of course buy

Embracer Group​

 

[Stuart360]

I think this is a good buy even if zero IP's came with it, just for the talent of CD and Eidos Montreal. Although the TR and Deus Ex games have hardly been big sellers in recent years. And i wonder if that was in part why to this deal being so good.
Its like if MS didnt buy Zenimax and they just spent 100mil on Arkane, on paper you woudl be like Arkane are top devs, all their games are great, but all their games dont sell very well too.

 

[CamHostage]

The 300 million makes more sense then. They've just bought a few (in Squeenix mind probably) unprofitable studios and IPs that they could go without. Not an entire publisher + associated contracts. Hell it doesn't even seem to be any European stuff involved in the Purchase. Just American.

But that's what Eidos was, at this point: a number of studios and IPs. They weren't really a "publisher" once they lost their name and after some consolidation, though they still acted as a publisher outside Japan with Square Enix External Studios (so they kind of were a publisher still, they just didn't get their name on a box anymore) and also the Collective titles.

The value of a publisher is its titles and talent, and maybe its brand name if they're known for making hits, but they're not massively more valuable just because their business is active in publishing.

 

[justiceiro]

I don't get it, are they sold or not? Or they just sold the IP?

 

[Forsythia]

300 million only? What? Anyway, I'm glad it's not MS or Sony, at least the games will stay multiplatform.

 

[Knightime_X]

So did they buy the ips or just a set of employees?

 

[Solarstrike]

Elon Musk should have bought them instead of wasting $40 Billion dollars on Twitter.

 

[LordBlodgett]

Embracer is huge now. I really hope they will bring some of these IPs back from the dead, especially Sleeping Dogs.

 

[GonSama]

They bought 2/3 studios + 4 IPs (Tomb Raider, Deus Ex, Thief, Legacy of Kain) for 300M. Seems like a steal.

But I think SE still owns other IPs like Life is Strange, Just Cause, Sleeping Dogs, and so on...

 

[Fitzchiv]

Deus Ex as an IP on it's own SHOULD be worth >£300M based on the original, let alone the fantastic Human Revolution from that Eidos-Montreal team. The fact that and Thief, another criminally treated IP, are being snapped up like this fills me with hope both of them can see a new era.

Deus Ex has so, so much modern relevance in the continuation of its story and themes.

 

[remember_spinal]

Once again, this makes me believe Sony is prepping to buy Square Enix, and of course SE isn’t gonna give that reasoning in their official statement. My reasons as so why I think this is even more likely….

• Sony already have console exclusivity for all of Square Enix’ bigggest franchises. Final Fantasy 7 Remake, Final Fantasy XVI, Final Fantasy XIV, Forspoken, and who knows what else….
• A very large majority of sonys game history is tied to Squaresoft/enix, with them starting PS Premium and opening up their back catalogue it gives them the freedom to add stuff like chrono trigger, final fantasy collection, xenogears, Final Fantasy tactics, vagrant story, etc. etc.
• I dont think Sony would have wanted the western branch, its even more inefficiency to have to manage. Way more mouths to feed and they don’t really turn out big profitable games. Sony also already have Tomb Raider at home, which makes far more money in gaming and the box office now
• The long history and relationship between the two companies. It also helps that Sony is still a japanese company at the end of the day. The whole narrative about ‘culture clashing’ really doesn’t come into play here

I’m not saying for sure I think it’s happening but if Square Enix is looking to sell then it will most likely be Sony. I could see them staying multiplatform but keeping final fantasy exclusively on playstation from now on. They’re already locked to their console right now and nintendo systems aren’t equipped to even run them. Nintendo will sitll get bravely default, Asano games, DQ games….

 

[Badlucktroll]

Lord help us when Apple decides to enter the gaming market and takes over.

 

[II_JumPeR_I]

 

[Gambit2483]

I feel like SE set up Crystal Dynamics with Marvel's Avengers. It could have been a much better game if SE didn't force them to focus on the GAAS stuff.

Kind of sad considering it's now a pretty decent game on PS5 and Series X (great visuals and runs smoothly).

Oh well, hopefully this means the return of Soul Reaver....a man can dream...

 

[adamsapple]

 

[geary]

I wonder who will continue the Avengers development? Who has the license now? Square or Embracer?

 

[Papacheeks]

I feel like SE set up Crystal Dynamics with Marvel's Avengers. It could have been a much better game if SE didn't force them to focus on the GAAS stuff.

Kind of sad considering it's now a pretty decent game on PS5 and Series X (great visuals and runs smoothly).

Oh well, hopefully this means the return of Soul Reaver....a man can dream...

There's nothing in what I played of that game where it felt the game's monetization came after the fact. If that was going to be the plan then they would have forced Guradians to have something similar and have a content plan for that game as well.

It was a group that chose to build levels a specific way and created a boring game loop. Monetization is easily a fixable thing as seen with Halo, GT7. Whats not easy to fix is a gameplay loop.

Team behind avengers had no clue what they were doing in making a game. Destiny's game loop though in terms of actual played content in the base game is shallow, the loop is fun as fuck. Avengers the loop isn't fun after 15 minutes and your doing the same thing over and over. Monetization or not.

The game is just not fun, nor is it fun with friends.

Once again, this makes me believe Sony is prepping to buy Square Enix, and of course SE isn’t gonna give that reasoning in their official statement. My reasons as so why I think this is even more likely….

• Sony already have console exclusivity for all of Square Enix’ bigggest franchises. Final Fantasy 7 Remake, Final Fantasy XVI, Final Fantasy XIV, Forspoken, and who knows what else….
• A very large majority of sonys game history is tied to Squaresoft/enix, with them starting PS Premium and opening up their back catalogue it gives them the freedom to add stuff like chrono trigger, final fantasy collection, xenogears, Final Fantasy tactics, vagrant story, etc. etc.
• I dont think Sony would have wanted the western branch, its even more inefficiency to have to manage. Way more mouths to feed and they don’t really turn out big profitable games. Sony also already have Tomb Raider at home, which makes far more money in gaming and the box office now
• The long history and relationship between the two companies. It also helps that Sony is still a japanese company at the end of the day. The whole narrative about ‘culture clashing’ really doesn’t come into play here

I’m not saying for sure I think it’s happening but if Square Enix is looking to sell then it will most likely be Sony. I could see them staying multiplatform but keeping final fantasy exclusively on playstation from now on. They’re already locked to their console right now and nintendo systems aren’t equipped to even run them. Nintendo will sitll get bravely default, Asano games, DQ games….

Jeff Grubb implies the same thing I've been saying, that Square is trimming the fat for a larger buyout/Merger. Pretty sure its Sony. They heavily invested in with Square, and recently I feel there's a reason there was no platforms listed for KH4.

 

[brian0057]

> Legacy of Kain, Thief, and Deus Ex are mentioned.

LET'S FUCKING GO!

 

[SteelCurtain 59]

Once again, this makes me believe Sony is prepping to buy Square Enix, and of course SE isn’t gonna give that reasoning in their official statement. My reasons as so why I think this is even more likely….

• Sony already have console exclusivity for all of Square Enix’ bigggest franchises. Final Fantasy 7 Remake, Final Fantasy XVI, Final Fantasy XIV, Forspoken, and who knows what else….
• A very large majority of sonys game history is tied to Squaresoft/enix, with them starting PS Premium and opening up their back catalogue it gives them the freedom to add stuff like chrono trigger, final fantasy collection, xenogears, Final Fantasy tactics, vagrant story, etc. etc.
• I dont think Sony would have wanted the western branch, its even more inefficiency to have to manage. Way more mouths to feed and they don’t really turn out big profitable games. Sony also already have Tomb Raider at home, which makes far more money in gaming and the box office now
• The long history and relationship between the two companies. It also helps that Sony is still a japanese company at the end of the day. The whole narrative about ‘culture clashing’ really doesn’t come into play here

I’m not saying for sure I think it’s happening but if Square Enix is looking to sell then it will most likely be Sony. I could see them staying multiplatform but keeping final fantasy exclusively on playstation from now on. They’re already locked to their console right now and nintendo systems aren’t equipped to even run them. Nintendo will sitll get bravely default, Asano games, DQ games….

If this is the plan, Embracer's acquisition makes me really happy, Tomb Raider and Deus Ex were the IPs I'd be mad at being exclusive, combined with those studios it seems like basically all the parts of Square Enix I really care about have been sold. Just Cause and Life is Strange maybe but Just Cause seems to have run it's course and Life is Strange will be unlikely to ever reach the highs of the first one. And basically everything else was already timed or permanent exclusive to Playstation anyways.

 

[remember_spinal]

There's nothing in what I played of that game where it felt the game's monetization came after the fact. If that was going to be the plan then they would have forced Guradians to have something similar and have a content plan for that game as well.

It was a group that chose to build levels a specific way and created a boring game loop. Monetization is easily a fixable thing as seen with Halo, GT7. Whats not easy to fix is a gameplay loop.

Team behind avengers had no clue what they were doing in making a game. Destiny's game loop though in terms of actual played content in the base game is shallow, the loop is fun as fuck. Avengers the loop isn't fun after 15 minutes and your doing the same thing over and over. Monetization or not.

The game is just not fun, nor is it fun with friends.



Jeff Grubb implies the same thing I've been saying, that Square is trimming the fat for a larger buyout/Merger. Pretty sure its Sony. They heavily invested in with Square, and recently I feel there's a reason there was no platforms listed for KH4.

Yeah, i was pretty adamant that there’s no way Sony would go after Square Enix, and thats partly because of how big they were. Cutting off the western division just kind of aligned a lot of different ideas i had been fighting against.

I wouldn’t be surprised to see square enix sell off more of its non-gaming assets by the end of this year

 

[Papacheeks]

Yeah, i was pretty adamant that there’s no way Sony would go after Square Enix, and thats partly because of how big they were. Cutting off the western division just kind of aligned a lot of different ideas i had been fighting against.

I wouldn’t be surprised to see square enix sell off more of its non-gaming assets by the end of this year

I mean what else is there for assets? Sony would want currently all of their Japan studios.

FF14 online prints money. Sony see's that as a win, FF7R sold better than FF15 did and that game was on 3 platforms.

 

[K2D]

So shitty Final Fantasy games left?

Oh and DQ, which has been consistently better than FF for like 20 years now.

You should see a proctologist about that..

 

[TidusYuna]

I wonder who will continue the Avengers development? Who has the license now? Square or Embracer?

The license was between Marvel and Square Enix so Square Enix should have the license but now they have nobody to make their marvel games because they just sold off their western division and their Japanese divisions are all tied up in projects already.

I think this could mean three things:

1) Either the two marvel games: Marvel's Avengers and the Guardians of the Galaxy completed the licensing deal. Because the original deal was multiple Marvel games, they never specified how many. So the licensing agreement could have been fulfilled with those two games.

or

2) Square Enix sold off their western division/IPs in an effort to become cheaper in order to be acquired with the marvel games license still in tact for whoever acquires Square Enix.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

insane deal. Shocked Sony didn’t want in on that

On one hand i agree.
On another hand...would Sony care for more studios that do what theirs already do...only worse?
The IPs are nice though.

But honestly...better Embracer than a company that could hold these IPs hostage or behind a subscription service.

But now i wonder if Sony will care to acquire Square-Enix...what IPs do they have? Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Kingdom Hearts and...what else?

Before this happened i'd prefer Square-Enix to Capcom...but as it is right now, Capcom is a better fit for them. Final Fantasy is already "theirs" in a way.

 

[Papacheeks]

imagine all the legacy titles square has? Imagine all of those classics like PS1 games of Vagarant Story/ff6/7/8/9/Brave Fencer Musashi all on the classics section?

Fuck yes.

On one hand i agree.
On another hand...would Sony care for more studios that do what theirs already do...only worse?
The IPs are nice though.

But honestly...better Embracer than a company that could hold these IPs hostage or behind a subscription service.

But now i wonder if Sony will care to acquire Square-Enix...what IPs do they have? Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Kingdom Hearts and...what else?

Before this happened i'd prefer Square-Enix to Capcom...but as it is right now, Capcom is a better fit for them. Final Fantasy is already "theirs" in a way.

Honestly I really think thats what is happening. The big give away was Sony pushed their report from APril till May. Meaning deals are being made and not finalized yet. Square-Enix biggest investment isn't NFT's it's Cloud and AI, which Sony literally invested heavily in past couple years.

Makes sense that a merger/Buyout would happen. And since Sony would not want the extra baggage of all those western developers, selling them off seems to be the best option. I expect there to be couple other developers/groups from Square spun off.

Sony will get this down to Mobile, FF teams, and their tech teams.

 

[TidusYuna]

On one hand i agree.
On another hand...would Sony care for more studios that do what theirs already do...only worse?
The IPs are nice though.

But honestly...better Embracer than a company that could hold these IPs hostage or behind a subscription service.

But now i wonder if Sony will care to acquire Square-Enix...what IPs do they have? Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Kingdom Hearts and...what else?

Before this happened i'd prefer Square-Enix to Capcom...but as it is right now, Capcom is a better fit for them. Final Fantasy is already "theirs" in a way.

The Square Enix/Marvel licensing deal. The rights to make a Marvel's Avenger game assuming the deal hasn't expired. Bring Spiderman together with Marvel's Avengers would be huge. Also Guardian of the Galaxy and Wolverine.

 

[reksveks]

FF7R sold better than FF15 did and that game was on 3 platforms.

Source?

Suspect its true but we haven't got a ff7r number for a while.

For ff xv

By November 2021, the game had sold over 9.8 million copies worldwide.[

 

[TidusYuna]

imagine all the legacy titles square has? Imagine all of those classics like PS1 games of Vagarant Story/ff6/7/8/9/Brave Fencer Musashi all on the classics section?

Fuck yes.



Honestly I really think thats what is happening. The big give away was Sony pushed their report from APril till May. Meaning deals are being made and not finalized yet. Square-Enix biggest investment isn't NFT's it's Cloud and AI, which Sony literally invested heavily in past couple years.

Makes sense that a merger/Buyout would happen. And since Sony would not want the extra baggage of all those western developers, selling them off seems to be the best option. I expect there to be couple other developers/groups from Square spun off.

Sony will get this down to Mobile, FF teams, and their tech teams.

So Nintendo is about to make some acquisitions then?

 

[adamsapple]

FF7R sold better than FF15 did and that game was on 3 platforms.

Source?

FF7R did not sell more than XV.

Final Fantasy XV Sells 9.5 Million Copies, Now Fourth Best-Selling Game In The Series

Final Fantasy XV sales have hit more than 9.5 million copies worldwide. The game was originally released back in November 2016.

twistedvoxel.com

It sold 9m as of latest recorded figures in Feb 2021. FFVII R I can only find figures of 5m shipped.

 

[SF Kosmo]

I don't think this will be a bad thing in the end. Hopefully we get more Deus Ex out of it.

 

[jimmypython]

This either signals a SE sell, or a Konami style transition (blockchain etc)

Sell might not be bad but Konami transition is definitely the worst case scenario.

 

[Papacheeks]

So Nintendo is about to make some acquisitions then?

Nintendo won't buy anyone that doesn't have "Nintendo DNA", also they dont have the leverage Sony has for other ventures.

 

[LordCBH]

This either signals a SE sell, or a Konami style transition (blockchain etc)

Sell might not be bad but Konami transition is definitely the worst case scenario.

I honestly don’t think we’d see Square make a Konami type transition to be honest. It doesn’t make sense for them and I think they know it.

I don't think this will be a bad thing in the end. Hopefully we get more Deus Ex out of it.

Sign me up for a new Deus Ex. I adored HR and thoroughly enjoyed Mankind Divided despite its issues.

 

[TidusYuna]

Nintendo won't buy anyone that doesn't have "Nintendo DNA", also they dont have the leverage Sony has for other ventures.

So who do you think will get spun off and who do you think will acquire them? Or you mean just dev teams not IPs.

 

[Papacheeks]

Source?

Suspect its true but we haven't got a ff7r number for a while.

For ff xv

Yea I don't have them just know from couple sales people on twitter that it's well beyond the 5 million that was reported in 2020. And that was on 1 platform. FF15 was on 3 platforms and has been out since 2016. and it sold like 10 Million.

So the fact FF7R sold over half that in half the time tells me Square can do almost as well on one platform. Where I think FF7R faltered was the PC potential. ANd I also think part of Square's venture with Sony will be getting their games like Kingdom Hearts, FF7R part 2 on steam/PC easier, and in a better playing state.

So who do you think will get spun off and who do you think will acquire them? Or you mean just dev teams not IPs.

Square Enix Shanghai. Which is Eidos Shanghai I believe.

Which might be part of the sale?

It wasn't mentioned.

Taito Group is legacy part of the company so that will stay. But anything under that like Amusement parks if hasn't already been shut down will be sold.

I think Japan wise SQure Enix is in good standing. Literally Mobile, MMO and FF/KH brands pull in money. FF14 prints money.

 

[Pilgrimzero]

You should see a proctologist about that..

Your response makes no sense.

Do you think I care about Square or FF?

If this a new Deus Ex made or a better Tomb Raider. I’m all for the sale.

 

[JMarcell]

I wonder if they will EMBRACE old IPs like Legacy of Kain Soul Reaver. A Remake would be awesome.

 

[Baki]

Yeah, Sony should have pounced for the Tomb Raider movie rights, maybe they’re tied up with something too?

Movie rights probably already tied up.

Looking at the financials, both units pulled in $190M revenue for 2021. Net income was low, but that still makes the purchase price of $300M absolutely comical. Even at a conservative 3X price to sales ratio, those studios would have been valued at $570M. This just makes it clear that Square Enix wanted to offload them at any cost. Talk about terrible mismanagement right until the end. Losing $190M in yearly revenue and recognisable IPs is not going to reflect well on their stock price.

 

[Stuart360]

I wonder if they will EMBRACE old IPs like Legacy of Kain Soul Reaver. A Remake would be awesome.

I dont know if i'm losing my mind here but i thought a rmake/remaster was already being made?. I'm sure i read about it as they were talking about readding known content that was cut. Unless i'm mixing it up with some unofficial remake by a modder etc. I dont think i am though.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

Lord help us when Apple decides to enter the gaming market and takes over.

Not sure why they would. They're already making money hand over first without the huge investment it would take.

 

[Baki]

230mil for Insomniac is the deal of the century. They are pretty much the #1 Sony studio around these days if you ask me.

This is now the deal of the century. Multiple iconic IPs, 2 talented studios and $190M in yearly revenue for $300M is mind blowing lol.