Spiritwalker
Member
Hmm well let's hope it ends well. Erdogone is a cunt who should fuck off.
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Failed military coup in Turkey; Erdogan promising swift reprisal
- Thread starter nynt9
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Correct me if i am wrong but... the nazi party never got 51% or more of the vote if i am not mistaken. More like 30% and then they bullied themselves to power.
On topic : erdogan is a vile character, so i hope this turns for the best. I fear it might get ugly though, with how popular erdogan is...
islamism vs secularism it's a pretty complex topic, but summing up the army in turkey was always the drive for secularism and modernization, but many times through history many religious prone leaders rose to power and the army step in to avoid losing the secularism, until they had to constitutionally legitimize this actions with out overthrow the all political rule
In the past, coups have saved Turkey.
Depends on who is behind the coup and why.
Advancement into a fundamentalist religious dictatorship?
CitizenVectron
Member
Something that also needs to be repeated is that the Turkish military have the legal right to perform a coup, as per a clause in their constitution. The military have the legal right to perform such a coup if the secularity of the country is threatened by the civil government.
It's an incredibly strange clause, but it's in there. Most democracies have some anti-democratic clauses in their constitutions or common law (Queen has the power to dissolve British Parliament, for example), but this is an unusual one.
It's an incredibly strange clause, but it's in there. Most democracies have some anti-democratic clauses in their constitutions or common law (Queen has the power to dissolve British Parliament, for example), but this is an unusual one.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
"Democratically" "elected" and then proceeded to tear up the constitution. I've made numerous comments in the past year that someone had to notice that Erdogan was consolidating power towards an autocracy. It looks like a lot of people noticed.
Nicaragua and Venezuela are good examples of this.. a kind of a fake democracy, just to not look bad to the world.
I'm worried for Turkey now, what are the political reasons for this?
elrechazado
Banned
Demonstrably false
Huw_Dawson
Member
If this is a Kemalist coup then things should be OK once the shooting stops. Unless you're a member of AK.
From their wiki article they seem better (more progressive) than the status quo, what am I missing?
He was in a coalition with another party.
BBC News saying the coup was in response to Erdogan's increasing autocracy, control of the media, and treatment of journalists.
Obviously those initiating the coup will always paint themselves as the good guys, but could this be a good thing? Erdogan was democratically elected, but we've all seen what can happen when people vote based on a malevolently driven media...
Obviously those initiating the coup will always paint themselves as the good guys, but could this be a good thing? Erdogan was democratically elected, but we've all seen what can happen when people vote based on a malevolently driven media...
He was the leader elected by the people. does their will mean shit?
You are correct, 43.9 was their best. It was the enabling act that gave him real power, and that was passed by parliament.
Don't worry, nukes can only go supercritical under very very specific circumstances (which are created only when the nuke is armed), when a nuke is destroyed by force the nuclear reaction isn't triggered and it acts as a dirty bomb.
Elected officials are still bound by the constitution.
More Fun To Compute
Member
Looks like we need to update the world war 3 timeline again.
boiled goose
good with gravy
Erdogan had been eroding advances... so let's hope for the best. ..
not saying a coup is necessarily a good thing but erdogan was already doing a fine job dragging turkey backwards, unless you think a religious despot is a good thing
so what you are against democracy?
Elements of the Turkish military have no doubt been plotting against Erdogan since the early days of his leadership. For whatever reason, they gained enough support now to feel they could pull this off. Probably a combination of the confrontation with Russia, the re-ignited war with the PKK, the spillover of the Syrian conflict, and the rapid growth of ISIS in Turkey, plus a variety of domestic factors I am not familiar with.
For me, Erdogan has always been a Hitleresque figure: thriving off chaos, pitting his deputies against one another as he accumulates more power, killing hundreds and destroying entire city centers (Cizre and Sirnak) to garner electoral support, and fueling chaos in Syria for imperial ambitions.
His luck finally ran out. If he does decide to start a full-fledged civil war, I don't think Turkey will emerge from it the same as it entered. There are too many pressure points now.
I'm praying for peace.
No. He lost a great degree of power. Called new elections and using sectarian practices retook that power. It has been a fucking disaster.
Ask him, he thinks their will means shit. See all the electoral fraud and dismantling free press.
It was a three way race, so they couldn't have gotten 51%.
Jesus. This is the kind of shit that starts wars.
As someone who isn't Turkish nor has an extensive knowledge about Turkey (so I admit this is a hunch based on the media, rather than an objective view), I don't have a good feeling about Erdogan at all. In addition to that, my Turkish friends/colleages were also quite worried about the current government of their homecountry. So it could be that this really is for the better, but a military coup sure sounds like a drastic/bad thing. I really hope this will turn out well for the Turkish citizens.
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
May I ask why?
NealMcCauley
Member
Someone earlier in the thread said that's a bit of a lie, and that they're basically if Islam and Scientology joined together.
No, stop with that nonsense. The NSDAP never won the majority in elections. Their votes were going down when chancellor Schleicher and a guy called von Papen thought it was the best idea in the world to approach President Hindenburg to make Hitler chancellor of Germany. They thought Hitler and his supportes may work like a bandwagon for the deeply divided Weimar republic. Boy, were they wrong
Judging by what NBC is saying, it sounds like US intelligence genuinely has no fucking idea what's going on.
Resident_UA
Member
I'm so confused by your opinions. How can you be OK with Putin?!
Where is, exiled in Moscow or Damascus?
SDCowboy
Member
No it's not. Posts like this really need to stop.
Melon Husk
Member
Ismail Kahraman's comments in April probably triggered the move, do you think? First "official" comment about removing the secularism from the Turkish constitution.
I hope the coup will be quick and clean, and that the constitution won't be mutilated again inadvertedly afterwards.
I hope the coup will be quick and clean, and that the constitution won't be mutilated again inadvertedly afterwards.
Baron Doggystyle von Woof
Member
Someone who payed attention in history class.
TheAutomator
Banned
I'm fine with Democracy, as long as idiots are not voting.
Indeed it seems incredibly well choreographed. Insane.
How can something so major and requiring such great precision organisation get planned without anyone in government smelling a rat?
boiled goose
good with gravy
Turkey and Greece have a "rocky" history to put it mildly... See Cyprus.
You do not need a majority to become a democratically elected ruler. It all depends on the specific flavor of democracy and its rules. Technically(!), the NSDAP's rise to power was largely consistent with the democratic process, even up to the removal of the democratic system itself. Because of that, Germany's current constitution contains safety guards to prevent such things that the Weimar Republic did not have.
"Democratically elected" can have very different meanings in different contexts.
There have been four major coups in Turkey's history. The last one occurred in 1997. This will not set them back much should things go relatively smoothly.
hobblygobbly
Member
Reuters: Access to Facebook, Twitter and Youtube restricted in Turkey: Internet monitoring groups
https://twitter.com/ReutersWorld/status/754059570713092097
https://twitter.com/ReutersWorld/status/754059570713092097
JonnyDBrit
Member
Holy shit this situation is going full tilt.
Please don't let this powder keg get lit.
djplaeskool
Member
Yep.
I remember living on a base in Germany when the Kenyan embassy bombing occurred. All bases went to FPCON Charlie for weeks.
Armed personnel and concrete barricades everywhere.
PdotMichael
Banned
If the leader acts against the constitution, yes.
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