Psycho_Mantis
Banned
Got to disagree. I liked 3.0. Its not as polished as the 1 and 2 but thats because it wasn't essentially a retread.
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Evangelion 3.0 You Can (Not) Redo |OT| :Q
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John Kowalski
Banned
I liked it too. Well i didn't exactly like it. I had a very strong reaction it, contrasted with the somewhat anaesthetic experience of the two first movies, but i've come to feel very nicely about it. The soundtrack in particular is ridiculously impressive.
Can't wait!
I wish you could buy the original series on DVD or blurays, it's been years since I've actually watched it.
Rebuild while pretty good, never captured what I actually liked about Eva. 3.33 was so different, that I wasn't sure if it was a good or bad thing. It did feel like there was supposed to be more...well the 4rd part was meant to come out much closer to the 3rd.
Rebuild while pretty good, never captured what I actually liked about Eva. 3.33 was so different, that I wasn't sure if it was a good or bad thing. It did feel like there was supposed to be more...well the 4rd part was meant to come out much closer to the 3rd.
I have a weird relationship with the film in that I really hate that it totally derailed from what was originally promised but really love all the weird macabre shit it does have that I admired in EoE.
http://www.gwern.net/docs/eva/2010-crc
The Complete Records Collection is a great read btw. Link above has tons of translations and sketches for the 2.0 book, but there's a lot of fantastic insight about the project as a whole and it also helps to understand the path they ultimately took with 3.0.
The Complete Records Collection is a great read btw. Link above has tons of translations and sketches for the 2.0 book, but there's a lot of fantastic insight about the project as a whole and it also helps to understand the path they ultimately took with 3.0.
It wouldn't much of an issue, if it didn't take years for each movie to come out. You can only dwell on the good things for so long before you start picking the movie apart. You've got to take out that frustration somehow.
The movie was fine, great maybe but it's been missing a link for far too long.I can't believe the blurays only just came out. Damn. I had it preordered on day 1 and I've completely forgot about it after the preorder has been cancelled.
Fake Edit:
I have a better idea.
I dare not threaten Anno. He may be depressive but he's completely sane. Beyond that, the ending had a reason to be bad, they ran out of budget. This does not.
Tell ya what. Within the next week or two, I'll rewatch the movie. I have such vitriol towards it, maybe it's not fair to rely on my impressions from watching the movie 3 times within the first year of it's release. I dunno, 3 years ago me seemed 100% sure in his convictions. I'll write up an essay about every aspect of the movie to the best of my abilities. A full review!
Oh this is exciting! I have this light in me now. This hope that maybe the only thing in this world I hate with a passion might not be as bad as I want it to be.
Can you explain what you mean by this? I can only read it as something like. "Because it was all new content in terms of story, it wasn't as tested" Actually I have no idea what you mean by polished. No vitriol here, I really don't understand your post.
I started picking the movie apart within seconds of it ending the first time. And still within second of it ending a second time during my immediate rewatch.
meltingparappa
Member
Looking forward to rewatching it with Funimation's rumored-to-be-redone sub/dub efforts.
I know I'm deeeeeeeeefinitely in the minority, but 3.33 has been my favorite rebuild film. I can see how it's a huge disappointment for most after the character breakthroughs in 2.22, but an intimate story that felt true to the original series.
Instead of doing something straight forward and predictable, Anno pulled an Anno and carved out something that seemed extremely personal, regardless of how unpalatable it was received by people wanting more 2.22. To me, it definitely felt like putting on a pair of familiar clothes that smell like the general tone of episodes 18-22.
I hope Anno continues to take his sweet time to find his finale, and I'll enjoy his inevitable eccentric take on Godzilla in the meantime.
I know I'm deeeeeeeeefinitely in the minority, but 3.33 has been my favorite rebuild film. I can see how it's a huge disappointment for most after the character breakthroughs in 2.22, but an intimate story that felt true to the original series.
I knew ahead of time that the film was rewritten after the devastating tsunami, and I feel like it definitely shows in the final product. Moreso than the previous two, "You Can (Not) Redo" is the thesis written into the fabric of every decision Shinji makes. Blindsided by the timeskip, I'm still haunted by the music that plays on the bridge as you feel as disoriented as Shinji. Every accomplishment from the previous films are ripped from him. The only people that showed any affection towards him now seemingly hate him. The world as we know it is seemingly ruined beyond repair. Shinji relapses worse than ever, and at one point is even shown nearly catatonic.
Kaworu the savior shows up out of nowhere to slip him some sweet BL, and says he has a master plan to fix everything. Kaworu is played by like a damn fiddle by Gendo, and Shinji loses the one bit of hope that he had. Everyone harps on Shinji for making bad decisions, but that is the point - he's driven to delusion that it's still somehow possible to 'Redo' everything instead of moving forward. I felt it complete true to his character and true enough a desperate reaction to the terrible world he's forced to live in. Then Unit-02 turned into a cat for some dumb reason. The three children are reunited again in as complicated and tenuous a professional agreement as ever, and there are mysteries that can be solved through wiki-diving and ones that you have to swallow until the next installment.
Kaworu the savior shows up out of nowhere to slip him some sweet BL, and says he has a master plan to fix everything. Kaworu is played by like a damn fiddle by Gendo, and Shinji loses the one bit of hope that he had. Everyone harps on Shinji for making bad decisions, but that is the point - he's driven to delusion that it's still somehow possible to 'Redo' everything instead of moving forward. I felt it complete true to his character and true enough a desperate reaction to the terrible world he's forced to live in. Then Unit-02 turned into a cat for some dumb reason. The three children are reunited again in as complicated and tenuous a professional agreement as ever, and there are mysteries that can be solved through wiki-diving and ones that you have to swallow until the next installment.
Instead of doing something straight forward and predictable, Anno pulled an Anno and carved out something that seemed extremely personal, regardless of how unpalatable it was received by people wanting more 2.22. To me, it definitely felt like putting on a pair of familiar clothes that smell like the general tone of episodes 18-22.
I hope Anno continues to take his sweet time to find his finale, and I'll enjoy his inevitable eccentric take on Godzilla in the meantime.
Where was the hate on the TV ending? A lot of us local fans back then liked that for what it was. It even popularized a pop culture of some sort (the bumping into a running girl with bread loaf on mouth thingie).
Well, I wasn't watching Evangelion in Japan in 1996, so I have no first-hand account of it. But, by many other accounts, the hate was pretty widespread, to the point -- like I said earlier -- that Anno was sent death threats by fans over it (messages that he inserted into EoE during the real world section of Third Impact). I mean, the impetus for doing EoE at all was in response to the vocal negative reaction toward the tv ending.
Never was aware of it back then. Though the creation of EoE makes sense. Poor Anno lol.
Zoe
Member
That was around way before then...
NeOak
Member
Possibly! It's a weird-ass film in that it completely defies your expectations and goes in a very different direction than the first two movies. It's actually a lot like the anime series in that regard - it doesn't really care about the viewer or storytelling rules and Anno just uses the medium to express whatever he feels like.
I have no doubt in my mind that, would the original EVA series be broadcasted today, the corresponding GAF thread would look pretty much exactly like this one does the further the series got. That doesn't mean that 3.0 is some misunderstood, genius work of art - i honestly have no idea what it is. But it did leave an impression on me and I won't judge it until I've seen were it leads (or doesn't) in 4.0 or 3.0+1.0 or however it's going to be called.
You are definetely in a better position to enjoy the movie because you didn't spend years and years with the series characters already and don't have much of an already established image of these characters you just want the movies to fulfill. These characters look and sound the same but are very, very different from their series counterpart. Inherintely, that isn't a good or a bad thing - but if you love a thing and are promised a new version of a thing only to notice that the thing is now very different, you are probably not going to like it too much.
I actually really liked the last episodes of Evangelion so if the movie's like that then maybe I'll like it too.
meltingparappa
Member
By the way, here is an incredibly comprehensive FAQ for the scant answerable questions in 3.33.
Just like old times.
Just like old times.
There's definitely a difference, as you can choose between Theatrical or Home Release subtitles. I haven't watched the blu ray yet so I'm not sure how exactly they differ.
I loved the Star Wars prequels and the Matrix sequels.
And I think 3.33 was a disappointment of the highest level, and it single-handedly killed my expectation for 4.44.
Better see it for yourself, I think.
Mass_Pincup
Banned
I was like you and 3.33 bored me.
NeOak
Member
Sadly, it barely scratches the surface of the questions 3.33 does not answer.
I don't think most people have a problem with the "tone" of 3.0, or that detractors wanted "more 2.22". Comparing this to the end of the TV series or to EoE like it's just misunderstood in its time is laughable. The execution in 3.33 is just bad. I'm just gonna skim through the movie real quick and call out things I see.
Giant chunks of the first 30 minutes are wasted on ship porn. Keep in mind this is already the shortest Rebuild movie as it is.
The CG through the whole film is awful, but especially early on in the cockpit of the Wunder.
The whole film could've been avoided had anyone sat and talked to Shinji for ten minutes.
"Curse of EVA" is basically a punchline, it's so obviously a dodge so that they could keep Asuka looking the same.
Misato acts ridiculously out of character.
How do we make the world look post-apocalyptic? idk, fill tool + red all the backgrounds?
Near-Third Impact is a giant retcon of the end of 2.22, where Third Impact was stopped way before it could possibly have wreaked this much destruction.
"hey shinji let's play mahjong. btw, apropos of absolutely nothing, your mom's an eva spirit now and your love interest is her clone you oedipus-complex fuck."
Shinji wears this explode-y collar for most of the movie and then Kaworu just takes it off of him no problem. What took him so long? And why the fuck did he put it on himself and not just throw it into the abyss or something? Kaworu's exposition about it is just cryptic nonsense.
Kaworu figures out the spears are wrong even before Asuka shows up, but he waits until Shinji's already climbing up to them before saying "yo this is a bad idea." Whole fucking thing could've been avoided if he'd just said "hey if you pull these spears the world will end, we need different ones". But no, Kaworu just acts cryptic and doesn't explain anything until Shinji decides fuck it, you don't get Eva control anymore.
Let's put in a bunch of new lore and then provide absolutely no context for what any of it means at all! Lance of Cassius? I don't know, man, just make it sound nice!
"I was the first angel but now I am the thirteenth" is some MGS4 "one becomes zero becomes one becomes a hundred which is one with two zeroes" levels of nonsense.
KAWORU: "Hey don't pull the spears"
SHINJI: "Fuck you I'm pulling the spears"
*five minutes later*
SHINJI: Is this my fault? Because I pulled out the spears?
Unit 02 becoming a cat is fucking ridiculous.
The Black Moon is a goblet now, okay, sure. Why not.
Boooooy does the 4.0 preview look awful.
The CG through the whole film is awful, but especially early on in the cockpit of the Wunder.
The whole film could've been avoided had anyone sat and talked to Shinji for ten minutes.
"Curse of EVA" is basically a punchline, it's so obviously a dodge so that they could keep Asuka looking the same.
Misato acts ridiculously out of character.
How do we make the world look post-apocalyptic? idk, fill tool + red all the backgrounds?
Near-Third Impact is a giant retcon of the end of 2.22, where Third Impact was stopped way before it could possibly have wreaked this much destruction.
"hey shinji let's play mahjong. btw, apropos of absolutely nothing, your mom's an eva spirit now and your love interest is her clone you oedipus-complex fuck."
Shinji wears this explode-y collar for most of the movie and then Kaworu just takes it off of him no problem. What took him so long? And why the fuck did he put it on himself and not just throw it into the abyss or something? Kaworu's exposition about it is just cryptic nonsense.
Kaworu figures out the spears are wrong even before Asuka shows up, but he waits until Shinji's already climbing up to them before saying "yo this is a bad idea." Whole fucking thing could've been avoided if he'd just said "hey if you pull these spears the world will end, we need different ones". But no, Kaworu just acts cryptic and doesn't explain anything until Shinji decides fuck it, you don't get Eva control anymore.
Let's put in a bunch of new lore and then provide absolutely no context for what any of it means at all! Lance of Cassius? I don't know, man, just make it sound nice!
"I was the first angel but now I am the thirteenth" is some MGS4 "one becomes zero becomes one becomes a hundred which is one with two zeroes" levels of nonsense.
KAWORU: "Hey don't pull the spears"
SHINJI: "Fuck you I'm pulling the spears"
*five minutes later*
SHINJI: Is this my fault? Because I pulled out the spears?
Unit 02 becoming a cat is fucking ridiculous.
The Black Moon is a goblet now, okay, sure. Why not.
Boooooy does the 4.0 preview look awful.
The hate for the original final episodes was legendary. It was all anyone talked about in the fandom at the time, in my experience. On Usenet if you even breathed a positive word about the final two episodes you'd get shredded and branded a pariah for a time. It was possibly my first real glimpse of fandom gone insane.
AnathemicOne
Banned
Will 4.0 ever come out? Lol
NeOak
Member
At this rate, both Miura will finish Berserk and GRRM will finish the 7th and last book of A Song of Ice and Fire first.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Weird... I adored the ending upon my first watch in 2004.
Now the Endless Eight in Haruhi... that I'd get the ire for....
oh god it's all coming back to me
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
"Kyon-kun, Denwa!"
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
We're lucky then that the outrage never reached here back then. Or that I was so young to be ignorant of that times lol.
But yeah, still the TV ending was pretty good, was then and still is. 3.33 is nothing compared to that.
NeOak
Member
I skipped that shit, watched the last one and read what was the differences.
MEsoJD
Banned
Oh god that was torture. I eventually started skipping ahead episodes...
NightShift
Member
Oh shit, 3.33 is out? Can't wait to find out why so many hate this movie.
Woody Invincible
Banned
So, I gotta say, 3.33 was much better on a repeat viewing. I just wasn't expecting what I was about to get the first time around.
I was pissed about the last episode of Evangelion. It seemed cheap and rushed, like the last episode to His and Her Circumstances.
I was pissed about the last episode of Evangelion. It seemed cheap and rushed, like the last episode to His and Her Circumstances.
Guess Who, a lot of things you are complaining about are things that didn't have exposition as its expected the discerning fan already knows this.
Answers to your questions can be found online or by re-watching the Eva series with the extended episodes and reading the manga.
Things like why Kaworu is the 1st angel is because he contained the soul of Adam. He is relegated to the last angel when he has lost the soul.
This movie is fan service for the knowledge fan is probably best way to describe it. It also brings new things to the table like what an incomplete / rejected human instrumentality looks like. Unlike EOE where it was accepted and then reversed by Shinji.
The characterization is poor in this but the plot is interesting with the background knowledge.
Answers to your questions can be found online or by re-watching the Eva series with the extended episodes and reading the manga.
Things like why Kaworu is the 1st angel is because he contained the soul of Adam. He is relegated to the last angel when he has lost the soul.
He realizes it all 3 times before he dies and the theme of choosing to die is due to being the angel of free will, Tabris.
The black moon, the white moon, the 2 lances, Adam soul (in tabris) and body (in gendo usually). Lilith soul (in Rei or Eva unit 1) and body (in terminal dogma usually). The lilem and the evas. All available knowledge before this movie.
The black moon, the white moon, the 2 lances, Adam soul (in tabris) and body (in gendo usually). Lilith soul (in Rei or Eva unit 1) and body (in terminal dogma usually). The lilem and the evas. All available knowledge before this movie.
This movie is fan service for the knowledge fan is probably best way to describe it. It also brings new things to the table like what an incomplete / rejected human instrumentality looks like. Unlike EOE where it was accepted and then reversed by Shinji.
The characterization is poor in this but the plot is interesting with the background knowledge.
Lights and Waves
Member
I loved 3.33. It's my favorite of the reboot movies and FINALLY took the story somewhere new. I didn't love how Asuka had no development in the x years since Shinji was captured, but whatever.
I think the best part of the film is Kaworu's comment that alludes to the movies taking place in a parallel universe to the original series. That was dope.
I think the best part of the film is Kaworu's comment that alludes to the movies taking place in a parallel universe to the original series. That was dope.
vainglorious
Member
So... was the "Nemesis series" developed by Nerv and Seele and similar to the Mass Produced Evas? Or are they... autonomous and self-aware... Eva-like things that evolved as a result of the 3rd Impact?
One hiding in the Tesseract makes it seem like it was planted by Seele as a defensive mechanism to protect and contain Unit 01 but...
The beginning of this movie is a joy to watch but such an assault to the senses at the same time my god.
One hiding in the Tesseract makes it seem like it was planted by Seele as a defensive mechanism to protect and contain Unit 01 but...
The beginning of this movie is a joy to watch but such an assault to the senses at the same time my god.
I always wanted to believe that Kaworu was aware of what happened in prior versions of Eva.
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