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Well, the obvious answer is because Square-Enix isn't nearly as diverse as they used to be. Honestly, how many non-FF RPG's have they even released in the last five years? Their output took a major downturn.

 

[Galactic Fork]

If inazuma 11 can keep its legs, it should break 250k, if it's reall lucky it'll FFIII its way up to 300k. Level 5 has to be happy about its performance.

 

[duckroll]

Well, the obvious answer is because Square-Enix isn't nearly as diverse as they used to be. Honestly, how many non-FF RPG's have they even released in the last five years? Their output took a major downturn.

Last 5 years? Okay.... I'll list all the non-FF RPGs from 2005 up to what is announced for each system but unreleased. I shall not list ports unless they're substantially remade.

PS2:
Radiata Stories
Romancing SaGa Minstrel Song
Hanjuku Hero 4
Drag-on Dragoon 2
Musashi 2 Blademaster
Grandia III
Code Age Commanders
Kingdom Hearts 2
Dragon Quest Yangus
Valkyrie Profile 2
Seiken Densetsu 4


PSP:
Star Ocean First Departure
Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep
The 3rd Birthday


DS:
Egg Monster Hero
Children of Mana
Dragon Quest Monsters Joker
It's A Wonderful World (The World Ends With You)
Heroes of Mana
Front Mission 2089
Sigma Harmonics
Valkyrie Profile DS
Kingdom Hearts DS
Blood of Bahamut


Xbox360:
Infinite Undiscovery
The Last Remnant
Star Ocean 4


Wii:
Dragon Quest Swords

 

[BlazingDarkness]

Last 5 years? Okay.... I'll list all the non-FF RPGs from 2005 up to what is announced for each system but unreleased. I shall not list ports unless they're substantially remade.

PS2:
Radiata Stories
Romancing SaGa Minstrel Song
Hanjuku Hero 4
Drag-on Dragoon 2
Musashi 2 Blademaster
Grandia III
Code Age Commanders
Kingdom Hearts 2
Dragon Quest Yangus
Valkyrie Profile 2
Seiken Densetsu 4


PSP:
Star Ocean First Departure
Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep
The 3rd Birthday


DS:
Egg Monster Hero
Children of Mana
Dragon Quest Monsters Joker
It's A Wonderful World (The World Ends With You)
Heroes of Mana
Front Mission 2089
Sigma Harmonics
Valkyrie Profile DS
Kingdom Hearts DS
Blood of Bahamut


Xbox360:
Infinite Undiscovery
The Last Remnant
Star Ocean 4


Wii:
Dragon Quest Swords

:lol
you win

 

[RpgN]

True, but lets not discount Square and Enix entirely, and lets look at all PS1-era Rpgs which hit 400K+ without the help of the Final Fantasy/Dragon Quest names:

SaGa Frontier - 1.09M
Parasite Eve - 994K
Xenogears - 892k
Tales of Destiny - 829k
Arc the Lad II - 817k
Legend of Mana - 707k
Star Ocean: The Second Story - 700k
Chrono Cross - 689k
SaGa Frontier 2 - 675k
Tales of Eternia - 669k
Brave Fencer Musashi - 649k
Valkirye Profile - 635k
Tales of Phantasia - 550k
Front Mission 2 - 496k
Breath of Fire III - 435k
PoPoLoCrois Monogatari - 406k

16 titles that I recognize from 13 non-Final Fantasy/Dragon Quest series. On top of that, 4 titles (all over 600k) are completely new franchises.

Discounting Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, and Pokemon games, how many Rpgs have been released to >400k sales in the past 5 years for all consoles? I'd be willing to bet the list is shorter than the one above which only represents the PS1. Also, when was the last time a new jRPG franchise broke 600k? Kingdom Hearts?

Discounting the big three from S-E and the Pokemon games, there seems to be 1/2-1/3 as many gamers interested in jRPGs (in general) currently as there was in the PS1 era. Numbers from nearly every series have been on a downward trend since then.

I don't think that's a fair comparison. FFVII made RPGs mainstream and new IPs were a safe bet to sell. Everyone wanted to try more RPGs at that time.

Only Brave Fencer Musashi and PoPoLoCrois Monogatari were released earlier.

I don't think it's easy for new IPs (or existing) to sell that much now. RPGs aren't new or the next big thing anymore. We had FPSs, Sandbox and Music games follow them. I wonder what the new trend will be now.

 

[C.T.]

A lot of these games were just published by square enix. There was a time they developed them. Most new I.P.s they developed are on DS. They fear the risk, but sadly it isn't just Square these days.

 

[Kurosaki Ichigo]

So aren't you just doing exactly the opposite of what you're accusing others of? Before you were insisting on calling the game a spin-off (to discredit it, perhaps), but now you're content with calling it a sequel to fit your own agenda.

If I use 'TOS2' now is just to piss off those who used it in the past because they didn't acknowledge it was a spin-off. So no, I didn't change my point, I'm just being as ass about being right

 

[Link]

Well, duckroll shut me up.

EDIT - Kurosaki - Fair enough.

 

[duckroll]

A lot of these games were just published by square enix. There was a time they developed them. Most new I.P.s they developed are on DS. They fear the risk, but sadly it isn't just Square these days.

I don't think that's very accurate. If you want to take the "developed by Square" issue up, then you can discount many of their PS1 games, and even some of their SFC titles. The Front Mission series wasn't even developed by Squaresoft originally, but they simply published the game and it was developed by G Craft. Only after the title became a success did they absorb the key G Craft staffers into Squaresoft, which is why Arc the Lad went to shit, because the original creators left and joined Squaresoft. Treasure Hunter G was developed by Sting. Many of Squaresoft's "risks" in the PS1 era weren't developed by them either. Tobal? Bushido Blade? CyberOrg?

Even in PS1 days, the cornerstones of Squaresoft were in the franchises. They didn't really experiment so freely with RPGs as people seem to remember then doing. The only new RPG IPs that are of note in the PS1 era are Xenogears and Parasite Eve. The Xenogears creators left after that, and Parasite Eve was developed by Square USA which no longer exists. All the other notable RPGs in the PS1 era from Squaresoft were established series that already existed - Chrono, Mana, SaGa, Hanjuku Hero, FF. Aside from Chrono, all those series still exist today. The idea that S-E is "less diverse" is an illusion caused by the fact that the industry at large today is simply outputting less, because stuff no longer sell as well. It's not something unique to S-E.

 

[charlequin]

where its always been, of course.

I don't think putting out a PS2 game in late 2009 would work out well for Konami.

Even in PS1 days, the cornerstones of Squaresoft were in the franchises. They didn't really experiment so freely with RPGs as people seem to remember then doing.

I think you have to take overall breadth of franchises into account too, though. On PS1, there were a number of new IPs (I don't think you should ignore Brave Fencer Musashi, Threads of Fate, or especially Vagrant Story), but also serious franchise entries in quite a few different series: Mana, Chrono, SaGa, Front Mission, all in addition to three "true" Final Fantasies and two high-quality spinoffs.

More than anything else, though, I think "castoff" projects got much bigger, starting last generation and now especially in the handheld era. Every Square franchise that was released for PS1 got a "real" entry -- a big-budget, fully-realized attempt at bringing that franchise to gamers, a full game that justified the 5900 yen or whatever people were expected to spend on it. Nowadays people have to wait for a game to actually come out to even know if it's a "real" game or just a shitty spinoff that no one should spend time with, which I think is really depressing the overall sales of games in all RPG-related genres.

 

[bttb]

.

 

[RpgN]

I don't think that's very accurate. If you want to take the "developed by Square" issue up, then you can discount many of their PS1 games, and even some of their SFC titles. The Front Mission series wasn't even developed by Squaresoft originally, but they simply published the game and it was developed by G Craft. Only after the title became a success did they absorb the key G Craft staffers into Squaresoft, which is why Arc the Lad went to shit, because the original creators left and joined Squaresoft. Treasure Hunter G was developed by Sting. Many of Squaresoft's "risks" in the PS1 era weren't developed by them either. Tobal? Bushido Blade? CyberOrg?

Even in PS1 days, the cornerstones of Squaresoft were in the franchises. They didn't really experiment so freely with RPGs as people seem to remember then doing. The only new RPG IPs that are of note in the PS1 era are Xenogears and Parasite Eve. The Xenogears creators left after that, and Parasite Eve was developed by Square USA which no longer exists. All the other notable RPGs in the PS1 era from Squaresoft were established series that already existed - Chrono, Mana, SaGa, Hanjuku Hero, FF. Aside from Chrono, all those series still exist today. The idea that S-E is "less diverse" is an illusion caused by the fact that the industry at large today is simply outputting less, because stuff no longer sell as well. It's not something unique to S-E.

Good post. I certainly agree. So far they have 5 new IPs released or are still in the works which is a better picture. Their many remakes/ports/FF/DQ hide that though.

 

[jeremy1456]

I love how Tales of Symphonia 2 is now just a spin off and has done wonderfully, and also how it is close to 300k or doubling Vesperia, such a stellar milestone btw. Sure guys, whatever floats your boat. "TOS2" is another disappointing performance in a dying series, but hey, its on the Wii, in the kingdom of blind men the one-eyed is king.

Wow, talk about bitter...

Yeah maybe the 300k was a bit of an exaggeration - I was simply guessing based on data I last saw.

 

[duckroll]

Since we're on the topic of how Tales sales are fucking dying...... Namco expects 400k out of Tales of Hearts in Japan alone. It seems obvious that it's going to struggle to hit 200k. I wonder where they're going to dig that extra 200k worth of sales from? :lol

 

[Kobun Heat]

Since we're on the topic of how Tales sales are fucking dying...... Namco expects 400k out of Tales of Hearts in Japan alone. It seems obvious that it's going to struggle to hit 200k. I wonder where they're going to dig that extra 200k worth of sales from? :lol

1 million Gundam + 1 million Dynasty Warriors =

 

[Regulus Tera]

Even in PS1 days, the cornerstones of Squaresoft were in the franchises. They didn't really experiment so freely with RPGs as people seem to remember then doing. The only new RPG IPs that are of note in the PS1 era are Xenogears and Parasite Eve. The Xenogears creators left after that, and Parasite Eve was developed by Square USA which no longer exists. All the other notable RPGs in the PS1 era from Squaresoft were established series that already existed - Chrono, Mana, SaGa, Hanjuku Hero, FF. Aside from Chrono, all those series still exist today. The idea that S-E is "less diverse" is an illusion caused by the fact that the industry at large today is simply outputting less, because stuff no longer sell as well. It's not something unique to S-E.

 

[duckroll]

Matsuno is dead.

Yes, I agree.

 

[schuelma]

Since we're on the topic of how Tales sales are fucking dying...... Namco expects 400k out of Tales of Hearts in Japan alone. It seems obvious that it's going to struggle to hit 200k. I wonder where they're going to dig that extra 200k worth of sales from? :lol

Yeah, we all knew that was a high expectation, but it looks even worse right now.

I wonder if the Wii Tales can do better. There should actually be a year or so between releases which might help.

Is it possible that the Tales audience just really prefers the games on consoles? I mean Vesperia has done 150K+ so far on a tiny tiny userbase, and even ToS:KoR, a low budget spin off looks like it will do about as well as the DS mainline games.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Honestly how many Tales games have been released so far? Maybe Namco/Bandai should consider trying something new.

 

[cw_sasuke]

Yeah, we all knew that was a high expectation, but it looks even worse right now.

I wonder if the Wii Tales can do better. There should actually be a year or so between releases which might help.

Is it possible that the Tales audience just really prefers the games on consoles? I mean Vesperia has done 150K+ so far on a tiny tiny userbase, and even ToS:KoR, a low budget spin off looks like it will do about as well as the DS mainline games.

Sales below 400K for Tales of 10 would be a huge flop, imo.

 

[Aaron Strife]

I wonder where they're going to dig that extra 200k worth of sales from? :lol

a US release?

Spoiler

 

[Y2Kev]

Nah, Y2Kev is awesomer than that.

RE4 PS2 is indeed super cheap now in the U.S. It's shipment total increased last quarter out of the blue.

This is my forth copy (2 GC-- so awesome I gave 1 as a gift-- 1 Wii, 1 PS2)

 

[duckroll]

Yeah, we all knew that was a high expectation, but it looks even worse right now.

I wonder if the Wii Tales can do better. There should actually be a year or so between releases which might help.

Is it possible that the Tales audience just really prefers the games on consoles? I mean Vesperia has done 150K+ so far on a tiny tiny userbase, and even ToS:KoR, a low budget spin off looks like it will do about as well as the DS mainline games.

I don't think the idea that there's a Tales audience that is larger than 150k even exists anymore. What we're looking at is about 150-200k of really dedicated Tales fans in Japan. These people will buy ANYTHING. So when anything Tales is released, it pretty much sells at least 100k, and can probably climb to 200k. But it doesn't do much better than that anymore. The height of Tales sales was 800-900k, and there was a time on the PS2 where the average game would do at least 500k. Those days are gone. The ToDr remake on PS2 didn't cross 500k either. I think what we're looking at is basically the Tales fanbase being reduced to a pool of 150-250k gamers because of the whoring of the series and several bad titles that devalued the brand, and it's just not growing.

 

[Y2Kev]

Since we're on the topic of how Tales sales are fucking dying...... Namco expects 400k out of Tales of Hearts in Japan alone. It seems obvious that it's going to struggle to hit 200k. I wonder where they're going to dig that extra 200k worth of sales from? :lol

get to it, yoh!!!

 

[schuelma]

I don't think the idea that there's a Tales audience that is larger than 150k even exists anymore. What we're looking at is about 150-200k of really dedicated Tales fans in Japan. These people will buy ANYTHING. So when anything Tales is released, it pretty much sells at least 100k, and can probably climb to 200k. But it doesn't do much better than that anymore. The height of Tales sales was 800-900k, and there was a time on the PS2 where the average game would do at least 500k. Those days are gone. The ToDr remake on PS2 didn't cross 500k either. I think what we're looking at is basically the Tales fanbase being reduced to a pool of 150-250k gamers because of the whoring of the series and several bad titles that devalued the brand, and it's just not growing.

Interesting, thanks for the thoughts

 

[Kurosaki Ichigo]

Namco must have some space wherever they dumped 100k Tempest copies that they claimed to have shipped and no tracker claims to have been sold.

Wow, talk about bitter...

Yeah maybe the 300k was a bit of an exaggeration - I was simply guessing based on data I last saw.

Well, if you want a serious answer, Namco shipped 215,000 units of TOS-R as of June end, and they shipped 0 units in the July-August-September period. Famitsu claims sales are 212,049 as of the latest update available. Maybe they end up overtracking like with the GC one!

 

[Y2Kev]

I don't think the idea that there's a Tales audience that is larger than 150k even exists anymore. What we're looking at is about 150-200k of really dedicated Tales fans in Japan. These people will buy ANYTHING. So when anything Tales is released, it pretty much sells at least 100k, and can probably climb to 200k. But it doesn't do much better than that anymore. The height of Tales sales was 800-900k, and there was a time on the PS2 where the average game would do at least 500k. Those days are gone. The ToDr remake on PS2 didn't cross 500k either. I think what we're looking at is basically the Tales fanbase being reduced to a pool of 150-250k gamers because of the whoring of the series and several bad titles that devalued the brand, and it's just not growing.

Don't Wanna Buy
Allll of those Talesssssssss
Don't wanna buy
All of those Taaaaaaaaaaales

anyyymooooreeeeeeeeeeeeee

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

So wait. The handhelds magically dont count, and Radiant Dawn sold more than a non existent second GC Fire Emblem?

You dont say?

Yes they don't because the handheld versions sell better then the consoles versions. There are console versions and handheld versions fo the game...I have no idea why your trying to point that out like it's some critical flaw in my arguement.

Also I could have sworn their were two Cube Fire Emblems. Either way the game sold more then the Gamecube version.

Last 5 years? Okay.... I'll list all the non-FF RPGs from 2005 up to what is announced for each system but unreleased. I shall not list ports unless they're substantially remade.

PS2:
Radiata Stories
Hanjuku Hero 4
Drag-on Dragoon 2
Musashi 2 Blademaster
Grandia III
Kingdom Hearts 2
Valkyrie Profile 2
Seiken Densetsu 4



DS:
It's A Wonderful World (The World Ends With You)
Front Mission 2089
Sigma Harmonics
Blood of Bahamut


Xbox360:
Infinite Undiscovery
The Last Remnant
Star Ocean 4

Now let's take the remakes, spin-off's, and budgeted titles. I know that list may seem to list a lot of "exceptions" but this is over the course of 4 years. Basically Square-Enix is now focused almost solely on Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, and Kingdom Hearts. Everything else is usually held for lower budget (usually A budget at best). I know this sounds strange after their exploration with The Last Remenant and their DS experiments but prior to those it was pretty much a FF, DQ, and KH fest. Even now after these games there is rarely anything in the future to look forward to that is fresh (then again it would be wise to wait for new announcements).

 

[duckroll]

Now let's take the remakes, spin-off's, and budgeted titles. I know that list may seem to list a lot of "exceptions" but this is over the course of 4 years. Basically Square-Enix is now focused almost solely on Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, and Kingdom Hearts. Everything else is usually held for lower budget (usually A budget at best). I know this sounds strange after their exploration with The Last Remenant and their DS experiments but prior to those it was pretty much a FF, DQ, and KH fest. Even now after these games there is rarely anything in the future to look forward to that is fresh (then again it would be wise to wait for new announcements).

You're really weird. Why would you remove Valkyrie Profile DS and not Front Mission 2089? If you want to compare just the new IPs, it's not hard:

Code Age Commanders
Radiata Stories
It's A Wonderful World
Sigma Harmonics
Blood of Bahamut
Infinite Undiscovery
The Last Remnant

Over the past 5 years, they have released 7 new RPG IPs across 3 systems. These are JUST the RPGs that were released in the past 5 years. Seriously, stop talking nonsense. Every generation, Squaresoft and Enix have dabbled in many experiments and occasional new IPs, and also many non-RPGs, but the focus of the business on both sides have always been FF and DQ respectively. So I really have no idea what you're trying to imply here. Considering RPGs are selling less and less these days, it would be moronic for a company like S-E to not push their strong franchises that still maintain a good brand power.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Code Age Commanders!

Worst part is I still have the game and every now and then I open the case and it gives off this weird smell. It's not disgusting or anything..just unique.

Speaking of obscure unpopular Square games anyone ever play Heavy Metal Thunder? I heard it sucked but never got around to finding out why.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

dp

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

You're really weird. Why would you remove Valkyrie Profile DS and not Front Mission 2089? If you want to compare just the new IPs, it's not hard:.

#1 I don't understand why you feel the need to call me "weird" because of something I missed while editing a list.

#2 I'm not comparing new IP's just games that aren't KH, DQ, and FF related.

Code Age Commanders
Radiata Stories
It's A Wonderful World
Sigma Harmonics
Blood of Bahamut
Infinite Undiscovery
The Last Remnant

Over the past 5 years, they have released 7 new RPG IPs across 3 systems. These are JUST the RPGs that were released in the past 5 years. Seriously, stop talking nonsense. Every generation, Squaresoft and Enix have dabbled in many experiments and occasional new IPs, and also many non-RPGs, but the focus of the business on both sides have always been FF and DQ respectively. So I really have no idea what you're trying to imply here. Considering RPGs are selling less and less these days, it would be moronic for a company like S-E to not push their strong franchises that still maintain a good brand power.

But how many of those games on that list are as production valued as say Vagrant Story or Xenogears? I'm not saying that there aren't (because there are a fair share) but with a list so slim from the past 5 years it's pretty clear that it isn't up to pace. People just feel the same way about Square as they do about modern SEGA. Square use to offer new enganging RPG experiences as well as IP's on a near regular basis that pushed norm. Now they usually rely on spin-offs and their big 3 as AAA titles and save their "different" games for lower budget or just have Tri-Ace do the experimenting. I understand that a company is suppose to keep safe by offering their well selling titles but looking at recent years Square has just overblown their releases with FF, DQ, and recently KH's spinoffs as well as diving into the port and remake pool. I admit that there has definately been progress over the past year but they still aren't at the level they should be.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

most people want more FF/DQ/KH games. Therefore, SE make them, simple.

 

[duckroll]

But how many of those games on that list are as production valued as say Vagrant Story or Xenogears?

I think there's something wrong when you put Vagrant Story and Xenogears on the same level when talking about production values. Xenogears is a much higher budget and larger scale project than Vagrant Story. It's not even comparable. Vagrant Story isn't a high budget game, but it's critically acclaimed. Those are two different things.

I'm not saying that there aren't (because there are a fair share) but with a list so slim from the past 5 years it's pretty clear that it isn't up to pace.

Up to pace compared to what? The list isn't any slimmer than 5 years before that, and 5 years before that even. Since when was Squaresoft or Enix known for publishing tons of AAA original IP RPGs? They've always been known for FF and DQ. How many AAA RPG IPs has Enix produced outside of tri-Ace games and DQ games? How many AAA RPGs has Squaresoft produced outside of SaGa/Mana/FF? Chrono Trigger was the big new Squaresoft franchise on the SFC, and Xenogears and Parasite Eve were the big budget attempts on the PS1. On the PS2 they had Kingdom Hearts. What exactly is this "pace" that you're talking about?

People just feel the same way about Square as they do about modern SEGA. Square use to offer new enganging RPG experiences as well as IP's on a near regular basis that pushed norm.

They used to offer new engaging RPG experiences and new IPs on a more regular basis than what I've listed for the past 5 years? Really? I don't think so....

Now they usually rely on spin-offs and their big 3 as AAA titles and save their "different" games for lower budget or just have Tri-Ace do the experimenting.

Wait, again you're speaking as if the main S-E franchises being the highest budget titles is unusual, when this has ALWAYS been the case. Is Xenogears higher budget than FFVII? Somehow I don't think so.....

I understand that a company is suppose to keep safe by offering their well selling titles but looking at recent years Square has just overblown their releases with FF, DQ, and recently KH's spinoffs as well as diving into the port and remake pool. I admit that there has definately been progress over the past year but they still aren't at the level they should be.

What's the level they should be? I really don't understand this mentality. What is this gold standard that S-E is supposed to aim for that they have alledgedly hit in the past but have not been hitting it lately? Are there more spinoffs and franchise titles in terms of remakes and ports now? Absolutely. Are there LESS titles with unique gameplay and original IPs coming out from S-E? No, absolutely not. It's two different matters entirely.

 

[Vinnk]

Back in the Famicom days Square DOG (Disk Original Group) produced tons of new PRG IP. Sadly other than Deep Dungeon (actually made by Hummingbird and Published by Square) almost all of them were garbage. For the Disk System they made a ton of shovelware.

The time before Final Fantasy was the only time that Square was making more original RPGs than now. And they almost went out of business. It was a bad business model and none of the series made during that era have survived to today.

 

[jesusraz]

If you want to compare just the new IPs, it's not hard:

Code Age Commanders
Radiata Stories
It's A Wonderful World
Sigma Harmonics
Blood of Bahamut
Infinite Undiscovery
The Last Remnant

And if you include non-RPGs from S-E, there's the likes of Nanashi no Game, Yosumin and the DS Style games on DS, plus Soul Eater on Wii...and there's another anime tie-in on DS that was recently announced. There's quite a nice mix coming out of the company in recent years.

 

[duckroll]

And if you include non-RPGs from S-E, there's the likes of Nanashi no Game, Yosumin and the DS Style games on DS, plus Soul Eater on Wii...and there's another anime tie-in on DS that was recently announced. There's quite a nice mix coming out of the company in recent years.

Can't really count stuff like Soul Eater, because its already part of a franchise that Square Enix owns outside of gaming. But yeah, outside of RPGs, there are lots of stuff that Square-Enix experiments wiht every generation. They even have a whole line of non-game software on the DS. I think the main reason people keep ragging on S-E for franchise whoring is because those are the titles that get the most attention and sell the best, so it's the most visible.

 

[Rpgmonkey]

Honestly how many Tales games have been released so far? Maybe Namco/Bandai should consider trying something new.

I don't know if they'll ever do it (anytime soon anyway), but I'd be interested in a Tales Studio game/RPG that isn't a Tales game. At least enough to watch how it turns out and differs from stuff they like to (or have to) put in Tales games.

 

[jesusraz]

Can't really count stuff like Soul Eater, because its already part of a franchise that Square Enix owns outside of gaming. But yeah, outside of RPGs, there are lots of stuff that Square-Enix experiments wiht every generation. They even have a whole line of non-game software on the DS. I think the main reason people keep ragging on S-E for franchise whoring is because those are the titles that get the most attention and sell the best, so it's the most visible.

Thought as much, since there's a BanNam version on DS, but just shows S-E is trying to diversify its releases, kind of like how it picked up LostWinds for a Japanese release on WiiWare as well. It's still releasing games in the DS Style range...but sadly the only one that sold a decent amount was the title similar to Nintendo's Housekeeping Diary thing.

 

[Datschge]

I don't know if they'll ever do it (anytime soon anyway), but I'd be interested in a Tales Studio game/RPG that isn't a Tales game.

The last non-Tales game plenty of the now Tales Studio veterans were involved in is the Playstation game Cybernetic Empire released ten years ago. There was also a rumor years ago that Tales Studio would actually work on a non-Tales again, but nothing surfaced so far indeed (besides some staff leaving due to Tales fatigues I guess =P).

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Whoa Telenet Japan. I thought they didn't live to see past the Mega-drive.

 

[duckroll]

I don't know if they'll ever do it (anytime soon anyway), but I'd be interested in a Tales Studio game/RPG that isn't a Tales game. At least enough to watch how it turns out and differs from stuff they like to (or have to) put in Tales games.

Speaking of which, I wonder if Sword of Legendia will ever surface, or if it's just a concept that they're kicking around.

 

[Dash Kappei]

no MC chart this week?

 

[Eteric Rice]

Speaking of which, I wonder if Sword of Legendia will ever surface, or if it's just a concept that they're kicking around.

I hope so.

Moar RPGs please.

 

[Rpgmonkey]

The last non-Tales game plenty of the now Tales Studio veterans were involved in is the Playstation game Cybernetic Empire released ten years ago. There was also a rumor years ago that Tales Studio would actually work on a non-Tales again, but nothing surfaced so far indeed (besides some staff leaving due to Tales fatigues I guess =P).

Oh wow. Anyone know if it was good?

Speaking of which, I wonder if Sword of Legendia will ever surface, or if it's just a concept that they're kicking around.

I figured that it would be something releasing pretty early into the Wii's life, but now it just kinda...disappeared.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Oh wow. Anyone know if it was good?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260340462461

I'll get back to you in a couple weeks.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

I think there's something wrong when you put Vagrant Story and Xenogears on the same level when talking about production values. Xenogears is a much higher budget and larger scale project than Vagrant Story. It's not even comparable. Vagrant Story isn't a high budget game, but it's critically acclaimed. Those are two different things.

I meant to say of budget and values like AA or AAA. Sorry that I didn't specify. My mistake.

They used to offer new engaging RPG experiences and new IPs on a more regular basis than what I've listed for the past 5 years? Really? I don't think so....

I'd consider Vagrant Story, Valkyrie Profile, and Parasite Eve new experiences.

Wait, again you're speaking as if the main S-E franchises being the highest budget titles is unusual, when this has ALWAYS been the case. Is Xenogears higher budget than FFVII? Somehow I don't think so.....

I didn't mean to say that the games would have higher budgets then their main games if that's what I seemed to imply.

Up to pace compared to what? The list isn't any slimmer than 5 years before that, and 5 years before that even. Since when was Squaresoft or Enix known for publishing tons of AAA original IP RPGs? They've always been known for FF and DQ. How many AAA RPG IPs has Enix produced outside of tri-Ace games and DQ games? How many AAA RPGs has Squaresoft produced outside of SaGa/Mana/FF? Chrono Trigger was the big new Squaresoft franchise on the SFC, and Xenogears and Parasite Eve were the big budget attempts on the PS1. On the PS2 they had Kingdom Hearts. What exactly is this "pace" that you're talking about?

What's the level they should be? I really don't understand this mentality. What is this gold standard that S-E is supposed to aim for that they have alledgedly hit in the past but have not been hitting it lately? Are there more spinoffs and franchise titles in terms of remakes and ports now? Absolutely. Are there LESS titles with unique gameplay and original IPs coming out from S-E? No, absolutely not. It's two different matters entirely.

I think what I'm trying to say is that I find the new Square-Enix not as ambitious (or in lesser terms good) as the previous one. I LOVED TWEWY but Last Remenant and Infinite Undiscovery couldn't compare to games such as Star Ocean 2, Xenogears, Vagrant Story, Valkyria Profile, and the likes from their heydays. I mean on paper they look similar but in actual quality and impact I think otherwise. I know you'll probably say something like (those are two companies you're comparing them against one) but you'd think with the merger they'd be able to step up their budgets to do bigger and better things (despite Squaresoft being in a hole). And to me the only thing I've noticed is more emphasis on remakes and spinoffs and less on tweaking up their new franchises. As I've said they've improved but they aren't as of quality as I've hoped they'd be.

Sorry that I jumped in the conversation before throughly establishing my ground.

 

[Datschge]

Whoa Telenet Japan. I thought they didn't live to see past the Mega-drive.

Telenet Japan went bankrupt in 2007. They sold their remaining Tales Studio stocks in 2006.

 

[jesusraz]

I don't know if they'll ever do it (anytime soon anyway), but I'd be interested in a Tales Studio game/RPG that isn't a Tales game. At least enough to watch how it turns out and differs from stuff they like to (or have to) put in Tales games.

From an interview back in January 2008:

Cubed3.com: Finally, it has been mentioned in the past that the Tales Studio will be doing a non-Tales game at some point. Is this something that will still happen or have plans been cancelled?

Hideo Baba: We always bear in mind multiple strategies as a part of our long-term view. We can't announce to you when and how it will be put into practice now, but we will try someday with the spirit of new challenge!

Speaking of which, I wonder if Sword of Legendia will ever surface, or if it's just a concept that they're kicking around.

I asked about SoL in a previous interview and the team chose to ignore the question. I've shoved it back in for the Fragile interview, though, so perhaps it'll...just get ignored again, but by a different team this time :lol

 

[schuelma]

no MC chart this week?

Last weeks data should be leaked/available tomorrow, is past years are any indication.