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[XiaNaphryz]

It's not that easy. I got a G27, because I don't like the H-Shifter that comes with the Fanatec.

They're planning on making a higher-end clubsport shifter.

 

[foomfoom415]

GT5's flaws are enough that I enjoy playing Forza 3 much more. However at the same time, GT5 brought enough new stuff to the table that Forza 3 now feels outdated.



This sucks.

 

[G_Berry]

After playing gt5 last night for 4 or 5 hours I have to say that it really is quite awesome!
However....

The skyboxes look a bit shit,
As do the Majority of the track textures and 2d trees.
The standard cars look a bit shit also.
Screen tearing is not so bad but it's there.
There are slight lod issues.
The thud noise when hitting other cars sounds shit.
The premium cars still have jags but look awesome,
However using that travel mode photo tool to showcase the games graphics is a bit unfair as they look nothing like that ingame.
The loading times are not as bad as people make out,
Neither is the interface or the sound.
The lighting on the freeway night track looks amazing.
Overall the lighting has a "capcom engine medal of honor I can't seem to find the right brightness / contrast" issue.

Great game. Won't be trading in!

 

[Psychotext]

After playing gt5 last night for 4 or 5 hours I have to say that it really is quite awesome!
However....

The loading times are not as bad as people make out,
Neither is the interface

Wait until you're 20, 30, 40 hours in and you find for the twentieth time you have to go through another bunch of load / confirm screens just because you've forgotten to buy the right type of tyres on your car...

/smashes everything

 

[Shaneus]

GT5's flaws are enough that I enjoy playing Forza 3 much more. However at the same time, GT5 brought enough new stuff to the table that Forza 3 now feels outdated.



This sucks.

This.

Wait until you're 20, 30, 40 hours in and you find for the twentieth time you have to go through another bunch of load / confirm screens just because you've forgotten to buy the right type of tyres on your car...

/smashes everything

and this.

Anyone else think that after fucking around and tuning your cars as much as possible, that the Forza 3 end result feels much more personal? I've fully worked a Swift in GT5 but it doesn't really feel like mine, whereas an equally customised Legacy B4 (no custom paint but all bodywork, tuning etc.) in Forza 3 truly feels like my own creation.

 

[antiquegamer]

yeah, I’m thinking the same thing but don’t really want to get into it in the OT. these patches seem like things that should’ve just been on the disc.

But, hey, they had to get it ready for Xmas 2010.

It's make me think that the delay was because the game just simply wasn't done. The patch fix simple stuff that should have been fix prior to game ship. This was the game that was suppose to be ready (at least for Japan release) back in March/April of this year.

Anyway, it's better to get patch than no patch however. In the old days if the game ship with bug then you will just have to deal with it at least now it can be patch but then yeah, you run into publisher that have "ship now" patch later mentality.

 

[theignoramus]

After playing gt5 last night for 4 or 5 hours I have to say that it really is quite awesome!
However....

The skyboxes look a bit shit,
As do the Majority of the track textures and 2d trees.
The standard cars look a bit shit also.
Screen tearing is not so bad but it's there.
There are slight lod issues.
The thud noise when hitting other cars sounds shit.
The premium cars still have jags but look awesome,
However using that travel mode photo tool to showcase the games graphics is a bit unfair as they look nothing like that ingame.
The loading times are not as bad as people make out,
Neither is the interface or the sound.
The lighting on the freeway night track looks amazing.
Overall the lighting has a "capcom engine medal of honor I can't seem to find the right brightness / contrast" issue.

Great game. Won't be trading in!

Obviously, but as opposed to what? The menu models swapped into Forza's photomode?

 

[Chrange]

Obviously, but as opposed to what? The menu models swapped into Forza's photomode?

GT5 has entire shooting locations that are swapped in :lol

 

[theignoramus]

GT5 has entire shooting locations that are swapped in :lol

I'm sorry, does that give Forza bullshots more integrity?:lol

 

[Chrange]

I'm sorry, does that give Forza bullshots more integrity?:lol

I just don't understand the thought process of people who call out he one game for "lying" when the other one does it to an even greater degree lol

 

[theignoramus]

I just don't understand the thought process of people who call out he one game for "lying" when the other one does it to an even greater degree lol

I agree, you dont even get to drive Forza's high lod models, let alone see them in replays.:lol

 

[Chrange]

I agree, you dont even get to drive Forza's high lod models, let alone see them in replays.:lol

Like you get to drive in the photo travel locations? :lol

Sorry but after all the "THEY LIED" garbage for months about Forza, it's hilarious to see the same people posting PT shots now

 

[Dead Man]

Wait until you're 20, 30, 40 hours in and you find for the twentieth time you have to go through another bunch of load / confirm screens just because you've forgotten to buy the right type of tyres on your car...

/smashes everything

God, so much this. I love the game, but fucking hell they made some shit UI decisions. Paint being used up? Who thought that was a good idea?

 

[Stripper13]

I agree, you dont even get to drive Forza's high lod models, let alone see them in replays.:lol

So let me get this straight? Photo-mode in Forza which you can take at any time, on any track, on any car - and come up with good/great results is somehow worse than GT5's "Hey here's a few photo-mode exclusive locations that you use to take excellent pictures of up to 20% of the cars in the game".

The level-of-detail bullshit that came up with Forza 3 was definitely an under-handed bullshot tactic... but GT5's system takes the cake entirely.

Replay-wise, we all know GT5 is king.

 

[antiloop]

You must be right but the bottom line is that it's online, it's something that shouldn't be sweated specially with the infrequency of it occuring.

This is 2010. A lot of people play more online than offline, no?

 

[theignoramus]

So let me get this straight? Photo-mode in Forza which you can take at any time, on any track, on any car - and come up with good/great results is somehow worse than GT5's "Hey here's a few photo-mode exclusive locations that you use to take excellent pictures of up to 20% of the cars in the game".

The level-of-detail bullshit that came up with Forza 3 was definitely an under-handed bullshot tactic... but GT5's system takes the cake entirely.

Replay-wise, we all know GT5 is king.

there was pre-rendered trailers and replay footage used in the advertising campaign, but I dont remember PT being promoted as anything other than what it was. Nobody loaded up the game and said "hey, why isnt this red bull hangar a race track!?".:lol
Everyone knew PT was a pretty area specifically designed for bullshots.

 

[Stripper13]

there was pre-rendered trailers and replay footage used in the advertising campaign, but I dont remember PT being promoted as anything other than what it was. Nobody loaded up the game and said "hey, why isnt this red bull hangar a race track!?".:lol

There were plenty of photo-mode bullshots floating around well before the advertising campaign. And more importantly, it's not about the what it was presented as, rather than it being about what the modes actually are.

To get the photo's people are getting out of Forza 3, just choose a track, car, and have a race.

To get the photo's people are getting out of GT5 (and while I'm aware you can take pics in-game/in-replay etc.. the Photo-mode pics are the ones floating around as evidence of GT5's graphical prowess) you have to choose from 20% of the car roster, on a select few locations that are otherwise completely unavailable. However PD chose to present this option, it's clearly a bull-shot generator that proves nothing other than the fact that PD had some messed up priorities when developing the game... (Awesome Photo mode... check. 60 FPS.... check. Best modelled cars ever.... check. Tirewalls.... fuck. Screen-tearing.... fuck. Good looking cars across the board... fuck. etc etc).

 

[Ashes]

Like you get to drive in the photo travel locations? :lol

Sorry but after all the "THEY LIED" garbage for months about Forza, it's hilarious to see the same people posting PT shots now

Nobody is that stupid. Now you're just openly trolling. :lol Two can play at that game!
Here, I'll do it more openly. These are all gt5 shots (wink):

 

[Ploid 3.0]

GT4 photo mode was the same. No one was tricked.

 

[DarkJC]

Wait until you're 20, 30, 40 hours in and you find for the twentieth time you have to go through another bunch of load / confirm screens just because you've forgotten to buy the right type of tyres on your car...

/smashes everything

I'm level 18 and it's still not that big a deal to me.

To get the photo's people are getting out of GT5 (and while I'm aware you can take pics in-game/in-replay etc.. the Photo-mode pics are the ones floating around as evidence of GT5's graphical prowess) you have to choose from 20% of the car roster, on a select few locations that are otherwise completely unavailable.

You can get just as good looking photos out of replay photo mode, you don't need to be in photo travel, unless you want 8MP. And trust me, there are tons of amazing looking photos that aren't from photo travel floating around, so quit pulling shit out of your ass.

 

[Ploid 3.0]

I'm level 18 and it's still not that big a deal to me.



You can get just as good looking photos out of replay photo mode, you don't need to be in photo travel, unless you want 8MP. And trust me, there are tons of amazing looking photos that aren't from photo travel floating around, so quit pulling shit out of your ass.

Wait :lol Hold on Jay, are you telling this guy to not take a crap anymore?

 

[DarkJC]

Well, thats one way to interpret it

 

[theignoramus]

There were plenty of photo-mode bullshots floating around well before the advertising campaign. And more importantly, it's not about the what it was presented as, rather than it being about what the modes actually are.

To get the photo's people are getting out of Forza 3, just choose a track, car, and have a race.

To get the photo's people are getting out of GT5 (and while I'm aware you can take pics in-game/in-replay etc.. the Photo-mode pics are the ones floating around as evidence of GT5's graphical prowess) you have to choose from 20% of the car roster, on a select few locations that are otherwise completely unavailable. However PD chose to present this option, it's clearly a bull-shot generator that proves nothing other than the fact that PD had some messed up priorities when developing the game... (Awesome Photo mode... check. 60 FPS.... check. Best modelled cars ever.... check. Tirewalls.... fuck. Screen-tearing.... fuck. Good looking cars across the board... fuck. etc etc).

So...you're angry about people using a feature of the game that functions the way it was advertised? Or you're angry about the praise being lavished on the PT pics, since the game doesnt look like that when you play it? (but duh) That's about all I can make out from your remarks..

 

[Yoritomo]

GT4 photo mode was the same. No one was tricked.

You were tricked into thinking you were buying a 60 fps racing game with GT5.

45 FPS with tearing baby it's the only way to race.

"OMG they swap to lower LOD models LIESSSS".

Well hell if GT5 would manage lod better perhaps it could actually hit 60 fps with more than 1 car on the screen.

 

[scandisk_]

try harder....

 

[duk]

You were tricked into thinking you were buying a 60 fps racing game with GT5.

45 FPS with tearing baby it's the only way to race.

"OMG they swap to lower LOD models LIESSSS".

Well hell if GT5 would manage lod better perhaps it could actually hit 60 fps with more than 1 car on the screen.

cold cold

 

[Windom Earle]

Photo Mode bitching

Lots of sand in your vagina!

 

[nib95]

You were tricked into thinking you were buying a 60 fps racing game with GT5.

45 FPS with tearing baby it's the only way to race.

"OMG they swap to lower LOD models LIESSSS".

Well hell if GT5 would manage lod better perhaps it could actually hit 60 fps with more than 1 car on the screen.

You realise in the majority of those tests the average frame rate was like 57fps?

 

[Stripper13]

GT4 photo mode was the same. No one was tricked.

I can't speak for everyone - but I certainly don't believe I was 'tricked'. It's just that the PT mode is, at its core, a bull-shot generator. Nothing in the game looks anywhere near the same as the PT photo mode. That's fine.. cool a mode for the hardcore car collectors/enthusiasts. It becomes an issue however when A) It is used the majority of the time when talking about or talking up the game B) It is implemented despite a large number of issues still existing within the game - not least of which are the inconsistencies of the actual in-game graphics.

 

[TheOddOne]

I think this belongs here.

NFS Shift 2: “We won’t add 1000 irrelevant cars”, says lead designer

Andy Tudor, the lease designer behind Need for Speed: Shift 2 – Unleashed, has promised the game will be all about racing instead of car collecting.

Speaking in an interview with Eurogamer, Tudor said the fun in racing games is “behind the wheel” not grinding for cash to buy another car.

“[Gran Turismo and Forza] are on pedestals at the moment. When we’re thinking about what we want to do in this game, it’s not a numbers game,” said Tudor. “We’re not going to add a thousand irrelevant cars. Both those games, to me, are almost like encyclopedias. You’ve got a thousand cars, a thousand tracks, whatever, and basically the game is about earning cash to get another car, earning cash to get another car. It’s like a grind. It’s almost like stamp collecting.

“That’s not where the fun is. The fun is behind the wheel, feeling you’re on the edge, pushing it to the limit, putting in the cars that are relevant and cool to drive, allowing you to completely customize those from factory to the works level we had in Shift 1, and giving you the chance to then play against your friends in a social way. Taking Autolog, which is present in Hot Pursuit, to the next level, adding more features and making the core gameplay really fun as opposed to just adding five variations of the 1986 Toyota Corolla or something like that.”

According to Tudor, most players only have around 10-15 cars in their virtual garages anyway, tending to go for cars similar to the ones they own in real life. Tudor said the developers have also found that most players just get a car from each tier or category, and then pick a dream car like a Lamborghini or a Porsche.

“Then, generally, people fill out the rest with cars they want to try out, like a Dodge Challenger, that they may not have access to,” he said. “So people have 10-15 cars anyway. They certainly don’t fill their garage up with every single car there is in the game – all 500 of them.

“It’s a different way of thinking, basically. We want to take those guys on. We want to make a more authentic experience. We’ve put in a new elite handling model and given you more access over deadzone, sensitivity, steering aids, break assists, all that kind of stuff, to allow you to dial in the experience you want. We all come from different backgrounds. You may love muscle cars and might think Burnout is the best game in the world. I may like Japanese tuner cars, and may think Hot Pursuit is the best game in the world.

“We have very different views on racing, so we want to make sure everyone is able to get the experience they want from it.”

Shift 2: Unleashed, which will provide an innovative helmet camera view, will release in spring 2011 for PC, PS3, and Xbox 360.

 

[Ploid 3.0]

You were tricked into thinking you were buying a 60 fps racing game with GT5.

45 FPS with tearing baby it's the only way to race.

"OMG they swap to lower LOD models LIESSSS".

Well hell if GT5 would manage lod better perhaps it could actually hit 60 fps with more than 1 car on the screen.

The only thing GT5 didn't deliver on, for me, was the upload video to youtube. Other than that I'm satisfied.

After being burned on no online when GT4 launched, GT5 delivered on it's first night. I'll never forget that gaf night race 2 laps random cars of about the same level Nurburgring. I separated from them until the Nascar thing stops though. If you guys are watching I just couldn't hang. Nascar requires a gentle touch. :lol

I think this belongs here.

NFS Shift 2: “We won’t add 1000 irrelevant cars”, says lead designer

This guy just don't know, I like stamp collecting. Especially if my car could be one of the stamps. I'll never tune, and race my car irl, but in a game I can.

 

[Ashes]

Damn, I'll say one good thing about Criterion and PD as developers, are pretty cool and tolerable. Some of the smack talk by Turn 10 and Slightly Mad Studios are just embarrassing.

 

[Stripper13]

You can get just as good looking photos out of replay photo mode, you don't need to be in photo travel, unless you want 8MP. And trust me, there are tons of amazing looking photos that aren't from photo travel floating around, so quit pulling shit out of your ass.

Oh I know, I have seen them - and I've praised them (even in this thread) for the quality of the pics available in replay mode etc. It doesn't change the fact that the PT mode outputs, quite often used in the PR/Advertising/Hype prior to release, and even now by PD/GT fans to 'prove' something, are based off what is essentially bullshit.

So...you're angry about people using a feature of the game that functions the way it was advertised? Or you're angry about the praise being lavished on the PT pics, since the game doesnt look like that when you play it? (but duh) That's about all I can make out from your remarks..

Not angry, just giving my two cents on the matter. For the record, it's more the latter of your statements that I'm leaning on. As someone who played the game quite a bit before returning it, I can 100% truthfully say that I never saw one moment 'in-game' (or even in replay mode) that came close to the PT mode. And being as bias-free as possible, I can say that I saw plenty of moments in Forza 3 that looked as good as the photo/replays very often. I'm not saying it's a technical feat etc but as far as the Level-of-detail fiasco went, the PT mode photo's being passed around as 'proof' of anything but PD's inability to manage time/resources to build a consistent game, is IMO, a waste of time.

Lots of sand in your vagina!

Nice input!

 

[painful fart]

I'm not saying it's a technical feat etc but as far as the Level-of-detail fiasco went, the PT mode photo's being passed around as 'proof' of anything but PD's inability to manage time/resources to build a consistent game, is IMO, a waste of time.

Lots of sand in your vagina.

 

[saladine1]

I think this belongs here.

NFS Shift 2: “We won’t add 1000 irrelevant cars”, says lead designer

Well, I disagree about the irrelevancy of certain cars and tracks. I mean, I might like a 71 GTR, others may prefer a 03 M3...it's all about choice and I love this aspect of both FM and GT....absolutely love it!
I hate it when racing games only offer the newest cars,the fastest cars,the supercars. I want to be able to drive a shitbox and turn it into an absolute machine. I want to take on a Ferrari with my Datsun 510. I want to take on a Lamborghini with my Shelby Mustang.
Again, it's all about options,content and customization...
What I do agree with is that SHIFT does deliver an awesome 'racing' experience with a very good cockpit and tension on the track. Sure it had it's flaws as well but can you imagine how much better FM or GT would be if it had the same racing feeling that SHIFT offered?
It would be so exhilirating.

 

[Slayer-33]

This is 2010. A lot of people play more online than offline, no?

Bugs like that will occur not because of the fault of the game but because of the fault of the network/users ISP etc, we are not in South Korea or Japan. Online bugs are clearly not in any way replicated offline where in actuality the vast majority play (campaign/career modes) any packet loss to an extent can cause the "gamebreaking bugs" you see by throwing a huge wrench into code that gets loose with a peaked inconsistency from servers.

We still have a primitive online infrastructure in place that is slowly being replaced.


You can say that there won't be any excuse in 2015 maybe at the ealiest for none of this to happen, but as it is right now 2010 is still too early to expect not seeing this sort of issue.

 

[Zaptruder]

You realise in the majority of those tests the average frame rate was like 57fps?

Not when it doesn't suit his narrative!

 

[Zaptruder]

Oh I know, I have seen them - and I've praised them (even in this thread) for the quality of the pics available in replay mode etc. It doesn't change the fact that the PT mode outputs, quite often used in the PR/Advertising/Hype prior to release, and even now by PD/GT fans to 'prove' something, are based off what is essentially bullshit.



Not angry, just giving my two cents on the matter. For the record, it's more the latter of your statements that I'm leaning on. As someone who played the game quite a bit before returning it, I can 100% truthfully say that I never saw one moment 'in-game' (or even in replay mode) that came close to the PT mode. And being as bias-free as possible, I can say that I saw plenty of moments in Forza 3 that looked as good as the photo/replays very often. I'm not saying it's a technical feat etc but as far as the Level-of-detail fiasco went, the PT mode photo's being passed around as 'proof' of anything but PD's inability to manage time/resources to build a consistent game, is IMO, a waste of time.




Nice input!

You're going about a very simple statement and idea in the worst way possible if you don't mean to troll.

"I wish PD would have used the time they used to make all those photomode locations on doing up old tracks or making more new ones instead."

Easy, not controversial, means the same thing once you cut through the guff and the stupid.

 

[Brashnir]

Has the thread really reached the point where we're arguing which bullshots are more bullshotty?

 

[Dead Man]

Has the thread really reached the point where we're arguing which bullshots are more bullshotty?

Apparently so. :lol

You're going about a very simple statement and idea in the worst way possible if you don't mean to troll.

"I wish PD would have used the time they used to make all those photomode locations on doing up old tracks or making more new ones instead."

Easy, not controversial, means the same thing once you cut through the guff and the stupid.

I love my GT5 and I will heartily endorse that statement.

 

[Psychotext]

You realise in the majority of those tests the average frame rate was like 57fps?

That was a rather cherry picked figure wasn't it? There were 6 average framerate figures in the test you got that from... and five of the others were lower.

Spoiler

Special Stage Route 7
Bumper：Avg:43.400fps Min-Max:35.5-53.5fps Tear:70.222%
Cockpit：Avg:37.483fps Min-Max:31.0-45.5fps Tear:60.500%

Chamonix
Bumper:Avg:52.733fps Min-Max:43.5-58.0fps Tear:84.306%
Cockpit:Avg:47.900fps Min-Max:40.0-54.5fps Tear:78.250%

London
Bumper:Avg:57.110fps Min-Max:48.5-60.0fps Tear:53.002%
Cockpit:Avg:48.400fps Min-Max:39.5-57.0fps Tear:78.385%

 

[SmokyDave]

I love my GT5 and I will heartily endorse that statement.

I love my GT5 and especially the photo-mode

I really 'get' what Polyphony were doing with photo travel. I love it. I'd like to see them add more photo travel locations. It's not supposed to be representative of in-game graphics, it's not supposed to be a fanboy baiting tool, it's supposed to be the highest possible quality photo-mode available in a 'car' game. It's for car lovers to meticulously pose their precious metal and then 'ooh' and 'aah' whilst you walk around it, looking for the perfect angle.

The end results speak for themselves, it is possible to achieve nigh-on photo-realism. That in and of itself impresses the shit out of me. I'd have bought a photo mode only game with 20 locations and 300 premium models and still have felt I'd got my moneys worth.

 

[ResidentDante]

GT4 photo mode was the same. No one was tricked.

Say that to all the GT boys posting random pics from photomode to prove what the game looks like.

 

[Stripper13]

I love my GT5 and especially the photo-mode

I really 'get' what Polyphony were doing with photo travel. I love it. I'd like to see them add more photo travel locations. It's not supposed to be representative of in-game graphics, it's not supposed to be a fanboy baiting tool, it's supposed to be the highest possible quality photo-mode available in a 'car' game. It's for car lovers to meticulously pose their precious metal and then 'ooh' and 'aah' whilst you walk around it, looking for the perfect angle.

The end results speak for themselves, it is possible to achieve nigh-on photo-realism. That in and of itself impresses the shit out of me. I'd have bought a photo mode only game with 20 locations and 300 premium models and still have felt I'd got my moneys worth.

That's awesome that you enjoy it so much. I can certainly see its merits, and the results speak for themselves in terms of its effectiveness and polish. My concern is that looking back through this thread you see alot of photo's from PT mode attached to a post that more or less touts the graphical prowess of GT5, when in fact the game looks nothing like the PT mode unless you want to park a limited number of cars, in a few select locations.

I'm all for the mode, I really am... I would be more than happy to see it in any racing game in the future because it obviously pleases a subset of gamers (and definitely has benefits for everyone) that want that ability and impressive output. I even had quite a bit of fun with it with my little red Daihatsu I won near the beginning of the game (all Gold in B's perhaps? can't recall) because of the mode. It just seems to be some sort of bold positive talking point (in general) from the GT5/PD fans when, at least from my point of view, it is indicative of a messy development process that seen more polish and focus go into a very specific mode, than went into the general track/environment quality and more importantly, the frame-rate and screen tearing optimisation.

 

[Opus Angelorum]

The photo modes are funtional, however when they are used to show how good the game can look (when in reality the cars look much poorer in-game) it becomes an issue.

Some the of the GT5 photos look unbelievable, in-game...a different story.

And Forza 3 has the same issue, although not as obvious as Turn 10 are not attempting outright realism.

 

[scandisk_]

:lol

 

[Router]

GT5's flaws are enough that I enjoy playing Forza 3 much more. However at the same time, GT5 brought enough new stuff to the table that Forza 3 now feels outdated.



This sucks.

STOP STEALING MY OPINIONS DAMN YOU.

 

[eso76]

one thing i don't like in either is how pointless lower division races become after a couple hours.
I really hate seeing 7 out of 10 competitions i didn't even enter but there's no point going back to them when they're 3/4000 credits worth and your level allows you to compete in the 30k/40k prize range. Both developers really need to think of something to spice things up; at the end of the day GT5's most entertaining stuff is licenses and special events.

Advice for T10.
Rewind made me realize how awesome it would be to have some 'special extreme maneuvers which require omgmadskillz' events.
What does it mean ? sometimes you don't want to (or are not allowed to) rewind to a more comfortable moment of the race, and you find yourself trying to escape or control a situation which already went a little pear-shaped (learned the expression reading top gear impressions on fm3 ).
Happened a lot to me and thought it was great fun, actually.
Could be a great response to GT license tests and an even more effecive driving school to teach you advanced techniques.

Let's say you're put in control of a car heading into a wall at 200mph (take this, GT braking license test !) or a car oversteering or a car already fishtailing from too much countersteering, or a car which back wheels touched grass and you're about to lose control.
It would also be cool if at lower levels, the game told you exactly what to do (like, countersteer 450° now, release accelerator a bit, shift down, feather on clutch) even in slow motion, and told you what you did wrong or right.

 

[Mastperf]

That was a rather cherry picked figure wasn't it? There were 6 average framerate figures in the test you got that from... and five of the others were lower.

Spoiler

Special Stage Route 7
Bumper：Avg:43.400fps Min-Max:35.5-53.5fps Tear:70.222%
Cockpit：Avg:37.483fps Min-Max:31.0-45.5fps Tear:60.500%

Chamonix
Bumper:Avg:52.733fps Min-Max:43.5-58.0fps Tear:84.306%
Cockpit:Avg:47.900fps Min-Max:40.0-54.5fps Tear:78.250%

London
Bumper:Avg:57.110fps Min-Max:48.5-60.0fps Tear:53.002%
Cockpit:Avg:48.400fps Min-Max:39.5-57.0fps Tear:78.385%

Get them damn facts outa here, boy!
It manages 57 fps (with over half of those frames torn) that's all that needs to be seen...end of discussion!

 

[Stripper13]

one thing i don't like in either is how pointless lower division races become after a couple hours.
I really hate seeing 7 out of 10 competitions i didn't even enter but there's no point going back to them when they're 3/4000 credits worth and your level allows you to compete in the 30k/40k prize range. Both developers really need to think of something to spice things up; at the end of the day GT5's most entertaining stuff is licenses and special events.

Advice for T10.
Rewind made me realize how awesome it would be to have some 'special extreme maneuvers which require omgmadskillz' events.
What does it mean ? sometimes you don't want to (or are not allowed to) rewind to a more comfortable moment of the race, and you find yourself trying to escape or control a situation which already went a little pear-shaped (learned the expression reading top gear impressions on fm3 ).
Happened a lot to me and thought it was great fun, actually.
Could be a great response to GT license tests and an even more effecive driving school to teach you advanced techniques.

Let's say you're put in control of a car heading into a wall at 200mph (take this, GT braking license test !) or a car oversteering or a car already fishtailing from too much countersteering, or a car which back wheels touched grass and you're about to lose control.
It would also be cool if at lower levels, the game told you exactly what to do (like, countersteer 450° now, release accelerator a bit, shift down, feather on clutch) even in slow motion, and told you what you did wrong or right.

Great ideas.

Also completely agree on the lower division race events - it's absolutely the biggest thing that GT5 and F3 have in common (aside from being racing games). Both F3 and GT5 made me want to progress to the point where having to step back into a lower class/level car for the sake of completion was an absolute chore. I'm not sure what the solution is besides creating a linear experience that offers little branching/freedom (like Hot Pursuit I guess)... but I certainly hope it is fixed in the next racing sim genre entry... seeing the dreaded 'D' class or '200hp' etc restrictions show up when trying to 100% the game is a fucking nightmare.