Final Fantasy XV SPOILER THREAD
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Shadow Broker
Banned
Sausage fest the game.
He's a dude and talks/thinks of females. Spoiler alert it happens in real life and all the time too! Not once I remember him saying she's Mine! Or claiming them as his or even using volgur language. He refers to them by name and asks/wonders if he has a chance(Cidny). I don't remember the dialog he had about the dragoon but he was attracted to her. Big deal! What's sad about Iris is that he mentions her and her cooking more then her own brother. If it wasn't for Promto there would be no talk of the female cast period.
Luna was robbed.
What is weird for me atleast is Noctis and the other Bros didn't talk about the female cast. Noctis was going to get hitched to Luna but barely spoke on any of it.
But let's pretend Promto is the worse shit ever while we pretend we're saints. I've seen a special amount BS on the Internet today.
BasilZero
Member
You want wanna look at that dialogue again. They don't imply that prompto likes her for her suit they say "and about that suit" or something like that, and they all make a nervous "yeah...". They're clear as day talking about how out of place it was around them.
Nyx used the power of the old Kings by wearing the ring. He borrowed the power of the Lucian line (Which Ardyn despises). I think that alone puts him in Ardyn's blacklist.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Nyx is supposed to be an Insomnian hero of sorts, so Noctis knew of him at least. Because he's missing after the invasion and the other three corpses are people that sacrificed themselves for Noctis, it's an easy connect-the-dots moment, and also a way of saying "guess who else died for you?"
That was my interpretation, anyway.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
While I can see problems with Prompto's infatuation in the game, mainly because is so poorly written, like many things in the game, in the end is almost harmless. The game has enough problems with woman treatment, that is not even necessary to point out such things.
Suuuuuuure.
Suuuuuuure.
MissDeviling
Member
Finished the game last night, was pretty emotional for pretty much the whole of the last chapter.
Things that pissed me off during the game:
- Gladio always up in Noctis's face and telling him to grow up. Most of the time it just felt random and forced, or insensitive.
- EVERYTHING HAPPENS OFF-SCREEN. Gladio's scar, whatever happens to Prompto when he's kidnapped, Ignis going blind, Ravus's capital punishment.
- Not enough Luna time to really care about her.
- Niflheim's emperor and that other old dude was used in so much of the promo materials but had almost no presence in the final game.
- Not enough build-up to Prompto being an MT or Noctis's line being usurpers of the throne (Izunia), or that Ardyn was of the real Lucis Caelum line.
- Not enough well-polished cutscenes in general. Some of them felt as abrupt as Type-0's.
- Shoehorned scenes from Kingsglaive. Omen trailer one kinda fit so that wasn't too bad, but bit random.
- Should have done more with Ignis being blind. Also, he seemed at most inconvenienced by it. Would have liked to see some more emotion.
- Combat can be disastrous at times, especially with mobs. Moves are telegraphed very poorly and made the game feel unfair.
- Camera and soft-lock need major improvements.
- So many shitty fetch/hunt/find quests. Not what I want in an FF game.
- Some decisions felt like the game was chasing after trends without knowing their functions, e.g. timer on dialogue choices.
Other stuff I haven't mentioned yet, but those are the big ones. It was kind of a reverse experience between this and FF13, in that while this game felt incredibly impolished, I still had a very fun time with it. The opposite is true of 13. I hope FF is never open world again, because I want tighter plot direction and more polish in general. Glad I cancelled my UCE because this game is not worth it. Also not buying the DLC for Gladio's scar and presumably Ignis going blind. That shit is important enough that it should have been in the game. Gladio randomly leaving was especially jarring.
Things that pissed me off during the game:
- Gladio always up in Noctis's face and telling him to grow up. Most of the time it just felt random and forced, or insensitive.
- EVERYTHING HAPPENS OFF-SCREEN. Gladio's scar, whatever happens to Prompto when he's kidnapped, Ignis going blind, Ravus's capital punishment.
- Not enough Luna time to really care about her.
- Niflheim's emperor and that other old dude was used in so much of the promo materials but had almost no presence in the final game.
- Not enough build-up to Prompto being an MT or Noctis's line being usurpers of the throne (Izunia), or that Ardyn was of the real Lucis Caelum line.
- Not enough well-polished cutscenes in general. Some of them felt as abrupt as Type-0's.
- Shoehorned scenes from Kingsglaive. Omen trailer one kinda fit so that wasn't too bad, but bit random.
- Should have done more with Ignis being blind. Also, he seemed at most inconvenienced by it. Would have liked to see some more emotion.
- Combat can be disastrous at times, especially with mobs. Moves are telegraphed very poorly and made the game feel unfair.
- Camera and soft-lock need major improvements.
- So many shitty fetch/hunt/find quests. Not what I want in an FF game.
- Some decisions felt like the game was chasing after trends without knowing their functions, e.g. timer on dialogue choices.
Other stuff I haven't mentioned yet, but those are the big ones. It was kind of a reverse experience between this and FF13, in that while this game felt incredibly impolished, I still had a very fun time with it. The opposite is true of 13. I hope FF is never open world again, because I want tighter plot direction and more polish in general. Glad I cancelled my UCE because this game is not worth it. Also not buying the DLC for Gladio's scar and presumably Ignis going blind. That shit is important enough that it should have been in the game. Gladio randomly leaving was especially jarring.
Luna needed more fleshing out, as far as I'm concerned, that's as bad "female representation" gets in this game, I put it in quotes because I don't feel it's a gendered issue in this case, it's plain bad characterization. Her core motivations are alright in principle. We just needed more context, much more emphasis on Noctis and Luna's relationship to make it believable. It raises an eyebrow on why she would care so much about Noctis to the point of living her life for his sake when we know so very little of their relationship and for all intents and purposes it's not very believable that she would realistically do that by what we saw of their interactions and history. Maybe there's a lot of content that happens offscreen throughout the years, where her living/sacred duty became true love as time went on but we don't really see any of that.
In that sense it makes her a sort of two dimensional character but I don't really see the gender perspective here. She's as shallow as other supporting characters like Ravus/Cor/Emperor. I think it's beautiful when you love someone to the point of being utterly selfless, it's a genderless motivation, but it's not well done and it ends up being wasted potential. In spite of all this I still thought the ending with the logo change to be very well done and I got a little emotional just by the idea and portrayal of it, they are finally together, they both sacrificed themselves for the greater good and now they can rest in peace.
In that sense it makes her a sort of two dimensional character but I don't really see the gender perspective here. She's as shallow as other supporting characters like Ravus/Cor/Emperor. I think it's beautiful when you love someone to the point of being utterly selfless, it's a genderless motivation, but it's not well done and it ends up being wasted potential. In spite of all this I still thought the ending with the logo change to be very well done and I got a little emotional just by the idea and portrayal of it, they are finally together, they both sacrificed themselves for the greater good and now they can rest in peace.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Luna is obsessed with Noctis for one reason.
Engaged to the one true king of prophecy? Life of ease, baby
Engaged to the one true king of prophecy? Life of ease, baby
Before I get ripped apart for whatever reason I am joking
orthodoxy1095
Banned
You can selflessly love somebody without seeming like you have no agency or without it seemingly like your entire person revolves around that person.
This is fairly true as well.
Pretty sure it isn't Ravus by the way but Iedolas Aldercapt. They seem to be the most important stepping stones towards Ardyn's victory/vengeance.
I think there are two things people are discussing. People express that there's a lack of exposition or explanation does affect a lot of characters, e.g. Niflheim brass, Cor,
Jared
I feel like the wires get crossed sometimes.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
I think Luna has also enough problems in her characterization to be pointed out.
And there's the thing she got fridged...
KZXcellent
Member
In regards to Prompto's conversations about how he was attracted to Cindy and Aranea, I didn't really think much of it. Seemed like a natural thing for a guy his age. It also fits in with it being a "Bro-roadtrip" since he's just talking about the girls he likes to his guy friends. Then again, I still can't see people's intense outrage of Yosuke in Persona 4. Going as far as to call him a homophobic bigot.
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
I wish he crushed on Luna so Noct can kick his arse, tbh.
I have to agree here. It seems to me like her duty must have been instilled in her during childhood and then she actually bonded with noctis and grew to love him, the problem is that we just don't see any of that happening, we don't see why she becomes personally invested in it rather than pure duty, we only see the beginning and the end of that dynamic.
outside of luna's fridging and cindy's outfit, people are super overblown about how tjis game "treats women poorly". There's a good deal of pro-feminist parts to this game (not like people ever want to talk about positive things). Sure a good deal of it is side content or world building, but its there.
stuff like sania being a world leading zoologist, The exineris staff being all women, critiques on how petty male ego is in relation to women progressing in industry (npc's talk about how little they feel when their wives get promotions, which is petty), even gentiana (shiva's appearence being... well shiva aside) is basically the main character that gets shit rolling by guilding noct and humanity to salvation and even kills ifrit.
theres more that i'm missing,and im not trying to say the game is a paragon of feminism, i'm saying that being a sausage fest and guys talking about guy stuff and goofing off does not make a misogynistic game.
i'd say this game has problems, sure. but the misogyny angle is way too overblown >.>
stuff like sania being a world leading zoologist, The exineris staff being all women, critiques on how petty male ego is in relation to women progressing in industry (npc's talk about how little they feel when their wives get promotions, which is petty), even gentiana (shiva's appearence being... well shiva aside) is basically the main character that gets shit rolling by guilding noct and humanity to salvation and even kills ifrit.
theres more that i'm missing,and im not trying to say the game is a paragon of feminism, i'm saying that being a sausage fest and guys talking about guy stuff and goofing off does not make a misogynistic game.
i'd say this game has problems, sure. but the misogyny angle is way too overblown >.>
orthodoxy1095
Banned
So pro-feminist. Don't even get me started on how ridiculous Shiva looks this time.
As somebody using a Yosuke avatar, Yosuke is a complete dolt. I think the reason that Yosuke ends up "okay" most of the time is that the writing doesn't tend to imply that his behavior is okay because of some kind of circuitous "boys will be boys" ideal. Karma ends up biting him in the ass on a number of occasions after he says or does certain things and he, like most of the cast, isn't shied away from being shown as a humanly flawed person.
Shadow Broker
Banned
I'm quoting you but you decide if I'm talking to you.
Is it the cleavage? Is that really a issue? Would it make everyone feel better if she wore clothes that covered up? Would it some how make who she is in the game better? What I mean by who she is I mean her as a character and not the cleavage.
For those who are bothered by her cleavage. Does it bother you when you see a woman you DON'T KNOW show off cleavage in their outfits?
Is Cidny a corporate president or is she a self employed mechanic? which is a field you don't see females really work in.
10 years into the future when everything went to shit that boy in the truck said she basically focused soley on her work. She didn't go out and fuck everyone who came along in despair.
If Cindy's clothes bothers you does Gladios chest bother you also? I'm curious.
Unknown One
Member
There were signs, he asked about her in Brotherhood and etc. I don't think Noctis would kick his ass, he would probably ntr his ass.
People focus too much on appearance, Cindy as a character is quite alright.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Does Gladio has a cutscene refelling car's gasoline tank emphasizing his chest, like Cindy does?
The problem is cindy was designed only as a eyecandy. Gladio wasn't.
Oh yeah the pro-feminist city with hot women with bouncing big tits and the X-2 pants.
you mean the scene where there are 5 potential camera angles per shot that are used randomly, many of which aren't focused on boobs?
Lestallum is a hot environment, and those women were working in the scolding in heat suits all day. context is there. I'd be wearing minimal clothing at night too if it was perpetually hot outside.
but sure, twist whatever you want
Relaxed Muscle
Member
The one when she cleans the windshield? Yeah, dosn't focuses on her tits, not at all sir. I wonder why only Cindy gets a cutscene of cleanig the windshield? Um....
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
Cindy is really garbage.
Shadow Broker
Banned
Does Cidny have battle poses that shows off her muscle up figure? While a agree it felt much for me. I wish they included more to the cut scene that showed her actually checking out the car instead of wiping the windshield. It would have been her doing her job which in turn would have kept her in character and less fan service.
Edit: I also agree with your edit.
Oooh please tell me how Shiva looked better in the previous game where she was completely naked or maybe just wearing a thong. You are seriously tripping over yourself in your mindless hate for this game.
And women basically being the biggest or only workforce in the city to the point where men are the housekeepers? Yeah, that sounds pretty feminist to me.
Are you against attractive women?
You are literally the only person who is coming up with such ridiculous statements (And Relaxed Muscle. But well, he is Relaxed Muscle....). And I don't think it's a coincidence you are the most overly negative person about this game here.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Here's a basic answer to get you rolling:
It's a ridiculous outfit for a mechanic. You could redesign her and have her showing cleavage and it'd still look a million times more sensible:
And please, when Gladio is shown off like this, maybe we can talk about that ridiculous comparison:
By the way, it might not have been their intention, but Prompto looks thirsty AF in that sequence.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Does the game change the camera angle and aims at Gladio barechest doing these poses?...
Do you think those poses were made with the intention of being eyecandy? Or just making Gladio a big guy with muscles, which is basically his entire character?
Gladio is basically half naked the entire game, the abs and sculpted chest on the dude are pretty prominent all the time. There's also a scene of Noctis filling up the car and the camerawork is nearly identical. I don't see the camera highlighting any of cindy's saucy features, it's just showing her full body.
Why is this a problem at all? Was her designed made to be attractive to people? No doubts, but so were everyone else's and the skin is exposed to various degrees in all characters, I don't see the moral abhorrence here.
And who's to say her outfit isn't related to her character? She's "married" to her work so maybe her dressing choices reflect her wanting to feel attractive to compensate how little time she has to invest in her personal life. Who are you to judge? Some of my friends dress more "provocatively" because they feel good and attractive in doing so, they aren't any less deserving of respect and legitimacy for their choices. Not only that but she's working in broad daylight in a desert area, maybe a full bodied suit would be too cumbersome.
Whether it's problematic or not is on the eye of the beholder
Why is this a problem at all? Was her designed made to be attractive to people? No doubts, but so were everyone else's and the skin is exposed to various degrees in all characters, I don't see the moral abhorrence here.
And who's to say her outfit isn't related to her character? She's "married" to her work so maybe her dressing choices reflect her wanting to feel attractive to compensate how little time she has to invest in her personal life. Who are you to judge? Some of my friends dress more "provocatively" because they feel good and attractive in doing so, they aren't any less deserving of respect and legitimacy for their choices. Not only that but she's working in broad daylight in a desert area, maybe a full bodied suit would be too cumbersome.
Whether it's problematic or not is on the eye of the beholder
again, not all of the randomly selected camera angles do. I've seen a few that focus on her jacket back, for example.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
A good starter would be that her summon wasn't a harem of naked women in past games.
You don't get to claim "feminism" when your clothing for that workforce looks like that.
Yes, that's clearly what it is. I'm afraid of tits.
Lmao.
Hammerhead must be pretty hot too. Thank goodness Cindy is wearing those clothes. She might burn up otherwise!
Relaxed Muscle
Member
All of the scenes for me, where with her focusing on her tits...
Oh, so your problem is with numbers now. Get real.
Pretty much proof that you are shitposting for the sake of it. "Look how Shiva looks this time around... Errr... She actually looks more dressed than in previous games? Huh... But look, there's so many of them!"
Sad.
oh please, do tell us how the should look after a day in scalding heat in a town that is basically summer 24/7?
I don't like cindy's outfit so stop with that absurdist bs
Relaxed Muscle
Member
The fact that in past games were bad (in most aren't THIS bad, anyway) dosn't excuse for being THIS bad, this time around.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Uh, I never said anything about how she was dressed. I said "don't even get me started on how ridiculous Shiva looks this time."
How ridiculous she looks is this:
ShadowSoldier89
Member
You could also button up gladio's shirt, and give the 4 bros some actual armor to fight in. Bringing logic into fantasy character's clothing doesnt quite work, from either side.
I really dont care what the design looks like from any kind of logical standpoint, onyl design. I dont like cindy's underwear sticking up over the top of the shorts and a longsleeve jacket with that much midriff looks goofy to me
However I love aranea's design despite the cleavage making no logical sense.
My problem with these characters will remain how fucking half baked they are. Luna of course being the worst
How is it "bad", exactly?
She freezes and shatters a demonic male entity (Who is also almost naked, basically only wearing a loincloth by the way).
But hey! Whatever that fits your agenda, right?
Oh yeah. So "ridiculous".
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Is almost time to start quoting anime, avatars, I don't want to, but you are making me do it.
Lights and Waves
Member
You sound so ignorant right now.
Coming from you, especially, that reads like such an irrelevant statement.
Soooo mysoginist!
Lovely Salsa
Banned
If cindy feels confortable wearing that, let her wear that. My only gripe is where she got the implants from
Relaxed Muscle
Member
My SJW agenda, right?
She's basically 90% naked, with her army of almost nude women, making sure to give the male protagonist some warm.
Yeah, but she freezes some dude, so is totally fine. Go along, nothing to see there.
Ifrit dosn't have a summon where he erotically touches Noctis face, while showing his naked body to the camera....in restrospect, that would have been awesome. But they didn't do it.
(Male gaze, you know, and all those things)
ShadowSoldier89
Member
great argument bruh