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[AZ Greg]

What 'excuse'? Why are Forza's wonky physics and crashes ignored? Isn't it all about consistency? This doesn't look realistic to me.

1.) The excuse that a non-locked 60FPS, screen tearing, and any other issues, are fine because of what the game is pushing.

2.) Can you quote where I have defended Forza? This isn't about Forza for me. Don't be so quick on the defensive. I've simply stated my frustration with what this GT is compared to the standards of the past iterations and the acceptance (settling?) from the fanbase.

 

[CadetMahoney]

yes you're right... looks like you can't control the replay too (rewind, fast forward, etc.)

hmm I love messing with all that.

 

[Shaneus]

You won't, I promise. Game is worth the purchase for a lap with the Mercedes SLS on the Ring alone. Fucking ridiculous! Gran Turismo Nürburgring is so superior to all other sims.

I know, I can't wait. There's something that's so fucking zen about cruising around the 'ring in any of the other games it's in (I seem to remember enjoying it more in PGR4). I find it relaxing. Dial in 1 lap and I'm in a state of bliss for hours later.

Is that Merc easily unlockable?

 

[Ranger X]

GT5 wins the driving feel/physics and the beauty of the cars (premium ones).

Forza 3 wins everything else!!

 

[XiaNaphryz]

2.) Can you quote where I have defended Forza?

If you're not on one side, you're automatically on the other. ;P

 

[TheExodu5]

1.) The excuse that a non-locked 60FPS, screen tearing, and any other issues, are fine because of what the game is pushing.

2.) Can you quote where I have defended Forza? This isn't about Forza for me. Don't be so quick on the defensive. I've simply stated my frustration with what this GT is compared to the standards of the past iterations and the acceptance (settling?) from the fanbase.

There's no excuse regardless of what it's pushing. It should be pushing less to maintain a stable framerate.

 

[Windom Earle]

I know, I can't wait. There's something that's so fucking zen about cruising around the 'ring in any of the other games it's in (I seem to remember enjoying it more in PGR4). I find it relaxing. Dial in 1 lap and I'm in a state of bliss for hours later.

Is that Merc easily unlockable?

I don't know if relaxing is the right word, it's pretty brutal and that's what the track is known for after all (green hell). The car is probably hard to unlock, it's on the game's cover after all, but you get to drive it in the AMG Driving School (2) relatively early.

 

[oatmeal]

Well I waited it out, and decided to go with Forza!

ORDERED

 

[TEH-CJ]

Well I waited it out, and decided to go with Forza!

ORDERED

Yea Forza is the way to go. It cant match GT5 physics or presentation but everything else is superb.

Until they patch gt5 with better sound effects, I wont be playing it.

 

[scandisk_]

PHYSICS IS GT5's lastname

 

[oatmeal]

Yea Forza is the way to go. It cant match GT5 physics or presentation but everything else is superb.

Until they patch gt5 with better sound effects, I wont be playing it.

I enjoyed Prologue, I put a decent amount of hours into it. It looked great, it had a great presentation (very classy), but it's just very slow and...it's not as FUN.

I'm by no means a car guy, so while I can appreciate what GT5 is doing for the genre, I think I will stick with a game that forgoes a little simulation for a little extra flair.

 

[Firewire]

Yea Forza is the way to go. It cant match GT5 physics or presentation but everything else is superb.

Until they patch gt5 with better sound effects, I wont be playing it.

GT5 kicks the shit out of Forza physics. If you don't want to play it then fuck off, nobody really cares about your supposed sound impressions.

 

[Trickster]

GT5 kicks the shit out of Forza physics. If you don't want to play it then fuck off, nobody really cares about your supposed sound impressions.

This is the Forza 3 vs GT5 topic, not the GT5 OT :lol

 

[FStop7]

I'm still in the license tests but so far GT feels markedly better in terms of physics. Much more challenging than Forza. Graphically I prefer GT, but I can see where it would come down to personal preference on that. PD came through and delivered.

 

[Firewire]

This is the Forza 3 vs GT5 topic, not the GT5 OT :lol

yeah i fucked that up....:/

 

[ghst]

if only there was a decent quota of vocal iracing fanatics on gaf to come and put this thread to bed.

 

[Len Dontree]

if only there was a decent quota of vocal iracing fanatics on gaf to come and put this thread to bed.

PGR4 fans gave it the ol' college try recently, but regardless, us-vs-themism will forever be a staple of human interaction, mefears.

 

[Stinkles]

yeah i fucked that up....:/

:lol

 

[Firewire]

PGR4 fans gave it the ol' college try recently, but regardless, us-vs-themism will forever be a staple of human interaction, mefears.

pgr4 isn't really a sim in my book, still an awesome game though.

 

[Windom Earle]

a little extra flair.

Good luck with that... Forza has always felt a bit soulless to me. Same goes for Prologue though. Glorified demo, etc.

 

[Firewire]

:lol

:lol

 

[G_Berry]

:lol

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[duk]

it's just a game ppl sheesh :lol

 

[Firewire]

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

:lol :lol :lol

 

[TEH-CJ]

GT5 kicks the shit out of Forza physics. If you don't want to play it then fuck off, nobody really cares about your supposed sound impressions.

can you fucking read or what dipshit?

"It can't match GT5 physics or presentation"

 

[adelante]

pgr4 isn't really a sim in my book, still an awesome game though.

Lol I doubt anyone here claimed it was one and it certainly wasn't the reason why some of us brought that game up

 

[Glowingmonx]

Motorcycles!

 

[RustyNails]

can you fucking read or what dipshit?

"It can't match GT5 physics or presentation"

Now that kind of language is uncalled for.

 

[gillty]

pgr4 isn't really a sim in my book, still an awesome game though.

If you are saying you might consider PGR4 a sim, then maybe you shouldn't post about sim racers ever again... :lol

PGR4 is not a sim whatsoever.

 

[Insertia]

Standard cars in GT5 look like the average car in Forza 3.

Premium cars are just...holy shit. No other racer comes close to the detail. There's no comparison. Period. I can't believe PD actually put that much time into models that I'll probably never drive.

 

[VGChampion]

If you are saying you might consider PGR4 a sim, then maybe you shouldn't post about sim racers ever again... :lol

PGR4 is not a sim whatsoever.

He's saying it's not a sim racer but he enjoys it.

 

[Poimandres]

Standard cars in GT5 look like the average car in Forza 3.
Premium cars are just...holy shit. No other racer comes close to the detail. There's no comparison. Period. I can't believe PD actually put that much time into models that I'll probably never drive.

Really?.... Really?!

 

[supermackem]

Standard cars in GT5 look like the average car in Forza 3.

Premium cars are just...holy shit. No other racer comes close to the detail. There's no comparison. Period. I can't believe PD actually put that much time into models that I'll probably never drive.

What do you mean by average car, there isnt levels of car models in forza is there? i thought they were all done to the same level.

 

[enzo_gt]

Standard cars in GT5 look like the average car in Forza 3.

Premium cars are just...holy shit. No other racer comes close to the detail. There's no comparison. Period. I can't believe PD actually put that much time into models that I'll probably never drive.

Sometimes you can just sniff out the people who only took a glancing look at Forza 3 before commenting. Sorry dude, but this is just wrong. More polygons and better lighting on the cars in Forza 3 makes them highly and quite visibly superior to GT5s standard cars. That goes without saying.

And why the hell are we still talking about PGR4?

 

[Yoritomo]

Funny thing. Now that I've played both.

Forza 3 > GT5 with regards to graphics but GT5 > Forza 3 with regards to vehicle dynamics and gameplay.

The track detail and vehicle rendering while actually playing the game aren't as good as Forza 3, yet you have 16 vehicles on track at once. I prefer the 16 vs 8 cars on track. The vehicle shadows look really really bad in GT5 while playing. Photo mode is another story.

 

[skybaby]

Man can you imagine the shitstorm if forza3 had premium and standard cars? :lol
Anyway, people at Turn10 must be laughing right now, I remember someone saying that 1000 cockpits wasn't doable...

 

[flyinpiranha]

That's not interesting, it's depressing.

Ahh well, I guess I'll find out tomorrow if I can deal with it or not. I f*ck*ng hate tearing though.

I absolutely hate tearing myself and after 2 hours of playing I can say I haven't noticed it at all. In fact I was looking for it after reading the threads. I just wonder if by chance it's where the horizon breaks or something. But honestly, it's one of my most hated things. In fact I don't notice it in GT5 but I really can notice the pixelated shadows.

I haven't really experimented with everything in GT5 obviously but after a couple hours and at least 5 seasons deep in Forza 3 I can really say they are equally matched (to me) graphically. I don't know if it was my low expectations of F3 (did not enjoy F2) or my high expectations of GT5 but they really are equally beautiful games.

I expect to see more 'issues' in GT5 once I really get into the meaty stuff though because right now it's mainly standard cars and such. I did race a snow rally race with a premium in arcade and that was fucking magical. I do think I'll enjoy GT5 more than F3 because the career mode in F3 never made me feel like I was going anywhere ... just getting levels and I think after 30 or 40 you stop even getting cars for a level earned (don't remember, haven't played in a while).

It really makes me respect what T10 did though. All the detractors really have nothing to say because while GT5 delivered, it wasn't the "blow the doors off of Forza" we were all expecting. I think the features in GT5 are immense and it makes me hope Forza 4 will step it up and not go the Kinect route.

 

[shinnn]

What do you mean by average car, there isnt levels of car models in forza is there? i thought they were all done to the same level.

don't know what he means by "average".. but let's clarify this shit

all cars in FM3 have 4 levels of modeling..

1 - AI car in gameplay (worst)
2 - your car in gameplay
3 - photomode - improves your car
4 - car selection/"screen saver" (best)

Cars in replay mode have the same model as in gameplay. That's it.

 

[BobsRevenge]

Lens of Truth did a comparison of sorts. I don't know if anyone posted it yet, but here it is:

http://www.lensoftruth.com/?p=24784

The tearing is pretty hard to notice at 60fps, and there isn't much of it. And it only seems to dip below 60 when you're kicking up a bunch of dust.

I mean, the lighting in GT5 blows Forza's away in the video they have on there. Its not even close, really. It makes a huge difference.

 

[TheOddOne]

I absolutely hate tearing myself and after 2 hours of playing I can say I haven't noticed it at all. In fact I was looking for it after reading the threads. I just wonder if by chance it's where the horizon breaks or something. But honestly, it's one of my most hated things. In fact I don't notice it in GT5 but I really can notice the pixelated shadows.

I haven't really experimented with everything in GT5 obviously but after a couple hours and at least 5 seasons deep in Forza 3 I can really say they are equally matched (to me) graphically. I don't know if it was my low expectations of F3 (did not enjoy F2) or my high expectations of GT5 but they really are equally beautiful games.

I expect to see more 'issues' in GT5 once I really get into the meaty stuff though because right now it's mainly standard cars and such. I did race a snow rally race with a premium in arcade and that was fucking magical. I do think I'll enjoy GT5 more than F3 because the career mode in F3 never made me feel like I was going anywhere ... just getting levels and I think after 30 or 40 you stop even getting cars for a level earned (don't remember, haven't played in a while).

It really makes me respect what T10 did though. All the detractors really have nothing to say because while GT5 delivered, it wasn't the "blow the doors off of Forza" we were all expecting. I think the features in GT5 are immense and it makes me hope Forza 4 will step it up and not go the Kinect route.

If I remember correctly it goes up to level 50, after that you don't get any more cars.

But with the credits you ears you can pretty much buy any car you want or just buy them for cheap in the Auction House. Lamborghini Murcielago for 20k? Yeah, I aint passing on that.

 

[enzo_gt]

Man can you imagine the shitstorm if forza3 had premium and standard cars? :lol
Anyway, people at Turn10 must be laughing right now, I remember someone saying that 1000 cockpits wasn't doable...

I know right? The fact that a shitstorm occurred when people said Forza only had 400 or so cars in it is fucking pathetic in retrospective.

Now someone tell me why there wasn't a Premium vs. Standard shitstorm for GT5 and everyone is still dick riding PD. But really, why is everyone still dick riding PD?

I can't help myself having this tone because, it's absolutely pathetic how GT has been given the benefit of the doubt forever because of all the amazing pre-release stuff we've seen, and now on release some pretty huge technical mishaps are pointed out and people go back to attacking the stuff in Forza 3 that 99% of the players have never seen happen themselves? GT5 was expected to put out on multiple levels to be the greatest game ever. It has it's flaws much like Forza has, but some of the apologists here are unbelievable.

 

[Insertia]

What do you mean by average car, there isnt levels of car models in forza is there? i thought they were all done to the same level.

" That said, when I play FM3, I do not think about how awful the graphics are or low in-game car models, etc. simply because the overall effect is that the game looks good. Can it look better? Yes, totally and I agree it is not perfect. "

-Che Chou, ex-Turn 10 Community Manger

Forza 3 is very inconsistent. It's obvious that between the development of Forza 2 and 3 they modeled new cars and updated some models. It's also obvious some models are straight from Forza 2(which isn't pretty) and/or little thought went into them.

Turn 10 doesn't call it Premium or Standard. It's just how large content filled games this gen have been designed.

The only way to get 100% visually consistency across the board with a large content filled game is to go the World of Warcraft route; sub-par graphics that allows unlimited variety and great consistency.

 

[theignoramus]

I know right? The fact that a shitstorm occurred when people said Forza only had 400 or so cars in it is fucking pathetic in retrospective.

Now someone tell me why there wasn't a Premium vs. Standard shitstorm for GT5 and everyone is still dick riding PD.

Come on now, dont just make stuff up.:lol
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=398721

 

[Fortinbras]

Is this part of the 'focused' Forza experience?

Wait a few weeks, there are going to be videos that show the broken GT5 physics. There's stuff like that in almost every racing game. If you want to make a game look bad you can make a game look bad, no matter how good the game really is.

 

[enzo_gt]

Come on now, dont just make stuff up.:lol
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=398721

Post #3:

very disappointing indeed, but theres a lot of other stuff to be very happy about

Further down:

Those PS2 pimped cars still look 2x better than anything else that comes to mind.

:lol

In retrospect? This is the benefit of the doubt and apologists I'm talking about. I'm not saying nobody voiced concerns, but the fact that people now are still trying to justify it as an acceptable game design decision is beyond absurd. So, why do people have this same mentality exactly? Same goes for Forza really, apologists were all up in the thread that had the news break of the car list. Actually those wars probably occurred earlier in this thread somewhere.

 

[UntoldDreams]

Post #3:

Further down:


In retrospect? This is the benefit of the doubt and apologists I'm talking about. I'm not saying nobody voiced concerns, but the fact that people now are still trying to justify it as an acceptable game design decision is beyond absurd. So, why do people have this same mentality exactly? Same goes for Forza really, apologists were all up in the thread that had the news break of the car list. Actually those wars probably occurred earlier in this thread somewhere.

Ahhh let it go... You want a fair answer?
PD is well loved and gets the benefit of the doubt.

If you want to proclaim "that's not fair I want T10 to be popular" sure go ahead.
Popularity isn't fair that's why everyone wants it.

...
I seem to recall asking why everyone was comparing the graphics in Gears of War to Resistance Fall of Man (twice) and asking why we were comparing two completely different genres?
That didn't make much sense either and yet it happened.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Standard cars in GT5 look like the average car in Forza 3.

and

can you fucking read or what dipshit?

"It can't match GT5 physics or presentation"

:lol :lol :lol :lol

people are starting to catch feelings in this thread. delicious feelings.

I know right? The fact that a shitstorm occurred when people said Forza only had 400 or so cars in it is fucking pathetic in retrospective.

Now someone tell me why there wasn't a Premium vs. Standard shitstorm for GT5 and everyone is still dick riding PD. But really, why is everyone still dick riding PD?

I can't help myself having this tone because, it's absolutely pathetic how GT has been given the benefit of the doubt forever because of all the amazing pre-release stuff we've seen, and now on release some pretty huge technical mishaps are pointed out and people go back to attacking the stuff in Forza 3 that 99% of the players have never seen happen themselves? GT5 was expected to put out on multiple levels to be the greatest game ever. It has it's flaws much like Forza has, but some of the apologists here are unbelievable.

all I can say is that it's very entertaining to watch the goal posts moving. just a couple weeks ago, even the notion of the thread taking this turn would have been laughed off.

 

[enzo_gt]

Ahhh let it go... You want a fair answer?
PD is well loved and gets the benefit of the doubt.

If you want to proclaim "that's not fair I want T10 to be popular" sure go ahead.
Popularity isn't fair that's why everyone wants it.

...
I seem to recall asking why everyone was comparing the graphics in Gears of War to Resistance Fall of Man (twice) and asking why we were comparing two completely different genres?
That didn't make much sense either and yet it happened.

T10 needing to be more popular..? Erm, what? If anything, I'm saying popularity and strong attachments to these devs shouldn't cloud peoples judgement. And if the last page or so is any indication, it already has.

Neither company should be given any benefit of the doubt. Which brings me full circle again to ask, why is PD being defended for the premium vs. standard distinction? "Oh well Forza had different LODs too" is not a valid EXCUSE for a poor game design choice on either end.

But alas, apparently I come off as a T10 fanboy for criticizing PD. Ignorance is bliss I guess.

all I can say is that it's very entertaining to watch the goal posts moving. just a couple weeks ago, even the notion of the thread taking this turn would have been laughed off.

I'm still pretty shocked at everyone who has come out from hiding to say FM3 looks better. Still thing the lighting is what pushes GT5 a bit over the edge though. But your right, I wouldn't have even pictured people praising F3 in this thread cause it's like taboo :lol

 

[Averon]

Sorry, but there's absolutely no good excuse for PD as to why GT5 is in the state it is in. PD had a ridiculous amount of time and money to develop GT5. 99% of developers would kill to get even half the amount of time and money PD had to develop their games. There's no reason why GT5 shouldn't be kicking the shit out of every racer released within the last 3-5 years with relative ease.

I think SCE gave Kaz too much leeway, and as a result, we have the unpolished, unfocused game we have today. In retrospect, SCE should cracked their whip on PD a lot sooner.

 

[ResidentDante]

What 'excuse'? Why are Forza's wonky physics and crashes ignored? Isn't it all about consistency? This doesn't look realistic to me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRE9PlJesn8&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcuz-gdzSuM&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdQIkyrSjl0&NR=1

Is this part of the 'focused' Forza experience?

Play the game for a few hours, instead of searching on youtube for "Forza 3 + fail" to fuel your FM3 hate. If you are looking for strange bugs you find them in a lot of games on youtube.