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February Wrasslin' |OT| Did somebody not get what they wanted?

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P

Plywood

NeoGAF's smiling token!
DMczaf said:
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Well I had fun with it.
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T

Terrabyte20xx

Junior Wrestlemania XXX Champion
Killing_Joke said:
And this classic booking helped how many wrestlers? Cesaro will be nowhere in a month. Hell maybe even a week. But at least he kept up with Cena in that one match. Same with Ziggler, Miz, Ryback, Umaga, etc etc. I think it's a point where wrestling Cena is going to kill your career more than help. Edge and Punk seem to have been the only exceptions.
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Ziggler fell victim to loss of momentum due to injuries, and creative never picked the ball back up with him.(And I'm a huge Ziggler fan.)

Miz was never going to be anything more than he is now, he just doesn't have the in ring talent or mic skills for it.

I've never liked Rybacks wrestling, and I don't think I've ever seen a good match that he's been in, with the exception of him teaming with Team Hell No vs The Shield.

Umaga suffered from losing his manager, and not picking up the slack.(Not necessarily his fault, assume Creative is to blame.)

You noticing a pattern yet? None of their faults have direct connections to Cena.

As for Cesaro, He'll be fine. He's WAY too over for even terrible booking to stop him.

Oh, and you forgot one more person to add to that list of "Exceptions":

daniel-bryan.jpg
 
S

strobogo

Banned
jmdajr said:
The territory eras were filled with Cena's.

Am I wrong?
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You aren't. But they didn't run 300 shows a year and guys didn't stay in the same place for 10 years. The clearest analogue to a territory Cena would be Lawler, but King jobbed all the time. Almost all of his feuds were "New guy/monster comes in and beats King, they trade the title 3 times" or "Guy comes back, beats King, they trade the title 3 times". Or "champ comes in, King wins or loses via count out or DQ 3 or 4 times".


Killing_Joke said:
And this classic booking helped how many wrestlers? Cesaro will be nowhere in a month. Hell maybe even a week. But at least he kept up with Cena in that one match. Same with Ziggler, Miz, Ryback, Umaga, etc etc. I think it's a point where wrestling Cena is going to kill your career more than help. Edge and Punk seem to have been the only exceptions.
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You can't really blame all of those on Cena. It's not his fault if he and Cesaro have a great match, he does all he can to make Cesaro look good, and then WWE doesn't do anything with Cesaro. There is a big difference in getting the "gave the ace all he could handle" kind of match and a 3 month feud. Cena should shoulder some of the blame for 3 month feuds where he makes guys look like shit and doesn't say "How about we make him look good tonight?". You can't blame him for one off matches where he does everything he can to make someone look good.

You can't blame him for how Daniel Bryan was booked after Summerslam. He had a great match and put Daniel over 100% clean. He then passed him the baton the next night on Raw. What came next was all on booking. Do you really think that Cesaro having that match with Cena does him no good? To go out and impress the fans and people in the back with putting on an excellent match with the top guy?
 
K

Killing_Joke

Member
Terrabyte20xx said:
Ziggler fell victim to loss of momentum due to injuries, and creative never picked the ball back up with him.(And I'm a huge Ziggler fan.)

Miz was never going to be anything more than he is now, he just doesn't have the in ring talent or mic skills for it.

I've never liked Rybacks wrestling, and I don't think I've ever seen a good match that he's been in, with the exception of him teaming with Team Hell No vs The Shield.

Umaga suffered from losing his manager, and not picking up the slack.(Not necessarily his fault, assume Creative is to blame.)

You noticing a pattern yet? None of their faults have direct connections to Cena.

As for Cesaro, He'll be fine. He's WAY too over for even terrible booking to stop him.

Oh, and you forgot one more person to add to that list of "Exceptions":

daniel-bryan.jpg
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I didn't say they were great talent. When you lose to a top guy you're in for a puch. Hardy/Taker is a great example of giving a "weaker" talent a nice rub. When has Cena done that ever? I'm not blaming him per say i'm just calling out his bullshit when he says he wants to help young talent. And Bryan was over before he faced Cena. And you realize that rub lasted a whopping 2 months right? If it wasn't for the fans Bryan would be curtain jerking WM30.
 
S

strobogo

Banned
I don't think you understand what you're talking about. You're using Bryan's booking while Cena wasn't even on the shows as evidence that Cena doesn't put people over. Competitive matches with the ace raises the profile of a guy, allowing them to gain some momentum. That's the whole point. It isn't to make someone an instant top guy.


Look at matches like Bret vs 123 Kid, or Bret vs Austin at Survivor Series 1996. It's the same concept. Or Ric Flair vs Ricky Morton. Or HHH vs Shelton. The whole point is to raise the profile of the guy with the fans. What comes next isn't on the ace unless they go out of their way to ruin a push. It's not Cena's fault that WWE can only book one or two things at a time. EVERYONE gets marginalized in WWE now. Even people that aren't connected to Cena in any way.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Cena's a career killer because they treat the guys like they would a heel brought in from another promotion who they expect to be gone in 1-2 years. It's short sighted and kills their ability to build for the future.
 
T

Terrabyte20xx

Junior Wrestlemania XXX Champion
Killing_Joke said:
I didn't say they were great talent. When you lose to a top guy you're in for a puch. Hardy/Taker is a great example of giving a "weaker" talent a nice rub. When has Cena done that ever? I'm not blaming him per say i'm just calling out his bullshit when he says he wants to help young talent. And Bryan was over before he faced Cena. And you realize that rub lasted a whopping 2 months right? If it wasn't for the fans Bryan would be curtain jerking WM30.
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None of that is Cena's fault though, that all belongs to Creative. Cena could want to lose to Zack Ryder of all people, but if Creative says no, then that means no. Cena doesn't havee any control over that.

As for your Hardy/Taker example. What, patting a guy, who by all accounts lost by being beaten halfway to death, on the head is a better "rub" than only just barely winning a match like with Cena/Cesaro? Wow, just wow.
 
S

Showaddy

Member
kirblar said:
Cena's a career killer because they treat the guys like they would a heel brought in from another promotion who they expect to be gone in 1-2 years. It's short sighted and kills their ability to build for the future.
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Which is why this "Managed to hang with Cena" crap won't work with Wyatt at Mania. It's fine if you're building a face but he needs to lose if they want to build a credible heel.
 
H

Hasney

Member
strobogo said:
I don't think you understand what you're talking about. You're using Bryan's booking while Cena wasn't even on the shows as evidence that Cena doesn't put people over. Competitive matches with the ace raises the profile of a guy, allowing them to gain some momentum. That's the whole point. It isn't to make someone an instant top guy.


Look at matches like Bret vs 123 Kid, or Bret vs Austin at Survivor Series 1996. It's the same concept. Or Ric Flair vs Ricky Morton. Or HHH vs Shelton. The whole point is to raise the profile of the guy with the fans. What comes next isn't on the ace unless they go out of their way to ruin a push. It's not Cena's fault that WWE can only book one or two things at a time. EVERYONE gets marginalized in WWE now. Even people that aren't connected to Cena in any way.
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Yup. Cena has recently made his opponents look really good in general when he's been against someone who needed it. Sandon looked great against him and then they did nothing with him. The only reason I'm not totally thinking that Ceasaro won't suffer the same fate is because other than a kilo of cocaine, he has all the tools Vince looks for.
 
S

strobogo

Banned
kirblar said:
Cena's a career killer because they treat the guys like they would a heel brought in from another promotion who they expect to be gone in 1-2 years. It's short sighted and kills their ability to build for the future.
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But that isn't exactly on Cena. That's a systemic booking problem. How many guys just vanish for a few weeks or show up on Superstars or Main Event only for a month with no angles of any kind? They don't do anything with guys even after a feud with Cena when they could do anything they want.
 
H

Hasney

Member
Showaddy said:
Which is why this "Managed to hang with Cena" crap won't work with Wyatt at Mania. It's fine if you're building a face but he needs to lose if they want to build a credible heel.
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I don't think that's always the case, I think it's fine for an up and coming heel to do the job and still look good. Wyatt's character though? Yeah, he needs to hand with Cena and then win, but the win doesn't have to be clean.
 
S

Showaddy

Member
Terrabyte20xx said:
As for your Hardy/Taker example. What, patting a guy, who by all accounts lost by being beaten halfway to death, on the head is a better "rub" than only just barely winning a match like with Cena/Cesaro? Wow, just wow.
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Hardy screaming down the mic that he was still standing and forcing Taker back to the ring was fucking epic. Way more of a rub from that match than Cesaro got from Cena.
 
K

Killing_Joke

Member
strobogo said:
I don't think you understand what you're talking about. You're using Bryan's booking while Cena wasn't even on the shows as evidence that Cena doesn't put people over. Competitive matches with the ace raises the profile of a guy, allowing them to gain some momentum. That's the whole point. It isn't to make someone an instant top guy.


Look at matches like Bret vs 123 Kid, or Bret vs Austin at Survivor Series 1996. It's the same concept. Or Ric Flair vs Ricky Morton. Or HHH vs Shelton. The whole point is to raise the profile of the guy with the fans. What comes next isn't on the ace unless they go out of their way to ruin a push. It's not Cena's fault that WWE can only book one or two things at a time. EVERYONE gets marginalized in WWE now. Even people that aren't connected to Cena in any way.
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But are you saying Cena doesn't have enough pull to go "Bryan is really over let me have a couple of programs with him"? I know putting someone over while at the top isn't new. All i'm saying is when it comes down to Cena it seems to have the opposite effect.
 
S

strobogo

Banned
Vince McMahon said:
HEY STRO
8:30
http://www.twitch.tv/sunnybuns/b/498216964
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Best part of the Rumble. That and Alex Wright dancing during an entrance that was only captured because someone was eliminated.

Killing_Joke said:
But are you saying Cena doesn't have enough pull to go "Bryan is really over let me have a couple of programs with him"? I know putting someone over while at the top isn't new. All i'm saying is when it comes down to Cena it seems to have the opposite effect.
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So are you trying to imply that Cena was responsible for Bryan's bad booking because he didn't request to work a program with him, even though he was injured and off the shows anyway? I get that people are tired of Cena, I'm tired of Cena, but people project so much of the over all terrible booking onto him like he's WCW Hogan or something.
 
M

MC Safety

Member
lovely ladies said:
It doesn't seem like it, there are so many pics where he's showcased in conventions but there's no one around him. Not sure how he even pays for all the traveling fees.
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They get paid for him.

I missed when he did it, but apparently he's set up shop in Grand Central Station a few times.
 
T

Terrabyte20xx

Junior Wrestlemania XXX Champion
Showaddy said:
Hardy screaming down the mic that he was still standing and forcing Taker back to the ring was fucking epic. Way more of a rub from that match than Cesaro got from Cena.
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But at what stage in Hardy's push did this occur? Cesaro is still part of a tag team, and is about to enter if first main event in the WWE. Not to mention the fact that he hasn't really had any outstanding matches on the main roster up until now.

Sure, with Hardy it was right out of his Tag Team days, but it was still months until he got another shot. I don't deny that it has a better image and feels like the making of a guy, but the match Cesaro had with Cena was never meant to be that kind of match. Cesaro's match was just answering the question of "Does this man belong in the Chamber?" And the answer was yes.
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
So, I just discovered my first grey chest hair. I'm already dead WrassleGAF. When I'm gone, is like to pass on my AJ stanning duties to somebody worthy of shopping to the fullest, maybe Fex, he could pull it off
 
S

strobogo

Banned
Aiii said:
So, I just discovered my first grey chest hair. I'm already dead WrassleGAF. When I'm gone, is like to pass on my AJ stanning duties to somebody worthy of shopping to the fullest, maybe Fex, he could pull it off
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I've had gray leg hairs and head hairs since I was 14. I'm 26 and get white pubes from time to time.
 
K

Killing_Joke

Member
strobogo said:
Best part of the Rumble. That and Alex Wright dancing during an entrance that was only captured because someone was eliminated.



So are you trying to imply that Cena was responsible for Bryan's bad booking because he didn't request to work a program with him, even though he was injured and off the shows anyway? I get that people are tired of Cena, I'm tired of Cena, but people project so much of the over all terrible booking onto him like he's WCW Hogan or something.
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Cena was only gone for 2 months. And even then i'm sure the undisputed crap was planned months before. I'm not putting full blame on Cena at all. I'm just calling him out when he says he wants to push guys. But then the next line he says he does whatever they want him to do. Which is usually shit and helps no one but himself.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
Plywood said:
Link, while you lay there, hopefully as uncomfortable as you possibly can be, I want you to listen to me. I want you to digest this because before I leave in 3 weeks with your Nintendo Twitter accounts, I have a lot of things I want to get off my chest.

I don’t hate you, Link. I don’t even dislike you. I do like you. I like you a hell of a lot more than I like most people in the back.

I hate this idea that you’re the best. Because you’re not. I’m the best. I’m the best in the world. There’s one thing you’re better at than I am and that’s kissing Iwata’s ass.

You’re as good as kissing Iwata’s ass as Mario was. I don’t know if you’re as good as Samus though. She’s a pretty good ass kisser. Always was and still is.

Whoops! I’m breaking the fourth wall!

[Cranky Kong waves to the camera]

I am the best videogame franchise in the world.

I’ve been the best since day one when I walked into this company. And I’ve been vilified and hated since that day because Shigeru Miyamoto saw something in me that nobody else wanted to admit. That’s right, I’m a Miyamoto guy. You know who else was a Miyamoto guy? Bowser. And he split just like I’m splitting. But the biggest difference between me and Bowser is I’m going to leave with the twitter accounts.

I’ve grabbed so many of Satoru Iwata’s brass rings that it’s finally dawned on me that they're just that, they’re completely imaginary. The only thing that’s real is me and the fact that day in and day out, for almost thirty-three years, I have proved to everybody in the world that I am the best on this microphone, in that console, even as a cameo! Nobody can touch me!

And yet no matter how many times I prove it, I’m not on your lovely little collector 3DS's. I’m not on the cover of the games. I’m barely promoted. I don't get to be in Smash Bros. I’m certainly not on the crappy Wii-U home menu. I’m not on the poster of E3. I’m not on the signature that’s produced at the start of Nintendo Direct. I’m not on IGN. I’m not on GameSpot. But the fact of the matter is, I should be.

This isn’t sour grapes. But the fact that Samus is in the main event at E3 next year and I’m not makes me sick!

Oh hey, let me get something straight. Those of you who are cheering me right now, you are just as big a part of me leaving as anything else. Because you’re the ones who are playing on those collector 3DS's right now. You’re the ones that buy those games that my face isn’t on the cover of. And then at five in the morning at the airport, you try to shove it in my face and get an autograph and try to sell it on eBay because you’re too lazy to go get a real job.

I’m leaving with the Twitter accounts on February 22nd. And hell, who knows, maybe I’ll go vine about it at SCE. Maybe…I’ll go to Microsoft.

[Cranky Kong looks at the camera and waves]

Hey, Captain Falco, how you doing?

The reason I’m leaving is you people. Because after I’m gone, you’re still going to pour money into this company. I’m just a spoke on the wheel. The wheel is going to keep turning and I understand that. Satoru Iwata is going to make money despite himself. He’s a millionaire who should be a billionaire. You know why he’s not a billionaire? Because he surrounds himself with glad-handed, nonsensical, douchebag (censored) yes men, like Reggie, who’s going to tell him everything he wants to hear, and I’d like to think that maybe this company will better after Satoru Iwata is dead. But the fact is, it’s going to be taken over by his idiotic daughter and his doofus son-in-law and the rest of his stupid family.

Let me tell you a personal story about Iwata alright. We do this whole family-friendly campaign...

[Microphone cuts off]
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WrestleGAF Post of the Year nominee right here!
 
S

strobogo

Banned
Killing_Joke said:
Cena was only gone for 2 months. And even then i'm sure the undisputed crap was planned months before. I'm not putting full blame on Cena at all. I'm just calling him out when he says he wants to push guys. But then the next line he says he does whatever they want him to do. Which is usually shit and helps no one but himself.
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If the unification thing was planned months in advance and that terrible build that on screen screamed "rushed as fuck" was the best they could do, then WWE should close down immediately. No way that wasn't planned in November at the latest.
 
S

Sweeney Tom

Banned
strobogo said:
If the unification thing was planned months in advance and that terrible build that on screen screamed "rushed as fuck" was the best they could do, then WWE should close down immediately. No way that wasn't planned in November at the latest.
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The unification thing was planned in advance, they just rushed it to culminate at TLC when they found out Cena was coming back early and Show/Orton was DOA in terms of fan appreciation and panicked about both. They had both guys as champs with no plan for what to do with their biggest champ (who wasn't Cena only because of the injury in the first place).
 
A

Alucard

Banned
Matches on Impact tonight:

-Gunner vs. Magnus for the belt
-The Wolves vs. Bad Influence
-Gail Kim vs. Madison Rayne street fight
-Samoa Joe vs. Bro Mans and Zema Ion

Hope that Joe loses. I get wanting to book him like a beast, but he can't be going around beating the tag champs and a former X champ.
 
J

jred2k

Member
Alucard said:
Matches on Impact tonight:

-Gunner vs. Magnus for the belt
-The Wolves vs. Bad Influence
-Gail Kim vs. Madison Rayne street fight
-Samoa Joe vs. Bro Mans and Zema Ion

Hope that Joe loses. I get wanting to book him like a beast, but he can't be going around beating the tag champs and a former X champ.
Click to expand...
Holy shit there might actually be 30 mins of wrestling on their wrestling show this week.
 
S

Singularity42

Member
strobogo said:
Man, Sting actually looks better than Taker.
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Never thought anyone would say that.

Taker lookin old as shit, but there are a ton of miles and no tread left on the tires.

I really hope this Mania is his last in the ring and he goes out with a win.

As a kid that guy terrified me. I remember crying to my mom when he locked warrior in the coffin.
 
S

strobogo

Banned
Singularity42 said:
Never thought anyone would say that.

Taker lookin old as shit, but there are a ton of miles and no tread left on the tires.

I really hope this Mania is his last in the ring and he goes out with a win.

As a kid that guy terrified me. I remember crying to my mom when he locked warrior in the coffin.
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Oh shit, The Undertaker was my right front tire. It all makes so much sense now.


1622120_248075432030011_2054462124_n.jpg
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Someone should shop that onto his head.
 
A

Alucard

Banned
Saw Nash in person. He looks good. Just has the silver fox thing going on. Bret Hart looks pretty old and beat up, but it kind of fits him at this point.
 
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