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[Seyavesh]

How is he doing that?

shooty swords autocorrects you as it's a special and has very bizarre momentum tricks when combined with j.s as you can cancel out of any of vergil's normals into shooty swords (this is also how you get the instant overhead shit with him that everyone should know about)

you probably see flux go for a shooty swords crossup/fake (you can change this by holding back or not) every now and then by doing jump forward-> j.s-->shooty swords transition (or shoot if he's already got them out) during spiral swords
it looks really fucking weird because vergil will clearly be behind your character as he zooms forwards with the shooty sword anim and then either magically appears in front of you or behind you from being like above your head

 

[Dahbomb]

Yooooooooooooo

My dude bringing in the inertia tech from DMC4 when he just got put into that game. :lol

This is LITERALLY reverse inertia.

It's like a reverse swing yorker from cricket.

 

[BakedYams]

shooty swords autocorrects you as it's a special and has very bizarre momentum tricks when combined with j.s as you can cancel out of any of vergil's normals into shooty swords (this is also how you get the instant overhead shit with him that everyone should know about)

you probably see flux go for a shooty swords crossup/fake (you can change this by holding back or not) every now and then by doing jump forward-> j.s-->shooty swords transition (or shoot if he's already got them out) during spiral swords

shooty swords is possibly the most adorable way to say it lmao

 

[irfaanator]

This is LITERALLY reverse inertia.

It's like a reverse swing yorker from cricket.

god damn the duck at the end of the video. the burn lol

 

[Azure J]

This is LITERALLY reverse inertia.

It's like a reverse swing yorker from cricket.

Well that was fantastic.

 

[Rentahamster]

avatar!

Weee!

 

[supahkiwi]

That cute asian chick is streaming Ultra Street Fighter:

twitch.tv/keikoqvq

 

[ThatCrazyGuy]

Who wants to play sf4!

 

[RedEther]

That cute asian chick is streaming Ultra Street Fighter:

twitch.tv/keikoqvq

She plays on PS3 :/

 

[CountBlack]

Fuudo/Bonchan think no chip KO's in SFV are dumb

im not the only one ayyyy

 

[fader]

Fuudo/Bonchan think no chip KO's in SFV are dumb

im not the only one ayyyy

Top players have opinions, News at Kappa

EDIT: also, both of these players came into SF series with SF4. so when they imagine things on how it is relative to a SF game, they are thinking how it's relative to SF4, not SF.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Fuudo/Bonchan think no chip KO's in SFV are dumb

im not the only one ayyyy

play more jojo's nubs

 

[jerry1594]

That's Jojo's though... such a blatant crutch for the worse player kind of doesn't sit well with me.

 

[CountBlack]

Top players have opinions, News at Kappa

EDIT: also, both of these players came into SF series with SF4. so when they imagine things on how it is relative to a SF game, they are thinking how it's relative to SF4, not SF.

SF 2, 3 and 4 all had chip kills no?
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";169612841]play more jojo's nubs[/QUOTE]

 

[Karsticles]

There are so many ways to counter fireballs in SFV that no chip kills sounds like it will really only affect oki situations, which is fine with me. You can still save meter for a chip kill.

 

[Coffeeling]

I dont know which FG would be more balanced tbh. Maybe Virtua Fighter?

Some system-first game probably - KOF, VF5, Tekken, something like that.

I would say Super Street Fighter 4 is the best version of 4 series.

Doesn't mean most balanced. I mean, all the dirty tech we had in 2012 was already in Super, it just hadn't been discovered yet. Cammy wasn't that bad, she became evil due to AE giving her completely ****** ******* ******** insane buffs to her frame data. Akuma, though?

1: All the dirt from AE2012 except teleport U2
2. st.hk that was still +0 on block, did 100 damage
3. universal safejump off fthrow that happened to be unblockable on shotos (and not a safejump on them, was 4f IIRC)
4. Coward copter
5. EX tatsu did more damage
6. Palm Strike was an overhead so he had a legit high/low/throw with Demon Flip.

People say charge characters were good in Super. They are and were wrong. Super never lived long enough.

Which was the most poorly balanced version of sf4? Ae? How was vanilla?

AE and SF4 probably take the cake. So much bullshit.

Vanilla. Sagat was OP.

Correction: Akuma and Seth were OP. You know why Akuma's demon flip throw has 17 frames of grounded recovery now?
The reason is it used to have the standard 4 of a jumping attack so he could do flip throw => shoryuken. You had a tiny window to do a command grab as your out, I guess.

Also, jab roundhouse loops are fun I hear. Broken game was broken.

sagat
unblockable meaty ultras

The fun thing is that fixing the glitch that led to unblockable ultras is what made the unblockables that came to define SSF4 possible in the first place. You can test AE-style UB setups in vanilla, they won't work and vanilla characters in Edition Select don't have unblockable Ultras.

Im thinking of straight up quitting USF4, at least in terms of actively practicing. Might switch to practicing ST and 3S full time.

Then you got the SFV beta and Yata in a month

This plan. I like it.

#RIPSF4
#AboutGodDamnTime

<3

2012 allowed Cammy frauds to win

Hey, at least he was frank about it unlike some *cough* James "Cammy is maybe top5" Chen *cough* SRK Cammy forums *cough*.

(SRK Cammy and ERyu forums were pretty hilarious stuff. So much downplaying of their character and telling themselves they're not that good. The Cammy players got Alioune to quit the forum because they refused to face the reality of her being dirty as hell)

 

[vocab]

SF 2, 3 and 4 all had chip kills no?

They did.

 

[fader]

SF 2, 3 and 4 all had chip kills no?

not my point but SF4 has hard knockdown okizeme which sorry is only a SF4 thing.

I just don't see an issue with this since opportunities to cash out just don't seem impossible.

Hey, at least he was frank about it unlike some *cough* James "Cammy is maybe top5" Chen *cough* SRK Cammy forums *cough*.

(SRK Cammy and ERyu forums were pretty hilarious stuff. So much downplaying of their character and telling themselves they're not that good. The Cammy players got Alioune to quit the forum because they refused to face the reality of her being dirty as hell)

James is wierd about Cammy... first he says she's not good then he stops playing her because she was "too" good (or he just didn't like her game play style, but w/e)

 

[CountBlack]

There are so many ways to counter fireballs in SFV that no chip kills sounds like it will really only affect oki situations, which is fine with me. You can still save meter for a chip kill.

3 out of the 6 characters announced so far have a V-Skill that counters fireballs. On top of that now you can't chip with fireballs either.

CA's to chip aren't guaranteed either. Daigo tried to use cr.MK ~ CA to chip kill Tokido, but it didn't work because Tokido alpha countered.

When you're facing someone with Dieminion's level of blocking.. this is gonna be an issue breh.

 

["God's Beard!"]

That's Jojo's though... such a blatant crutch for the worse player kind of doesn't sit well with me.

It's a balancing exchange for getting such an aggressive game. When you get stunned by like two 3-hit combos and normals chip you've gotta give something to the defensive player. Chip kills don't encourage better gameplay or reward more intelligent players. It just leads to a solved end game. Instead of chess you're playing tic-tac-toe at the end of the round.

No chip deaths mean that there's a longer application of mind games and mixups and make the game deeper and more intense throughout the entire round. SFV has done a great job of removing brainlessness, and that's what chip kills were. Just like crouch techs and wake up dp fa backdash. It requires very little thought process.

Hopefully the CVS2 players like SteveH start playing V.

 

[petghost]

Yeah no chip kills seems weird and kinda arbitrary. Maybe it will make for more exciting ends of rounds but it's still strange. Personally I'm fine with people being put into no win situations.

Uniel does this too right?

 

[fader]

3 out of the 6 characters announced so far have a V-Skill that counters fireballs. On top of that now you can't chip with fireballs either.

CA's to chip aren't guaranteed either. Daigo tried to use cr.MK ~ CA to chip kill Tokido, but it didn't work because Tokido alpha countered.

When you're facing someone with Dieminion's level of blocking.. this is gonna be an issue breh.

Dieminion level of... "blocking"? Since when is he well-regarded for his blocking?

 

[Karsticles]

3 out of the 6 characters announced so far have a V-Skill that counters fireballs. On top of that now you can't chip with fireballs either.

CA's to chip aren't guaranteed either. Daigo tried to use cr.MK ~ CA to chip kill Tokido, but it didn't work because Tokido alpha countered.

When you're facing someone with Dieminion's level of blocking.. this is gonna be an issue breh.

Cammy - her knuckle passes through fireballs, doesn't it?
Ryu - parry (doesn't matter since chip doesn't kill).
Bison - reflect.
Nash - absorb.
Chun-li - command jump.

I'd say that 5/6 counter them on some level right now.

Reflecting on this more, no chip kills might be the result of Ryu's parry. If parry negates chip, but everyone else can die from chip, it might be too good in the meta. If no one can die from chip, then parry is more balanced.

Also, no chip kills will probably lead to more "hype" moments. Fewer foregone conclusions.

Edit: though if chip kills are out, everyone should have a standing overhead, and DPs should be rare (which seems the norm so far).

 

[NEO0MJ]

I'm with GB on this. His thorough analysis and elegant words swayed me.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Reflecting on this more, no chip kills might be the result of Ryu's parry. If parry negates chip, but everyone else can die from chip, it might be too good in the meta. If no one can die from chip, then parry is more balanced.

I'm pretty sure you can just meaty low short against Ryu and if he parries it you can throw him out of the parry recovery.

Edit: though if chip kills are out, everyone should have a standing overhead, and DPs should be rare (which seems the norm so far).

This is way too large of a reaction to the chip invulnerability. 3s had universal overheads because parries were completely nuts(as high as a 10 frame window plus they left you at advantage whereas Ryu's in SFV is disadvantageous, as well as the ability to cancel to block or throw tech) and you needed a large variety of attack options to keep them from being too strong. In terms of getting the last hit, basic meaty/throw mixups are more than enough.

 

[CountBlack]

Cammy - her knuckle passes through fireballs, doesn't it?
Ryu - parry (doesn't matter since chip doesn't kill).
Bison - reflect.
Nash - absorb.
Chun-li - command jump.

I'd say that 5/6 counter them on some level right now.

Reflecting on this more, no chip kills might be the result of Ryu's parry. If parry negates chip, but everyone else can die from chip, it might be too good in the meta. If no one can die from chip, then parry is more balanced.

Also, no chip kills will probably lead to more "hype" moments. Fewer foregone conclusions.

Edit: though if chip kills are out, everyone should have a standing overhead, and DPs should be rare (which seems the norm so far).

I agree that every character should have some sort of overhead to deal with there being no chip kills. While it'll be hype, it'll be really difficult to close out matches against players with really good defence.

I do understand what you're saying with Ryu's parry. I wonder how different the meta changes with the new characters that are coming out, because right now it's looking mostly RTSD.

 

["God's Beard!"]

I agree that every character should have some sort of overhead to deal with there being no chip kills. While it'll be hype, it'll be really difficult to close out matches against players with really good defence.

With the pace of SFV, I doubt that enough matches end in the traditional "chip range" that you need to go heavy on giving every character high/low mixups. It's easy for the game to stagnate that way as well and you're back to a similar problem in terms of game design.

The fact that crouch techs are gone is enough to make meaty mixups strong enough that you shouldn't worry about defense being too strong.

 

[Karsticles]

I agree that every character should have some sort of overhead to deal with there being no chip kills. While it'll be hype, it'll be really difficult to close out matches against players with really good defence.

I do understand what you're saying with Ryu's parry. I wonder how different the meta changes with the new characters that are coming out, because right now it's looking mostly RTSD.

<3

 

["God's Beard!"]

I think it is a good idea in general to give everyone a standing overhead. Especially in an aggressive game.

The problem is that universal overheads encourage a certain playstyle and as a game designer you detract from individual character designs by adding them. It's lazy, and it reduces the amount of play between characters. The characters as they are have plenty of ways to open up their opponents without homogenizing them. It was probably necessary in 3s, but certainly not here.

As such, everyone was given part of the parry's value: no chip kills. This ensures all characters have to close in to finish the round. If chip kills are still in, then Ryu probably shouldn't be able to parry still.

Forcing a parry was a major part of initiating mixups in 3s. I have my doubts that Ryu's weakened SFV parry would be too good because of one relatively uncommon situation.

 

[fader]

universal overhead seems like a neat idea but I just don't like how it will work juxtaposition to "normal's doing recoverable damage" for some characters since you can mix up between an overhead and a low to take off all that life you've added on block.

I agree with GB, with the damage being high I see a lot of people optimizing damage to where we wont see a lot of rounds play around that mechanic plus dash grab or whiff punishing just seems like perfectly okay mix ups.

 

[Coffeeling]

universal overhead seems like a neat idea but I just don't like how it will work juxtaposition to "normal's doing recoverable damage" for some characters since you can mix up between an overhead and a low to take off all that life you've added on block.

I like the sound of that I think.

 

["God's Beard!"]

I like the sound of that I think.

That idea exists to an extent with characters like Ryu that already encouraged to be aggressive(quick forward dash and easy combo into sweep), but it's not as interesting as you think because light attacks don't cause chip in SFV and heavier attacks have horrendous recovery.

So there isn't going to be a game plan where somebody just dashes up and hits you with 5 lights and does 25% with a standing overhead. Unless of course, that's a design for a super-quick character.

In fact, I'm sure that's part of Nash's higher-level strategy which is probably why he has so many target combos and a teleport.

 

[oneida]

fuck.... *unzips pants*

lets go

this is your best post

 

[CountBlack]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";169613993]It's a balancing exchange for getting such an aggressive game. When you get stunned by like two 3-hit combos and normals chip you've gotta give something to the defensive player. Chip kills don't encourage better gameplay or reward more intelligent players. It just leads to a solved end game. Instead of chess you're playing tic-tac-toe at the end of the round.

No chip deaths mean that there's a longer application of mind games and mixups and make the game deeper and more intense throughout the entire round. SFV has done a great job of removing brainlessness, and that's what chip kills were. Just like crouch techs and wake up dp fa backdash. It requires very little thought process.

Hopefully the CVS2 players like SteveH start playing V.[/QUOTE]

I understand what you're saying too. Since the comeback mechanics in SFV don't seem as strong as they were in SFIV (damage/stun) for basic combos might be higher though) it might change how effective having no chip kills really are. It will encourage more intelligent play for sure, but I think it'll also spread the gap of top/good/bad players even more.

For example, when I played Justin in that set a while back, I noticed that his defence was ridiculous. Opening him up was one of the hardest tasks to do and I was using Elena the can-opener queen. Being able to close out matches with guaranteed chip gave me a solid option when he was in that territory. Now that I can't get that guaranteed chip and can't find a way to open him up.. :dahell:. Smart players won't hang themselves by jumping in or doing really unsafe moves. Would this promote more time-outs if both sides are waiting for the other to do something punishable to get that for sure hit?


Also, Koji/Alex Myers/Poongko confirmed for Evo

 

[Anne]

my internet is awesome when i play against everybody else... you trying to find excuses now even tho you beat me? lol

It could be I'm so not used to SF4 online now it just feels that bad to me, PC netcode is way worse since I used to play on GFWL and 360 wired, or something's up with my PC's connection :v

 

[NEO0MJ]

Hey Anne, do you really think that the new OS in GG Xrd is gonna ruin the game? I'm planning on umping back soon but you have me worried.

 

[Anne]

Hey Anne, do you really think that the new OS in GG Xrd is gonna ruin the game? I'm planning on umping back soon but you have me worried.

In the current state, the game is fine. The OS has been implemented in a way that is definitely super shitty and detrimental, but the game still functions the same as of right now.

If it develops the way it looks like and people actually implement it, high level play is going to start looking absolutely disgusting and stupid :T

Most GG players would slap me and call me a drama queen for this post and say everything is fine and encourgae people to play the game. Atm things are kind of shaky and I heavily question what this will end up looking like. That being said, if you like the game how it is now there's no reason to not play it until there's legitimate reason you feel you shouldn't.

 

[NEO0MJ]

Most GG players would slap me and call me a drama queen for this post and say everything is fine and encourgae people to play the game. Atm things are kind of shaky and I heavily question what this will end up looking like. That being said, if you like the game how it is now there's no reason to not play it until there's legitimate reason you feel you shouldn't.

Oh, OK. It was just that Elph roll that freaked me out. And I know some of the people I'll play will use her >.<

Thanks, love.

 

[Rice-Eater]

I don't like the inability to chip kill either. And needing a whole bar to use your critical art is practically useless because your opponent only needs to save one V trigger bar to V Reversal it and they have all day because of the cinematic start up to every critical art gives them plenty of time to see that it's coming.

I'm OK with regular specials not chip killing, same goes for EX specials. I guess that can be a SFV thing if they want it to be. But I think they should allow chip kill via special moves if your V Trigger is activated. Now the threat is real and you can't just sit on down back while trying to build meter or look for an opening.

 

[Grokbu]

I'm not sure how it works now, but maybe they could make it so that you can't v-reversal after the super freeze has shown up (and after) or something?

 

[Coffeeling]

Oh, OK. It was just that Elph roll that freaked me out. And I know some of the people I'll play will use her >.<

Thanks, love.

Elph roll is evil, but it's peanuts. Think more evil. Think Ky.

Kusoge OS Stun Dipper.

 

[sixteen-bit]

I'm not sure how it works now, but maybe they could make it so that you can't v-reversal after the super freeze has shown up (and after) or something?

Yeah, it would be too strong otherwise.

 

[Tripon]

Somebody donated $500 to the /R/kappa donation drive, so Kogi-kog is going to get to go to EVO. They still need a place to crash in Vegas.

 

[Horseress]

I'm 100% on the "no chip kills" train. It's like Mike Ross said in that video with Gootecks and LI Joe: if you get knocked down with a pixel of life, you can already shake your opponent's hand. That's sooooooooooo lame, c'mon! Work for that pixel!

I don't like the inability to chip kill either. And needing a whole bar to use your critical art is practically useless because your opponent only needs to save one V trigger bar to V Reversal it and they have all day because of the cinematic start up to every critical art gives them plenty of time to see that it's coming.

Not sure if it's that easy to activate it on the very first hit tho, we'll have to wait on see.

About the CA's, I think 3 bars is too much. Make it two

 

[Holy Order Sol]

About the CA's, I think 3 bars is too much. Make it two

That meter builds really fast, I don't see the need for that.

 

[Tripon]

CA are fine. I would argue that you should build up levels for CA or ex moves.

 

[KidA Seven]

oh my god

Daigo's new PV for his manga is god like :lol

 

[CountBlack]

oh my god

Daigo's new PV for his manga is god like :lol

UMEHARAGAA

 

[Grakl]

oh my god

Daigo's new PV for his manga is god like :lol

Daigo has a manga?

 

[Horseress]

oh my god

Daigo's new PV for his manga is god like :lol

They showed it @ topanga now? Damn I missed it