SatelliteOfLove
Member
Joooooooooooooke.
Believe me, I was here for that wild west shit, popcorn at the ready.
Exactly six years ago*, GameSpot reviewed The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess.
- Thread starter Mama Robotnik
- Start date
Joooooooooooooke.
Believe me, I was here for that wild west shit, popcorn at the ready.
Is that how we're referring the Bayonetta 2 situation? I hope it sticks. Still quite a lot of people under the impression that Nintendo "stole" their game lol.
To Far Away Times
Member
Nah, man. That 2% difference means that it's not an A game. And since hes a professional gaming journalist, his opinion is more serious and shit.
Didn't something similar happen with SS?
Anyway, i hold no respect for reviewers, but the fact that some people automatically assume that x game from a famous company or brand MUST be a masterpiece no matter what despite the fact they haven't played it and solely based on the hype it's one of the most sick and depressing aspect of videogames.
Also scores are fucked up yo, it's 1-10, not Shit<9.
Anyway, i hold no respect for reviewers, but the fact that some people automatically assume that x game from a famous company or brand MUST be a masterpiece no matter what despite the fact they haven't played it and solely based on the hype it's one of the most sick and depressing aspect of videogames.
Also scores are fucked up yo, it's 1-10, not Shit<9.
If anything it was the complete opposite.
disappeared
Banned
Judging from some of the posts in this very thread, some of them haven't been able to let it go.
Typographenia
Member
And, yet, Jeff was spot on.
I wasn't upset at the time, but I do remember the general outrage at the time. I just played it and had a good time. Coming back to it last year, though, I think he was perhaps a little generous with his scoring.
I wasn't upset at the time, but I do remember the general outrage at the time. I just played it and had a good time. Coming back to it last year, though, I think he was perhaps a little generous with his scoring.
I like this thread and i must admit i don't feel Jeff is in the wrong. I believe that anyone should take a review and someone's opinion with a grain of salt no matter who they are. Why do we have to get up in arms over an opinion? C'mon really why do we have to voice our opinion of someone because of something they do for work? Lets all ascend this body and realize we are all one and after we pass this life none of this shit will matter.
ThanksVision
Member
3D ZELDAS
OOT - 5/5
MM - 5/5
WW - 4/5
TP - 3/5
SS - 4/5
OOT - 5/5
MM - 5/5
WW - 4/5
TP - 3/5
SS - 4/5
JumpJeff84
Member
Perfectly reasonable score. Reviews are SUBJECTIVE, remember?
I was not a fan of Twilight Princess either.
The backlash was ridiculous. 8.8 was probably about right for TP, and Jeff's written text was spot on. I'd probably score it less than that because of the unresponsive waggle crap.
I guess the closest we've got to it was Eurogamer's 8.0 for Uncharted 3 debacle. Fanboys are just the worst.
I guess the closest we've got to it was Eurogamer's 8.0 for Uncharted 3 debacle. Fanboys are just the worst.
Thats just your opinion man.
Bloody hell! That nuclear bomb tweet in particular.
.... the game stole Nintendo?
buddha0991
Member
Ice cold, son! Even I, to whom the Persona 2 duology are some of my favorite games ever made agree the gameplay is mediocre, and downright bad in some cases...
TreasureHunterG
Banned
I really enjoy TP. Here on NeoGAF, everyone praise the hell out of Wind Waker and bashes TP all the time. Outside of GAF (or even the net), TP is far more praised.
King of the Potato People
Member
The reaction to the first negative reviews for TDKR on Rotten Tomatoes is the most extreme I've seen in this sort of case, when comments were shut down for weeks. Death threats, misogyny, it wasn't even funny, just utterly pathetic.
Definitely, 100% Guitar Hero 2.
I absolutely loved this game, I spent 22 hours playing it over a weekend playing it after the Wii launched. It was the first Zelda I played through from start to finish. I still consider it probably my favourite Zelda game, the atmosphere was just amazing at some points. I felt they rushed through the dungeons towards the end though, after the slow and steady start.
DarknessTear
Banned
GC version pros: has superior controls and left handed link. Cons: No widescreen.
Wii version pros: Widescreen. Wii version cons: Cheap controls. Only thing worth a damn is the bow stuff. Aside from that, waggle = A button. SS did it better (kinda). Also gargantuan HUD.
Satisfied?
MisterHero
Super Member
People wanted more OoT and they got more OoT. TP doesn't reference every little thing in said game, but it really is more of the OoT formula. My only technical problem was the pacing but I loved the story and the art direction.
With the possible argument on puzzle solving, combat and exploration were also a lot deeper and more engaging than any of its predecessors. It might not be that tough, but it has some of the best dungeons in the series.
There was a time when people posted angrily without having played the game, but most of them did play the game later. Out of that group, many including myself still think Gerstman's wrong. The debate as it exists should be the thing being paid attention to, not the former.
If reviewers really wanted to stab at Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword, maybe they should have brought up that both games have GAME-ENDING BUGS. Those are far more crucial than some pacing issues or unfamiliarity with motion controls.
If this thread is an argument trying to lend credibility to the bias/lack of bias on the part of reviewers, it goes both ways. IGN went out of their way to trash Twilight Princess in their Game of the Year video. It's okay though; they're professionals and forum posters who disagree know nothing.
With the possible argument on puzzle solving, combat and exploration were also a lot deeper and more engaging than any of its predecessors. It might not be that tough, but it has some of the best dungeons in the series.
There was a time when people posted angrily without having played the game, but most of them did play the game later. Out of that group, many including myself still think Gerstman's wrong. The debate as it exists should be the thing being paid attention to, not the former.
If reviewers really wanted to stab at Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword, maybe they should have brought up that both games have GAME-ENDING BUGS. Those are far more crucial than some pacing issues or unfamiliarity with motion controls.
If this thread is an argument trying to lend credibility to the bias/lack of bias on the part of reviewers, it goes both ways. IGN went out of their way to trash Twilight Princess in their Game of the Year video. It's okay though; they're professionals and forum posters who disagree know nothing.
HyperCubed4
Member
The backlash makes me laugh out loud to this day. An 8.8 is far from a bad score. Plus, Legend of Zelda isn't safe from criticism. So why were people flipping out that this game didn't get a 10/10 from one single reviewer? I cannot wrap my mind around that.
Nightstick11
Banned
He whines about motion controls, when there was literally nothing wrong with the motion controls at all. He bellyached about having to swing the wiimote for a sword slash, not realizing he didn't, you know, have to swing it like a sword.
If anything, bitch about the long ass beginning. The beginning is the reason why the game's a 9.2 or so, not the motion controls.
TheGreatDivide
Banned
You had to do a fucking song to change the boats direction in Wnd Waker, and then the game takes it to the extreme with the fetch quest. Nothing in TP comes close to being that tedious.
DarknessTear
Banned
Nothing wrong with the motion controls? Considering all it does is map waggle as a button press instead of something deeper, there is reason to complain. It's a lot smoother to just press a button in that game, which is why the GC version just feels right in comparison. The intro was a bit lengthy and felt slow, so I can see the problem there too. Especially if you're replaying the game. Still one of my favorite games in the series regardless.
Don't give a shit about the number applied.
My beef with this review- and others of its kind- is that it triumphs a particular point of view of successful game design: specifically, that formulas get "old" and need to be refreshed at certain intervals. The degree to which they are refreshed sounds like a decent objective measure, but it fails by lack of specificity (what exactly crosses the threshold from "too samey" to "new enough"?) and a lack of a compelling argument about whether people actually want the formula changed in every case; whether or not, in fact, the general public really give a damn about the concept of "formula" at all.
So it's a subjective measure the same as other methods of parsing personal responses to a work. This must be emphasized again and again, since so many discussions about the quality of this game (and others) hinges on people tacitly accepting the idea of the Stale Formula as an obvious and objective flaw. Further, it's a particularly unhelpful sort of criticism: it is unspecific, and to some extent depends on a counterintuitive understanding of what people want; isn't it strange to expect people buying a Zelda game to want something unlike other Zeldas?
The truth is, very few games like Zelda are made. If each were nearly identical (and they aren't) they would still be unusual against the background of the thousands of non-Zelda titles in existence that do not share the series' mechanics to any great degree. If we wish to criticize games for being formulaic I would expect attention to turn to the games that ARE very much like many others recently released: your annual sports franchises, your constant flow of team multiplayer FPS, and so forth. The concept of the Stale Formula does get applied sometimes, but other times it is completely ignored.
Some other specific criticisms of TP make a lot of sense to me. This one in particular, though, has been repeated so much but to me says so frustratingly little.
My beef with this review- and others of its kind- is that it triumphs a particular point of view of successful game design: specifically, that formulas get "old" and need to be refreshed at certain intervals. The degree to which they are refreshed sounds like a decent objective measure, but it fails by lack of specificity (what exactly crosses the threshold from "too samey" to "new enough"?) and a lack of a compelling argument about whether people actually want the formula changed in every case; whether or not, in fact, the general public really give a damn about the concept of "formula" at all.
So it's a subjective measure the same as other methods of parsing personal responses to a work. This must be emphasized again and again, since so many discussions about the quality of this game (and others) hinges on people tacitly accepting the idea of the Stale Formula as an obvious and objective flaw. Further, it's a particularly unhelpful sort of criticism: it is unspecific, and to some extent depends on a counterintuitive understanding of what people want; isn't it strange to expect people buying a Zelda game to want something unlike other Zeldas?
The truth is, very few games like Zelda are made. If each were nearly identical (and they aren't) they would still be unusual against the background of the thousands of non-Zelda titles in existence that do not share the series' mechanics to any great degree. If we wish to criticize games for being formulaic I would expect attention to turn to the games that ARE very much like many others recently released: your annual sports franchises, your constant flow of team multiplayer FPS, and so forth. The concept of the Stale Formula does get applied sometimes, but other times it is completely ignored.
Some other specific criticisms of TP make a lot of sense to me. This one in particular, though, has been repeated so much but to me says so frustratingly little.
TheGreatDivide
Banned
The IR aiming was good though!
MisterHero
Super Member
IR aiming is incredible. Skyward Sword's aiming is just as good, especially if you appreciate how something like the Bow & Arrow works. The fishing in the Wii version of TP was exceptional as well.
My pacing issue isn't just with the beginning, but also that you don't get the Horse Call until the game's almost over. The whistle weeds aren't everywhere in the game, so you're stuck running around as a human or a wolf a lot.
I didn't have that much of a problem, but in a field that is magnitudes larger than OoT's Hyrule Field, I can see how it can get boring.
TheGreatDivide
Banned
Hey hey hey hey hey. Lets not say silly things.
You got this backwards.
Foliorum Viridum
Banned
Nothing has changed. People still freak out over review scores for games they haven't played. Even GAF, which is probably the best gaming community there is. It's embarrassing.
Compare those TP quotes to the Uncharted 3 quotes from the review thread here. Fanboys being fanboys, just for different systems and games.
(OoT > TP > MM > WW > SS for 3D Zeldas)
Compare those TP quotes to the Uncharted 3 quotes from the review thread here. Fanboys being fanboys, just for different systems and games.
(OoT > TP > MM > WW > SS for 3D Zeldas)
Supermanisdead
Member
SS
TP
OOT
MM
WW
TP
OOT
MM
WW