Support NeoGAF

[SaturnSaturn]

Aaaaah yes, another scripted win as fia does everything in its power for mercedes and hamilton to win his 8th title. also it was a deliberate crash, schumi got banned a entire season for doing the same thing to hill.

the same morons that champion hamilton for being a clean racer and fair and say that schumi was a dirty piece of shit can fuck off now.

 

[Business]

Aaaaah yes, another scripted win as fia does everything in its power for mercedes and hamilton to win his 8th title. also it was a deliberate crash, schumi got banned a entire season for doing the same thing to hill.

the same morons that champion hamilton for being a clean racer and fair and say that schumi was a dirty piece of shit can fuck off now.

Schumacher never got banned an entire season.
When he closed the door looking for a crash on Hill in 94 he got away with it. When he did it with Villenueve in Jerez, irrc he got deprived from his season’s points but it didn’t matter as the crash wrecked him but not Villenueve and so he’d have lost that title anyway.

As for Hamilton being particularly clean or not making mistakes, I agree this has been hailed in the last few seasons but it was only the (obvious) consequence of having no competition and seldomly being under any pressure. When things get tight he does as many mistakes as the next guy.

 

[Airbus Jr]

Horner launches scathing attack on Hamilton​

Christian Horner launched a withering attack on Lewis Hamilton after the British Grand Prix opening-lap incident that sent Max Verstappen to hospital.

In what was a probably inevitable on-track clash between the two World Championship rivals, Hamilton went for a move up the inside of Verstappen at Copse, the two cars clipped wheels and the Red Bull hurtled into the barrier at high speed.
Initially motionless in the cockpit, Verstappen eventually clambered from the wreckage clearly shaken as the Silverstone contest was swiftly red-flagged.
For Red Bull, it became the worst day they could imagine without a driver being seriously hurt. Hamilton, given a 10-second penalty for the collision, ultimately chased down Charles Leclerc to win his home grand prix and cut Verstappen’s le
ad in the Drivers’ standings to eight points.
With Valtteri Bottas third and Sergio Perez only 16th, Red Bull’s advantage in the Constructors’ Championship has been slashed to just four.
Emotions were understandably running high after the race and Horner, the Red Bull team principal, did not hold back in a scathing assessment of Hamilton’s part in the lap one incident.
“It shouldn’t be like that, to be honest with you,” Horner told Sky F1. “Max has incurred a 51G accident. Lewis Hamilton is an eight-time World Champion (seven Drivers’) and he shouldn’t be making manoeuvres like that. It’s unacceptable.

“He’s put a driver…thank goodness the biggest result for us is he was uninjured. He’s had to go to hospital for precautionary checks after a 51G accident, so I hope Lewis is very happy with himself.
“He stuck a wheel up the inside in a corner that you just know you don’t do that. You just don’t stick a wheel up the inside at Copse in that corner in that circumstance. He was nowhere near ahead, it was contact left front to right rear and the speed they’re travelling at, it’s one of the fastest corners in the championship.
“Lewis has more than enough experience to know that is unacceptable. I’m just very disappointed that a driver of his calibre should make such a move as that.
“It’s dangerous, it looked desperate and he’s put a competitor, thank goodness uninjured, in hospital getting himself checked out.
“I don’t care what Lewis says, have a look on your own analysis, draw your own comparison. For me, that’s a hollow victory.”
Red Bull driver chief Helmut Marko had initially called for Hamilton to be suspended for one race and regarding the 10-second time penalty, which was eventually rendered irrelevant by the Mercedes driver’s recovery, Horner said: “It wasn’t much of a penalty really, was it?”
On Verstappen’s condition, he added: “He was conscious throughout, he’s very heavily winded. It’s a hell of a shunt, probably the biggest of his career and totally unnecessary. Thankfully he got out of the car unaided. He’s battered and bruised.”

 

[SkylineRKR]

Hamilton was vile, but what I have the most issues with is the way he celebrates it.

In the end the rules are kind of questionable. You can gently push off your competitor and end up with a 10 second penalty which he can make up as he's much faster than Ferrari and Bottas will let him pass anyway. This means Verstappen can do the same if the situation asks for it.

 

[xrnzaaas]

Hamilton was vile, but what I have the most issues with is the way he celebrates it.

In the end the rules are kind of questionable. You can gently push off your competitor and end up with a 10 second penalty which he can make up as he's much faster than Ferrari and Bottas will let him pass anyway. This means Verstappen can do the same if the situation asks for it.

But Verstappen will get a harsher penalty.

 

[Mohonky]

Horner launches scathing attack on Hamilton​

Christian Horner launched a withering attack on Lewis Hamilton after the British Grand Prix opening-lap incident that sent Max Verstappen to hospital.

In what was a probably inevitable on-track clash between the two World Championship rivals, Hamilton went for a move up the inside of Verstappen at Copse, the two cars clipped wheels and the Red Bull hurtled into the barrier at high speed.
Initially motionless in the cockpit, Verstappen eventually clambered from the wreckage clearly shaken as the Silverstone contest was swiftly red-flagged.
For Red Bull, it became the worst day they could imagine without a driver being seriously hurt. Hamilton, given a 10-second penalty for the collision, ultimately chased down Charles Leclerc to win his home grand prix and cut Verstappen’s le
ad in the Drivers’ standings to eight points.
With Valtteri Bottas third and Sergio Perez only 16th, Red Bull’s advantage in the Constructors’ Championship has been slashed to just four.
Emotions were understandably running high after the race and Horner, the Red Bull team principal, did not hold back in a scathing assessment of Hamilton’s part in the lap one incident.

“It shouldn’t be like that, to be honest with you,” Horner told Sky F1. “Max has incurred a 51G accident. Lewis Hamilton is an eight-time World Champion (seven Drivers’) and he shouldn’t be making manoeuvres like that. It’s unacceptable.

“He’s put a driver…thank goodness the biggest result for us is he was uninjured. He’s had to go to hospital for precautionary checks after a 51G accident, so I hope Lewis is very happy with himself.
“He stuck a wheel up the inside in a corner that you just know you don’t do that. You just don’t stick a wheel up the inside at Copse in that corner in that circumstance. He was nowhere near ahead, it was contact left front to right rear and the speed they’re travelling at, it’s one of the fastest corners in the championship.
“Lewis has more than enough experience to know that is unacceptable. I’m just very disappointed that a driver of his calibre should make such a move as that.
“It’s dangerous, it looked desperate and he’s put a competitor, thank goodness uninjured, in hospital getting himself checked out.
“I don’t care what Lewis says, have a look on your own analysis, draw your own comparison. For me, that’s a hollow victory.”
Red Bull driver chief Helmut Marko had initially called for Hamilton to be suspended for one race and regarding the 10-second time penalty, which was eventually rendered irrelevant by the Mercedes driver’s recovery, Horner said: “It wasn’t much of a penalty really, was it?”
On Verstappen’s condition, he added: “He was conscious throughout, he’s very heavily winded. It’s a hell of a shunt, probably the biggest of his career and totally unnecessary. Thankfully he got out of the car unaided. He’s battered and bruised.”

So Horner wants to stop 'racing' at fast corners in case of accidents?

Horner wouldnt have said jack shit if it was the other way around, its just their job. Protect your driver / team. The cars were reversed just two corners earlier and Lewis backed out despite being even further up the track from the outside. Its a racing incident, it doesnt matter what the corner speed was.

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

All I can say after this weekend is that I’m utterly disgusted by a driver named Lewis Hamilton and the team backing him.

Onto a new weekend where we can hopefully continue this battle in a fair manner. Or have Perez knocking Lewis off the track. Whatever comes first.

 

[Airbus Jr]

So Horner wants to stop 'racing' at fast corners in case of accidents?

Horner wouldnt have said jack shit if it was the other way around, its just their job. Protect your driver / team. The cars were reversed just two corners earlier and Lewis backed out despite being even further up the track from the outside. Its a racing incident, it doesnt matter what the corner speed was.

Not a racing incident in my opinion

Couldve been avoided if lewis hit the brake

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

I guees that Toto's email was ready before the race.

 

[Mohonky]

Not a racing incident in my opinion

Couldve been avoided if lewis hit the brake

Could of been avoided if Max hit his brakes, whats your point?

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

Hamilton just needed practice.

 

[Airbus Jr]

Could of been avoided if Max hit his brakes, whats your point?

Hes ahead why would max need to hit break

Its hamilton that must do that ( in order to avoid collision)

 

[Great Hair]

Hamilton very dirty today. Ridicolous to celebrate like this with Verstappen in the hospital.

When Romain Grosjean could have lost his life, guess which clown(s) celebrated on the podium of that race? You are all forgetting what an twat Max can be. The only thing one can accuse Ham for, for someone with 7 titles that was a dumb move, decision to "cut" a fast corner.

After the Styrian Grand Prix, Max Verstappen was criticised by race director Michael Masi for slowing down on the start finish to perform a celebratory burnout. Max Verstappen will cause a "massive accident sooner or later" if he does not change his driving tactics, Ferrari driver Kimi Raikkonen says.

VIDEO: Did this 2015 crash trigger FIA's warning to Verstappen?

A 2015 finish line crash at the Red Bull Ring may have been on the FIA's Michael Masi's mind, when he told Red Bull that Max Verstappen's celebratory burnout wouldn't be tolerated..

racingnews365.com

Max Verstappen will cause huge accident, says Kimi Raikkonen

Max Verstappen will cause a "massive accident" if he does not change his driving tactics, Ferrari driver Kimi Raikkonen says.

www.bbc.com

 

[Business]

Hamilton just needed practice.

I think still images don’t do the move justice. Hamilton is clearly understeering away from the apex. There was no way he was taking the corner at normal speed from where he was on the inside without going wide and into Verstappen.

 

[MastaKiiLA]

Racing incident. I didn't agree with the penalty, but can understand how the stewards arrived at that conclusion. 2 drivers fighting for the same real estate will end in disaster. Neither driver wanted to concede the corner. The guy on the outside always runs the higher risk in that situation. Lewis could've back off earlier. Max could've taken a wider line like Charles. Neither did. The guy on the outside got the worst of it. Life moves on.

Max will want to consider collecting the points in future duels, especially if he has another cozy lead in the points. There's no need to go for broke when you're 33 points ahead in a quicker car that just handily won the sprint the day before. Lewis being down 33 points is going to have to take more chances. It's a recipe for disaster. Alonso, Schumacher, and Hamilton would've all taken the wider line into Copse there. Live to fight another day. Losing 7 points is better than losing 25. We saw this at T1 in Barcelona. If you have a capable car, opportunity will present itself again, perhaps even in the same race.

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

I think still images don’t do the move justice. Hamilton is clearly understeering away from the apex. There was no way he was taking the corner at normal speed from where he was on the inside without going wide and into Verstappen.

Verstappen relied on Hamilton making the apex. If Hamilton makes the corner there they both continue. Hamilton misjudged the line, understeers off into Verstappen who crashes. And ultimately ends up with the 10-second penalty. That's literally what happened this incident. Just like Russell misjudged it yesterday and got a penalty for the incident with Sainz.

 

[Jorav]

I think its a racing incident, both drivers at fault. Max took the line as if he's the only one there, Ham took the line expecting Max to give him space. Max has the point advantage and couldve given him space, knowing that he had a fair chance of reclaiming the positon. But Max is being Max and not yielding. Ham could've also braked but once you commit, you commit. This is over in milliseconds so its hard to react, we have the advantage of being armchair analysts and look it frame by frame. Isn't the first and wont be the last incident of this type.

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

I think its a racing incident, both drivers at fault. Max took the line as if he's the only one there, Ham took the line expecting Max to give him space. Max has the point advantage and couldve given him space, knowing that he had a fair chance of reclaiming the positon. But Max is being Max and not yielding. Ham could've also braked but once you commit, you commit. This is over in milliseconds so its hard to react, we have the advantage of being armchair analysts and look it frame by frame. Isn't the first and wont be the last incident of this type.

It was not deemed a racing incident. The stewards gave Hamilton a penalty so it's his fault.

 

[Jorav]

It was not deemed a racing incident. The stewards gave Hamilton a penalty so it's his fault.

I know that, but people are jumping up and down to inforce race-bans and a 10 sec penalty was soft. People are quick to forget Max's antics in the past.

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

I know that, but people are jumping up and down to inforce race-bans and a 10 sec penalty was soft. People are quick to forget Max's antics in the past.

Might as well mention Alex Albon and review Hamilton's antics. but it holds no water to the crash of Sunday and vice versa.

 

[Airbus Jr]

 

[xrnzaaas]

F1 reveals Monza schedule including 18-lap sprint race

www.autosport.com

A Monza sprint should be more exciting with the typical first lap mayhem.

 

[Airbus Jr]

 

[Great Hair]

youtube algorithm recommendation
add: max vs ham spanish GP (first corner)
edit1: maybe he locked up and cut the corner?

he is.

 

[DarkestHour]

When Romain Grosjean could have lost his life, guess which clown(s) celebrated on the podium of that race? You are all forgetting what an twat Max can be. The only thing one can accuse Ham for, for someone with 7 titles that was a dumb move, decision to "cut" a fast corner.

Grosjean was OK and Max didn't cause Grosjean to slam in to the wall. Hope that helps you understand the difference. Also your linked "source" to your argument is laughable.

 

[Airbus Jr]

Turns out one of mercedes admin is Bottas

 

[massivekettle]

It was not deemed a racing incident. The stewards gave Hamilton a penalty so it's his fault.

The fact that they've only given him a 10sec time penalty suggests that stewards aren't entirely convinced this was 100% Hamilton's fault. Read the stewards report: "predominantly at fault", not "totally at fault".

At the end of the day, Verstappen kept assuming Hamilton would yield (as he had done in Spain and Imola, and in prior seasons). Had he played the percentages and given Lewis more room (as Lewis would have done had roles been reversed), he probably would have finished 2nd if not 1st as Mercedes wasn't too hot on the medium tyres.

Might as well mention Alex Albon and review Hamilton's antics. but it holds no water to the crash of Sunday and vice versa.

Brazil 2019, for which Hamilton apologised on the spot before even seeing the stewards. Austria 2020 was a racing incident, IMO. Albon should have gone for a different overtaking spot considering the huge tyre delta he had over both Mercedes thanks to the safety car.

 

[Business]

The fact that they've only given him a 10sec time penalty suggests that stewards aren't entirely convinced this was 100% Hamilton's fault. Read the stewards report: "predominantly at fault", not "totally at fault".

At the end of the day, Verstappen kept assuming Hamilton would yield (as he had done in Spain and Imola, and in prior seasons). Had he played the percentages and given Lewis more room (as Lewis would have done had roles been reversed), he probably would have finished 2nd if not 1st as Mercedes wasn't too hot on the medium tyres.



Brazil 2019, for which Hamilton apologised on the spot before even seeing the stewards. Austria 2020 was a racing incident, IMO. Albon should have gone for a different overtaking spot considering the huge tyre delta he had over both Mercedes thanks to the safety car.

I think it’s fair to say Hamilton was more at fault than the other driver on all 3 incidents, specially clumsy on the 2 vs Albon.
In Silverstone Verstappen gave him more than enough physical room on the inside but Hamilton tried to hold it from there at normal speed and he was always gonna understeer into Verstappen. Looking at the incident in isolation I think the penalty he was given is fair, but I can see how Red Bull are not happy at Hamilton gaining massive advantage in the championship from it, he was lucky the red flag gave him a free repair, there’s also some more luck in Imola… but that’s racing and in the long run luck will tend to even out.

 

[massivekettle]

I think it’s fair to say Hamilton was more at fault than the other driver on all 3 incidents, specially clumsy on the 2 vs Albon.
In Silverstone Verstappen gave him more than enough physical room on the inside but Hamilton tried to hold it from there at normal speed and he was always gonna understeer into Verstappen. Looking at the incident in isolation I think the penalty he was given is fair, but I can see how Red Bull are not happy at Hamilton gaining massive advantage in the championship from it, he was lucky the red flag gave him a free repair, there’s also some more luck in Imola… but that’s racing and in the long run luck will tend to even out.

Stewards said that Hamilton was 'predominantly' at fault in their official verdict of the Max/Lewis incident, suggesting Max was partly at fault. I think Verstappen could have definitely done more to avoid the incident, similar to how Lewis yielded multiple times in the past. Had roles been reversed, I imagine Hamilton would have yielded and tried to fight back later in the race.

As for the 2 Albon incidents, the Brazil one is clear cut (and Hamilton apologised even before seeing the stewards). The Austria incident is less clear. Hamilton was on worn and cold hard tyres whilst Albon was on fresh softs. Hamilton understeered into T4 (which is very easy to do with cold and worn tyres) and Albon took a much tighter line on exit, as if he didn't expect Hamilton to be there. Other drivers (IIRC, either Leclerc, Norris or Perez) were able to make those moves stick around the outside without causing contact because they left enough room to the driver on the inside. Ultimately, Albon was just too damn impatient trying to overtake Hamilton; he had a huge tyre advantage over both Mercedes and could have just bided his time instead of forcing a difficult overtake around the outside at T4 (which is very treacherous as we saw this season).

 

[Business]

As for the 2 Albon incidents, the Brazil one is clear cut (and Hamilton apologised even before seeing the stewards). The Austria incident is less clear. Hamilton was on worn and cold hard tyres whilst Albon was on fresh softs. Hamilton understeered into T4 (which is very easy to do with cold and worn tyres) and Albon took a much tighter line on exit, as if he didn't expect Hamilton to be there. Other drivers (IIRC, either Leclerc, Norris or Perez) were able to make those moves stick around the outside without causing contact because they left enough room to the driver on the inside

All due respect but don’t you see most of what you wrote here is irrelevant? You keep insisting HAM apologised in Brazil as if it mattered, and for Austria all this cold and worn tyres stories could only explain why the accident happened, but not make HAM innocent. The bolded is specially unbelievable suggesting Albon who was at the very edge outside should have somehow left more room to Hamilton on the inside. I mean…

 

[Airbus Jr]

 

[Airbus Jr]

I’d do exactly the same move on Verstappen again – Hamilton​

2021 Hungarian Grand Prix​

Posted on
29th July 2021, 18:23 | Written by Keith Collantine
Lewis Hamilton says he would change nothing about the overtaking move he made on Max Verstappen at the British Grand Prix which led to his rival crashing out of the race.


The stewards are considering a request from Red Bull to review their decision to penalise Hamilton 10 seconds for the collision between the two championship contenders. Hamilton went on to win the race after serving the penalty.

He sees no reason to change his approach in similar circumstances. “In terms of the move I would do the move exactly the way I did it last,” Hamilton said.
“In terms of how I’ve reviewed it and analysed from all my experience – and my experience obviously with over the years speaks for a lot – I wouldn’t change it.”
The stewards ruled Hamilton was “predominantly” to blame for the contact between the pair, and also gave him two penalty points on his licence. The Mercedes driver was reluctant to expand on the approach he took when he tried to pass Verstappen on the inside of Copse corner on the first lap of the race.

“I definitely can explain, but I’m not going to explain,” said Hamilton. “I’ve been racing 20… God knows how many years. I know how to navigate through corners and overtaking manoeuvres so I won’t waste my energy trying to explain it. It’s definitely going to be difficult for people to fully understand.”

So he thinks if he can get a away with just a 10s penalty from taking out Max he will do that again

 

[Great Hair]

 

[xrnzaaas]

Damn Max can't catch a break even from the official interviews guy. RBR got played in the qualy and unless something unexpected happens (like the mega storm predicted for these areas for tomorrow) it's looking like an easy Merc win scenario.

Daniel and Yuki disappointed again in qualifying. They're both dragging down their teams. Mick also with a crappy weekend ruining his qualy with the FP3 crash.

 

[Jorav]

Yep Dan Ric disappointing given his experience. I wonder if there is a results clause in his multi year contract? Yuki needed another year in F2 but that engine RB engine deal probably dictated it. Max should take out Ham on the first lap and cruise to victory. The shit-storm that would create would be great to witness.

 

[Fox Mulder]

Bottas is such a great teammate. Took out both Redbulls and Norris in turn one.

 

[Peter303]

Bottas is such a great teammate. Took out both Redbulls and Norris in turn one.

Bottas is an idiot.

 

[Airbus Jr]

Bottas is a disgusting driver

He should be banned for the next race

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

How can a Finn not manage to get around one corner in the wet? Should instantly lose his citizenship.

 

[Can't decide]

George Russell has one luck, bad luck.

 

[Can't decide]

An Alpine win and both Williams in the points, nice.

 

[Fox Mulder]

Bottas only gets a 5 grid place penalty for Spa.

He only took out both Redbulls and Norris, giving Mercedes a huge points and race advantage for the second straight race. Redbull also has engine damage that will cost them grid penalties later.

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

Always great to see a first time winner.

Ocon and Vettel owe Fernando big time. What an incredible defensive race from him.

 

[Can't decide]

Bottas only gets a 5 grid place penalty for Spa.

He only took out both Redbulls and Norris, giving Mercedes a huge points and race advantage for the second straight race. Redbull also has engine damage that will cost them grid penalties later.

I would have thought a back of the grid penalty for sure, he might have also been responsible for the mess behind him too as people tried to avoid his carnage, so 5 cars retired because of him. If Mercedes/Lewis win a title this year, it will be because they bashed their opponents off the circuit.

Alonso won the race for Ocon today, I bet he had the biggest shit eating grin while holding Hamilton up.

 

[FunkMiller]

Amazing race.

Alonso was on another level with that defending. Possibly some of the greatest driving I’ve ever seen in 25 years of watching F1.

Congrats to Bottas for fucking everyone else to help his team mate, like a good little lap dog.

 

[Great Hair]

Ocon and Vettel owe Fernando big time. What an incredible defensive race from him.

 

[Fox Mulder]

Would be hilarious if Mercedes swaps Bottas for Russell and avoids the grid penalty.

 

[Airbus Jr]

Alonso is incredible simple as that

I wish he had decent car to fight hamilton

That was very sad to see him struggle to hold hamilton with that poor car

 

[xrnzaaas]

Great result from Alpine, both from Ocon who managed to keep the lead and from Alonso to keep Hamilton behind him for so long. Nice to see Williams scoring points with both cars, but I'm pretty sure Russell will be unhappy about being behind his teammate.

In other news I'm pissed Hamilton got lucky again and took the lead in the championship. Bottas might've taken a 5 place penalty, but he's helped Hamilton immensely by taking out both Red Bull's from the fight for the win in the race. Hopefully that's enough of bad luck for them and they'll have a chance to fight in Spa.

 

[Airbus Jr]

Great result from Alpine, both from Ocon who managed to keep the lead and from Alonso to keep Hamilton behind him for so long. Nice to see Williams scoring points with both cars, but I'm pretty sure Russell will be unhappy about being behind his teammate.

In other news I'm pissed Hamilton got lucky again and took the lead in the championship. Bottas might've taken a 5 place penalty, but he's helped Hamilton immensely by taking out both Red Bull's from the fight for the win in the race. Hopefully that's enough of bad luck for them and they'll have a chance to fight in Spa.

Im afraid has nothing to do with luck

His car is just too powerful

Guy start last and almost win the race if it werent for Alonso heroic defending skills

Thats how pathetic the gap is between merc car and the others ( aside from red bull)