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[adelante]

this must be the hardest thread on Gaf to get banned in but people still find a way:lol

Not really if all you do is talk about sick shit that has absolutely nothing to do with the games or even cars. Inertia's series of meltdowns however, was truly exemplary, for he left behind a guideline as to how far one can push a little beyond this thread's limit of forgiveness while still staying somewhat on topic :lol .

One I did a long ass time ago yeah I fail

OH hey that looks not bad, at the very least it doesn't have those typical compression artifacts

 

[Zabka]

Proper shadows were inadvertently removed with a patch iirc :lol

I can't believe they never fixed that. Was it a mistake or intentional?

 

[adelante]

That's not real time dude. That's photo mode despite the photo not being taken yet. You can tell by the amount of AA. F3 is jaggier than GT5 generally. 2xAA at 720p instead of GT5's 4xAA. GT5 only uses 2xAA in it's 1080p mode from my recollection. The above pic is definitely not 2xAA.

How is that not real-time when you can control the viewpoint in 3D? Photomode's definitely not indicative of actual gameplay however but I don't think that's ever up for debate

 

[nib95]

How is that not real-time when you can control the viewpoint in 3D? Photomode's definitely not indicative of actual gameplay however but I don't think that's ever up for debate

Sorry that's what I meant, not indicative of gameplay visuals.

 

[Shaneus]

I can't believe they never fixed that. Was it a mistake or intentional?

Mistake. Never fixed because I think Bizarre were sent sailing not far after the DLC was released. FWIW I never even noticed it until someone pointed it out a little while ago, now I can't unsee it :lol

 

[Truespeed]

Yes, people and their wallets speak very loudly. A lot of people went to see Transformers 2 (it has made hundreds of millions of dollars worldwide). I doubt Black Swan, which will probably win this year's Oscar for best picture, will get over $40 million domestically.

Yet interestingly Black Swan is at 90% and Transformers is at 20% over at Rotten Tomatoes.

Do you really think I believe that just because one game outsells another it must therefore be better? Is that really what you extracted from that? Let me break it down so you can't infer crazy shit and come up with Transformer analogies any more - more people who like to play console racing simulators selected GT5 over Forza 3. That's the extent of what I implied.

Oh, one more thing, Transformers 2 is a better movie than your ballet action movie.

 

[jett]

No, I see the same AA and resolution of final shot in FM3. Inside the photomode, but in real-time.

Are you crazy? That's not real-time.

 

[saladine1]

I have to say once again, that FM and especially GT need to revise their engine,exhaust and general sound effects. I can't strees this enough.
The gear change effects in both games need an overhaul. The turbo spool and BOV need an overhaul. FM's race transmission gear whine needs an overhaul while GT's is actually not that bad.
Cars, especially when fully upgraded need to sound more menacing, more mechanical rather than the subdued effects we have in both games.
I'm not saying that all the cars in the games are bad,but more often than not they are...especially GT.
Now, I've mad this comparison before but if anyone from both dev camps happen to read GAF,then here's a sound montage from a few different NFS games. Listen to the gear whine,turbo spool, BOV, braking and shifting effects and general engine and exhaust notes.
I know that NFS make their sounds are little over the top but mang, they sound orgasmic..
:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o52KARRl9Lk

 

[user_nat]

Are you crazy? That's not real-time.

What is it then.. pre-rendered?

 

[Truespeed]

Truespeed:

So you think that Mario Kart is far superior to GT5? It's funny when sales start mattering and when the fantards decide to ignore them.

No, shit like that was patented, copyrighted and trademarked directly from your melon. Also, let's try and keep it in the same genre and try to avoid using Transformer movie analogies.

Do come back when GT5 can "handle" that too. Maybe you've missed how poorly it's being "handled"? How about coming back when it can handle 60 fps without massive tearing/slowdown?

When you push the envelope sometimes you get minor side effects. It's the price you pay for reaching for the stars.

 

[2real4tv]

I have to say once again, that FM and especially GT need to revise their engine,exhaust and general sound effects. I can't strees this enough.
The gear change effects in both games need an overhaul. The turbo spool and BOV need an overhaul. FM's race transmission gear whine needs an overhaul while GT's is actually not that bad.
Cars, especially when fully upgraded need to sound more menacing, more mechanical rather than the subdued effects we have in both games.
I'm not saying that all the cars in the games are bad,but more often than not they are...especially GT.
Now, I've mad this comparison before but if anyone from both dev camps happen to read GAF,then here's a sound montage from a few different NFS games. Listen to the gear whine,turbo spool, BOV, braking and shifting effects and general engine and exhaust notes.
I know that NFS make their sounds are little over the top but mang, they sound orgasmic..
:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o52KARRl9Lk

those sounds are insane

 

[fernoca]

Is like some forgot what "realtime" means.

In-game is what they aren't; since is not the visuals you get while playing the actual game.

 

[m0dus]

Are you crazy? That's not real-time.

Seriously? What is it then, FMV? A pre-rendered trailer of a car in the grass somehow snuck into the game year after launch?

Or rather, do you simply not understand the term you are arguing?

Do...Do you need to google what 'real time' means?

Go ahead. We'll wait.


The truly sad fact is, he is not the only person in this thread to make that statement.

Spoiler

Bish. What have you wrought.

 

[LordPhoque]

Are you crazy? That's not real-time.

It hasn't been taken with the photomode, it's a screenshot from Gamekult. That's what he meant. Of course it was enhanced by the tools of the photomode.

 

[Shaneus]

When you push the envelope sometimes you get minor side effects. It's the price you pay for reaching for the stars.

Shame you can't travel to the stars at a smooth, constant speed (or see out the window due to the tinting) :lol

 

[les papillons sexuels]

You know, I can't wait to see a good 360 emulator come out, and the emulator gets optimized enough to increase the resolution in the forza games to 1080p, with decent AA and then watch as people take the menu cars, and swap them in for other models... then preform texture mods on the environment.

 

[Stallion Free]

You know, I can't wait to see a good 360 emulator come out, and the emulator gets optimized enough to increase the resolution in the forza games to 1080p, with decent AA and then watch as people take the menu cars, and swap them in for other models... then preform texture mods on the environment.

By that time I'm sure the hardcore PC racing sims will have caught up visually to Forza's level at least making this completely pointless.

 

[les papillons sexuels]

By that time I'm sure the hardcore PC racing sims will have caught up visually to Forza's level at least making this completely pointless.

I doubt it, I just don't think the PC sims have the budget to put as much time and work into the higher polygon models like turn 10 and PD do. With the exception of SimBin, maybe...

Though modders could probably take them... Either way i'd still rather see what forza would look like in that situation, and GT for that matter.

 

[CrushDance]

You know, I can't wait to see a good 360 emulator come out, and the emulator gets optimized enough to increase the resolution in the forza games to 1080p, with decent AA and then watch as people take the menu cars, and swap them in for other models... then preform texture mods on the environment.

....so a new game?

 

[les papillons sexuels]

....so a new game?

with the potential of this generation lingering on longer then any other, I think the hardware is really going to limit the level of fidelity that either t10 or pd can provide, so I'd rather just see something like the forza 3 or 3.5 or 4 or w/e that new kinect thing is emulated on PC at higher resolution, better aa, better texturing and significant higher poly count on the cars at all times.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

I'd like to see the Forza team have a FM game ready at the launch of the next system...but I'm sure Forza 4 has been under development for the 360 since Forza 3 launched. companies don't just...hibernate...until they're needed. so here's hoping Forza 5 will launch within 3 months of the Xbox 720.

 

[eso76]

I doubt it, I just don't think the PC sims have the budget to put as much time and work into the higher polygon models like turn 10 and PD do. With the exception of SimBin, maybe...

Though modders could probably take them... Either way i'd still rather see what forza would look like in that situation, and GT for that matter.

i think Microsoft should have allowed porting Fm3 to pc at this point.


Speaking of jaggies; i don't doubt GT5 is using 4xaa, but i swear it looks very aliased on my set, yes, more than fm3. That might be because it's reflections are a lot more realistic and result in much greater contrast.

Photomode; i hate not being able to walk forward or backwards in gt5 while snapping a photo. You can only strafe. I also hate the fact the frame is displayed in a very small portion of the screen. I hate not being able to see the effects shutter speed produces in real time and a slow shutter speed won't affect reflections and shadows on the car (they should obviously look motion blurred too). I also hate the fact it doesn't save your settings and the fact you can't enter photomode whenever you like. But everything is forgiven since it produces incredible results.

As for tech discussion, i would be more interested in learning how PD managed to get those reflections. It looks like they're using HDR maps, where 'luminous' objects reflect on cars much more clearly than the ones in the shadow.
Either hdr maps or they just 'luma keyed' reflection maps to fade dark spots.

 

[Slayer-33]

T10 needs to reverse engineer that voodoo magic shit PD figured out when it comes to lighting and general photo realism even on shitty badly detailed tracks (texturally *is that even a word?* :lol speaking)

 

[just tray]

Look, if you hate cars and yourself, and more or less just want to bang your head against broken rocks while molesting multiple disabled children in a concentration camp, you'll probably prefer GT5.

For those of us with more refined tastes, who prefer proper shadows... the choice is clear.

Was this really necessary? And u wonder why I mute live when my kids around smh.

I think overall Forza is the better game. But GT5 is better in some areas.

 

[Stallion Free]

I doubt it, I just don't think the PC sims have the budget to put as much time and work into the higher polygon models like turn 10 and PD do. With the exception of SimBin, maybe...

Though modders could probably take them... Either way i'd still rather see what forza would look like in that situation, and GT for that matter.

Judging by our current status with PS2/Wii emulation I would say we are a minimum of 5 years out from your little fantasy, and that is more than enough time for the hardcore sim devs to play catch up.

 

[jett]

Seriously? What is it then, FMV? A pre-rendered trailer of a car in the grass somehow snuck into the game year after launch?

Or rather, do you simply not understand the term you are arguing?

Do...Do you need to google what 'real time' means?

Go ahead. We'll wait.


The truly sad fact is, he is not the only person in this thread to make that statement.

Spoiler

Bish. What have you wrought.

Aren't you condescending! Pictures pre-rendered in photomode quality(in either game) aren't running in real-time. Because they are pictures. Pre-rendered. Image quality in that screen is way beyond the meager 2XMSAA Forza 3 uses(and beyond any AA solution any PS360 game uses). I don't see what's so hard to understand about what I said.

 

[Brashnir]

Aren't you condescending! Pictures pre-rendered in photomode quality(in either game) aren't running in real-time. Because they are pictures. Pre-rendered. Image quality in that screen is way beyond the meager 2XMSAA Forza 3 uses(and beyond any AA solution any PS360 game uses). I don't see what's so hard to understand about what I said.

That's not a photomode render. It's a screencap taken while within the game's photo mode, before the picture has been taken.

If it was a render, you wouldn't see the HUD.

 

[jett]

That's not a photomode render. It's a screencap taken while within the game's photo mode, before the picture has been taken.

If it was a render, you wouldn't see the HUD.

I know it's screencap taken by gamekult themselves, but I don't believe for a second that image quality is actually applied when the game is in motion, in any mode, considering this:

is what the game looks like when there's nearly nothing on screen. What I guess is that FM3 gives you a rendered preview of what your screenshot is going to look, making the render on the fly when the camera is static? I dunno.

If it wasn't rendered, surely we would have heard by now of the magical real-time 16XMSAA FM3 uses in the photomode.

 

[shinnn]

Aren't you condescending! Pictures pre-rendered in photomode quality(in either game) aren't running in real-time. Because they are pictures. Pre-rendered. Image quality in that screen is way beyond the meager 2XMSAA Forza 3 uses(and beyond any AA solution any PS360 game uses). I don't see what's so hard to understand about what I said.

Oh god.. you can't be serious. Have you ever played Forza?

 

[Psychotext]

That's not a photomode render. It's a screencap taken while within the game's photo mode, before the picture has been taken.

If it was a render, you wouldn't see the HUD.

This one. I was starting to wonder what the argument was about. :lol

I'd imagine that Forza just dedicates more processing power to making the image look good when it knows the game is paused.

I know it's screencap taken by gamekult themselves, but I don't believe for a second that image quality is actually applied when the game is in motion, in any mode, considering this

That model rotates (and needs to change colour)... the car in the camera viewpoint isn't going anywhere. Surely you can understand the difference?

 

[Stallion Free]

Oh god.. you can't be serious. Have you ever played Forza?

Based on his responses, no he has never touched the game.

 

[Shurs]

Oh god.. you can't be serious. Have you ever played Forza?

Have you played GT5?

 

[jett]

I don't need to play Forza 3 to understand that level of image quality is unattainable in current consoles. Like I said, I suppose a preview of the final render is generated on the fly when you stop moving the camera in photomode?

 

[shinnn]

Have you played GT5?

did I said anything wrong about GT5 photomode?

 

[Psychotext]

I don't need to play Forza 3 to understand that level of image quality is unattainable in current consoles. Like I said, I suppose a preview of the final render is generated on the fly when you stop moving the camera in photomode?

If you want to see see what the game can make the graphics look like when the cars aren't moving then you'll want the screensaver... I can't remember what it's called but it looks fantastic.

I imagine they use the same tricks for when you're taking photos.

 

[Shurs]

did I said anything wrong about GT5 photomode?

You've been talking about GT5 for the past week.

 

[shinnn]

You've been talking about GT5 for the past week.

No.. I've been talking about GT5 for the past 5 years. What's the deal?

 

[enzo_gt]

I know it's screencap taken by gamekult themselves, but I don't believe for a second that image quality is actually applied when the game is in motion, in any mode, considering this:

is what the game looks like when there's nearly nothing on screen. What I guess is that FM3 gives you a rendered preview of what your screenshot is going to look, making the render on the fly when the camera is static? I dunno.

If it wasn't rendered, surely we would have heard by now of the magical real-time 16XMSAA FM3 uses in the photomode.

As someone who HAS played Forza, this is what this screen actually looks like. Every other Forza picture aside from the Ferrari California and Lancer comparisons in this thread have been trolling.

Not that there's anything wrong with this picture. Still looks pretty damn good to me.

 

[RSTEIN]

Do you really think I believe that just because one game outsells another it must therefore be better? Is that really what you extracted from that? Let me break it down so you can't infer crazy shit and come up with Transformer analogies any more - more people who like to play console racing simulators selected GT5 over Forza 3. That's the extent of what I implied.

I think you're taking this too seriously.

 

[Cuban Legend]

I don't need to play Forza 3 to understand that level of image quality is unattainable in current consoles. Like I said, I suppose a preview of the final render is generated on the fly when you stop moving the camera in photomode?

your last few posts indicate to me you need to learn to stealth troll :lol

 

[Trunchisholm]

I don't need to play Forza 3 to understand that level of image quality is unattainable in current consoles. Like I said, I suppose a preview of the final render is generated on the fly when you stop moving the camera in photomode?

Forza uses 4X AA for replays and photo mode. I don't know what's so hard to understand about that.

 

[Shurs]

I think you're taking this too seriously.

I forget. Is he the one gathering "hard data" in order to show which game is better?

 

[brotkasten]

I forget. Is he the one gathering "hard data" in order to show which game is better?

I think that was Iknos.

 

[Mastperf]

No, shit like that was patented, copyrighted and trademarked directly from your melon. Also, let's try and keep it in the same genre and try to avoid using Transformer movie analogies.



When you push the envelope sometimes you get minor side effects. It's the price you pay for reaching for the stars.

If only the side effects were minor. There's no accomplishment in making a game that can't run properly on current consoles. Sometimes "reaching for the stars" gets your fingers burned.

 

[Stallion Free]

Not that there's anything wrong with this picture. Still looks pretty damn good to me.

Anyone who tints a window that color shouldn't be allowed to go near real cars.

 

[RSTEIN]

I forget. Is he the one gathering "hard data" in order to show which game is better?

That's me. There's no way to come to a conclusion, tho. I'm just gathering data to see what the grand 'consensus' is.

 

[Diablohead]

Forza 3 looks like that image above when I play it, the car's in the menus are very smooth like it's using 4xMSAA or something.

 

[m0dus]

Aren't you condescending! Pictures pre-rendered in photomode quality(in either game) aren't running in real-time. Because they are pictures. Pre-rendered. Image quality in that screen is way beyond the meager 2XMSAA Forza 3 uses(and beyond any AA solution any PS360 game uses). I don't see what's so hard to understand about what I said.

No, it seems you are unfortunately completely ignorant of what the hell you're arguing about, despite the fact that 4 people have already laid the knowledge out for you. Let me spell it out: that picture that has your knickers tied is real time, because it is being generated by the console in real time. Ie, you can manipulate said camera. That is why the HUD is still visible. This applies to BOTH GAMES. the only thing actually hitting the PHOTO button (in forza ) does is upsample the image AA and the effect resolution. Let's be totally clear: the only thing PRE RENDERED about Forza or GT is the video intro. That is the high res 'showroom model' of the car, which you"d be aware of, had you played the game. The user in that screenie hasn't taken the picture yet.


Are we clear? I'm now the 3rd or 4th person to clarify this.
If that is not clear enough, and you want to argue this extremely basic concept further, let me know, I'd be happy to give you a little vacation from this thread.

 

[Windom Earle]

GT5 AA advantage is quite clear in the ISR comparison. Geometry in Forza has considerably more aliaising. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1KVKSIVdK8

 

[Unregistered007]

The thread is filled with fan boys arguing about which SIM is better or what not.


I think this might be the best place to as the following question.

CAN SOMEONE please give me the best Need for Speed: SHIFT (360) tweaked control settings so I can enjoy it. I know developers f'ed up.

Please post the optimal settings so I can enjoy Need for Speed Shift.

Also can someone gift me some good/awesome cars in Forza MotorSport 3?


LETS make this thread useful.