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Failed military coup in Turkey; Erdogan promising swift reprisal

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F

Familienoberhauptvogel

Banned
B

BigAl1992

Member
orthodoxy1095 said:
I wonder how the Turks getting fired feel about this.

Is there a Stockhom Syndrome-esque excusal of the dear leader, or would this ever change public opinion?

But why.
Click to expand...

I'm going to be very blunt when I say this, even though I wouldn't normally say this about people; the dumber the populace is, the easier it is to make them believe what you're telling them. What Erdogan is doing here is similar to Nazi Germany in terms of Propaganda; put in people in high up or respectable positions that are on your side, and get them to say nothing but good things about in everything, debates, public speaking, normal conversations, ect. That's what's going on.
 
F

Funky Papa

FUNK-Y-PPA-4
chadskin said:
Indeed:

AFP: #BREAKING Turkey demands resignation of all public university deans: state-run media
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It is now outright impossible to defend Erdogan's countercoup strategy.

Nearly nothing points towards removing individuals who could be potentially dangerous to the nation and everything towards a complete purge of the system at all possible levels so Erdogan can rule unopposed.

Targeting universities and intellectuals are universal milestones for any authoritarian government.

He's setting the country back for decades.
 
N

NyMartin90

Member
Funky Papa said:
It is now outright impossible to defend Erdogan's countercoup strategy.

Nearly nothing points towards removing individuals who could be potentially dangerous to the nation and everything towards a complete purge of the system at all possible levela so Erdogan can rule unopposed.

Targeting universities and intellectuals are universal milestones for any authoritarian government.

He's setting the country back for decades.
Click to expand...

Pretty much.
If Ataturk was alive right now, he'd probably be arrested as a Gulenist too at this point.
 
K

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
It's like he's intentionally putting in place this, but in a fast forward mode:

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
Click to expand...
 
D

daxy

Member
This is starting to look a lot like Stalinist Soviet Russia's antics with purges of intelligentsia and civil society members that had not yet sworn the figurative blood oath on the hammer and sickle.
 
B

BigAl1992

Member
Funky Papa said:
It is now outright impossible to defend Erdogan's countercoup strategy.

Nearly nothing points towards removing individuals who could be potentially dangerous to the nation and everything towards a complete purge of the system at all possible levela so Erdogan can rule unopposed.

Targeting universities and intellectuals are universal milestones for any authoritarian government.

He's setting the country back for decades.
Click to expand...

I agree with all of the above. What we are seeing is the formation of the second dictatorship in Europe. I can't see any reason from here on out to defend his actions from any of his supporters.

This has gone beyond trying to suppress another coup and trying to make the country his own play-toy. A complete and utter disgrace.
 
F

Funky Papa

FUNK-Y-PPA-4
daxy said:
This is starting to look a lot like Stalinist Soviet Russia's antics with the purges of intelligentsia and civil members that had not yet sworn blood oath on the hanger and sickle.
Click to expand...
All it's missing is a nice gulag to keep those mischievous intellectuals occupied.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Meadows said:
This is legitimately worse than Putin.
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I'm unsure this is true. Putin hasn't really done these things because he's never needed to, the opposition was already dead in Russia. When Putin disappears what political opponents who do arise, it's rarely just an arrest - they end up dead the next day. Which is now beginning to happen in Turkey, but they have some catching up to do. Not to mention Putin literally annexed sovereign territory; Erdogan's not got there yet.
 
O

orthodoxy1095

Banned
BigAl1992 said:
I'm going to be very blunt when I say this, even though I wouldn't normally say this about people; the dumber the populace is, the easier it is to make them believe what you're telling them. What Erdogan is doing here is similar to Nazi Germany in terms of Propaganda; put in people in high up or respectable positions that are on your side, and get them to say nothing but good things about in everything, debates, public speaking, normal conversations, ect. That's what's going on.
Click to expand...
I mean, probably half of the population supports him.

The universities couldn't have been doing such a great job producing anti-Erdogan thought.

I guess he has to eliminate even the remote possibility.
paperboywriter said:
He is building a Putin state, Holy shit.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure this is actually worse than Putin.
 
S

spekkeh

Banned
Maybe he's trying to silence all opposition? Universities are generally secularist or have CHP constituencies. Whatever it is, it's clear he's gone complete dictator mode.
 
O

orthodoxy1095

Banned
Crab said:
I'm unsure this is true. Putin hasn't really done these things because he's never needed to, the opposition was already dead in Russia. When Putin disappears what political opponents who do arise, it's rarely just an arrest - they end up dead the next day. Which is now beginning to happen in Turkey, but they have some catching up to do. Not to mention Putin literally annexed sovereign territory; Erdogan's not got there yet.
Click to expand...
Greece is watching the border carefully.
 
S

Sijil

Member
I pray to God and hope some of the holdouts in the military grow a pair and do something.

If this purge persists and goes beyond the military and well into the public sector and academia I could very well see a public revolution in the coming months. But with Erdogan maintain high fundamentalist support I suspect a civil war looming between secularist and Erdoganists, and the kurds in the south would take it as an opportunity to grow bolder.
 
S

Sijil

Member
Crab said:
I'm unsure this is true. Putin hasn't really done these things because he's never needed to, the opposition was already dead in Russia. When Putin disappears what political opponents who do arise, it's rarely just an arrest - they end up dead the next day. Which is now beginning to happen in Turkey, but they have some catching up to do. Not to mention Putin literally annexed sovereign territory; Erdogan's not got there yet.
Click to expand...

Erdogan sent his army to Northern Iraq without the consent of Baghdad, violating its sovereignty, he pretty much did the same thing in Syria.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Sijil said:
Erdogan sent his army to Northern Iraq without the consent of Baghdad, violating its sovereignty, he pretty much did the same thing in Syria.
Click to expand...

...which is not annexation. Violating territorial sovereignty is sadly a fairly frequent occurrence on the international stage and not just restricted to obvious bad guys like Erdogan and Putin.
 
P

PatjuhR

Member
Always-honest said:
Wow.. this is sounding so more and more fucked up every day.
I can't believe Turkish people are okay with this. Turkey is so modern for a big part.
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I can't understand the Erdogan supporters outside of Turkey aswell. Turkish people here in Holland can't really think its okay right?
 
C

Chairmanchuck

Member
PatjuhR said:
I can't understand the Erdogan supporters outside of Turkey aswell. Turkish people here in Holland can't really think its okay right?
Click to expand...

I also dont get those. The ones here in Germany that I know of dont even have a strong connection to the country besides their parents being turkish, but living here their whole lives and been to Turkey maybe once or twice in their life...
 
M

msv

Member
I feel like this second Erdogan coup should be its own thread. It's something new, and it's obvious that it's not just 'dealing with' the initial coup anymore. This is a full fledged coup of it's own now, much wider and deeper than the first one.
 
C

CadetMahoney

Member
oti xero said:
BREAKING: All political prisoners in #Turkey are now denied the right to meet lawyers, family, & make phone calls

TURKEY: List of independent news websites banned in #Turkey in the last 72 hours by the government - @HasanSari7
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Wait a minute, the mainstream media keeps telling me constantly about how he was democratically elected and he is an ally who was fighting against ISIS in Syria, we should side with him!
 
O

oti

Banned
Big part of the country (the majority?) is still drunk from patriotism after stopping the coup (which don't get me wrong, it's the best reason to be proud of one's nation if you think about it). Once they sober up they'll realize what happened.

The rest is either gone or (hopefully) preparing their exit plan.
 
S

spekkeh

Banned
PatjuhR said:
I can't understand the Erdogan supporters outside of Turkey aswell. Turkish people here in Holland can't really think its okay right?
Click to expand...

I doubt there's much thinking going on. It's like they read the headlines "Turkey becoming a dictatorship", but stop right after reading Turkey to go outside and yell Turkiye Turkiye Turkiye.
 
C

chrizzz09

Member
I mean, Erdogan did say some time ago that "Hitler's Germany is an example of effective government"

And now is the time, to change it into that.

Although, at that time he added:

“If the system is abused it may lead to bad management resulting in disasters as in Hitler’s Germany ... The important thing is to pursue fair management that serves the nation,” the statement said, adding it was unacceptable to suggest Erdogan was casting Hitler’s Germany in a positive light.
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But I guess he does not abuse this system, because he was democratically elected and does all those things to "serve the nation"...
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
CadetMahoney said:
Wait a minute, the mainstream media keeps telling me constantly about how he was democratically elected and he is an ally who was fighting against ISIS in Syria, we should side with him!
Click to expand...

Both of those statements are true, though. He was democratically elected, and he is assisting (to an extent) the efforts against ISIS.

I mean, if you're a Western nation now, what would your response to Turkey be? Kicking them out of NATO is very risky. You could cut the EU accession process (which would be a de facto economic sanction as Turkey has a trade partnership deal with the EU). But what else do you do? There's very little that can be practically be done to get a not-Erdogan in power. So you have to work with him, it's all you've got as an entry to the Middle East.
 
S

SgtCobra

Member
PatjuhR said:
I can't understand the Erdogan supporters outside of Turkey aswell. Turkish people here in Holland can't really think its okay right?
Click to expand...
Hell yeah they are, the ones I've spoken call the opposition traitors and terorrists. There's tons of praising on social media, pics of paintings of Erdogan on a golden throne etc. He's their hero and "he made Turkey great".
If they're happy with him then so be it, I accept that. I feel bad for the opposition and I myself would never support him but I'm not Turkish nor do I live in Turkey so it doesn't really matter what I think about this/him I guess.
 
H

His Majesty

Banned
Crab said:
Both of those statements are true, though. He was democratically elected, and he is assisting (to an extent) the efforts against ISIS.

I mean, if you're a Western nation now, what would your response to Turkey be? Kicking them out of NATO is very risky. You could cut the EU accession process (which would be a de facto economic sanction as Turkey has a trade partnership deal with the EU). But what else do you do? There's very little that can be practically be done to get a not-Erdogan in power. So you have to work with him, it's all you've got as an entry to the Middle East.
Click to expand...

Plus any measures you take towards Turkey will probably trigger a revolt in your own country. Just suck it up and hope for the best.
 
F

Funky Papa

FUNK-Y-PPA-4
I just took a look at twitter and some people are actually supporting the idea of Erdogan becoming Sultan.

I thought it was a joke at first. I'm speechless.
 
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