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Fitness |OT3| BroScience, Protein Dysentery, XXL Calf Implants, and Squat Rack Hogs

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Right now, I'm just following a 6 day setup in alternating days of Upper Body/Lower Body with a 5x5 setup. Wish my gym had a machine for calf raises though, they've got just about everything else I need. Ah well, can always grab some weights and do it the old fashioned way!
 

MrToughPants

Brian Burke punched my mom
I know some of fitgaf hates straps, but im really glad I picked up a set for my deadlifts. For the first time in awhile it feels like my back really got hit, instead of my grip failing me.

Yea I got a pair for RDLs to prevent injury and imbalances.

Almost at 500x5 after 8 weeks with a year off from any kind of pulling.
 

ezrarh

Member
Im having to use them for my work sets now, otherwise I can't grip anything higher than 315. My gym doesn't allow any chalk unfortunately.

My gym doesn't allow chalk either but I sneak in a chalk ball in my gym bag and go down to the locker room and use it for my last working set of 5/3/1. Also, since I've started 5/3/1, I've noticed that my grip has gotten much stronger doing 5 sets of 10 at 50% 1 rep max after doing the final max rep set. My theoretical max has gone up by 35 lbs since I started this 6 weeks ago. I always felt like my deadlift lagged behind considering how it was lower than my squat but ever since I've started 5/3/1, I've noticed dramatic improvement in grip and obviously weight lifted.
 

Petrie

Banned
My gym doesn't allow chalk either but I sneak in a chalk ball in my gym bag and go down to the locker room and use it for my last working set of 5/3/1. Also, since I've started 5/3/1, I've noticed that my grip has gotten much stronger doing 5 sets of 10 at 50% 1 rep max after doing the final max rep set. My theoretical max has gone up by 35 lbs since I started this 6 weeks ago. I always felt like my deadlift lagged behind considering how it was lower than my squat but ever since I've started 5/3/1, I've noticed dramatic improvement in grip and obviously weight lifted.
Yeah, im close to moving on from starting strength, I just wanna eke out every bit of progress I can first.
 

gdt

Member
I would be concerned if I had to take medication daily.

It's not terrible, its just on workout days, I go workout before I go to work. I pretty much stand for 8 hours straight so it kind of builds up. It's not really pain, just muscle aches in my feet (mostly from work, of course) and a bit in my lower back (which is slowly going away because of my running, I think). My left leg...shin area (just to the left of my shin) feels a little odd too after a run/during squats.

I don't haveeeee to (I've never taken any medication that I wasn't literally forced to), but I'm really gonna start pushing myself way harder in my running from now on and want to prevent any more muscles aches, especially since they draggggg at work.
 

grumble

Member
Well, advil's fairly harmless but it does have side effects. It reduces inflammation systemwide, but also hurts the healing and maintenance process of your stomach and intestines. If you have a sensitivity to stomach troubles, I'd avoid it but otherwise it's not a huge deal.
 

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
Im having to use them for my work sets now, otherwise I can't grip anything higher than 315. My gym doesn't allow any chalk unfortunately.


Wait, you can't do a single set over 315 without straps?

You really need to work on your grip strength bud, straps shouldn't be the only way you can do deadlifts. At that point (in my opinion) the straps are less of an assistance piece of equipment and more of a crutch.

Yea I got a pair for RDLs to prevent injury and imbalances.

Almost at 500x5 after 8 weeks with a year off from any kind of pulling.

I'm actually looking to pick some up next week.

I'm getting to the point that I'm doing so much grip work that I'm finding my grip fatiguing enough at the end of my work that it's effecting my output.

Is that deal you got still in effect?
 

EviLore

Expansive Ellipses
Staff Member
There have been some studies suggesting that taking NSAIDs like ibuprofen will interfere with muscle growth. We're talking about significant quantities though; 200mg a few times a week isn't likely to be detrimental to a degree worth caring about.
 

Petrie

Banned
Wait, you can't do a single set over 315 without straps?

You really need to work on your grip strength bud, straps shouldn't be the only way you can do deadlifts. At that point (in my opinion) the straps are less of an assistance piece of equipment and more of a crutch.
Its just a part of me that isn't getting stronger. My grip has completely stalled at that weight, and since I can't use chalk I don't know what else to do. I've tried resetting, I've tried grip work, it isn't helping.
 

MrToughPants

Brian Burke punched my mom
Its just a part of me that isn't getting stronger. My grip has completely stalled at that weight, and since I can't use chalk I don't know what else to do. I've tried resetting, I've tried grip work, it isn't helping.

Have you tried liquid chalk it's clean and leaves no white dust like regular chalk will. Spray it on your hands and nobody will know.
 

deadbeef

Member
Its just a part of me that isn't getting stronger. My grip has completely stalled at that weight, and since I can't use chalk I don't know what else to do. I've tried resetting, I've tried grip work, it isn't helping.


What grip work? The only grip work that ever transferred to the deadlift for me were sets of high rep deadlifts.

Are you using a mixed grip? At what weight do you have to start using it?
 

IceCold

Member
Guys I need your help. I think my wrist is fucked up and I don't know what to do. I noticed this problem when I first worked out months ago for just 1 month and did pendlay rows. Basically, when the weight is heavy enough while I'm doing rows, I feel my left wrist starting to give in and going out of its socket. It's a scary feeling since it feels like my hand is about to detach itself from my arm. I don't know why I have this either since I can't really think of a time where I injured my left wrist. Do you guys know what I can do to fix it, or at least, know an alternative to rows that I could do?
 

Petrie

Banned
What grip work? The only grip work that ever transferred to the deadlift for me were sets of high rep deadlifts.

Are you using a mixed grip? At what weight do you have to start using it?
I have to go to a mixed grip at around 280 or so, why, does that seem low?

Im not sure how id add any high rep deads to SS, seems to go against the entire program.
 

deadbeef

Member
I have to go to a mixed grip at around 280 or so, why, does that seem low?

Im not sure how id add any high rep deads to SS, seems to go against the entire program.

Nah, I was just curious.

I have suffered from grip problems in the past. They come and go. If you keep at it, you will get past it.

SS has you deadlifting once per week right? What are you doing before the DLs in your workout? Can you move the DLs to the beginning of the workout?


Just because you are on a program of linear progression doesn't mean that you will necessarily progress linearly all the time. It will come in fits and spurts as you run into your limits. I would keep at it before trying to add straps, or reset or get worried about it. Sure, the program says you are supposed to add X pounds per workout, but if you don't it's alright. You'll likely make it over this hump and then progress linearly on a weekly basis for a little longer, then something else will hold you back. Maybe getting the weight past your knees. Then you will progress past that. Then it will be your grip again. Lather, rinse, repeat, forever.
 

Petrie

Banned
Nah, I was just curious.

I have suffered from grip problems in the past. They come and go. If you keep at it, you will get past it.

SS has you deadlifting once per week right? What are you doing before the DLs in your workout? Can you move the DLs to the beginning of the workout?
I always assumed moving the excersices around was a no-no. I squat and bench before my deads, though im doing them on both Tuesdays and Saturdays.
 

deadbeef

Member
I always assumed moving the excersices around was a no-no. I squat and bench before my deads, though im doing them on both Tuesdays and Saturdays.

I always go by the philosophy that I put the lift most important to me first, because by the end of the workout, I am gassed, and it is harder to give 100%. I don't think there is any magic to the order of the exercises.
 

Petrie

Banned
I always go by the philosophy that I put the lift most important to me first, because by the end of the workout, I am gassed, and it is harder to give 100%. I don't think there is any magic to the order of the exercises.
Guess I just figured squatting after deadlifts would be dangerous if nothing else. Maybe it really is just time for a new routine.
 

deadbeef

Member
Guess I just figured squatting after deadlifts would be dangerous if nothing else. Maybe it really is just time for a new routine.

Isn't the Texas Method the preferred "next step" after Starting Strength? I don't know anything about it, but I guess I've heard positive things about it.
 

mooooose

Member
Gonna start lifting again tomorrow. Here's where I am at

135 bench
185 squats
185 dead
REALLY bad on rows, like 85...

I always try sticking to a workout and can't commit and I don't understand the whole warm up process and I end up getting completely tired by getting to my working sets or feel like I'm monopolizing whatever equipment I'm using can someone help me out.
 
This HIIT talk has made me think of hitting the road early in the morning, while still fasted, and before leaving home for school/work.

I usually go to the gym at 2 or 6pm but their treadmills are shitty and even if they weren't I much prefer running on the street.

No problem in completely separating the cardio from the weight workout right?
No. I wouldn't do hill sprints the day before squats/leg day though. Otherwise a little HIIT on rest days seems to be fine afaik.
 

deadbeef

Member
Gonna start lifting again tomorrow. Here's where I am at

135 bench
185 squats
185 dead
REALLY bad on rows, like 85...

I always try sticking to a workout and can't commit and I don't understand the whole warm up process and I end up getting completely tired by getting to my working sets or feel like I'm monopolizing whatever equipment I'm using can someone help me out.

List how you would warm up.

And if you're using the equipment properly and paying dues, I wouldn't feel bad about monopolizing equipment. If someone wants to work in with you, you can let them. If they are too afraid to ask, then that's too bad for them. Don't sit there with a snarl on your face, though.
 

mooooose

Member
do 1x5 starting at 50% to 75% to whatever is near between my working set and there but by that time i'm pretty tired to do a full 3x5 or 3x8 working set of my top weight and sometimes by my last set i fail pretty miserably

its a very busy school gym so spending a long ass time on equipment feels like a dick move
 
do 1x5 starting at 50% to 75% to whatever is near between my working set and there but by that time i'm pretty tired to do a full 3x5 or 3x8 working set of my top weight and sometimes by my last set i fail pretty miserably

its a very busy school gym so spending a long ass time on equipment feels like a dick move
I like the Starting Strength calculator myself (I don't actually use it most of the time but i approximate it).

http://startingstrength.wikia.com/wiki/Tools_and_Downloads

Warming up correctly helps a lot. Your muscles are probably getting really tight after the first set? That's the sign for me that i didn't warm up correctly.

If the gym is crowded, as deadbeef said just let people work in. If you really feel bad, ask people if they want to work in if you see them looking.
 

Ashhong

Member
do 1x5 starting at 50% to 75% to whatever is near between my working set and there but by that time i'm pretty tired to do a full 3x5 or 3x8 working set of my top weight and sometimes by my last set i fail pretty miserably

its a very busy school gym so spending a long ass time on equipment feels like a dick move

Is warming up necessary? I found myself failing at OHP when I did warmup sets first so I stopped.

Also, everyone is paying the same amount of money to use that gym, ie. tuition. There's nothing wrong with you using it as long as you aren't wasting time or preventing others from sharing with you. I use the squat rack almost exclusively for about 30-40 minutes every time I go to my gym. IDGAF.
 
Is warming up necessary? I found myself failing at OHP when I did warmup sets first so I stopped.

Also, everyone is paying the same amount of money to use that gym, ie. tuition. There's nothing wrong with you using it as long as you aren't wasting time or preventing others from sharing with you. I use the squat rack almost exclusively for about 30-40 minutes every time I go to my gym. IDGAF.
You're just starting out, ya? Could be that you're still conditioning. Also the bar might be too close to your work set weight. Maybe just get warm with a little 5-10 mins of cardio. Or some push ups or something. I dunno, just suggestions.

But yes, in general warming up is very valuable, to prevent injury and get your body ready for the weight. You're warming up the tissue and you're also telling your brain, bigger weights are coming.
 

Ashhong

Member
You're just starting out, ya? Could be that you're still conditioning. Also the bar might be too close to your work set weight. Maybe just get warm with a little 5-10 mins of cardio. Or some push ups or something. I dunno, just suggestions.

But yes, in general warming up is very valuable, to prevent injury and get your body ready for the weight. You're warming up the tissue and you're also telling your brain, bigger weights are coming.

Yea I am just starting out, so the bar was only about...5-10 lbs lighter than the working weight lol. I guess I can do a few assisted pullups or something to just warm up. I thought you guys were saying to do a warm up set with every exercise.
 

Trey

Member
Yo, Petrie, I feel for you bro. Grip issues suck. I would probably change gyms if I couldn't use grip chalk. That stuff is essential.
 

Kosh

Member
This HIIT talk has made me think of hitting the road early in the morning, while still fasted, and before leaving home for school/work.

I usually go to the gym at 2 or 6pm but their treadmills are shitty and even if they weren't I much prefer running on the street.

No problem in completely separating the cardio from the weight workout right?

If you're doing HIIT, it's probably best not to be in a fasted state.

http://alanaragon.com/myths-under-the-microscope-part-2-false-hopes-for-fasted-cardio.html
 

MjFrancis

Member
Regarding warm-ups, Martin Berkhan of LeanGains:

Martin Berkhan said:
A warm-up is a warm-up. Treat it as such. It should be light, just enough to get the blood flowing and prepare the nervous system for the real stuff. It should never cause fatigue or interfere with your performance in the work sets. All the time, I see people doing sets of 10-15 reps before they get to something that remotely resembles their real set. Which is completely retarded, because you will be fatigued and glycogen-depleted, and your performance in the work sets will be limited for metabolic reasons, and not limited by your actual strength.

The only standing recommendation I have regarding warm-ups is for compound movements: 1-3 sets of 4-6 reps of 40%-80% of target weight for the first work set. Warm-ups for assistance movements is whatever you feel is needed. Personally, I only warm up for squats, deadlift, bench press and chins. If you do these at the start of your workout, which you should, you'll find that they usually get your whole body warmed up, which makes warm-ups redundant or entirely unnecessary for the rest of the workout.

So for someone like Ashhong, if the press isn't your first movement of the day, don't sweat it. Go into the working sets and give those your all. If the press is your first movement of the day simply grab a pair of dumbbells that would suffice as 50% of the weight of your working sets and do a set of 1x5 or 1x3. Or do a couple quick chins. Just something to get those muscles primed and the blood flowing.

I'm also assuming you do something at the beginning of your workout to warm the whole body. A half-mile jog or fifty skips of a jump rope are enough for me, but some people make do more or less. I'm not saying this way is the right or only way but it's worked very well for me.
 

MjFrancis

Member
Guess I just figured squatting after deadlifts would be dangerous if nothing else. Maybe it really is just time for a new routine.
Like you I wouldn't consider deadlifting before squatting. But if you were to switch up programs I wouldn't be surprised if deadlifts became a little easier once you ceased squatting at maximal intensity thrice a week.
 

jts

...hate me...
No. I wouldn't do hill sprints the day before squats/leg day though. Otherwise a little HIIT on rest days seems to be fine afaik.

Makes sense. Thanks!

If you're doing HIIT, it's probably best not to be in a fasted state.

http://alanaragon.com/myths-under-the-microscope-part-2-false-hopes-for-fasted-cardio.html
Nice article, thanks. I suppose carbs intake can help your performance but for now I really just want a cut and I think I'm staying as away as I can from them. Just for a couple of months.
 
Yea I am just starting out, so the bar was only about...5-10 lbs lighter than the working weight lol. I guess I can do a few assisted pullups or something to just warm up. I thought you guys were saying to do a warm up set with every exercise.

The lower the weight, the lower the warm up weight needed. If you are pressing 55 pounds, then try to do 2 sets of dumbbell presses with increasing weight that is below your work weight. So maybe something like 2 10 pound dumbbells for one set of 5, then 2 20 pound dumbbells for one set of 5, then your work sets with the barbell + 10. Eventually you'll just use the barbell.

As the weight goes up, you would need to add another warm up set or two. Take for example a 200 pound squat. Your warm up sets might be 95, 135, 175.

As other people mentioned, the idea is you get your muscles ready for the worksets. I personally like the warm ups because it lets me get into the groove of the move before the heavy weight in addition to the other benefits.
 

-viper-

Banned
What is the proper way to do barbell rows? I see a million clips on youtube and I am confused. What is the best way to keep my back straight so I don't snap some shit up?
 

gdt

Member
Wooot! Pushed a lot harder today on my 1.5 mile run, and I chopped off 90 seconds. Came in at 17:59. I have to chop off two more in 2 1/2 months.

Weight training went awesome too.
 

MjFrancis

Member
What is the proper way to do barbell rows? I see a million clips on youtube and I am confused. What is the best way to keep my back straight so I don't snap some shit up?
I've seen arguments for different characterizations of doing the barbell (and dumbbell) row.

Jim Wendler said:
Barbell Rows

I like the dumbbell version better because it takes some of the back strain out of the movement, but there’s no denying the awesomeness of the barbell row. There are a lot of variations here, and some of them are pretty awful. The key to doing these properly – and the same holds true for any other exercise – is to figure out what you want to accomplish with the exercise. Then, you perform it in a way that accomplishes this goal.

For example, some lifters squat because they want to move the heaviest weight possible in a full range of motion (powerlifting). With squatting, for example, you improve your leverages, take an advantageous stance, descend quickly, etc. By contrast, some people squat to improve their quad mass. This lifter will squat differently.

The point here is to ask yourself why you’re doing this. Are you doing barbell rows to improve upper back and lat strength? Or are you doing them to improve your barbell row? One (the former) is based on muscles, and the other (the latter) builds a movement.

Answer this question and you will never wonder how to do a barbell row again. Like the dumbbell row, the barbell row is great for the bench press and the deadlift.

It took a long time for the bolded to sink in for me. As to the best way of keeping your lower back 'straight' or not out of form in any way I would suggest any variation that has the weight plates resting on the ground between reps. That isn't to say the lower back is resting, it should be tensed and braced for the entire set, but having the barbell touch the ground is helpful at any rate. I don't suggest throwing around heavy weight if your lower back is getting too fatigued, so maybe even a change in weight or pace is in order.

But again, like Wendler suggests, ask yourself why you're doing barbell rows in the first place and hopefully that can help you in the long run.
 

Petrie

Banned
I go to the Burt Flickinger Center downtown. They do. (They say they don't, but they do. Just make sure to not leave it all over the gym)

Hmm, I never considered whether such rules were actually enforced, I'm just a vey "by-the-book" guy. Something to look into.
 

blackflag

Member
There have been some studies suggesting that taking NSAIDs like ibuprofen will interfere with muscle growth. We're talking about significant quantities though; 200mg a few times a week isn't likely to be detrimental to a degree worth caring about.

Yeah but I stay away from them entirely. It may be a bit of an overreaction but the studies show it does impede muscle protein synthesis and that's the last thing I want right after I workout - which happens to be the only time I would need to take advil.
 

Enco

Member
What's the consensus on rows done like this:

bent-over-barbell-row.jpg


I find it much easier and my back can stay much more straight. I go down a bit further than in the pic but I'm not parallel to the ground.
 

deadbeef

Member
Hmm, I never considered whether such rules were actually enforced, I'm just a vey "by-the-book" guy. Something to look into.

I keep it in a Tupperware box inside a large duffel bag with my other gym crap. Before my last set I carefully open it inside the duffel, get some, rub my hands over the box and duffel and then lift. Then I close it up. One set only - heavy set. If you really want to be a good gym client bring a small wire brush to clean off the bar knurling after you perform your lift.
 

jacobs34

Member
What's the consensus on rows done like this:

bent-over-barbell-row.jpg


I find it much easier and my back can stay much more straight. I go down a bit further than in the pic but I'm not parallel to the ground.

That's how I've been doing rows, do people prefer doing Pendelay's to this?
 

Enco

Member
Those rows are easier, don't hit the lats as much. They're not a bad excercise or anything. If you can't do real rows work on your flexibility.
Yea I have to work on my flexibility.

They'll do until I can do the other ones properly. Would rather not snap my back doing something that feels wrong now.
 
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