• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Fighting Games Weekly |8/17-23| It was a little beta this time.

V

ViewtifulJC

Banned
Ryu's forward+MP allowed him to instantly react to the Crush Counter into a combo. Most players I see get Crush Counters that'll far away to really capitalize on it
 
O

Onemic

Member
AAK said:
I'm sorry man, I don't see it. Where is this experimentation of character design? Every design in Tekken 7 except Kazuya, Lars, and Jin is recycled from the previous games INCLUDING the putrid customs of TTT2. When it comes to gameplay, it still fundamentally plays the same as Tekken Revolution with just tweaks to frame data like when you can block after sidestepping/walking. Picking any character from TTT2 or TR and jumping into T7 you already pretty much know 90% of the character already in the game. I don't see where they experimented to induce some kind of discovery that one expects when diving into a new game.

And again the Tekken 4 argument comes into play, a game that didn't get a re-release with a BR/DR version like Tekken 5/6/Tag2 got, so it's not a fair comparison. But regardless, Tekken 4 is fondly looked upon right now because we're all just desperate for a new feeling in the series again. The last thing was the experimentation of the tech which I assume something had to be done to convert everything into Unreal Engine 4... but I guess that's where their entire budget got squandered to. There isn't a single brand new hit animation developed for this iteration of the game. The new screw-attack is just DJin's WS+2 hit animation recycled; the new bound animation is just Law's DSS,2 recycled; The new twirl animation from moves like T7 Kazuya's d/f+1,4 is just the beginning frames of Law's WS+1,2 hit animation recycled; That toe grab animation that's new in T7 is completely ripped off of Soul Calibur; and I can go on. Where is the experimentation on new content? And not just that The game actually looks worse tech wise in a lot of the character models compared to Tekken 6 which was released 8 years ago.
Click to expand...

So im finally no longer crazy for thinking that T7's character models look like they were ripped straight from T6 polygons and all?
 
O

OceanBlue

Member
Holy Order Sol said:
It does, but he tried something there, it said Reversal as he got hit.
Click to expand...

Yeah, maybe the Nash player thought his DP was invincible or something. I just was thinking that if you tried using st.HK in a frame trap and they were just crouch blocking, they could punish you without too much difficulty lol.
 
O

Onemic

Member
Karsticles said:
In bizarro land, Tekken 7 looks great and SFV looks like its predecessor.
Click to expand...

That seems to be the prevailing opinion, at least amongst many Tekken fans.(At least that was the impression I got when I argued that it doesnt look much different than T6) To anyone else though, it just looks like T6 with better lighting and hit sparks. Sorta like the transition from DS2 for PS3/360 to DS2: Scholar of the First Sin for PS4.
 
S

Sayad

Member
Karsticles said:
In bizarro land, Tekken 7 looks great and SFV looks like its predecessor.
Click to expand...

SFV is untouchable in character models and animation, though they really dropped the ball with the backgrounds. 30fps, low poly, low anisotropic filtering and the new stage have horrible lighting and textures, it's only saving grace are the sheep. Hong Kong stage does look good but the other two are nowhere near it.

I'd say it's reasonable to say T7 have better backgrounds, but they're "both" still work in progress.
 
K

KidA Seven

Member
Rice-Eater said:
Good thing Americans have Summer Jam next week...but Asians still have HK tournament and then another one in Manila the week after. Man their are a lot of Asian events this year with 16 listed in the Asian category. It's like they're trying to make up for last year when it was so lop sided in favor of America.

Technically America still has more events but guys like Smug, Die, and Art better make sure they're at these ranking events and finishing high. And I mean no less than top 4 or it doesn't really matter.
Click to expand...

US still has a big advantage considering the overall player skill in the region compared to Asia. One of Asia's premier and ranking events don't really do anything to effect the standings as no points are being given out in Singapore. US players have 6 premiere tournaments in the region and 8 ranking events. Asia has 3 premier tournaments and 11 ranking events, again due to no points given out in Singapore.

Also it's important to note who Smug, Ricki, Dieminion, and Art will be competing against for the last few spots.

-Art has 40 points
-Smug has 48 points
-Ricki has 82 points
-Dieminion has 36 points

Who they will be fighting against:
-KojiKOG has 68 points
-Kubo, Infexious, Sako, and aiai have 64 points
-Chuan has 56 points

Not in top 32
-Ryan Hart has 52 points
-Shiro has 41 points
-Gackt has 32 points
-Inco has 25 points
-Valmaster has 18 points

Ryan, Valmaster, and Infexious can easily get top 3 in the 3 remaining European ranking events. Valmaster and Ryan especially have proven to consistently get top 3 at European majors without Asian competition. I think Art is done for now that it looks like Smug, Dieminion, and Snake will go to those ranking events that take place in the East Coast. Ricki has 82 points and a great sponsor in EG, but with those 3 players attending to keep her out of top 3 she is still at risk of getting knocked out.
 
T

Thomasorus

Member
AAK said:
I'm sorry man, I don't see it. Where is this experimentation of character design? Every design in Tekken 7 except Kazuya, Lars, and Jin is recycled from the previous games INCLUDING the putrid customs of TTT2. When it comes to gameplay, it still fundamentally plays the same as Tekken Revolution with just tweaks to frame data like when you can block after sidestepping/walking. Picking any character from TTT2 or TR and jumping into T7 you already pretty much know 90% of the character already in the game. I don't see where they experimented to induce some kind of discovery that one expects when diving into a new game.
Click to expand...

Well Tekken Revo was also an experiment but it's not canon in the series and not a major release. Adding what they liked from Revo to 7 seems logical.

Also when I'm talking about "experimenting" it's not so much creating something 100% unique but adapting yourself to a new public while retaining what makes you special. New characters still feels like Tekken characters but they are different. Claudio can use "magic", Chloe is using a fighting style not fit for her size and appealing to a specific community, Gigas is going into the comics/monster thing, Shaheen is trying to appeal to the middle east public... If you look at Josie and Katarina you'll probably say they're just babes but the goal here is like Shaheen, to put a character from a country (philippines and brasil) that is a potentiel market for the brand and nail it. If you miss it, you can't try a second time, you're fucked. This is why I'm saying they are experimenting here.

You're right saying it's a shy attempt but it's an attempt anyway. Tekken is transitioning from a fighting game that was split between classic martial arts characters, complete nonsense like ninjas/robots/bears, and complete invention like Alisa, Lilli and Lars ; to something else that is not entirely defined but will be different. The young audience that Tekken might chase doesn't watch Bruce Lee movies, only saw Jackie Chan in Rush Hour and maybe understands who John Cena is but that's all. If you look at he popularity of characters like Alisa, Lars and Lili you can guess the series already evolved and the new public probably don't care about martial arts in the first place. But you have to make them play Tekken so they transformed some characters into pretty girls or big monsters to see if it works.

It's not enough, I'm okay with you on this. For these kind of things you need to take your time if you don't want to kill the series. Remember that many series didn't met success when rebooted (SF3 and KOF99 come to my mind) and because the last games were so full of everything the fans wanted that new entries could not compete. After TTT2 Tekken is in the exact same position.

AAK said:
And again the Tekken 4 argument comes into play, a game that didn't get a re-release with a BR/DR version like Tekken 5/6/Tag2 got, so it's not a fair comparison. But regardless, Tekken 4 is fondly looked upon right now because we're all just desperate for a new feeling in the series again. The last thing was the experimentation of the tech which I assume something had to be done to convert everything into Unreal Engine 4... but I guess that's where their entire budget got squandered to. There isn't a single brand new hit animation developed for this iteration of the game. The new screw-attack is just DJin's WS+2 hit animation recycled; the new bound animation is just Law's DSS,2 recycled; The new twirl animation from moves like T7 Kazuya's d/f+1,4 is just the beginning frames of Law's WS+1,2 hit animation recycled; That toe grab animation that's new in T7 is completely ripped off of Soul Calibur; and I can go on. Where is the experimentation on new content? And not just that The game actually looks worse tech wise in a lot of the character models compared to Tekken 6 which was released 8 years ago.

In the end, we just want something new again... that's all. We have TTT2 to play for this style of gameplay. When I hear the word experimentation I can see that for every other game like SFV, MKX, Xrd, but I really don't see it for Tekken 7. I love the series and in my opinion gameplay wise it is the best among all the FG's. I'll still end up buying and playing Tekken 7 but this current effort is not what I expect from a sequel.
Click to expand...

Like I said I'm 100% with you on this, I also want something fresh with Tekken. It's just not going to happen right now as they need time to make it happen. SF5 was started way sooner that most people think, MKX had was on the drawing board right after MK9.
 
A

AAK

Member
Thomasorus said:
Also when I'm talking about "experimenting" it's not so much creating something 100% unique but adapting yourself to a new public while retaining what makes you special. New characters still feels like Tekken characters but they are different. Claudio can use "magic", Chloe is using a fighting style not fit for her size and appealing to a specific community, Gigas is going into the comics/monster thing, Shaheen is trying to appeal to the middle east public... If you look at Josie and Katarina you'll probably say they're just babes but the goal here is like Shaheen, to put a character from a country (philippines and brasil) that is a potentiel market for the brand and nail it. If you miss it, you can't try a second time, you're fucked. This is why I'm saying they are experimenting here.You're right saying it's a shy attempt but it's an attempt anyway. Tekken is transitioning from a fighting game that was split between classic martial arts characters, complete nonsense like ninjas/robots/bears, and complete invention like Alisa, Lilli and Lars ; to something else that is not entirely defined but will be different. The young audience that Tekken might chase doesn't watch Bruce Lee movies, only saw Jackie Chan in Rush Hour and maybe understands who John Cena is but that's all.
Click to expand...

That's not experimentation as far as I see, Tekken has always been making new characters catering to different markets and diversities. They used to always make games based on real life martial arts and celebrities until Tekken 6 BR where they went full anime with Lars and Alisa.

And as for the non-sensical characters like Bears, Kangaroo's, and mokujin, you can't simply look at those characters in a vacuum. Those characters were always side characters that were basically pallette swaps of other major character's movelists that were combined into one. Kangaroo's and Dinosaur's were basically another variation of King while Bears were another variation of Jack with some Mishima grabs & uppercuts. Those characters were never representative of what a Tekken character archetype was. Tekken always had diverse characters representing different people whether Steve represented Ippo, Marduk representing Goldberg, Xiaoyu representing Angela Mao, Feng Wei representing Jet Li's Once Upon a Time in China series, etc. That was the DNA of Tekken. They have been experimenting ever since with Tekken 6 making different pandering characters and turning previously legitimate fighters like Asuka and Paul to pandering yuri fan service and idiot retards. Regardless, I'm just ranting right now. The point is, I'm replying to your statement here:

Thomasorus said:
They put a lot of effort in Tekken 7 too.
Click to expand...

Experimenting with other nationalities is nothing new to the series and I don't see how Tekken 7 doing that again counts as effort when the main focus should be on evolving their game.

If you look at he popularity of characters like Alisa, Lars and Lili you can guess the series already evolved and the new public probably don't care about martial arts in the first place. But you have to make them play Tekken so they transformed some characters into pretty girls or big monsters to see if it works.
Click to expand...

You know.... THIS IS THE PROBLEM. They're simply trying to either turn a solid foundation of character like Asuka just into an objectified idol sex toy (Asuka T5 Official Art vs Asuka TTT2 Official Art) and hoping that could generate sales. They're not thinking that maybe popularity is waning because it's time the series started doing something new? Just reducing the amount of clothes a female character wears and adding another anime monster into the cast while recycling the exact same system isn't a solution. This is the core issue here. When I hear that Namco is putting effort I can't take that comment seriously since that effort needs to go into making a brand new friggin game rather than trying to make some new character to pander to some new otaku niche.

It's not enough, I'm okay with you on this. For these kind of things you need to take your time if you don't want to kill the series. Remember that many series didn't met success when rebooted (SF3 and KOF99 come to my mind) and because the last games were so full of everything the fans wanted that new entries could not compete. After TTT2 Tekken is in the exact same position.
Click to expand...

Except in this case, while TTT2 is also the definitive Tekken game, it's also by a considerable margin the worst selling game in the series as well. If that's not an indication to start taking risks then I don't know what is.

Like I said I'm 100% with you on this, I also want something fresh with Tekken. It's just not going to happen right now as they need time to make it happen. SF5 was started way sooner that most people think, MKX had was on the drawing board right after MK9.
Click to expand...

MK9 came out in 2011, the same year that TTT2 vanilla came out. Between then NRS managed to make Injustice and a brand new MKX that recycled nothing from MK9. Tekken 7 releases the same year as MKX and recycles almost everything from its pervious game. Namco had time, I don't think that's a valid excuse.
 
K

KidA Seven

Member
AAK said:
Tekken 7's backgrounds destroy SFV. Character models on the other hand...
Click to expand...

Street Fighter backgrounds would look much better without the shitty animated characters in the background. They would be much better if the shitty animated characters just didn't do random flailing around.
 
A

Anne

Member
rookiejet said:
Edit: it is a state of mind you can actually practice being in more (like, basic cognitive behavioral therapy exercises can be surprisingly effective; most of our psychological failing is being on some sort of auto-pilot or ingrained behavior tbh)
Click to expand...

I've been trying to get my state of mind to being more active and focused on taking the time to make the right decision. I actually was dying in situations cause I wasn't confident in my defense, and my play on offense would be sloppy and I wouldn't be confident I could run the tight offense I would need to not explode.

It's been really hard forcing myself to actively think differently but progress is being made :eek:
 
R

rookiejet

Member
Anne said:
I've been trying to get my state of mind to being more active and focused on taking the time to make the right decision. I actually was dying in situations cause I wasn't confident in my defense, and my play on offense would be sloppy and I wouldn't be confident I could run the tight offense I would need to not explode.

It's been really hard forcing myself to actively think differently but progress is being made :eek:
Click to expand...

It's something I want to get better at too. It's why I like watching zen players like Steve H play. He will just sit there sometimes (for what feels like an eternity) and watch you. Often even when he's being pressured in the corner. It's unnerving that level of calm and collectedness lol. It impresses on you a sense of lack of control (even when you're at the advantage).

Also, I can't wait to see what Zib (Vlad) looks like when they add the pilots in Rising Thunder. FrankerZ <3
 
J

jerry1594

Member
K

Karsticles

Member
QisTopTier said:
Nah, you guys all have done way more for me than I could have ever dreamed of.


Also xrd models are more impressive to me than sf5's
Click to expand...
I still hate how Sol looks.

Bison's smile during a match intro makes him look like MODOK.

Xrd looks better right now, but who knows what SFV will look like once it is polished. Biggest issue is hair physics right now. Cammy and Necalli actually take me out of the game sometimes.
 
D

DunpealD

Member
Karsticles said:
This isn't a true combo. They can tech the knockdown.
Click to expand...

EX Psycho sphere into EX Stomp is actually a combo, since it hits the opponent before quick rising and I think I might have tried it too against dummy with quick rise. It's also the only way to combo into a full EX Stomp.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
DunpealD said:
EX Psycho sphere into EX Stomp is actually a combo, since it hits the opponent before quick rising and I think I might have tried it too against dummy with quick rise. It's also the only way to combo into a full EX Stomp.
Click to expand...
It definitely isn't. Try again. Me and two other Bison players here tried to get it to work. No success, and I did it for 30 min because I wanted to believe so bad.

If you know some magic sauce we didn't, please share. The combo in that video is definitely techable with how it went down, though.
 
D

DunpealD

Member
Karsticles said:
It definitely isn't. Try again. Me and two other Bison players here tried to get it to work. No success, and I did it for 30 min because I wanted to believe so bad.

If you know some magic sauce we didn't, please share. The combo in that video is definitely techable with how it went down, though.
Click to expand...

Will try tomorrow, if I can. But considering you have tried him a lot more than me, I'll take your word for it.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
DunpealD said:
Will try tomorrow, if I can. But considering you have tried him a lot more than me, I'll take your word for it.
Click to expand...
Even if you are crazy fast with the inputs, Bison sails right by the player and won't hit with VEX Head Stomp until they touch the ground. It's really unfortunate, because those OTGs are the hypest thing he has. After a few months, we''ll never see them in competitive play. I hope they change Bison so he can do this.

Maybe also let V-Blast always throw a fireball. >.>
 
R

rookiejet

Member
Xrd nailed the voice acting too, it has a lot of personality. (Good voice acting is also what's single-handedly giving Rising Thunder's robots any appreciable charm for me at this point.)
 
D

DunpealD

Member
Karsticles said:
Even if you are crazy fast with the inputs, Bison sails right by the player and won't hit with VEX Head Stomp until they touch the ground. It's really unfortunate, because those OTGs are the hypest thing he has. After a few months, we''ll never see them in competitive play. I hope they change Bison so he can do this.

Maybe also let V-Blast always throw a fireball. >.>
Click to expand...

If Psycho Blast into VEX Headstomp becomes a real combo, then it would become a quite damaging anti air.
 
shaowebb

shaowebb

Member
Damn. Got beat in the literal last second for an MLG TE stick for PS3. Sucks...I use stick on all my shit but I'm just now using the PS3 for fighters since I got it late. I was hoping for a stick on the cheap like that for shmups and fighters.

Anyone know of any decent cheap PS3 sticks online?
 
K

Karsticles

Member
shaowebb said:
Damn. Got beat in the literal last second for an MLG TE stick for PS3. Sucks...I use stick on all my shit but I'm just now using the PS3 for fighters since I got it late. I was hoping for a stick on the cheap like that for shmups and fighters.

Anyone know of any decent cheap PS3 sticks online?
Click to expand...
How much were you looking to pay?
 
K

Karsticles

Member
shaowebb said:
I was close to having that last gem for $60...not sure thats normally possible but thought id ask around.
Click to expand...
I tried to sell my HRAP V3 SA to Amazon for $70, but they felt the art on the top was too scratched up and are sending it back. In terms of functionality, it feels like it did the day I got it. If that sounds interesting to you, PM me. No worries if not.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Tekken 8 | Review Thread
News Analysis Review 2 3 4 5 6
263
21K
Klosshufvud replied
[Gematsu] TGS 2023 official live stream program schedule announced
News
3
1K
ElCasual replied
Tokyo Game Show 2024 will run from September 26 to 29 at Makuhari Messe in Chiba, Japan | Main Visual also unveiled
News 2
98
6K
Thick Thighs Save Lives replied
Coming to Xbox Game Pass: Assassin’s Creed Valhalla, Resident Evil 2, Hell Let Loose, and More
News Platform 2 3
143
9K
adamsapple replied
  • Poll
Rate The Game Awards 2023
News 2 3
107
7K
Shakka43 replied
Top Bottom