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Forza 3 vs Gran Turismo 5 Comparison Thread of John, Chapter 11, Verse 35

Shaneus

Member
Can I bitch about the load times and the load screens of GT5 in here? When I fired up F3 for the first time in a while, I was pleasantly surprised that it didn't seem to take as long to load as GT5. Why? Because it had useful information on the load screen.

What does GT5 have? The cars in the race scrolling across the top of the screen (that you can see on the previous menu anyway), the name of the track and a progress bar. Seriously. No facts, no useful information, absolutely fucking nothing. Some design choices are amazing in this game, others baffle the absolute fuck out of me.

Forza Motorsport 3 may seem somewhat simpler, but damnit at least it's consistent across all menus. GT5 feels like different parts of the interface were outsourced to about 10 different companies :lol
 

Salacious Crumb

Junior Member
I actually like GT5 more than Forza 3, but because of the Hubris of the GT5 fans pre-launch and PS3 fans in general I'm loving all the shit that's getting thrown at GT5. :)
 
XiaNaphryz said:
Which has nothing to do with whether or not the car's being generated in real-time or not.

Some of the previews our artists use are pretty close to real-time as they can be pretty interactive - yes, the model they're looking at may be isolated by itself on the screen, but it's still in real-time. Only when they kick it out to the renderfarm for a final render is it no longer real-time.

If you are intending to say something else, use the proper term. I'm guessing "real-time" isn't what some of you really are trying to say.

I never even mentioned "real-time". I'm suggesting the lack of AA on this shot is only because more power is being put in the loading of the car.
 

jett

D-Member
shinnn said:

zombiejeffgordon.gif


"Do a barrel roll!"
 

LCfiner

Member
Salacious Crumb said:
I actually like GT5 more than Forza 3, but because of the Hubris of the GT5 fans pre-launch and PS3 fans in general I'm loving all the shit that's getting thrown at GT5. :)

yeah, I love GT5 but it's really funny yo go back in this thread and re-read the super high expectations.

1000 fully detailed cars!!!
 

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
Littleberu said:
I never even mentioned "real-time". I'm suggesting the lack of AA on this shot is only because more power is being put in the loading of the car.
Well, you jumped into the middle of a discussion about the term. :lol
 
This thread should be renamed to GT5 and Forza 3 |OT| Glitch Thread. None of the shit that I see in here for either game have I come across ... sadly. I never get to see the cool glitches. This isn't even a comparison thread anymore :lol
 
flyinpiranha said:
This thread should be renamed to GT5 and Forza 3 |OT| Glitch Thread. None of the shit that I see in here for either game have I come across ... sadly. I never get to see the cool glitches. This isn't even a comparison thread anymore :lol
Yep, even if it was a glitch comparison thread. One game just came out, the other has had patches over the past year or so.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
phosphor112 said:
That's pretty bad, though understandable.

I notice that some hit boxes clip in GT5, and whenever that happens, wonky results happen. I remember programming my first physics engine. It took me forever to get hitbox detection calculated properly. Fast objects would either get stuck together or go flying in a ridiculous manner.
wat

Though that was really funny.
 

G Rom

Member
-viper- said:
Flying Delorean would be epic.

Hitting 88 mph should also teleport your car to a different track.

No, it should just teleport you to a different time of day and/or weather !:lol
 

Yoritomo

Member
Long post incoming. I've spent extensive time with both games. 150+ hours racing in Forza (maybe more I haven't checked my time lately) and I've got every gold license and every challenge in GT5 golded that's available for a level 20 driver. Both using the same wheel, a Fanatec PWTS with clubsports.

My impressions.

Both are great games with a very similar focus. I play lots of racing sims since it's the only genre that I'm good at. I just renewed my iRacing sub for another year. Prior to Formula 1 races I run the track the race will be on in rFactor with the FSONE 2009 mod. I run the tracks for 3-4 hours to get a good feel for what I'll be watching any given sunday. I've played most every sim out there. Ferrari Virtual Academy, RBR with the RSRBR (rallyesim) mod, NetKar Pro, Simbin games, NFS shift heavily modded. Hell I even play and love recent codemasters games although they're not really sims at all. It''s been years since doing so but I also used to have an old 240sx that I would run at a local club's track and down in College Station on a regular basis. I've since sold that car and am concentrating on my family and saving up for a bigger house, anyway, in a few years I'll pick up another FR car and go back to doing track days at the local track.

Anyone arguing that one game is SO MUCH BETTER than the other is a moron. They're both very similar games with similar design goals. Each game does certain things better.

GT5 has better handling with the wheel and primarily because Forza has an active steering assist that you cannot turn off. This is really frustrating because Forza does so many things better with the wheel. I can tell via FFB when the rear is stepping out or I can feel a FWD car has torque steer. I can't feel either of these things in GT5. I'll explain why even in the technical sense if Forza actually has better FFB why I just can't give it the nod over GT5 at the end of the post.

The vehicles in Forza feel flat, and there's something wrong with the suspension modeling, this feeling of flatness is exacerbated by replay cameras that are LOCKED on the car so you get less of an impression of visual body roll during replays. GT5 handles the feel of the suspension and weight transfer better.

Both games have issues. Incorrect specs, modeling, and weird things with some of Forza's cars, especially some of the DLC vehicles. GT5 seems to have the brake balance wrong on almost every car. The rear wheels should not lock up before the front wheels on almost any modern vehicle but that seems to be the case in GT5. Tire grip seems to go from unrealistic levels at the bottom end to a happy area around comfort soft and some of the sport tires to unrealistic levels at the top. The racing tires don't have the correct amount of falloff in the tire force curve. You can't have universal vehicle settings like turning Traction Control off as a preference for all your cars. GT5 comes up lacking if you're using an H-Gate shifter as well. They introduced some kludges to prevent power shifting so Clutch users don't have a speed advantage. Stupid decision.

Revisiting the Forza steering assist issue: On the full 900 degree setting I only have to counter steer about 60 degree for the car in game to go into FULL OPPOSITE LOCK. It's why the game feels so easy with a wheel. It also removes a lot of the tension since it sort of corrects slides for you. For instance in GT5 on the full nurburgring AMG intermediate challenge I dipped the rear wheels into the grass coming out of a corner. This sent the rear wheels wide and I had to counter steer, and I had to work for it. As in I hit full opposite lock at 450 degrees feathered the throttle and unwound the steering wheel so I didn't go into a tank slapper. My heart was pounding and I could hear blood rushing to my brain. I can't really get that feeling with forza because it holds my hand too much.

I think GT5 has higher highs and much lower lows than Forza 3. Forza 3 is a more consistent experience, and really excels at tuning, community features, controller interpolation, tire falloff and modeling for the entire range of tires, sound, some graphical aspects, and collision between vehicles (rubbing is racing). GT5 excels at vehicle dynamics, huge variety in the single player campaign, presentation (not counting some weird UI decisions), overall art direction, and the variety of experiences you can have(yeah I mentioned this twice, it's the best part of the game).
 

Shaneus

Member
Wasn't going to post this in the GT5 OT (because it may seem like a troll, but it's just venting frustration), but does it seem to anyone else that Polyphony is masking "listening to the fans" patches as "features we were going to include but ran out of time"? I just keep seeing stuff that seems bleedingly obvious to include but is being patched in at the "request" of "fans". Online, types of damage, obvious graphics glitches... this is the sort of shit that releasing on consoles is supposed to avoid (and has done up until the Dreamcast (and lesser extent, original Xbox).

If it's one thing I hate about the current console generation more than any other, it's developers releasing half-baked games and patching it up later. Pisses me off even more when they do it and make it seem like they're doing us a favour.

Five years... what the fuck happened?
 
XiaNaphryz said:
Well, you jumped into the middle of a discussion about the term. :lol

Listen, I only mentioned that the fact that the car selection screen had nothing to do with the way the game renders anything. It's more or less an optimization of the engine to allow a quick loading of the car's model.
 

LCfiner

Member
Shaneus said:
Wasn't going to post this in the GT5 OT (because it may seem like a troll, but it's just venting frustration), but does it seem to anyone else that Polyphony is masking "listening to the fans" patches as "features we were going to include but ran out of time"? I just keep seeing stuff that seems bleedingly obvious to include but is being patched in at the "request" of "fans". Online, types of damage, obvious graphics glitches... this is the sort of shit that releasing on consoles is supposed to avoid (and has done up until the Dreamcast (and lesser extent, original Xbox).

If it's one thing I hate about the current console generation more than any other, it's developers releasing half-baked games and patching it up later. Pisses me off even more when they do it and make it seem like they're doing us a favour.

Five years... what the fuck happened?


yeah, I’m thinking the same thing but don’t really want to get into it in the OT. these patches seem like things that should’ve just been on the disc.

But, hey, they had to get it ready for Xmas 2010.
 

Jonsoncao

Banned
Yoritomo said:
Long post incoming. I've spent extensive time with both games. 150+ hours racing in Forza (maybe more I haven't checked my time lately) and I've got every gold license and every challenge in GT5 golded that's available for a level 20 driver. Both using the same wheel, a Fanatec PWTS with clubsports.

My impressions.

Both are great games with a very similar focus. I play lots of racing sims since it's the only genre that I'm good at. I just renewed my iRacing sub for another year. Prior to Formula 1 races I run the track the race will be on in rFactor with the FSONE 2009 mod. I run the tracks for 3-4 hours to get a good feel for what I'll be watching any given sunday. I've played most every sim out there. Ferrari Virtual Academy, RBR with the RSRBR (rallyesim) mod, NetKar Pro, Simbin games, NFS shift heavily modded. Hell I even play and love recent codemasters games although they're not really sims at all. It''s been years since doing so but I also used to have an old 240sx that I would run at a local club's track and down in College Station on a regular basis. I've since sold that car and am concentrating on my family and saving up for a bigger house, anyway, in a few years I'll pick up another FR car and go back to doing track days at the local track.

Anyone arguing that one game is SO MUCH BETTER than the other is a moron. They're both very similar games with similar design goals. Each game does certain things better.

GT5 has better handling with the wheel and primarily because Forza has an active steering assist that you cannot turn off. This is really frustrating because Forza does so many things better with the wheel. I can tell via FFB when the rear is stepping out or I can feel a FWD car has torque steer. I can't feel either of these things in GT5. I'll explain why even in the technical sense if Forza actually has better FFB why I just can't give it the nod over GT5 at the end of the post.

The vehicles in Forza feel flat, and there's something wrong with the suspension modeling, this feeling of flatness is exacerbated by replay cameras that are LOCKED on the car so you get less of an impression of visual body roll during replays. GT5 handles the feel of the suspension and weight transfer better.

Both games have issues. Incorrect specs, modeling, and weird things with some of Forza's cars, especially some of the DLC vehicles. GT5 seems to have the brake balance wrong on almost every car. The rear wheels should not lock up before the front wheels on almost any modern vehicle but that seems to be the case in GT5. Tire grip seems to go from unrealistic levels at the bottom end to a happy area around comfort soft and some of the sport tires to unrealistic levels at the top. The racing tires don't have the correct amount of falloff in the tire force curve. You can't have universal vehicle settings like turning Traction Control off as a preference for all your cars. GT5 comes up lacking if you're using an H-Gate shifter as well. They introduced some kludges to prevent power shifting so Clutch users don't have a speed advantage. Stupid decision.

Revisiting the Forza steering assist issue: On the full 900 degree setting I only have to counter steer about 60 degree for the car in game to go into FULL OPPOSITE LOCK. It's why the game feels so easy with a wheel. It also removes a lot of the tension since it sort of corrects slides for you. For instance in GT5 on the full nurburgring AMG intermediate challenge I dipped the rear wheels into the grass coming out of a corner. This sent the rear wheels wide and I had to counter steer, and I had to work for it. As in I hit full opposite lock at 450 degrees feathered the throttle and unwound the steering wheel so I didn't go into a tank slapper. My heart was pounding and I could hear blood rushing to my brain. I can't really get that feeling with forza because it holds my hand too much.

I think GT5 has higher highs and much lower lows than Forza 3. Forza 3 is a more consistent experience, and really excels at tuning, community features, controller interpolation, tire falloff and modeling for the entire range of tires, sound, some graphical aspects, and collision between vehicles (rubbing is racing). GT5 excels at vehicle dynamics, huge variety in the single player campaign, presentation (not counting some weird UI decisions), overall art direction, and the variety of experiences you can have(yeah I mentioned this twice, it's the best part of the game).

you sir, are too rational to belong to this thread
 

X26

Banned
just an aside, but is the F50 not in GT5 or something? F40 in tons of the screenshots/vids used itt but none of the (superior) F50
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
phosphor112 said:
Have you never played a game... like, ever? Every game has a hit detection glitch. Prove me wrong.
Calm down. Yes, there's oodles of that shit like that in Forza too. It's just the "understandable" part that makes me wonder what shit gets a pass nowadays. Shit happens, I know but damn I always wonder what games today would be like if devs had the time and resources to polish their shit up.
 
Yoritomo said:
Anyone arguing that one game is SO MUCH BETTER than the other is a moron. They're both very similar games with similar design goals. Each game does certain things better.

319047856_dbf1ef3e92.jpg


You're a breath of fresh air. But I have no idea what you're doing in this wretched hive of scum and villainy.
 

Slayer-33

Liverpool-2
antiloop said:
Is this shit real? I mean bugs are horrible but this is game breaking..


Let's sensionalize online graphical bugs more due to lag brah.


Just saw the video though, looks hilarious.
:lol
 
Slayer-33 said:
Let's sensionalize online graphical bugs more due to lag brah.


Just saw the video though, looks hilarious.
:lol

It's not "graphical" if the car flying into you fucks up your physics. Just saying.
 

Slayer-33

Liverpool-2
phosphor112 said:
It's not "graphical" if the car flying into you fucks up your physics. Just saying.
He bumped into the car on the ground, even though he saw it in the air, hence the online graphical bug claim.

This shit is uncommon to this extent online, I would be worried if you saw it happen offline but since it doesn't I don't see the reason to try and blow this out of proportion.
 

skybaby

Member
Talking about glitches, I love crossing the Brooklyn bridge in PGR3 while playing online with a tight pack. It was almost certain someone would start pinballing all over the bridge at one point :lol
 

Slayer-33

Liverpool-2
skybaby said:
Talking about glitches, I love crossing the Brooklyn bridge in PGR3 while playing online with a tight pack. It was almost certain someone would start pinballing all over the bridge at one point :lol
Xf83b.gif


:lol
 
Shaneus said:
I just keep seeing stuff that seems bleedingly obvious to include but is being patched in at the "request" of "fans".
I wouldn't dare post that in the OT. . . but your right I think. After all why wouldn't you use the uber-loyal fanbase as a patch mask.
 
Slayer-33 said:
He bumped into the car on the ground, even though he saw it in the air, hence the online graphical bug claim.

This shit is uncommon to this extent online, I would be worried if you saw it happen offline but since it doesn't I don't see the reason to try and blow this out of proportion.

Erm.. not it's not just graphical. The floating kart on GT5 is graphical, this flying car shit is the interpolation of the vehicle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SjNxr7s64s

If you showed me some of that sort of thing in any other racing game, I wouldn't be surprised. FFS, lag in any shooter can cause someone to clip through a wall/floor. It happens, but to claim it's just "graphical" is 100% false.
 

Slayer-33

Liverpool-2
phosphor112 said:
Erm.. not it's not just graphical. The floating kart on GT5 is graphical, this flying car shit is the interpolation of the vehicle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SjNxr7s64s

If you showed me some of that sort of thing in any other racing game, I wouldn't be surprised. FFS, lag in any shooter can cause someone to clip through a wall/floor. It happens, but to claim it's just "graphical" is 100% false.
You must be right but the bottom line is that it's online, it's something that shouldn't be sweated specially with the infrequency of it occuring.
 
Slayer-33 said:
You must be right but the bottom line is that it's online, it's something that shouldn't be sweated specially with the infrequency of it occuring.

That's exactly what I'm saying ;o. Lol. I've been online gaming since Doom =P, so I know all about online experiences.
 

ElyrionX

Member
On the whole, GT5 has a lot more flaws than Forza 3. But what GT5 does right is truly amazing. The driving experience, the beautiful but clunky interface and the special events all combine to make it a better game than Forza 3, IMO.

Maybe I'm biased because I played Forza 3 on a pad and GT5 on a G27 but I think Forza really does get hampered by Microsoft's shitty third party peripherals policy.

Plus, the thing that puts me off the most in Forza was the massive amount of grinding required to buy the high end cars. Unfortunately, while GT5 has the sane problem but at least I can grind in B Spec mode without having to spend countless inane hours on the wheel and get some stuff done on the side.
 
ElyrionX said:
On the whole, GT5 has a lot more flaws than Forza 3. But what GT5 does right is truly amazing. The driving experience, the beautiful but clunky interface and the special events all combine to make it a better game than Forza 3, IMO.

Maybe I'm biased because I played Forza 3 on a pad and GT5 on a G27 but I think Forza really does get hampered by Microsoft's shitty third party peripherals policy.

Plus, the thing that puts me off the most in Forza was the massive amount of grinding required to buy the high end cars. Unfortunately, while GT5 has the sane problem but at least I can grind in B Spec mode without having to spend countless inane hours on the wheel and get some stuff done on the side.
Cars sell for a lot better in GT5. The resale prices in FM3 are ridiculous >_<
 

Shaneus

Member
CadetMahoney said:
I wouldn't dare post that in the OT. . . but your right I think. After all why wouldn't you use the uber-loyal fanbase as a patch mask.
Yeah, I wasn't actually using quotations as derogatory, more that "requests" are more "pre-existing yet unimplemented features" and "fans" are actually "devs", "Kaz" or "Sony".

I know replacing what I quoted doesn't quite fit in with what I originally wrote, but you get the idea... not paying out true fans, just saying that Polyphony are pinning it on them.
 

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
ElyrionX said:
Maybe I'm biased because I played Forza 3 on a pad and GT5 on a G27 but I think Forza really does get hampered by Microsoft's shitty third party peripherals policy.
Hey man, if you could spring for a G27, you could've easily gotten a Fanatec 911 TS when they were still available.
 

Yoritomo

Member
Jonsoncao said:
you sir, are too rational to belong to this thread


I got most of my first 100 posts trolling the hell out of this thread over a year ago. I thought I should leave a legitimate mark. :lol
 
XiaNaphryz said:
Hey man, if you could spring for a G27, you could've easily gotten a Fanatec 911 TS when they were still available.
It's not that easy. I got a G27, because I don't like the H-Shifter that comes with the Fanatec.
 
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