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Forza 3 vs Gran Turismo 5 Comparison Thread of John, Chapter 11, Verse 35

Slayer-33

Liverpool-2
RSTEIN said:
I also hate when people ridicule FM 3 for that rolleover abuse (oh it must be bad physics!) shown on YouTube vids and fail to realize that it's just some tool seeking attention abusing the analog stick and purposely not rolling the vehicle upright.

T10 was too generous and opened themselves for this misinfo abuse, the should just have made a single button press to reset the car or something.


Besides that I haven't seen much issues with FM 3 besides the lighting needing more work and maybe the color palette being toned down a lil bit (which i'm sure the team is working on)
 
PopcornMegaphone said:
I think you're rationalizing GTs lower scores. If anything history as shown marque franchise get inflated scores. Everyone uses GTA4 as a prime example of this.

True but franchises fall out of favour and not necessarily on merit. Sony has seriously damaged their relationship with reviewers by giving them 2 days to review a very large game, and for generally being uncommunicative.

What surprises me is the more I play the game, the more I'm baffled that anyone could give it something like 7/10. Some reviews just smack of uninformed criticism and others side-line GT5's considerable merits because they experienced some frame tearing (where they would never usually point out technical issues in other games - e.g. Black Ops) or saw a janky texture. Suddenly every niggling issue is front and centre and I suspect it's because of a) franchise expectation and b) because some reviewers were simply venting at being poorly treated by Sony.

Anyway, my 2 cents. You certainly make a fair point though.
 

test_account

XP-39C²
Slayer-33 said:
Can't we all agree that it's fucking good, hell even great that these two teams are going at it like his?


That being said of course GT 5 should sell extremely well, but I hope that more and more people start recognizing the amount of blood sweat and tears put into the creation of Forza Motorsport 3, I want FM 4 and want it to sell well. T10 has put in one hell of an effort to go against the GT series and would hate seeing the franchise fall appart due to poor support. They should have earned peoples respect by now considering their three exceptional releases so far.


If some of the diehard GT fans haven't tried it and have a 360 go pickup Forza Motorsport 3: Ultimate edition for $30 measly dollars. You will get another masterpiece worthy of any racing sim fans attention.
RSTEIN said:
That's what I've been saying all along... the fact that these two games are so close is awesome. The hyperbole thrown against GT5 (OMG PS2 cars!) is unjustified. Slamming Forza 3 (OMG cartoon graphix!) is unjustified. There's no "king", there's no "light year distance" between the two. Both are doing their own thing.

Taking the fanboy goggles off and looking beyond GAF and one's own console affiliation (I know it's hard), the reality is this is the consensus of the whole gaming community right now.

I say game on!
Very well said, both of you! :) Even if one of these games should be a bit better compared to the other, both games are still very good in my opinion, and isnt that the most important thing? :)

I guess that this thread was originally made to compare the graphics between GT5 and Forza 3, but instead it turned out to be a thread more about bashing the games, at least that is my impression of this thread :\ Even if the games arent perfect (which game is perfect?) and eventhough that someone expected more (that is fine by me), both games are still good, right?

I dont see anything wrong about comparing the game as long as it is done in a more respectful way to the developers (i am not refering to anyone particular here, i am just generally speaking). I am sure that both Turn10 and Polyphony Digital worked hard on their games and tried to make it the best experience possible. And even if they dont get it right to begin with (or even after a longer period of time as well) there are always room for improvement through patching and sequels. I am looking forward to see how Turn10 and PolyPhony Digital next games will be :)
 

NinjaBoiX

Member
painful fart said:
Yeah, I know what you mean, I am still waiting for T10 to add rally to Forza, but it´s such a shame T10 can´t deal with competition. I guess they are just not up for the task, what do you think?

Dumb post requires dumb answer.
I guess Turn 10 would rather finish their game property than add more content than they can deal with. PD bit off more than they could chew evidently. Dirt 2 is all you need for rallying. And Forza 3 for track. Wait to see if they finish/fix GT5 in the meantime.
 

Shaneus

Member
Despite only having put a few hours into GT5, I think I've nailed the main difference. Sure, F3 gives you more customisation over your cars (not including painting... more settings tweaking etc.) but GT5 just doesn't feel like a game where Forza 3 does. There's a certain clinical, almost educational element to it where Forza 3 feels like there's a little more emotion influencing the outcome. Forza's a documentary where GT is an encyclopedia (if you understand what I mean). Both are great but I think each are aiming for slightly different goals... no digs at GT5 dropping the ball or F3 playing catchup or copycat or whatever, it just seems that the final vision for each series is different.


PS. ARGH the screen tearing! I hate harping on about it but it really is distracting. I do hope they patch it soon.
 
-NinjaBoiX- said:
I guess Turn 10 would rather finish their game property than add more content than they can deal with.
I bet you any money that Turn 10 would rather have the sort of timescales PD get... but there's not a chance in hell that would ever happen so I guess they've got to be realistic.
 
Shaneus said:
Despite only having put a few hours into GT5, I think I've nailed the main difference. Sure, F3 gives you more customisation over your cars (not including painting... more settings tweaking etc.) but GT5 just doesn't feel like a game where Forza 3 does. There's a certain clinical, almost educational element to it where Forza 3 feels like there's a little more emotion influencing the outcome. Forza's a documentary where GT is an encyclopedia (if you understand what I mean). Both are great but I think each are aiming for slightly different goals... no digs at GT5 dropping the ball or F3 playing catchup or copycat or whatever, it just seems that the final vision for each series is different.

Fair point. I always get the feeling Kaz is on a mission to use the GT series like some sort of a car and motorsport racing restoration project. Like he's half making a game, and half making a museum/encyclopedia for cars and racing. That said, I think it does an injustice to GT5 to simply treat it as an encyclopedia, the game side of it is truly excellent, albeit punishing at times.
 
shinnn said:
Deal with competition includes making the right choices. GT isn't about rally. GT is about cars.

Adding rally to Forza in a hurried way like GT5 did with damage could be a mistake. Same for time cycle and weather. At least we don't need to wait 5 years to see their choices.

Rally was an essential part of GT3 (2001) for me, if PD crippled GT5 and left out Rally, (which by the way look gorgeous in GT5), it would have been a no-buy for me.

Good to see T10 is working on Rally, wonder how many years it will take them to get it ready for the market?
 

zoukka

Member
Well the rally in GT has always been something very bizarre. Not realistic at all. And without proper damage, it loses the atmosphere and tension of the best rally games.
 

shinnn

Member
DeadGzuz said:
That idiotic and you must know it. Comparing games from different years and thus different expectations. If FM2 came out today it would not reach 80.



MC has it, it must be true! :D

if GT5 came out today (after FM2) it would not reach 90. Oh wait.
 

Chinner

Banned
i gotta say, forza 3 and gt5 seem to appear to be good games but any REAL racing enthusiastic would know that mario kart is the real deal.
 
-NinjaBoiX- said:
I guess Turn 10 would rather finish their game property than add more content than they can deal with. PD bit off more than they could chew evidently. Dirt 2 is all you need for rallying. And Forza 3 for track. Wait to see if they finish/fix GT5 in the meantime.
If you don´t like Dirts arcade style, GT5 definitely fulfills a purpose. It is also really neat to take road cars on to dirt roads.
 
shinnn said:
if GT5 came out today (after FM2) it would not reach 90. Oh wait.

142eln9.gif
 
Chinner said:
i gotta say, forza 3 and gt5 seem to appear to be good games but any REAL racing enthusiastic would know that mario kart is the real deal.

Not this shit again Chinner. Everyone knows Diddy Kong Racing is the defining racing game. Shit's got karts, planes AND hoverboats. Where's your sacred cow now eh?
 

Chinner

Banned
LabouredSubterfuge said:
Not this shit again Chinner. Everyone knows Diddy Kong Racing is the defining racing game. Shit's got karts, planes AND hoverboats. Where's your sacred cow now eh?
er bro have you played that shit? controls are fucking terrible, physics are fucking terrible, the bosses are cancer inducing and whoever thought combining an adventure mode with racing is possibly on par with hitler.
 

zoukka

Member
LabouredSubterfuge said:
Not this shit again Chinner. Everyone knows Diddy Kong Racing is the defining racing game. Shit's got karts, planes AND hoverboats. Where's your sacred cow now eh?

They both kneel before CTR.
 

Brashnir

Member
LabouredSubterfuge said:
Not this shit again Chinner. Everyone knows Diddy Kong Racing is the defining racing game. Shit's got karts, planes AND hoverboats. Where's your sacred cow now eh?

Wacky Races on Dreamcast is where it's at, man.
 
shinnn said:
Deal with competition includes making the right choices. GT isn't about rally. GT is about cars.

Adding rally to Forza in a hurried way like GT5 did with damage could be a mistake. Same for time cycle and weather. At least we don't need to wait 5 years to see their choices.

also:

Turn10 Rally driving experience

[]http://i.imgur.com/XitNq.jpg[/IMG]

You do realize Rally has been in previous GTs right?
 
zoukka said:
Well the rally in GT has always been something very bizarre. Not realistic at all. And without proper damage, it loses the atmosphere and tension of the best rally games.
Proper damage? So what is the gold standard for damage, care to fill me in?

BTW I don´t drive with chase cam and to me the car handling is essential, that is what need to be realistic me, not like Dirt.
 
Chinner said:
er bro have you played that shit? controls are fucking terrible, physics are fucking terrible, the bosses are cancer inducing and whoever thought combining an adventure mode with racing is possibly on par with hitler.

Man, have you even played Diddy Kong Racing? It has the most accurate homing missile physics in a 64-bit game. And the controls are fine when you get used to how much better it is than Mario Kart's completely unrealistic floaty physics. Besides, since when does innovating in the anthropomorph karting genre constitute a bad thing. Face it, Rare just totally beat Mario Kart at its own game.
 

dankir

Member
LabouredSubterfuge said:
Not this shit again Chinner. Everyone knows Diddy Kong Racing is the defining racing game. Shit's got karts, planes AND hoverboats. Where's your sacred cow now eh?


The motherfucker has races against dragons and shit too!!

Diddy Kong Racing is god tier.
 

NinjaBoiX

Member
Insertia said:
GT5 makes Forza 3 and Shift feel like a unevolved last gen titles. GT5 really destroys everything in it's path. I tried Nascar and WRC for the first time. :O
I think it's partially because GT5 has much better graphics and this video explains the other half:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ndCohR7ovE
Can't agree with the graphics. The car models and lighting are amazing, but tracks look pretty poor. And considering the awful panhandle chase cam, how often are you going to be looking at the car? Also, the tearing is pretty bad and the framerate not much better. Forza 3 is a much more consistanty attractive game, rock solid performance to boot.
 

zoukka

Member
painful fart said:
Proper damage? So what is the gold standard for damage, care to fill me in?

BTW I don´t drive with chase cam and to me the car handling is essential, that is what need to be realistic me, not like Dirt.

Real damage, show stoppers, like in the best rally games. Richard Burns rally for example. I spit at the direction of Dirt games :D

The GT rally has never been realistic, the cars slide like on ice and the lack of damage really hurts the experience. The tracks are basically narrow tunnels.

This is how a rally game should look.
 

Insertia

Member
grand_turismo_5_370z_pt_3_by_slam_cannon-d33mdn5.jpg

YFFPrl.jpg


:lol
Developers really have their work cut out for them. I look forward to seeing how they will adapt. Polyphony set a new standard besides standard cars.
 

SmokyDave

Member
LabouredSubterfuge said:
Man, have you even played Diddy Kong Racing? It has the most accurate homing missile physics in a 64-bit game. And the controls are fine when you get used to how much better it is than Mario Kart's completely unrealistic floaty physics. Besides, since when does innovating in the anthropomorph karting genre constitute a bad thing. Face it, Rare just totally beat Mario Kart at its own game.
That's true, no doubt. I'd give the overall edge to MarioKart but, dem missiles.
 

Chinner

Banned
LabouredSubterfuge said:
Man, have you even played Diddy Kong Racing? It has the most accurate homing missile physics in a 64-bit game. And the controls are fine when you get used to how much better it is than Mario Kart's completely unrealistic floaty physics. Besides, since when does innovating in the anthropomorph karting genre constitute a bad thing. Face it, Rare just totally beat Mario Kart at its own game.
rare beats mario kart at its own game? maybe if that game was sucking total ass. diddy kong attempts to run before it can even walk. the performance of that game was terrible with unstable framerate, inconsistent game graphics and cartoon graphics. i dont even think diddy kong is a racing game, its more like wario ware getting you to do stupid little minigames like jerk a guy off.

mario is a pure racing game.
 
SmokyDave said:
That's true, no doubt. I'd give the overall edge to MarioKart but, dem missiles.

Mario%20Kart%2064.jpg


vs.

diddy-kong-racing-kart-race.jpg


Just look! It's not even a contest. Diddy Kong Racing has full 3D drivers and Karts AND it has real-time skid-marks.

Chinner said:
rare beats mario kart at its own game? maybe if that game was sucking total ass. diddy kong attempts to run before it can even walk. the performance of that game was terrible with unstable framerate, inconsistent game graphics and cartoon graphics. i dont even think diddy kong is a racing game, its more like wario ware getting you to do stupid little minigames like jerk a guy off.

mario is a pure racing game.

Whatever man. DKC innovates while MK just does the same old thing every time. The Emperor clearly has no clothes.
 
shinnn said:
Yes I know. And I realize that Forza beated GT without rally.
Yeah, so you are essentially understanding they are to different games.

T10 prioritized adding a livery editor over rally, while PD did the opposite.

They are essentially catering to slightly different customers.
 

Insertia

Member
-NinjaBoiX- said:
Can't agree with the graphics. The car models and lighting are amazing, but tracks look pretty poor. And considering the awful panhandle chase cam, how often are you going to be looking at the car? Also, the tearing is pretty bad and the framerate not much better. Forza 3 is a much more consistanty attractive game, rock solid performance to boot.

Car models in Forza 3 are worse.
AI is worse.
Only 8 cars on track compared to GT5's 16.
Lighting is worse in Forza.
Tracks are less detailed (there isn't a single track in Forza 3 that is visually detailed as Rome or London in GT5)
Rain
Snow
Nascar
WRC
Super GT
Photomode
Better physics
Cockpit: Holyshit
1080p and less jaggy then Forza 3

Of course Forza 3 is going to have better performance when all it has going for itself is 7 cars on screen, poor AI, visuals that are pushing no boundaries, and a livery editor.

GT5 has to calculate a lot and despite it all, it's just as smooth as Forza 3 and smoother than Shift.
 
zoukka said:
Real damage, show stoppers, like in the best rally games. Richard Burns rally for example. I spit at the direction of Dirt games :D

The GT rally has never been realistic, the cars slide like on ice and the lack of damage really hurts the experience. The tracks are basically narrow tunnels.

This is how a rally game should look.
Uhm yeah, I think it´s enough if your car gets slowed down by the damage, that means a instant restart to me anyways. But more options are always welcome.

Well GT has made some progress in those departments you mention, weather and day/night cycles do also add to the experience.
 

Shaneus

Member
LabouredSubterfuge said:
Fair point. I always get the feeling Kaz is on a mission to use the GT series like some sort of a car and motorsport racing restoration project. Like he's half making a game, and half making a museum/encyclopedia for cars and racing. That said, I think it does an injustice to GT5 to simply treat it as an encyclopedia, the game side of it is truly excellent, albeit punishing at times.
Oh, I don't mean *just* as an encyclopedia... more that the goal of it is to be as clinical and clean and exact, like an encyclopedia. For example, there's a fairly strong focus on seasons and calendars in F3, like you should complete somewhere or get to a certain point in a finite amount of time (even if it is a while, there's still that impression) whereas I haven't found any of that with GT. It's more of a "take your time, absorb everything at your own leisure... but try to take it all lin" sort of thing. Another point is the tuning. Forza has the option of just going to the marketplace to buy the best tune possible and apply it to your car, where GT almost seems to have deliberately avoided that so that the player can learn what everything does. Yes, it's a feature that some people would argue should be included so you can use it if you want and avoid if you don't, but you'd be learning so much less if it was there to rely on when you're stuck.

Finally understanding all that, I can totally see where Kaz is coming from. I don't get how so many niggly little things could make it through with the time it's taken (really... I just unlocked the Berlinetta. Should never have fucking made it in the state it's in), but his vision and overall implementation have come off really well.

Yeah, this post (and my last) are pretty much my own personal epiphany. I think I actually "get it". It seems like some die hard GT fanboys don't (arguing because it's on their console, because GT came first, because they hate Microsoft... whatever) and like it for other, perhaps more shallow reasons that Polyphony had intended (better graphics lolz) but for me, shit has just reached a whole new level.

Mind you, I don't think of Forza/Turn 10 any less, I just think of GT5 and Kazunori-san a whole lot fucking more.
 
shinnn said:
Yes I know. And I realize that Forza beated GT without rally.
But why would u call it rushed when it was in previous GTs already?...

And Forza beating GT is pretty relative. To each his own. Sales will also prove otherwise dispite the bigger 360 database
 
Oh hey I can play that game too.

Forza 3 has:

Equal detail across all tracks, not a mix of last gen visuals.
Custom FOV degrees for cockpit view via screen settings
Up to 5 screen multi-screen, even the ability to use one screen as a rear view mirror!
Deep customization for tuning and visuals
Online marketplace to sell user made liveries and vinyls
Auction house to sell tuned vehicles
Online photomode gallery
Matchmaking with trueskill rank
Real time tire flex
All 500+ cars can roll over, smash up and lose bumpers, wing mirrors ect
All 500+ cars hack a cockpit
Higher res real time shadows


:eek:
 

shinnn

Member
painful fart said:
Yeah, so you are essentially understanding they are to different games.

T10 prioritized adding a livery editor over rally, while PD did the opposite.

They are essentially catering to slightly different customers.
yes..

T10 prioritized adding the best livery editor ever.
PD adding the average rally driving ever.
 
Kaz always wanted to make a game that has in all the motor sports.
GT 5 is just the next step with NASCAR and Karts expect more events with them in next GT,to bad he can't get F1 it cost way to much .
If he had more time he also add in Motorbikes or maybe later on .
 
Diablohead said:
Custom FOV degrees for cockpit view via screen settings GT5 has this as well.
Online photomode gallery GT5 has this as well.
Matchmaking with trueskill rank That's not a good thing
Real time tyre flex GT5 has this as well. But it's not shown visually
.
 
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