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Fighting Games Weekly | Sept 22-28 | 2 Fast 2 Fuerte: Tokido Drift

W

WesternHeretic

Member
Pls stop calling marvel anime.

Go to the movie theaters. Do you see Wolverine on the big screen in anime form or do you see Hugh Jackman? Do you see animated Spiderman or do you see Andrew Garfield?

Lets be real here. Marvel is mainstream as fuck. The problem was that Marvel 3 came out a little too early, and the marketing team botched that completely. Then they came out with Ultimate Marvel 3 and confused the general public even more.

Absolute disaster. I'm sure you can grab 10 guys off the street and re-did the marketing for Marvel 3, delay it a bit to line up with the movies tie it in and you would of had a big ass success instead of the incompetent crap (marketing wise) that we ended up with.
 
L

Laconic

Banned
WesternHeretic said:
Pls stop calling marvel anime.

Go to the movie theaters. Do you see Wolverine on the big screen in anime form or do you see Hugh Jackman? Do you see animated Spiderman or do you see Andrew Garfield?

Lets be real here. Marvel is mainstream as fuck. The problem was that Marvel 3 came out a little too early, and the marketing team botched that completely. Then they came out with Ultimate Marvel 3 and confused the general public even more.

Absolute disaster. I'm sure you can grab 10 guys off the street and re-did the marketing for Marvel 3, delay it a bit to line up with the movies tie it in and you would of had a big ass success instead of the incompetent crap (marketing wise) that we ended up with.
Click to expand...

6'2 Wolverine confuses way more nerds than conflating the terms kusoge and animu.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
Marvel is only one half of the game, the other is Capcom which is all anime as fuck.

Dante and Vergil? Anime as fuck.

Phoenix Wright? Anime.

Zero? Anime.

The entire SF cast? Anime.
 
C

Cosmo Clock 21

Banned
Cast_of_Wolverine_%28Marvel_Anime%29.jpg


anime

IronManAnime.jpg


anime
 
W

WesternHeretic

Member
Dahbomb said:
Marvel is only one half of the game, the other is Capcom which is all anime as fuck.

Dante and Vergil? Anime as fuck.

Phoenix Wright? Anime.

Zero? Anime.

The entire SF cast? Anime.
Click to expand...

That's why you don't market that side. The hardcore audience will buy it for that alone. (We all know you buying anything with Dante/Vergil in it) The point being is you get people to buy your game. Them staying or not is a result in the actual game play, but you have to get it in their hands first.

And half Capcom's popularity is Street Fighter (I would say Megaman but we all know that n**** dead) and that isn't anime either.

That's the two driving force of the game Capcom and Marvel (Duh it's called Marvel VS CAPCOM). You push the SF characters on the Capcom side, Marvel sell itself (with right marketing). You get people to buy the game....then you pray maybe 10% of the people who bought it become hardcore (your tournament players), 30-50% become big time fans (aka the people that watch the tournament streams).

You do that you build a base, bring in money and open yourself up to Marvel 4 where you can repeat for Marvel 5, Marvel 6 etc... and build your brand. Put that shit on the big screen at EVO now you're building EVO's brand as well. Win-Win for everyone.

Instead.... sigh I know I'm ranting, but holy crap the people behind MVC3 were so fucking incompetent. Now it's nothing more than a niche game that really no one outside hardcore FGC cares about.
 
L

Laconic

Banned
Dahbomb said:
SFII_Animated_Movie_poster.jpg


Anime as fuck.
Click to expand...

That's post Ryu, Ryu though.

I love Alpha 2 as much as the next fighting game player with excellent taste, but c'mon.

Ryu as an iconic character is pretty well cemented in his WW sprite, despite the redheaded stepchild of SF1.
 
V

Village

Member
Dahbomb said:
Marvel is only one half of the game, the other is Capcom which is all anime as fuck.

Dante and Vergil? Anime as fuck.

Phoenix Wright? Anime.

Zero? Anime.

The entire SF cast? Anime.
Click to expand...

I would also vote resident evil for the animu as hell category after playing revelations.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
So who's going to be paying for that marketing? Surely not Marvel/Disney because they got their own shit to market. The marketing falls on Capcom and they probably marketed as much as they could with their budget (Capcom ain't exactly super rich). Plus the timing of the releases was already stated in the contract, they didn't have much to work with.


The main source of incompetency came from Capcom when they drafted whatever bogus contract they signed with Marvel. No sense of foresight whatsoever. They got the Marvel license back in order to make a quick buck with no idea of what's in store for the next 10-15 years. They probably didn't expect that Marvel 3 would get played for 5 years or that there would be demand of updates/new content after the game's release.


That's post Ryu, Ryu though.
Click to expand...
WW/SF2 Ryu is still anime.
 
W

WesternHeretic

Member
Dahbomb said:
SFII_Animated_Movie_poster.jpg


Anime as fuck.
Click to expand...

But that was not why SF4 revival was successful. When street fighter 4 came out 2008/2009 the people playing the game wasn't only the anime community.

It was the SF community, the Marvel community, the anime community, the people that had nostalgia from playing older street fighter from different communities like Sports game (your Madden/FIFA/NBA2k) your FPS (COD, CS), your MOBA communities.

That why it blew up and that's really what saved the FGC. Marvel 3 could of replicated that and blow shit up even more... and then we gut a dumpster fire of fuck ups.
Dahbomb said:
So who's going to be paying for that marketing? Surely not Marvel/Disney because they got their own shit to market. The marketing falls on Capcom and they probably marketed as much as they could with their budget (Capcom ain't exactly super rich). Plus the timing of the releases was already stated in the contract, they didn't have much to work with.


The main source of incompetency came from Capcom when they drafted whatever bogus contract they signed with Marvel. No sense of foresight whatsoever. They got the Marvel license back in order to make a quick buck with no idea of what's in store for the next 10-15 years. They probably didn't expect that Marvel 3 would get played for 5 years or that there would be demand of updates/new content after the game's release.



WW/SF2 Ryu is still anime.
Click to expand...




No doubt it's on Capcom for being stupid as fuck as usual.
 
S

SloaneRisette

Member
WesternHeretic said:
Instead.... sigh I know I'm ranting, but holy crap the people behind MVC3 were so fucking incompetent. Now it's nothing more than a niche game that really no one outside hardcore FGC cares about.
Click to expand...

Well, I mean... it's Capcom. Let alone a Capcom game update that was out 9 months after the original. In this day and age, you can't expect much better from them.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
The main problem is that Capcom doesn't control the Marvel IP. While some of it is their fuck up, a lot of is out of their hands.
 
E

El Sloth

Banned
This conversation reminds of when Hito would go off on people who tried to suggest the SF characters and art aren't all anime inspired.
 
W

WesternHeretic

Member
mbpm1 said:
Moral of the story is we could all be more anime. Let's
not
strive to do so!
Click to expand...

Basically my point. Look even if it is very anime, you don't ever market it as anime. Especially in the United States. Unless your goal is just the anime audience, then obviously no problem with that.

In Japan yea it can and will work, but not here. Marketing it as "anime" just kills everything. People (general population) isn't ready for anime boom, because there isn't an anime bubble.

Just look at this thread.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=885731&highlight=anime

I joke around with anime all the time (I don't actually hate anime), but I find it so stupid that anyone would market something as anime (again unless anime is your only target audience). It's like asking for the death penalty.

Going full circle ... dear anime community. STOP TRYING TO TURN EVO INTO AN ANIME CONVENTION. You're not helping anyone! You like anime games? That's find. Vote your favorite anime game into the main lineup but you turning it into an anime convention is killing the growth, and turning it into a niche "convention". There's a reason your games aren't prime time and Mavel/SF4 is.

P.S If Marvel was truly anime you damn know well it's being played at 10AM. The last thing a non hardcore gamer wants to see when turning into EVO is some dude hugging his pillow. It's a turn off, and makes them think you are WEIRD.
 
M

mbpm1

Member
I think at this point things are diverging even more from Anime and Animu. I don't know enough to call it though.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
I don't think Capcom marketed the game as anime in the West though.

Here is some example of Capcom advertising the game in the West:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpyEUdbLCd0

Seems pretty standard to me. Like they specifically took out any body shot of Morrigan in that clip and they clearly stressed the big Marvel characters (Wolverine, Hulk, Thor, Cap, Iron Man etc).

Hell the only 3 Capcom characters they showed were Ryu (poster boy of Capcom), Dante (one of the most popular Capcom characters in the West, the series as well) and Chris (huge in the West, RE5 sold big in the West so Chris is pretty known by now).
 
W

WesternHeretic

Member
Dahbomb said:
I don't think Capcom marketed the game as anime in the West though.

Here is some example of Capcom advertising the game in the West:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpyEUdbLCd0

Seems pretty standard to me. Like they specifically took out any body shot of Morrigan in that clip and they clearly stressed the big Marvel characters (Wolverine, Hulk, Thor, Cap, Iron Man etc).
Click to expand...

Yea you're right. That 2011 release date hurt though. Avengers hasn't come out, Thor hasn't come out, Captain America hasn't come out.

Jesus.... man this hurts my head. This is worst than Tony Romo botching the snap.
 
M

mbpm1

Member
WesternHeretic said:
Going full circle ... dear anime community. STOP TRYING TO TURN EVO INTO AN ANIME CONVENTION. You're not helping anyone! You like anime games? That's find. Vote your favorite anime game into the main lineup but you turning it into an anime convention is killing the growth, and turning it into a niche "convention". There's a reason your games aren't prime time and Mavel/SF4 is.

P.S If Marvel was truly anime you damn know well it's being played at 10AM. The last thing a non hardcore gamer wants to see when turning into EVO is some dude hugging his pillow. It's a turn off, and makes them think you are WEIRD.
Click to expand...
I actually hadn't thought about that. Maybe it's cos I don't usually associate works with their fandoms.

If I did though...oh boy.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
WesternHeretic said:
Yea you're right. That 2011 release date hurt though. Avengers hasn't come out, Thor hasn't come out, Captain America hasn't come out.

Jesus.... man this hurts my head. This is worst than Tony Romo botching the snap.
Click to expand...
There was no way Capcom was going to be get the same contract post Avengers.

Now with GoTG and Avengers 2 coming up... it's going to get harder and harder.
 
W

WesternHeretic

Member
mbpm1 said:
I actually hadn't thought about that. Maybe it's cos I don't usually associate works with their fandoms.

If I did though...oh boy.
Click to expand...

I try really hard not to be judgmental. The BB GF was awesome at EVO this year. truly one of the best grand finals ever. But do you know how many casual viewers (who have no experience with the anime realm) would be turn off seeing body pillows of waifus or whatever they are called. That shit was turning me off, and I'm a hardcore FGC fan.
 
M

mbpm1

Member
WesternHeretic said:
I try really hard not to be judgmental. The BB GF was awesome at EVO this year. truly one of the best grand finals ever. But do you know how many casual viewers (who have no experience with the anime realm) would be turn off seeing body pillows of waifus or whatever they are called. That shit was turning me off, and I'm a hardcore FGC fan.
Click to expand...

Oh trust me, as a former Brony I know what you mean. I don't watch too many animu streams though, so I didn't know it was like that.
 
M

MiniBossBattle

Member
Dahbomb said:
There was no way Capcom was going to be get the same contract post Avengers.

Now with GoTG and Avengers 2 coming up... it's going to get harder and harder.
Click to expand...

But they are the only ones that "get" the cast of characters; the moveset, specials and feel. I can't imagine another company that could handle the swagger/teamwork like a MvC game.

The only other team based superhero games I liked was what Marvel Ultimate Alliance but most of the people at Raven that worked on that game are no longer there.

Also, as a developer I can't imagine the ROI would be good since it such a crazy big Franchise.
 
D

DryEyeRelief

Member
That Dude John said:
All this talk of anime is confusing me given that marvel is totally anime
mechanically
Click to expand...

Man even Marvel presentation wise is anime as fuck.

-The emphasis on energy blasts/beams. and they're colored to give everyone a signature (Taskmaster is magenta, Doctor Doom is yellow, Magneto is purple!)
-How it cuts to close ups of the characters
-the characters won't shut up during the match (You like that?!)
-The fact that everyone shouts their attack names like they're power rangers
-Roll's theme
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
-The fact that everyone shouts their attack names like they're power rangers
Click to expand...
That's really more of a signature Capcom thing all the way from Street Fighter.

But yeah that is also very anime.
 
M

Mr. X

Member
Evo games are picked after the checks clear.

I guess multiquote is broken on mobile.

Mk9 and Injustice were included their first year before they were available. Does any of the Evo organizers need to spell it out that a publisher helping with the bills before you believe thats how they were added? It worked in the end, yes.

KI is even more obvious. Same year they "finally" run Sf4 and Umvc3 on 360.

Doesnt even matter at this point. Evo grows and so does the costs, sponsors are awesome for wanting to get involved. I just wish they would stop letting people think its a strong scene that gets Evo slots nowadays.

P.s. large amount of people now wait for the lineup to be announced before deciding the games they want to play so yeah, being in evo can inflate scenes sizes

Ssf4, umvc3, mkx before its even available for the majoity, ki, sm4sh (fan of this nickname tbh)

People gonna jump to Xrd because they'll be tired of losing in bbcp, uniel and p4a2 by then and think its a level playing field.

Doubting 7 games.
 
R

Rhapsody

Banned
DryEyeRelief said:
Man even Marvel presentation wise is anime as fuck.

-The emphasis on energy blasts/beams. and they're colored to give everyone a signature (Taskmaster is magenta, Doctor Doom is yellow, Magneto is purple!)
-How it cuts to close ups of the characters
-the characters won't shut up during the match (You like that?!)
-The fact that everyone shouts their attack names like they're power rangers
-Roll's theme
Click to expand...

That theme needs to come back.
 
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