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February Wrasslin' |OT| Royal Reignble Fallout. NO HOLDS BARRED, SMARKS!

It's pretty accurate. NJPW is number one with a bullet, but the others have declined significantly while Dragon Gate is doing very well. They've ascended by virtue of being a ton of fit ass Japanese dudes for girls to stare at

Yeah I can see that as even in the earliest Toryumon shows you would always hear the ladies screaming CIMAAAAAA! It's just so weird that AJPW/NJPW/NOAH used to be the top dogs and now AJPW/NOAH have fallen so far and NJPW has surpassed everything on Planet Earth.
 

DMczaf

Member
It's gonna break my damn heart when this ends.

Enjoy the ride

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DDT does big shows more regularly than Dragon Gate.

I had read that DDT was the king of Korueken Hall nowadays. Would you consider them to have a better product than Dragon Gate? I was planning on ordering a show each from DDT, BJPW, AJPW, Zero 1, Michinoku Pro and Wrestle 1 just to get a feel for the Japanese scene these days. All your Z1 gifs have me sold on them Data.
 

Man God

Non-Canon Member
Dragon's Gate is easily number two. NJPW also basically bought NOAH, AJPW is a tire fire and ain't nobody care about Wrestle 1. DDT might even be number three.
 
Nikki Bella said:
On wanting to work with Seth Rollins:

"But I really want to work with Seth (Rollins) too. He and I are kind of the Prince and Princess, so I think it would be fun to kind of throw him in the mix. It does (get complicated with having Total Divas to account for) but I think I have a lot to go off on John (Cena) about, so."

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Dragon's Gate is easily number two. NJPW also basically bought NOAH, AJPW is a tire fire and ain't nobody care about Wrestle 1. DDT might even be number three.

Yeah the NOAH/NJPW deal is very interesting and I'm curious to see how it plays itself out. I see a lot of DDT love online these days as well and I'm wondering if they still have an overabundance of absurd shit happening on their shows or if it's more balanced out now. Also I was surprised to see Daisuke Sekimoto from Big Japan appear in every promotion in Japan lol. When did they get traditional wrestlers and not just ultraviolent crap?
 

Man God

Non-Canon Member
He's frankly too good looking and too good at his job to avoid being cheered. Ideally he'll become Flair who can just switch it on and off as he goes back and forth.
 

Data West

coaches in the WNBA
I had read that DDT was the king of Korueken Hall nowadays. Would you consider them to have a better product than Dragon Gate? I was planning on ordering a show each from DDT, BJPW, AJPW, Zero 1, Michinoku Pro and Wrestle 1 just to get a feel for the Japanese scene these days. All your Z1 gifs have me sold on them Data.

Comparing DDT, NJPW, and Dragon Gate is basically impossible. The reason they excel is because they all offer different things. If they were all after the same crowd as NJPW/AJPW/NOAH etc.... Well, they wouldn't be where they are today. DDT being more comedic(kind of like a Chikara but the wrestlers actually have different styles instead of all wrestling like they were trained by Quack) and it's run by a wrestler since the beginning which is always super cool to see Takagi get success. He really deserves it. Dragon Gate is closer to lucha libre but with more Japanese sensibilities. They've always been 'Ultimo Dragon's students' even when they've tapered off into their own thing. All three(NJPW, DDT, and Dragon Gate) have one thing right and that it's appealing to all demographics. NJPW brings in older male wrestling fans who liked Nagata/Tenzan/Kojima/Liger growing up or who like guys like Shibata and Goto because they remind them of old school strong style wrestlers, former Pancrase/PRIDE fans who like Suzuki, older women who like Tanahashi, younger women who like naito, taichi, and ibushi, little kids who like tiger mask, liger, kushida, naito and ibushi, drug dealers who like shinsuke, american fans who know aj and follow him wherever they go, Lucha fans who watch all the luchadores who do regular tours over there now and little kids who love them. Seriously, little kids fucking LOVE luchadores and masks. Even the damn sushi dude in AJPW is over big time in AJPW. NJPW's roster is completely fucking loaded and no one can compete with them. America or Japan or Mexico.

Dragon Gate has a strong roster as well though they've usually just kept on doing what they've always done and Japan has sort of grown with that roster because it's mostly stayed the same over the years so fans get attached. They, like NJPW, also have a bunch of handsome dudes who work there, but they can wrestler so it pulls in a wide array of fans. Little kids love K-Ness, Dragon Kid, etc. DDT's popularity, I like to think, has been due to all the workers going to different places and just pulling in fans and bringing them back with them to DDT. Maybe someone hates 'comedy wrestling' but they see Sekimoto and say 'hey this guys awesome, where else does he wrestle?' and grows from there. Or Ibushi. Or Omega. Takagi is also smart in booking the right guys to bring buzz to his matches. He booked Jun Kasai and Minoru Suzuki for a tag match. He booked the meanest man in wrestling and the man who invented razorblade cross boards to work a comedy match in his show that kids come to, and it was the most over match of the night.

NOAH has the best juniors division in Japan. Of that particular style, of the Liger, Tiger Mask, Dynamite Kid, Koji Kanemoto, etc style. Not the style Dragon Gate works. They have so many talented juniors that I could see all as champions. And an incredible juniors tag division because of this. Something NJPW doesn't have at all. I look at NOAH and can see all these guys who could be the future of junior heavyweight wrestling in Japan. But the problem is, how many of the most notable names of all time in Japanese wrestling are junior heavyweights? You'll find the majority to be heavyweights. I think NOAH is doing the right thing right now and trying to highlight their juniors division because it kicks the shit out of their heavyweight division and it kicks the shit out of NJPWs juniors division. Their only competition would really be Dragon Gate if they went further in that direction, and I think those are very different styles. And the older wrestling fans have no reason to watch NOAH since Akiyama left. It's a young guys company now with a few exceptions. It's actually really 'new generation' these last couple years. It's why Marufuji worked the angle with Nagata to 'humble' himself. Getting beaten repeatedly by a veteran by making stupid mistakes. KENTA busted his ass when he won the title, and he's never performed better, but people just weren't watching with the focus on smaller guys in NOAH.

I think Zero-1 has a really solid product with all the potential to be great. I actually think it has more potential than it's ever had before, even more than when it was 'Hashimoto kills all your faves' days. It's got a solid range of talent in its roster, guys who might be B+ player versions of those guys in NJPW but still filling in all those spots. Appealing to everyone who wants to watch. It's just that people don't want to watch. They actually cancelled a show in 2014 because they couldn't drum up enough interest because the promotion was shit for years and years and years. In recent years, it was 'hey that's where Hashimoto's overrated kid wrestles. He's not very good.' and you might think people watched for Sekimoto, but Sekimoto didn't catch on with wrestling fans until about 3 years ago despite being with Zero-1 for so long. And that was because of his appearances in OTHER promotions. I had never even heard of anyone talking about Zero-1 poitively post-Hashimoto's death until Dangan Yankees became a thing.

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One thing CFO$ excel at, irrelevant of what you think of the actual music, is that they create the perfect style of music for the character they are making it for. Bayley's music fits her character perfect. Sasha's music fits her character perfect. Same with Balor, Itami, Zayn, Neville, etc. They just know how to get the style they need for every character.
 
Comparing DDT, NJPW, and Dragon Gate is basically impossible. The reason they excel is because they all offer different things. If they were all after the same crowd as NJPW/AJPW/NOAH etc.... Well, they wouldn't be where they are today. DDT being more comedic(kind of like a Chikara but the wrestlers actually have different styles instead of all wrestling like they were trained by Quack) and it's run by a wrestler since the beginning which is always super cool to see Takagi get success. He really deserves it. Dragon Gate is closer to lucha libre but with more Japanese sensibilities. They've always been 'Ultimo Dragon's students' even when they've tapered off into their own thing. All three(NJPW, DDT, and Dragon Gate) have one thing right and that it's appealing to all demographics. NJPW brings in older male wrestling fans who liked Nagata/Tenzan/Kojima/Liger growing up or who like guys like Shibata and Goto because they remind them of old school strong style wrestlers, former Pancrase/PRIDE fans who like Suzuki, older women who like Tanahashi, younger women who like naito, taichi, and ibushi, little kids who like tiger mask, liger, kushida, naito and ibushi, drug dealers who like shinsuke, american fans who know aj and follow him wherever they go, Lucha fans who watch all the luchadores who do regular tours over there now and little kids who love them. Seriously, little kids fucking LOVE luchadores and masks. Even the damn sushi dude in AJPW is over big time in AJPW. NJPW's roster is completely fucking loaded and no one can compete with them. America or Japan or Mexico.

Dragon Gate has a strong roster as well though they've usually just kept on doing what they've always done and Japan has sort of grown with that roster because it's mostly stayed the same over the years so fans get attached. They, like NJPW, also have a bunch of handsome dudes who work there, but they can wrestler so it pulls in a wide array of fans. Little kids love K-Ness, Dragon Kid, etc. DDT's popularity, I like to think, has been due to all the workers going to different places and just pulling in fans and bringing them back with them to DDT. Maybe someone hates 'comedy wrestling' but they see Sekimoto and say 'hey this guys awesome, where else does he wrestle?' and grows from there. Or Ibushi. Or Omega. Takagi is also smart in booking the right guys to bring buzz to his matches. He booked Jun Kasai and Minoru Suzuki for a tag match. He booked the meanest man in wrestling and the man who invented razorblade cross boards to work a comedy match in his show that kids come to, and it was the most over match of the night.

NOAH has the best juniors division in Japan. Of that particular style, of the Liger, Tiger Mask, Dynamite Kid, Koji Kanemoto, etc style. Not the style Dragon Gate works. They have so many talented juniors that I could see all as champions. And an incredible juniors tag division because of this. Something NJPW doesn't have at all. I look at NOAH and can see all these guys who could be the future of junior heavyweight wrestling in Japan. But the problem is, how many of the most notable names of all time in Japanese wrestling are junior heavyweights? You'll find the majority to be heavyweights. I think NOAH is doing the right thing right now and trying to highlight their juniors division because it kicks the shit out of their heavyweight division and it kicks the shit out of NJPWs juniors division. Their only competition would really be Dragon Gate if they went further in that direction, and I think those are very different styles. And the older wrestling fans have no reason to watch NOAH since Akiyama left. It's a young guys company now with a few exceptions. It's actually really 'new generation' these last couple years. It's why Marufuji worked the angle with Nagata to 'humble' himself. Getting beaten repeatedly by a veteran by making stupid mistakes. KENTA busted his ass when he won the title, and he's never performed better, but people just weren't watching with the focus on smaller guys in NOAH.

I think Zero-1 has a really solid product with all the potential to be great. I actually think it has more potential than it's ever had before, even more than when it was 'Hashimoto kills all your faves' days. It's got a solid range of talent in its roster, guys who might be B+ player versions of those guys in NJPW but still filling in all those spots. Appealing to everyone who wants to watch. It's just that people don't want to watch. They actually cancelled a show in 2014 because they couldn't drum up enough interest because the promotion was shit for years and years and years. In recent years, it was 'hey that's where Hashimoto's overrated kid wrestles. He's not very good.' and you might think people watched for Sekimoto, but Sekimoto didn't catch on with wrestling fans until about 3 years ago despite being with Zero-1 for so long. And that was because of his appearances in OTHER promotions. I had never even heard of anyone talking about Zero-1 poitively post-Hashimoto's death until Dangan Yankees became a thing.

71RPjjs.gif

a lot of good info, thanks
 
DDT does big shows more regularly than Dragon Gate.

Not sure that's true, DDT's Sumo Hall show drew 9,100 fans last year which is almost as much as the biggest Dragon Gate show of 2014, but the next biggest attendance for DDT was the 2,200 they regularly drew at Korakuen Hall. Dragon Gate, on the other hand, had 5 shows that drew well above Korakuen levels; Dead or Alive (6,800), Kobe World (9,650), Dangerous Gate (5,000), Gate of Destiny (7,150) & Final Gate (7,600). They run Korakuen about the same amount as DDT (12 times a year), but only draw a maximum of 1,800 because they use a stage set up that takes up more space, however they do tend to draw better than DDT outside of Tokyo, which you can see an example of with their shows in Osaka BODYMAKER coliseum #2, which Dragon Gate usually sells out with 1,800 fans, while DDT don't always break 1,000. DDT are definitely on the rise, though, and should certainly be considered above the like of AJPW & W-1.
 

rrc1594

Member
Late night WrestlingGaf is the weird. I don't know whats worst reading this creepy crap in late hours or waking up to it.
 
When did they get traditional wrestlers and not just ultraviolent crap?

They've always trained their wrestlers as wrestlers first, not just deathmatch guys, but it's only been in the past five year's or so that they've had enough legitimately good talent who can stand on their own without the deathmatches. It's largely thanks to Daisuke Sekimoto who, while starting his career in deathmatches, trained a lot of the guys who now make up BJW's 'strong' division; Yuji Okabayashi, Shuji Ishikawa, Ryuichi Kawakami, etc.
 

Data West

coaches in the WNBA
Sekimoto was also doing deadlift german suplexes in 2004.
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But y'know. Michael Elgin invented them and made them popular. Praise the pig man.
 
Sekimoto was also doing deadlift german suplexes in 2004.
5f2JsPR.gif

But y'know. Michael Elgin invented them and made them popular. Praise the pig man.

I assume Doug Williams doesn't count either? Man, fuck Elgin. Never interested me watching PWG shows. Brian Cage too, he's shite as well.
 
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