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[Riky]

Yes let's scrap the console that is half your userbase and half of those owners are new to the ecosystem. I'd love to see some people here run a business.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Yes let's scrap the console that is half your userbase and half of those owners are new to the ecosystem. I'd love to see some people here run a business.

It's more like the policy needs changing. Its still Microsofts fault and not Larians.

 

[DosGamer]

Yes let's scrap the console that is half your userbase and half of those owners are new to the ecosystem. I'd love to see some people here run a business.

Actually I think scrapping the series S would be a wise choice. So many things wrong with it...

1) yes its a cheaper alternative, but its more a minor upgrade and not a generational leap
2) The naming of these MS consoles is horrid. That alone hurts them. I have seen parents first hand buy the wrong console because of the shitty naming system they have.
3) They did the same thing last generation ... with a shitty 4 GB HD if I remember correctly. WTF, gonna download mobile games to play on it? Its poor business and I am an xbox fan.

 

[Topher]

That's a lot of RAM for a sphincter

Mindflayers have the "No constipation" skill.

 

[GHG]

Yes let's scrap the console that is half your userbase and half of those owners are new to the ecosystem. I'd love to see some people here run a business.

When you put "running a business" over being able to play great games.

Hey, if that's your attitude I hear there's plenty of money to be made in the mobile gaming space, why not just call it a day and spend your time there? That way you can enjoy the feeling of corporations making huge amounts of money without boundaries.

 

[DeepEnigma]

That's a lot of RAM for a sphincter

Assloads of RAM!

 

[Riky]

Actually I think scrapping the series S would be a wise choice. So many things wrong with it...

1) yes its a cheaper alternative, but its more a minor upgrade and not a generational leap
2) The naming of these MS consoles is horrid. That alone hurts them. I have seen parents first hand buy the wrong console because of the shitty naming system they have.
3) They did the same thing last generation ... with a shitty 4 GB HD if I remember correctly. WTF, gonna download mobile games to play on it? Its poor business and I am an xbox fan.

Depends what you mean by a generational leap, the CPU is and the storage is. The GPU is in some regards.

The naming isn't difficult it actually makes more sense than the 360 times. The X is the premium console and the S is the base console.

I think you're talking about the 360s which had 4gb of base storage, you could still slot a HDD in if you wanted to. Since games ran from disc anyway and saves were in the cloud it wasn't a huge deal back then.

 

[Riky]

It's more like the policy needs changing. Its still Microsofts fault and not Larians.

The whole Xbox file system and save system is unified, so that's why the policy makes sense. Also can you imagine for a second if they did allow Series S versions to omit whole gameplay features, there would just be threads about how MS lied that it would only be graphical downgrades.
I'd be amazed if they split their userbase like that now, the game will come to Xbox at some point and the split screen will be there.
At the moment no console version has launched with the PC version which is obviously their priority.

 

[DosGamer]

Most consumers under the age of 18 still rely on parents/ family or significant others to purchase the console for them. It really needs to be simplified when purchasing. Having multiple options just seems bougee and counter productive to what you are trying to do and that is put a foot print in as many homes as possible.

I still think MS needs to morph the xbox into an actual PC with gaming as a importance and some of the office capabilities be erased to improve functionality. Just a thought

 

[twilo99]

Here you go. VRAM drops to 3726 mb. Sys ram to 13121 mb.

Great so in that particular scene split screen requires an extra 1900mb (5637mb) of VRAM and ~134mb of system RAM.

The xss has 8GB of GDDR6? Isn't that enough to cover the situation at 900p and low settings based on all of that?

 

[MasterCornholio]

The whole Xbox file system and save system is unified, so that's why the policy makes sense. Also can you imagine for a second if they did allow Series S versions to omit whole gameplay features, there would just be threads about how MS lied that it would only be graphical downgrades.
I'd be amazed if they split their userbase like that now, the game will come to Xbox at some point and the split screen will be there.
At the moment no console version has launched with the PC version which is obviously their priority.

There's also the possibility that they can't get it to work on the Series S. If that happens would you be happy with the game never coming to Xbox?

That's why the policy needs changing.

 

[DForce]

Yes let's scrap the console that is half your userbase and half of those owners are new to the ecosystem. I'd love to see some people here run a business.

 

[Solidus_T]

There's also the possibility that they can't get it to work on the Series S. If that happens would you be happy with the game never coming to Xbox?

That's why the policy needs changing.

If they changed the policy, they would be subject to lawsuits due to their promise to deliver the same experience to those who purchased a Series S. At best, they could try to change the parity policy, but even that would be risky

 

[GHG]

Great so in that particular scene split screen requires an extra 1900mb (5637mb) of VRAM and ~134mb of system RAM.

The xss has 8GB of GDDR6? Isn't that enough to cover the situation at 900p and low settings based on all of that?

The split screen is untethered and allows both players absolute freedom to do as they please (for example one player can be in battle while another is in the midst of dialogue cutscenes).

A single scenario alone being within spec for the Series S isn't going to cut it, there needs to be appropriate headroom to cover the vast majority of possible situations at what they deem to be an acceptable level of performance.

 

[MasterCornholio]

If they changed the policy, they would be subject to lawsuits due to their promise to deliver the same experience to those who purchased a Series S. At best, they could try to change the parity policy, but even that would be risky

I believe that having the game available on Xbox consoles is better than not having it at all. They could make an exception but I agree there would be some risks with that.

 

[Topher]

Great so in that particular scene split screen requires an extra 1900mb (5637mb) of VRAM and ~134mb of system RAM.

The xss has 8GB of GDDR6? Isn't that enough to cover the situation at 900p and low settings based on all of that?

Clearly not when that leaves only 2 and a half gigs of ram free for everything else running in the game. And has been pointed out, this area I tested is not even close to the most demanding areas in the game and doesn't account for complete freedom to be in different areas.

 

[Riky]

There's also the possibility that they can't get it to work on the Series S. If that happens would you be happy with the game never coming to Xbox?

That's why the policy needs changing.

The developer has been clear it will come to Xbox.

 

[DeepEnigma]

 

[VideoGameEnjoyer]

Series S SKU was a mistake.

 

[MasterCornholio]

The developer has been clear it will come to Xbox.

Only if they can get it working on the Series S. If not some exception would have to be made.

Anyways I don't think your celebrating the delay or anything similar.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Great so in that particular scene split screen requires an extra 1900mb (5637mb) of VRAM and ~134mb of system RAM.

The xss has 8GB of GDDR6? Isn't that enough to cover the situation at 900p and low settings based on all of that?

You do realize memory allocation will change depending on what is being done and where you are, yes? For all games.

 

[Topher]

You do realize memory allocation will change depending on what is being done and where you are, yes? For all games.

NXGamer laid it out pretty well in his video. He showed sections where the two characters were in completely different areas and total memory usage was 13 GB. Granted, that was at 1080p, but 900p isn't that far off.

Timestamped

 

[GHG]

You do realize memory allocation will change depending on what is being done and where you are, yes? For all games.

He's joined the ranks of riky and darkmage.

Logic need not apply when you're a full time fluffer.

 

[DeepEnigma]

NXGamer laid it out pretty well in his video. He showed sections where the two characters were in completely different areas and total memory usage was 13 GB. Granted, that was at 1080p, but 900p isn't that far off.

Timestamped

He's joined the ranks of riky and darkmage.

Logic need not apply.

It's embarrassing at this point. The intellectual dishonesty all to paint a narrative that this falls on Larian, and not a box that has the same effective RAM allocation as last-gen, with a parity clause for 2023 and beyond. Firesale that industry disruption.

 

[iQuasarLV]

Xbox Should really drop the "must run on Series S locally" and migrate to the "stream on Series S" thought paradigm.

 

[Solidus_T]

I believe that having the game available on Xbox consoles is better than not having it at all. They could make an exception but I agree there would be some risks with that.

I don't disagree with you - MS is just in a really sticky situation right now, and of their own making of course.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Xbox Should really drop the "must run on Series S locally" and migrate to the "stream on Series S" thought paradigm.

Maybe that was the plan

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Maybe that was the plan

No, because that would involve them admitting they made a mistake hardware wise vs. Sony. They won’t do it due to hubris.

 

[skit_data]

NXGamer laid it out pretty well in his video. He showed sections where the two characters were in completely different areas and total memory usage was 13 GB. Granted, that was at 1080p, but 900p isn't that far off.

Timestamped

That system memory usage is pretty high as far as I can tell (rarely play on PC these days) so I assume it's the culprit rather than the VRAM.
Does that memory usage include OS and other processes running outside of the game itself?

Edit: *meant to quote your earlier posts with your own screenshots and numbers

 

[StereoVsn]

I blame the parity policy more than anything.

And it's not just S vs X party policy, there is also parity policy to PS5. Larian can't just drop split screen for Xbox, they would have to drop a working feature for PS5 and patch that in later as well.

 

[MasterCornholio]

I don't disagree with you - MS is just in a really sticky situation right now, and of their own making of course.

I agree with that.

Microsoft made this mess and now they have to find a solution to it. None of the outcomes is going to be easy for them. Either games get delayed or skip Xbox which would be the worst option for consumers. The other is that features get removed from the Series S version something which could end in a Law suit. But then again the fines are peanuts for them so maybe they can afford to do this.

 

[DeepEnigma]

And it's not just S vs X party policy, there is also parity policy to PS5. Larian can't just drop split screen for Xbox, they would have to drop a working feature for PS5 and patch that in later as well.

They would have to add it back later with exclusive Master Chief skins

 

[MasterCornholio]

And it's not just S vs X party policy, there is also parity policy to PS5. Larian can't just drop split screen for Xbox, they would have to drop a working feature for PS5 and patch that in later as well.

That's not Sonys fault though. They shouldn't have made the policy the way they did. Maybe if they were more flexible from the beginning this wouldn't have happened.

 

[IntentionalPun]

I still don't get why they can't release the game in general on Xbox w/o split screen.

Then release the feature when/if it's ever ready on Series S.

Where are people getting they have a parity policy with PS5?

 

[iQuasarLV]

It's embarrassing at this point. The intellectual dishonesty all to paint a narrative that this falls on Larian, and not a box that has the same effective RAM allocation as last-gen, with a parity clause for 2023 and beyond. Firesale that industry disruption.

Yea the optimization that I have seen throughout EA was amazing. From 2020 to release Larian was able to allow me to play on the same PC from 1080 to 4k. That says just how bad the series S is as a forced option to release on the Microsoft platform.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I still don't get why they can't release the game in general on Xbox w/o split screen.

Then release the feature when/if it's ever ready on Series S.

The parity clauses also cover other systems. If the PS5 has more features, that's a no-go.

 

[IntentionalPun]

The parity clauses also cover other systems. If the PS5 has more features, that's a no-go.

I edited my post; where are you guys getting that there would be a parity clause for this game?

I don't think there's any blanket policy like that for the systems, it's when they enter into some other form of deal like a marketing deal or something like Gamepass.

 

[GHG]

I edited my post; where are you guys getting that there would be a parity clause for this game?

I don't think there's any blanket policy like that for the systems, it's when they enter into some other form of deal like a marketing deal or something like Gamepass.

The full details are redacted but it encompasses their general 3rd party publisher license agreement:

https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1821175/000149315220023938/ex10-21.htm

That was from their agreement with 704games who make the nascar heat games.

 

[Ironman_Bad]

Do people really still play splitscreen?? Yikes better have 75+ inch screen

 

[mckmas8808]

The whole Xbox file system and save system is unified, so that's why the policy makes sense. Also can you imagine for a second if they did allow Series S versions to omit whole gameplay features, there would just be threads about how MS lied that it would only be graphical downgrades.
I'd be amazed if they split their userbase like that now, the game will come to Xbox at some point and the split screen will be there.
At the moment no console version has launched with the PC version which is obviously their priority.

 

[IntentionalPun]

The full details are redacted but it encompasses their general 3rd party publisher license agreement:

https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1821175/000149315220023938/ex10-21.htm

That was from their agreement with 704games who make the nascar heat games.

Thanks, interesting.

Still feel like MS would rather they ship w/o the feature, and they could get the OK from them.

It also just seems to me.. if they aren't releasing the game at all, anywhere near the PS5 version... how are they at parity? lol

 

[Solidus_T]

Do people really still play splitscreen?? Yikes better have 75+ inch screen

Yes. Before he left for his postdoc, I played Divinity Original Sin 2 with my twin brother all the time.

EDIT: And he plays it with his fiancée. I'm sure they'll be playing Baldur's Gate 3 split screen if they already aren't

 

[DeepEnigma]

Thanks, interesting.

Still feel like MS would rather they ship w/o the feature, and they could get the OK from them.

Nah, that would be mindshare suicide. Would make their system(s) look technically inferior.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Nah, that would be mindshare suicide. Would make their system(s) look technically inferior.

As opposed to..

Anyone paying attention to this kind of shit already knows why Larian didn't release at the same time?

lol

Seems like a damned if you do damned if you don't scenario.. but just outright not having a major game come out w/i it's PS5 launch window, for no reason other than a minor feature... seems way more damned.

 

[DeepEnigma]

As opposed to..

Anyone paying attention to this kind of shit already knows why Larian didn't release at the same time?

lol

Seems like a damned if you do damned if you don't scenario.. but just outright not having a major game come out w/i it's PS5 launch window, for no reason other than a minor feature... seems way more damned.

It's a popular feature in Larian games as well as the D&D parties people have.

 

[Mr Moose]

Great so in that particular scene split screen requires an extra 1900mb (5637mb) of VRAM and ~134mb of system RAM.

The xss has 8GB of GDDR6? Isn't that enough to cover the situation at 900p and low settings based on all of that?

5.6GB VRAM + 13GB RAM.

Yup, 8GB should be enough.

 

[Balducci30]

Isn’t it still coming out on Xbox later tho?

 

[MasterCornholio]

Isn’t it still coming out on Xbox later tho?

When they fix the Series S version. But no idea when that will be.

 

[Mr Moose]

Isn’t it still coming out on Xbox later tho?

Depends if they can get it working.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

If they'd have gone into this generation with the intent to make games exclusively for the Series X, they absolutely would be competing head on with Sony.

As it stands, they might as well get out of the console game entirely, as they clearly don't know what to do/don't care.

With Game Pass, no. It still would have been a clear loss to PlayStation. They’d be in a better position, yes, but still a loss nonetheless. They will always lose to PlayStation if Sony doesn’t mess up. It’s a far, Far, FAR bigger brand. Period.