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Enlightened Season 2 |OT| Even agents of change get cancelled sometimes.

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anaron

Member
The Awl: Why We Need "Enlightened" (great back and forth between these ladies on the show)

Michelle Dean: Recently I found myself actively worrying about the show's potential cancellation as I went about my day. And I keep tossing around different reasons of articulating why. One is of course that like David Haglund at Slate, I think it's the most interesting show on television right now, as well as the best acted and written and the most aesthetically rich. That sounds so boringly ordinary media narrative-y, but it does feel like the only show where I see a line back to the best of the "prestige cable" shows of the last few years, shows like "The Sopranos" and the better seasons of "Six Feet Under" and "Deadwood." White's grasp of people's interior lives is so much richer than anything else on television. Which of course, lately, I understand to be "unpopular," because things like the sight gag-driven "Girls" or the pageantry of "Mad Men" are what "we" want.

Jane Hu: I'm generally quite quick to invest in the television I watch, but I'm actually protective of "Enlightened," getting into frenzied arguments and pleading rants about why it's so singular and why everyone should watch it. You, reader, why aren't you watching it right now??

Michelle, I too have been overcome with an increasing concern that the show won't get the third season it so obviously deserves. That White seemed to be gratefully grasping at any praise the show could get in his HuffPo interview broke my heart: "He deserves better than this!" Suddenly, all other television felt like the enemy. That interview came out a bit over week ago, and since then there's definitely been a swell in critical attention. Where have all these other viewers been? (Admittedly, I had also been quiet on "Enlightened" until a month ago, when I started rewatching episodes in anticipation for the Todd Haynes-directed one. Please HBO, don't make me have only these two seasons to rewatch.)

Maura Johnston: I started watching "Enlightened" at the jump, and I remember feeling like it was somewhat falsely advertised in the first season; the posters showed Dern mid-first-episode-meltdown, teasing a show with an unhinged female at the center! and the promise of lunacy! and maybe at least one meltdown a show! Of course, things did not work out that way—the impressionistic first season felt at times like an uncomfortable, if very precisely remembered, dream, with long silences and rich hues draping the suburban Southern California setting; some of the social situations were the stuff of nightmares, the bad dreams that you have where you're rooted in a place and can't leave because your legs just won't move, thanks to all those deeply buried memories and thoughts in your brain that are locking you in place. Laura Dern's show-bracketing voiceovers had this drowsiness to them, but it was the type of sleepiness that accompanies an awakening, not a drifting into sleep. (The second season is a bit more "plotted," as it were, and the stark onyx of Abaddonn's fortress—that's the company where Dern works—seems to pay visual tribute to the show's increased dramatic structure.)

But even though it's beautifully written, elegantly shot and well-acted (and has made me curl up into a ball at least twice an episode this season), I don't think it's too surprising that this show is on the brink—and not just because I have a taste for lip glosses that get discontinued and foodstuffs that I can only find in, like, one grocery store, and maybe only for a few months. I've heard people complain that they don't find Amy "relatable," and I have to think that's in large part because she's a female character who isn't interested in presenting herself as someone who people have to like. That shit is only reserved for your Don Drapers, your Walter Whites—hell, your Jerry Seinfelds and your George Costanzas, even. In that way "Enlightened" reminds me a bit of "Bunheads," another show with a Woman Of A Certain Age Who Has Her Own Things Going On at its core; it, too, has low ratings and a question mark hanging over its future. Mike White's dialogue is certainly slower than Amy Sherman-Palladino's rapidfire patter, and Amy Jellicoe is more of an out-and-out antihero than Michelle Simms, acting more blatantly in her (sublimated) self-interest and seeming more deliberately divorced from the real world. But both characters are at an age where they should have kids and don't, where they should have signposts of stabile adulthood and don't (both are living rent-free, Amy with her mother and Michelle with her mother-in-law), where they should be settled. Neither of them is, though, and watching that struggle is essential to both shows' driving force.

(Dear HBO: If you do renew "Enlightened," please don't take this comparison as an excuse to "suggest" to Mike White that he add a group of dancing teenagers to the ensemble.)
 

Fumoffu

Neo Member
well it got its best press about half-way through the season. when it premiered everyone was all GIRLS GIRLS CULTURAL ZEITGEIST GIRLS GIRLS LENA DUNHAM GIRLS. i think a season break gives people a chance to catch up (there aren't many episodes really) and allows excitement to be built from before the start of the new season, now it has been embraced by the media as a genuinely excellent show.

then again it might be one of those shows that people just aren't interested in for whatever reason and despite my loud objections about how important it is, to most it probably doesn't have the intellectual cache of serious dramas about the american dream like the wire or mad men to work as a prestige show.

basically hbo plz. i love you don't let me down.


I gave Girls a shot, watched the first season and it was pretty good. After the hiatus I just couldn't go back, I get what Lena Dunham is trying to do but I relate to Enlightened more, just feel more emotions and tend to care about the characters a lot more than see them being killed off.
 

Bladenic

Member
This show is great and all, but it's not like HBO has any shortage of other highly acclaimed shows that also actually get watched by a lot of people. I want it to be renewed, but if it doesn't, I'm not gonna be all like "fuck HBO" because them cancelling this is totally understandable.
 

anaron

Member
Here Comes the Tidal Wave: On "Enlightened" by Jane Hu


These past weeks, there’s been an upsurge in attention paid to Enlightened. HBO hasn’t yet renewed the series for a third season and, in a recent interview with Maureen Ryan, White admits: “Right now, we’re struggling for our lives.” This week, on Marc Maron’s WTF podcast, even White admitted there probably won’t be a third season. It’s been difficult to see the hopes for Enlightened dwindle in such a way that its own creator anticipates its cancellation, but the show — while drawing a small audience — draws the kind that remains ferociously faithful. White has come forward too, asking critics and journalists who loved Enlightened to promote it before it’s too late.

The response has been impassioned. New interviews and articles have appeared each day this week, and it’s hard for viewers not to make an association between Amy’s desire to make a change through social media, and what individual Enlightened fans have done with Twitter. White’s pleas, like those of his critics and fans, are almost ironically in keeping with the show’s dwarfed characters, such as all those who work in the basement of Abaddonn, toiling away to not much avail. For me, though, it’s a gift to know Enlightened exists. I’m grateful.

Criticisms range from The Female Protagonist Is Aggravating to Nothing Happens, but at the center of all these judgments is the fact that Enlightened is a difficult show. It portrays mental illness and destructive co-dependent relationships without providing any easy perspectives on them, because White refuses to pathologize his characters. It moves among voiceovers and epistolary exchanges — a novelistic move, especially for television — to cinematic panoramas of L.A. reminiscent of Blade Runner, to slapstick comedy. One moment it’s deadly serious, and then Tyler needs to pee. (This happens more than once.) Nowhere else has HBO proven its adage to make “more than you imagined” than with Enlightened, a show buzzing with life and nerve. It’s one that is hard to pinpoint, because it forces you to jump among perspectives, genres, and modes of identification.

The laziest critique so far has been to come down on Amy as abrasive, socially deaf, or self-aggrandizing — all of which are true, at times, but which don’t come close to describing her character’s complexities, not to mention the sexism that underwrites many such opinions. Amy is overwhelmingly identifiable, and any recognition of how she makes one uncomfortable or embarrassed on her behalf only confirms this. To cringe at Amy’s social or romantic floundering is to recognize ourselves as perhaps once — or still — just as unaware. Amy’s character might even be a source of viewer vicariousness — a character so wholly flawed and vulnerable that to watch her live out, and live through, her mistakes allows us to avoid confronting ours.


As viewers critique Amy at the individual level, they might miss the more general critique the show presents. “People are living under the illusion that the American Dream is working for them,” says Amy in a moment of frustration. It’s a dream that has gone on too long. To see Amy face her past on a personal level is also to see her come to terms with it on a historical one. Criticisms of Amy as a person seem to ignore the environment that has formed her, and the show takes pains to illustrate how difficult it is to escape our past.

Salon: Dermot Mulroney: “I forced myself on Mike White and wound up with a part”

How did you land a role on “Enlightened”?

I don’t know. I just recently got to know [creator] Mike White, so that potentially had something to do with it. I’ve known Laura for years, but not that well. This is really what happened: I watched the whole first season because of, well, because of Laura and because of Mike. That was a good combination for me, of names. Plus there was a great poster on the streets in L.A. where her mascara is running down her face and she just looks like a maniac. I don’t watch that many series, but this one I started from the first episode. So I was already a fan, and then I met Mike. In fact, I kind of forced myself on him and wound up with a part. I don’t know if it’s directly related, but it worked out.

LOL
 
This show is great and all, but it's not like HBO has any shortage of other highly acclaimed shows that also actually get watched by a lot of people. I want it to be renewed, but if it doesn't, I'm not gonna be all like "fuck HBO" because them cancelling this is totally understandable.

That's pretty much exactly my thinking too. I would love for this show to come back, since the only other show HBO currently has that I like as much as it is ending for sure (Treme), but I'd totally get it if they pulled the plug.
 

RatskyWatsky

Hunky Nostradamus
it's not like HBO has any shortage of other highly acclaimed shows that also actually get watched by a lot of people.

No? Sure, Game of Thrones and Girls are two of the zeitgeist-y-est shows on the air, are well received, and are probably the most covered shows HBO has had in years, but what about their other shows?

Boardwalk Empire gets pretty good reviews, though it usually fails to make any top of the year lists. The Newsroom is extremely polarizing and even the best reviews are still pretty mediocre.

Veep and Treme are both well received critically, though I rarely see any critic talking up either of those shows. Both of them are sort of flying under the radar and Treme is ending this year.

True Blood and Eastbound & Down aren't exactly critical darlings, despite their popularity. Curb Your Enthusiasm is in limbo at the moment.

Enlightened is their most critically lauded show in years by seemingly a large margin. I don't remember seeing any "Why We Need The Newsroom" or " Veep is TV’s best show right now—and it needs more viewers" articles anywhere. Again, I'd understand if they cancelled it - it is a business after all and they're in it to make money - but they'd also be throwing away something special that only comes around once every half+ decade. Just looking at their programming lineup from the last few years...these types of cult/critical hits don't just grow on trees. Even for HBO.
 
Veep and The Newsroom will likely always be bigger shows. Enlightened is fucking amazing, but its hard to articulate why it's so amazing, even in a conversation, god forbid to think of how to do that in marketing, and that will always be a problem. The show is great in so many ways, but because there are so many moving pieces as to what makes it what it is, the message gets lost.
 

destrudo

Member
This show is great and all, but it's not like HBO has any shortage of other highly acclaimed shows that also actually get watched by a lot of people. I want it to be renewed, but if it doesn't, I'm not gonna be all like "fuck HBO" because them cancelling this is totally understandable.

While that's very true, and I would continue watching all their other quality shows quite happily even if Enlightened is cancelled, it definitely fills a niche that those other shows don't. I don't know, but this show feels so much more relatable to everyday life and therefore more meaningful to me than anything else on HBO right now.
 

anaron

Member
In an age where cable television shows are largely tent-poled by explicit violence and sex with leading male anti-heroes, Enlightened is one of the only comparatively 'normal' (yet still completely fresh) shows out there right now. I want it to serve as the leading example for network heads to take chances and let the mostly lacking constraints of their platforms to allow for the weird, amazing little stories like this one provides.
 

Bladenic

Member
In an age where cable television shows are largely tent-poled by explicit violence and sex with leading male anti-heroes, Enlightened is one of the only comparatively 'normal' (yet still completely fresh) shows out there right now. I want it to serve as the leading example for network heads to take chances and let the mostly lacking constraints of their platforms to allow for the weird, amazing little stories like this one provides.

Agreed. It's so refreshing to see an HBO show that is devoid of violence, nudity, light on cursing, etc. All while being fucking amazing.

However I do think the show just isn't for a wide audience. It sucks, but that's how I see it.

When can we expect an announcement regarding the fate? I assume next week, but I don't know if HBO sometimes waits to announce a renewal/cancellation after a season ends.
 

anaron

Member
Agreed. It's so refreshing to see an HBO show that is devoid of violence, nudity, light on cursing, etc. All while being fucking amazing.

However I do think the show just isn't for a wide audience. It sucks, but that's how I see it.

When can we expect an announcement regarding the fate? I assume next week, but I don't know if HBO sometimes waits to announce a renewal/cancellation after a season ends.

I assume within the next two weeks as well.

Kate Aurthur/Buzzfeed: How Mike White Turned “Enlightened” Into The Best And Most Original Show On TV
(possible spoilers)


KA: I'm curious about the sister character. When did you lop her off?

MW: The first season I had written pretty much the whole season even before they picked us up. I was such a junkyard dog when it came to TV that I wanted to give them the whole season so they could pick it up and be like, "we don't want this," or "we want it." But not pick it up and then try to make it into something it wasn't. I realize now that's not HBO's style. But I had been through that before. So anyway, I had a lot of time to write those episodes. The second season, it was going to be two and a half months before we were in pre-production. So I started writing, and it was halfway through the episode where the sister was going to come live with Helen and Amy that I found out they were reducing our order. And so that was when I kind of scrapped it.

KA: Do you think Amy becomes more likeable, or do you think the viewer just gets used to her?

MW: The first season was really more about her idealism, and falling short of what that is for her in these kind of personal vignettes. This one, it has a little more of a David and Goliath thing going on, so I think by its nature it gets you more on her side. Although people still this morning are writing in after yesterday's episode saying, "She's so stupid."

KA: Wait, why?


MW: If you go on The A.V. Club, there are many comments that are like, "This is supposed to be a sympathetic portrait, but she's a narcissist! She's so self-involved, she doesn't see what's going on right in front of her face." So I don't think she's been sanitized, or made more likeable in a sense. At the time, we never set out — or I never set out — to make a show about someone who's quote-unquote annoying. You know what I mean? It's about somebody who — someone said she's doing the right thing in her heart, but she's doing it for the wrong reasons. For me, no. She has all the right reasons, and sometimes she's doing the wrong things. If she was just a saint, I don't think it would be a show I could relate to or write. She's well-intentioned. Ultimately, she does have sort of delusions of grandeur — she's no saint. After awhile, having done the interviews for two seasons about it, the "annoying" thing? It starts to feel like — it's annoying to me.

KA: So in terms of what's happening now with the fate of the show —

MW: I assume I'm going to find out relatively soon. Last time, we found out the week after our last episode aired. I thought I might find out last week, but I didn't. I think it could go either way. I don't have a strong gut instinct here. I would be excited, certainly, to come back. I feel like next season could only be more interesting, because I feel like we've set up a lot of relationships that are fraught. Complicated characters. I feel like we could keep going. At the same time, I'm used to starting over on things. And coming up with something new. So I'm not afraid of that. I would understand either decision, frankly, from HBO. I do think they like the kind of attention the show gets, certainly within the creative community. And critics and that kind of thing. Maybe this year, certainly if they picked us up, we could have a shot at prizes or whatever. At the same time, I understand it's a bottom-line business. The fact that our numbers are what they are, it would be kind of naïve for me to not see how that makes it difficult to sell it, at least to themselves.

KA: What is your attachment level to the show? Has it varied?

MW: The truth is, it's not easy. You'd think it would be, considering these other shows, where they do 22 episodes a year. Eight episodes doesn't seem like such a huge task. But in the midst of it, it is a lot. Especially if you're writing all of it, and editing all the episodes. By the time I'm done with the actual doing of it, I'm, like, um — dead. There is a part of me that's like, I could go back to movies and just sit in my house and have a different kind of lifestyle. There's a part of me that deals with that. You know, the truth is, the more I think about Enlightened, and think about it as its own thing, I realize it might be the best thing I ever do. Because of the character and the way it's set up, it can talk about a lot of things. Things that are meaningful to me. When I think about what would be next, and what would the next vehicle be for me, even if it's something I feel can be equally — I don't know — complex or layered or whatever, I don't know if it could necessarily talk about all the things Enlightened is talking about. I'm not Lena Dunham. I'm not like a fresh — you know, I've been doing this for, like, 20 years. And I realize this is quite a bird in the hand. I would never be so presumptuous to think, "Oh, I'm going to be able to come back and do something that's equally challenging and bold, and be able to find the resources that HBO gives me. And have the access and support that I have there." The possibility of losing it seems like it would be a loss. For me. Personally. I may not have this again.

KA: What do you feel are the things you've been able to get at with Enlightened that you haven't in your other work?

MW: Just in its form, some of the stuff we were talking about with layering characters, you can't do in a movie. You just have more time. You have hours and hours of content, and because of that, you can make it more novelistic and dimensional. So there's that. But Enlightened really is about how do you live ethically in our certain kind of corporate world? And what does it mean to try to do something meaningful with your life when the world isn't necessarily set up for you to be able to do that?
 

inm8num2

Member
If the S2 finale really is that mind blowing, best to probably go out on a high note.

I love the show but in a way I think it might be better for its longevity to end now.

*ducks for cover*
 

Bladenic

Member
If the S2 finale really is that mind blowing, best to probably go out on a high note.

I love the show but in a way I think it might be better for its longevity to end now.

*ducks for cover*

Eh, I'd like one more 10-12 episode season that fully resolves everything (though maybe S2 will work as a series finale). I would be perfectly happy if HBO gave them another season but told them it would be final, so they can fully commit to making the finale conclusive and great.
 

RatskyWatsky

Hunky Nostradamus
If the S2 finale really is that mind blowing, best to probably go out on a high note.

I love the show but in a way I think it might be better for its longevity to end now.

*ducks for cover*

And what if season 3 turns out to be the show's high note? That's a chance that I'm willing to take!
 

anaron

Member
And what if season 3 turns out to be the show's high note? That's a chance that I'm willing to take!

This season has been wonderful in its own way, but for me, it hasn't featured nearly enough of the things that elevate the first one over it.

I want more Helen, Levi and Krista. And I wanna meet Bethany Jellicoe!
 

Bladenic

Member
This season has been wonderful in its own way, but for me, it hasn't featured nearly enough of the things that elevate the first one over it.

I want more Helen, Levi and Krista. And I wanna meet Bethany Jellicoe!

The scene with Krista was really sweet last episode. It actually seemed like Krista was sincere about Amy. Of course, I was still screaming "no" when she told Krista.
 

anaron

Member
The scene with Krista was really sweet last episode. It actually seemed like Krista was sincere about Amy. Of course, I was still screaming "no" when she told Krista.

It did seem sweet, but, I think she's going to betray Amy. It could've just been a red herring, but I think she's gonna snitch or tell someone thinking the situation is a lot lighter than it actually is.
 

inm8num2

Member
Fuck Krista. She's a two-faced punk like Janice and the others. Amy was stupid to tell Krista about the article, as I'm assuming Krista ratted and that's what led to Amy being offered the new position.
 

Bladenic

Member
I liked Season 1, I did. But I think S2 has given me more feels than S1 did, and I liked that there was a bigger focus on the Cogentiva employees than before. But it's hard to pick honestly.
 

Empty

Member
they compliment each-other nicely in styles i think, especially as much of season 2 constant stream of highs builds off what they established with the more meditative season 1. i need to watch them again back to back to know for sure which one i prefer as i watched season 1 nearly all in one go but season 2 week to week.

not too long now till the finale omgggg
 

KingKong

Member
Just binged through Season 1 and wow this show is fantastic. I really love it, it feels like a golden age HBO show where there's something special about it and I havent felt that way about Girls or Veep or Newsroom
 

anaron

Member
Just binged through Season 1 and wow this show is fantastic. I really love it, it feels like a golden age HBO show where there's something special about it and I havent felt that way about Girls or Veep or Newsroom

It's truly, truly special. Glad you found it! :)


Enlightened’s Amy Jellicoe: TV’s Most Tragic Heroine

If it winds up being the season and not series finale — ¡Ojalá! — I'm going to cry anyway, because I cry at every episode of Enlightened, because it is a beautiful little tragedy that tricks you into thinking it's a comedy but is actually this haunting fable of the limits of good intentions. Once upon a time, there was a woman named Amy, and she really tried. But it didn't matter at all. Weep.

With a description like that, I can't believe more people aren't watching this show! Seriously, though — we love characters who suffer. Don Draper will never be satisfied, and that's what makes Mad Men tick. Louis C.K. sees the world through sad-colored glasses, which fuels every episode of Louie. The Office was its best when Jim was pining for Pam. The more frustrated Liz Lemon got, the better. George Costanza is the most tragic figure American art has ever produced. But Enlightened's resonant sadness isn't that its characters themselves are sad — not like how George is sad, or Louie is lonely. (Though of course they are sad and lonely in their own real ways.) Enlightened's powerful sadness comes from the audience. We know how the world treats people like Amy and Tyler and Levi and even that crappy jerk Dougie, and it's not well. Enlightened invites us into the rich, mesmerizing interior lives of the downtrodden, and once we're in there, it's pretty clear that being downtrodden is, you know, the worst.
 

Bladenic

Member
Just binged through Season 1 and wow this show is fantastic. I really love it, it feels like a golden age HBO show where there's something special about it and I havent felt that way about Girls or Veep or Newsroom

It's definitely the best show from that bunch.

Enlightened > Veep > Girls > Newsroom

Not that it matters.
 

KingKong

Member
I'm not really sold on Veep, it seems like a less funny and less interesting Thick Of It (I know the same guy made both), but they only had 8 episodes so I'll see what season 2 is like
 
HBO needs more shows like Enlightened and Luck and less shows like Newsroom and Girls. I honestly feel like that their quality control has slipped and it's a shame they passed on Shameless.
 

ivysaur12

Banned
HBO needs more shows like Enlightened and Luck and less shows like Newsroom and Girls. I honestly feel like that their quality control has slipped and it's a shame they passed on Shameless.

I like Girls and appreciate it for what it is, but I would take another season of Enlightened over almost every other show on TV at this point. It's something else.
 
I like Girls and appreciate it, but I would take another season of Enlightened over almost every other show on TV at this point. It's something else.

Girls wins the award for the most over praised show on television. Critics love it, but cant even articulate why. The show was already mediocre from the start and the past several episodes have been a downgrade from that.
 

Bladenic

Member
Girls wins the award for the most over praised show on television. Critics love it, but cant even articulate why. The show was already mediocre from the start and the past several episodes have been a downgrade from that.

I agree. The fact that it won the GG for best comedy is still weird to me. Dunham winning best actress is even worse.
 

Empty

Member
it feels like critics are more in love with the idea of what girls is than the reality of the show

harsh to only put it one '>' ahead of the newsroom though. it's not that bad, i think it's just okay.
 

lunch

there's ALWAYS ONE
I like Girls and appreciate it for what it is, but I would take another season of Enlightened over almost every other show on TV at this point. It's something else.
I'm of the same opinion. I love Girls, but I'd offer it up as my sacrificial goat if it meant more Enlightened.
 
it feels like critics are more in love with the idea of what girls is than the reality of the show

Exactly.

I mean, hell, I see where they're coming from. I'd love for there to be more shows that are created/written/run by women. That desire doesn't change the fact that Girls is really weak.
 

anaron

Member
Always a Girls bash fest in here... *smh*

We're not really bashing it. Like Ivy said, I appreciate Girls and I'm glad it exists. We're just merely acknowledging that compared to Enlightened, it's not nearly as good. :p
 

anaron

Member
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haha, yesssssss
 

KingKong

Member
Caught up on Season 2 and to be honest, I enjoyed Season 1 a lot more. Maybe it's because there was so much focus on the world outside of Abbadon, they barely spent any time on the geeks or the people upstairs.
 

Bladenic

Member
Love those gifs. Tweeted them to HBO. Checking twitter, there seems to be a pretty strong campaign to get the show renewed. Hope HBO listens.
 
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