You dont make mistakes?
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Fighting Game Headquarters |2| 0-2 vs Community
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You dont make mistakes?
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
How can sf detach itself from the fgc. Wat.
About the US fgc being SF centric. Whats the problem with that. Its how it panned out. People like playing sf, hence its sf centric. Its not like it was declared SF wotld, then became that way. If everybody stopped playing SF, it would not be destined to be the same size and everbody would play something else to fill the vacuum. Its not SF players problem those other games don't have bigger bases. People just will need to want them to play them organicallly. Its like when people complain EVO is capcom game centric. Well shit, it did start as a sf tournament for goodness sake, jeez.
And about Aris. He has changed. On an ATP a few weeks back, they talked about how everybody is different now and change is a good thing.
About the US fgc being SF centric. Whats the problem with that. Its how it panned out. People like playing sf, hence its sf centric. Its not like it was declared SF wotld, then became that way. If everybody stopped playing SF, it would not be destined to be the same size and everbody would play something else to fill the vacuum. Its not SF players problem those other games don't have bigger bases. People just will need to want them to play them organicallly. Its like when people complain EVO is capcom game centric. Well shit, it did start as a sf tournament for goodness sake, jeez.
And about Aris. He has changed. On an ATP a few weeks back, they talked about how everybody is different now and change is a good thing.
ShinMaruku
Member
Personally I think they got better as soon as they loosed that Bellend and made DOA5. It's a marked improvement overall in the series from the older versions. Keep in mind that made the pervious ones solid where considered mistakes by TI and his 'fixed' version was a utter shit show in DOA4. Hell his idea on Genra was kinda batshit. I think their current output is great outside of them embraicng a bad idea with NG3. Anything after that has been quality, HW is great, DOA5 is great if they parse the data on DOAX well it should be good.
When I say "it's own thing" I mean like look at Smash. They are completely separated from the FGC, have their own shit going on all the time and only pop in during Evo etc. I think it works for them very well. I just think Capcom should focus on SF-exclusive events more for the CPT as rather than on events with SF mixed in with other games. Basically work towards being considered a different entity entirely like the "SF community". CS GO, LoL, and Dota 2 are never lumped in to a bigger category and I feel like SF should strive towards that goal. Even Tekken has this to a bigger degree.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
FGC = fighting games by capcom
it's other games that need to bolster themselves like smash has
it's other games that need to bolster themselves like smash has
I don't know if I'd call the separation of the different smash scenes "expert". The animosity between melee and smash 4 is especially bad. The benefit of having the fgc where tourneys and events host multiple games is that it sometimes forces communities to at least tolerate different scenes and not be total dicks.
edit: Sounds like you're talking about all smashes separating from traditional fgc. I was focusing on the smash scene itself.
edit: Sounds like you're talking about all smashes separating from traditional fgc. I was focusing on the smash scene itself.
Karsticles
Member
SFV | Pornography for Weirdos.
FGC| Pornography for Weirdos
Cindi Mayweather
Member
KOF02UM on steam is really, really cheap. I bought it because it was cheap and I was hoping for full on move lists for all characters to help practice for when I fight on Fightcade, and...there's no command list inside the game.
My problem is that people are willing to file what he did as just a "mistake". Miranda getting past it is cool, but it's for it to not color my impression of him, even if he's grown since then, and I don't see why that means I have " a crusade" on him, either.
lmao
My problem is that people are willing to file what he did as just a "mistake". Miranda getting past it is cool, but it's for it to not color my impression of him, even if he's grown since then, and I don't see why that means I have " a crusade" on him, either.
lmao
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
The player bases are way to small for this besides smash. These other games should do what smash does then if they feel SF is holding them back.
Or are you saying they are holding SF back? I personally like all ths other games mixed un at events. The numbers are low. Just get everybody in the door.
Not sure what you want us to do about that then.
Master Milk
Member
I was thinking strictly in terms of visuals when I read your statement.
But even if I weren't, while the current TN isn't bad, I don't think they polish their games like the old TN did. I'll admit that could be my bias though.
But NG3 was shit and DOAX3 is likely to be shit like 2 instead of a solid game like 1, so my bias is still right in my eyes
Individual T.O.'s should continue to do whatever they want to do. I'm just saying Capcom should focus their own efforts on SF-exclusive events. More (smaller) Capcom Cups and less emphasis on variety tournaments being designated as CPT majors. This is getting really specific, though, and perhaps not the only way.
The net effect would be SF being its own entity and the relative importance of other games at the usual majors would probably increase since SF is more seriously taken elsewhere.
Rice-Eater
Member
Are you saying you think this route will help SF grow more as a brand rather than being side by side with a bunch of other games? That's going to be kind of difficult since part of the foundation of the CPT is the community tournaments that run year round. Capcom doesn't want to intrude with community tournaments since that will cause some controversy and I'm not sure if anybody is willing to step up and create a SF only event and actually expect a good turn out unless Capcom promises to award them a spot in the CPT.
I think we will continue to see more SFV centric events in the future like the Canada Cup Masters Series and the Red Bull Invitational but I don't think we'll see a SFV only Premier tourney anytime soon nor do I think Capcom will push for it. I think their comfortable with where they are and the change your talking about might not happen for many years or maybe even until SF6.
ShinMaruku
Member
That's what I have always promoted and why that whole soft ban business was deluded and contributed to the problem it was trying to side step. Never try to put in the 'greater fgc' into any game, you have to build your game's scene by it's merits and once the size is big enough then you can force entry.
But I think we have a group that wants to tie them all together and think by doing that they can grow the scene but it's too small and fractious to do that. Somebody needs to tell that group of cos and personalites that that shit is pointless and is a waste of effort. We need more CEOtakus and other events like that and Apex for other games to grow around.
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
Unless capcom starts doing their own open tournaments, i dont see this happening. I dont want everything to be invitationals. The beauty of the fighting game tournaments is the open bracket and anybody can enter. Imo.
Holy Order Sol
Member
There is. Go into Practice Mode then in the pause menu set the select button to "Skill List", I believe it's on "Restart" by default.
There are many differences with the original 2002 though.
Cindi Mayweather
Member
Wow.
Hahaha.
I'm not sure if I want to support Last Blade 2 ps4 now, haha. Not if it's this cheap.
ShinMaruku
Member
I feel Street Fighter and Smash can indeed carry attendence to their events to fill out the numbers needed. Most people only do their own game, cross play is very rare and has no impact on the overall scene. Before it was the case, but now? I am certain SF would fill the seats because if it was not there, the numbers would be lower.
The animosity bettween melee and smash 4 is kinda very childish, but I think the character of the smash scenes being so rabit is why it was able to grow and keep itself relivant and keep decent numbers. Of course there is plenty of growing up to do but I think when you have Nintendo holding the reins you expect this to happen. Although if Nintendo go serious they could put the cabosh in this with serious money where there intrests are and then play the waiting game. But not worth their time so we have what they have.
Street Fighter is at a size where it will not be postively or negativly effect by how things are today, the presence is more a detriment to the other games than SF it's in the good place and since it's the main dog no need to upend the apple cart that serves it. I can understand why they don't want to mess with the community events because it IS their community after all. The onus is more on the others to do something themselves because if 'fighting games' blows up it will most likely be just Street Fighter in this set up, there is no trickling down.
Reganomics is reganomics in no matter what context. A delusion.
Be happy LB2 is getting being rereleased at all. This port is also from Code Mystics or some other C- tier porting dev.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Cindi Mayweather
Member
Who's handling LB2?
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Not that much honestly.
Him and his minion cover each other and he has high damage unblockable set ups and insane pressure. But as a move list goes it's pretty simple
ShinMaruku
Member
They call me the streak breaker
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcrJQr3jB1Q
Momiji is such a great sorceress
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcrJQr3jB1Q
Momiji is such a great sorceress
Karsticles
Member
Zato is pretty manageable unless he's being used by a top tier player. If you're getting frustrated by random casuals, maybe rethink your approach?
Hardly even playable when the shadow is down. It's telling that one of Ogawa's notes to himself during Evo was "Don't attack without the shadow".
RockTurtle
Member
of all the warriors characters to bring over....
my girl wang yi....you will get yours one day
my girl wang yi....you will get yours one day
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Cindi Mayweather
Member
RE: growing the FGC in the west.
I feel that what we need more than anything are more prominent locals. A lot of people over rely on online. I think we should be fostering environments that are allow people to congregate and feel welcome in a local environment to help grow the games. Also, advertise those places. Don't keep them secret. Arcades are mostly dead in the west, and they're not what they were in Japan either. So I think we should be trying to grow an environment as similar as possible but isn't the same thing as the arcades of old. I think each major city should have at least one center that's for local fgc meeting where you can play any fighter you want.
I think getting people offline is the first step to take.
As for non-SF and Smash games, I think they should get as much attention on them as SF and Smash. There's no reason Tekken isn't big over here and I'm not going to chalk it up to what Shin said about you needing a thesis to play it. I think the developers of anime fighters should cater to the community outside Japan does.
I think it starts with building a community locally, and then using that to foster a new generation.
I feel that what we need more than anything are more prominent locals. A lot of people over rely on online. I think we should be fostering environments that are allow people to congregate and feel welcome in a local environment to help grow the games. Also, advertise those places. Don't keep them secret. Arcades are mostly dead in the west, and they're not what they were in Japan either. So I think we should be trying to grow an environment as similar as possible but isn't the same thing as the arcades of old. I think each major city should have at least one center that's for local fgc meeting where you can play any fighter you want.
I think getting people offline is the first step to take.
As for non-SF and Smash games, I think they should get as much attention on them as SF and Smash. There's no reason Tekken isn't big over here and I'm not going to chalk it up to what Shin said about you needing a thesis to play it. I think the developers of anime fighters should cater to the community outside Japan does.
I think it starts with building a community locally, and then using that to foster a new generation.
Oh yea forgot about Seth. Nah when i look at the rest of the guilty gear cast theirs only a couple characters that have toolsets that cover a lot of different aspects.
Like when i look at Leo, he cant really play different styles, hes only equipped to get in that ass. He doesnt have intangibles or multiple tools that cover different gameplay styles.
Flight, the ability to go underneath the ground completely invincible while being able to still attack, a reflector for projectiles, an air trajectory changing move, 2 movesets simultaneously, amazing anti airs, long ranged hitboxes that force massive frame advantage, amazing lockdown capabilities, long range normals on the air and the ground, 2 different command grabs, an overhead, and theres probably some stuff im forgetting lmao.
You're misreading my post, im not calling him unfair nor am i complaining. Im stating i think his toolset is super well rounded and im trying to think of other characters that are as well equipped as he is.
petran79
Banned
my complain:
they added this:
which is based on this:
yet they omit bruised guys faces
ShinMaruku
Member
I also think online could hold a good part in putting a bridge say if you let a online tourney link into a offline local and regional structure, where you promote people on going to a local if possible but you must realize some people won't have a local to go to but putting a online qualifier and events to then go to with the resources open to them could also enable growth. I think the first game to actually set the the connection and make online tournies and transitioning into a local is the next game that could set up to grow to a decent point like smash and sf.
Tularensis
Neo Member
People were saying things similar to this all the time when 13 was first released. Even though I've spent more time playing it than other games, I still can't shake the feeling that there's definitely something off about the game compared to older KOFs. Also, who here still even plays 13 or the UMs on steam? I've been trying to get matches for the past week and no one on my friends list is playing the game anymore. After enjoying the simplicity of the SFV beta, I just can't bring myself to grind out the encyclopedia of BB at the moment.
Also, SF will naturally separate itself from the FGC at large when it has the numbers to do so. Rushing it will just ensure it fails.
Karsticles
Member
But this is like the 5th time you've complained about Zato.
I don't even think Zato is really well-rounded. I think he has a small toolset that is extremely well ingrained into his character type. Carl has way more options than Zato does. Even Rosalina arguably does when customs are allowed.
I think venom is a good example of a char with a varied enough toolset to facilitate different styles of play. The difference between hevens and finos and n.o.s venoms were pretty large.
Exr
Member
This is so slick, must have watched it 5 times in a row
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
The most well rounded fighting game characters is a super small list, zato is not on said list.
Some characters:
Akuma sf4
Seth sf4
Ky Kiske GGAC and up
Jin Kisaragi bbcp and up
SSF2T Ryu
There is an obvious pattern here
RockTurtle
Member
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
You mean Falco or Fox
Karsticles
Member
I guess your posts are masturbatory, then, lol.
Carl has an invincible command dash that allow his doll's attacks to cross you up.
The doll has a full screen projectile that takes up half of the vertical.
The doll has two anti-air options: one diagonal in front, and one directly above it.
The doll doesn't have to be summoned; it's always there, ready for a command, and invincible while waiting for a command.
The doll can attack from off-screen behind you.
The doll isn't decommissioned and put at 0 bar when hit.
Carl has a cross-up, dive-kick-like attack he can make use of.
That's the stuff that Carl has that Zato doesn't.
Stuff that Zato has that Carl doesn't:
A projectile reflector (of questionable usage).
Break the Law.
Unblockable through -D-.
A command grab.
Drills.
Hovering.
I guess you could say that Zato > Carl, but Eddie < Ada. Since Zato is hardly functional without the shadow, I think Carl is the stronger character overall. Both characters are top tier in their current versions of their games by most player opinions.
I'd also add in UMvC3 Magneto, Skullgirls Valentine, and Smash 4 Sheik and ZSS.
Pretty sure it's Code Mystics. Though surprisingly Sony Third Party Productions is helping out. The sad thing is I don't know if that's better or worse.
That whole set is full of crazyness. Kuroda says it's a 3:7 but he wrecked MOV.
Also for Christmas he did another set after several months, this time vs Ushi!? who was one of the best Uriens and is now a great Yun.
This is the full thing with a commentary track.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ru1Yvwgns1c
Just gameplay is on their channel too but they break it up into two parts for some reason. I think they switch sides to account for differences.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Eddie is faster than Ada as well overall
biosnake20
Member
I wonder if Kuroda will play SFV seriously.
Yea Venom definitely. He can play keepaway, hes got built in oki, he can control neutral really well, dictate the pace of the match.
Maybe Ramlethal?
I like Millias toolset but its built towards one thing.
Just Fox.
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