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[drugstore_cowboy]

Would you class rFactor, netKar or Live for Speed as sims?

They ship with little to no licensed content so there is no comparison to real world tracks and times.

 

[seattle6418]

NASCAR physics?

Either NASCAR has a seperate physics model or everything you said was rubbish.

The entire set of variables that make up the Nascar part of GT5 is wrong, from the lack of proper tire modelling, to the lack of car parts!

The physics engine was slapped on the Nascar cars without any adjustments. The camber/toe and other suspension adjustments are still front and rear, when they should be left/right.

There´s no proper wedge or track bar adjustments, meaning the game is simulating things that don´t exist and not simulating things that are present on those cars.

The worst offender is the lack of restrictor plates, making the races in Daytona a joke, because you don´t have 900hp cars in there since the 80´s.

You are right, there should be a separate set of physics and features for those cars, because they are entirely different. The whole standard set of values given to the suspension is ot only wrong but it comes from parts that don´t exist on those cars.

Agian, we are talking about in depth features, but if you are a sim game, and you know you are going to be compared to iRacing and older Papyrus games, you have to do it right otherwise it´s a detriment to the game.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

LOL, are you really saying that those things don't happen in GT5? That a Zonda R for example launches completely straight under full throttle? That understeer doesn't exist in GT (mega LOL) or that you can't lock up the front wheels (try racing without ABS for once)?

My God, you and FordGTDude are simply mindblowing.

Its clear he has never played GT5 or even bothered to look things up.

 

[seattle6418]

Would you class rFactor, netKar or Live for Speed as sims?

They ship with little to no licensed content so there is no comparison to real world tracks and times.

That´s not the point of those games. They have a game engine with values to simulate. Of course it´s a sim, the only difference is that the content is produced by the community. Those games would be nothing on the market if you couldn´t produce content for it.

Your experience with those games can change a lot depending on the mod you´re playing it. iRacing is regarded by many as the top standard for sim games because the content is produced by a professional developer, and thus, is much more polished than most mods.

rFactor and others are different types of sims, but they are simulation games, it´s not even debatable on the three examples mentioned.

 

[Pepto]

LOL, are you really saying that [...] a Zonda R for example launches completely straight under full throttle?

It does in my version of the game.

 

[phosphor112]

NASCAR physics?

Either NASCAR has a seperate physics model or everything you said was rubbish.

The Aero aspects of it are very off. Nascar's create VERY little downforce.

 

[shinnn]

Have Turn 10 never visited Laguna Seca before. The race track does not reflect light like that lol, and their rumble strips are the wrong colour and their missing the red bits that shows the apex of each corner.

First, yes the track will reflect the light if in the same condition as in the game. Facing the sun, and the asphalt with rubber.

Second, Laguna Seca had red strips in the past. FM4 does have the strips in blue.

 

[Toxa]

my beautiful pic with angst

 

[shinnn]

LOL, are you really saying that those things don't happen in GT5? That a Zonda R for example launches completely straight under full throttle? That understeer doesn't exist in GT (mega LOL) or that you can't lock up the front wheels (try racing without ABS for once)?

My God, you and FordGTDude are simply mindblowing.

So GT5 physics are right because all the cars act like the Zonda R?

This is mindblowing.

 

[gutterboy44]

Champions league time. The only other form of shit talking that could take me away from this captivating shit talking.

 

[Protome]

So GT5 physics are right because all the cars act like the Zonda R?

This is mindblowing.

He doesn't say anything remotely similar to that in his post.

 

[GTP_Daverytimes]

Well one of the most fascinating thing about dick waving in a thread like this is we have much more tangible real life counter parts to compare to, which is why the flames can burn for so long. Laguna Seca is Laguna Seca, a 2012 BMW M3 is a real car you can drive on that track in the game and in real life probably pretty easily. Moreover, the very nature of racing is a repeatable process. You are lapping a circuit in the same vehicle over and over, you are amassing numerous data points for comparison without even thinking about it. So when you are able to compare this to a real life experience or across multiple games on multiple platforms, with the same or similar cars on the same exact track, you have a tremendous foundation of objective and subjective data.

Sure you can compare the accuracy of gun models in BF3 v COD but most people aren't shooting them at human beings over and over in real life (hopefully) so they can't say much about how the game renders the experience of it. However, a lot of racing sim fans end up or simultaneous race cars in real life at some point. I know a ton of iRacers who use the game as a way to stay sharp or bring down lap times in between their track days. Even a buddy who now is on his third build of a race car and is wealthy enough to enjoy the luxury of consistent days at the track is resulting back to sim racers, specifically iRacing to hone his skill in the down time. Racing sims kept me sane from my 7 years in NYC where I barely ever got to drive, let alone a car on a road I want to be driving on.

Very few other gaming genres out there can claim that. It is dick waving, but racing sim dick waving has at least one ball in reality. Accuracy matters in sims, it is the entire fricking point.

Indeed, the racing sim genre is truly one of a kind in the gaming world. I think the creators should be giving tremendous respect for what they do because it ain't easy. Anyways i look forward to the day we can have a grid of 60-100 cars on tracks like the Nurburgring.

So GT5 physics are right because all the cars act like the Zonda R?

This is mindblowing.

What are you even talking about?

 

[gutterboy44]

Indeed, the racing sim genre is truly one of a kind in the gaming world. I think the creators should be giving tremendous respect for what they do because it ain't easy. Anyways i look forward to the day we can have a grid of 60-100 cars on tracks like the Nurburgring.

That and like a 4th gen Oculus Rift where the IQ is near flawless. That with some good in ear monitors on...fuck yes! Immersion is addicting, no wonder so many people dabble with a "basic" cockpit build and end up $8K later with an insane setup.

 

[shinnn]

He doesn't say anything remotely similar to that in his post.

What he said?

The other guy said that cars in GT5 don't sidestep. He responded saying that Zonda R don't do sidestep. What conclusion did you get from his response?

 

[Metalmurphy]

What he said?

The other guy said that cars in GT5 don't sidestep. He responded saying that Zonda R don't do sidestep. What conclusion did you get from his response?

It was first said high powered rear-wheel cars don't lift off in a straight line, implying they do in GT5.

Then he gave a sarcastic remark about one that doesn't do that all. That doesn't mean it's the only one that doesn't do it. Cause it's not.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

First, yes the track will reflect the light if in the same condition as in the game. Facing the sun, and the asphalt with rubber.

Second, Laguna Seca had red strips in the past. FM4 does have the strips in blue.

Still no red marker to show the apex and please show me a video of laguna seca glaring that much. I've never seen so much glare.

 

[Mascot]

Still no red marker to show the apex and please show me a video of laguna seca glaring that much. I've never seen so much glare.

Just curious - why do you care so much?

 

[Risk Breaker]

It does in my version of the game.

Now test it again with the Cobra. Then with the F10. Then with the Speed 12. Then come back and tell us what happened. With videos from 4 different PoVs please. And with its respective tyres, not with RS.

Also do it with Forza.

And do both with a wheel.

And do it naked. While wearing Kaz and Greenawalt masks. I'm sure you have at least one of those at home.

 

[Protome]

What he said?

The other guy said that cars in GT5 don't sidestep. He responded saying that Zonda R don't do sidestep. What conclusion did you get from his response?

It was just an example of one car that does, he didn't say that all cars behave like that one car. That was you either misreading his post or putting words in his mouth, whichever you'd prefer.

 

[saladine1]

I think you guys are forgetting one thing

 

[Snubbers]

No cause the majority if his points are agreed and well worn and the only one that matters, physics he seems to have a preference opinion over anything objective like the FFB articles Amar had posted

Thomas Buchta (Fanatec) says this on GTPlanet:

Good explanation. I might want to add that this XID protocoll is only better in theory. In practice most games use only force commands (left and right) because they are used to program FF effects that way from PS3 or PC games. Therefore the technology is not fully exploited yet. But the protocol is already better because of the additional support for vibration motors.
The reason why our wheels are a bit more expensive is that we made two independent sets of electronics into the wheel to get support for two consoles. This technology is pretty tricky and certainly the most advanced on the market today. Beside that you even have the option between wireless and wired on PS3/PC.

So XID is technically better, but developers used to HID will struggle with it. That's fair and valid, but we are talking T10 and FM, where XID is there only FFB option and clearly their primary market for wheel users..

I only see a great deal of subjectivity in people's FFB assessments, but there are some simple objective tests and a general acceptance of the following
1. Forza has a good torque element modelled in FFB, take a FWD car and launch on full throttle with wheel spin.. you get torque effects. Do the same on GT, and it's non-existant
2. Take a FWD car on a constant radius long corner and build speed to gradually increase slip angle, in Forza you get an amplified FFB effect as the slip angle increases, in GT you get very little
3. There are many vibration effects in Forza (engine, kerbs, etc), these aren't possible on HID devices (and thus GT)
4. Track feedback (suspension feedback) is rather subdued, it's not missing completely, but it's clear that T10 concentrate on the tyre FFB with just rudimentary suspension FFB

I can't see a technical reason why (for example) XID is responsible for the difference in FFB that exists between the games, it's more a design decision..

What you want is a game with both tyre FFB and track FFB at the same level, and so far Assetto Corsa seems to do that exceedingly well..

 

[seattle6418]

1. Forza has a good torque element modelled in FFB, take a FWD car and launch on full throttle with wheel spin.. you get torque effects. Do the same on GT, and it's non-existant

FF cars are very sensitive to LSD on GT5.

Play a bit with the limited slip settings + tuning and you will get FF cars to behave a bit differently. (LSD on low settings + brute power on crap tires will give you this).

Still, i agree that we could have a bit more on that department.

 

[Evolution_1ne]

I think you guys are forgetting one thing

lol this isn't need for speed underground

 

[shinnn]

It was first said high powered rear-wheel cars don't lift off in a straight line, implying they do in GT5.

Then he gave a sarcastic remark about one that doesn't do that all. That doesn't mean it's the only one that doesn't do it. Cause it's not.

It was just an example of one car that does, he didn't say that all cars behave like that one car. That was you either misreading his post or putting words in his mouth, whichever you'd prefer.

No. I know what he meant. So you guys also think there's no problem in the GT5 physics in that regard?

Now test it again with the Cobra. Then with the F10. Then with the Speed 12. Then come back and tell us what happened. With videos from 4 different PoVs please. And with its respective tyres, not with RS.

Also do it with Forza.

And do both with a wheel.

And do it naked. While wearing Kaz and Greenawalt masks. I'm sure you have at least one of those at home.

So you are just joking or what? the Cobra will launch in an straight line, just like every rwd car that I tried in GT5. Changing the tires will do nothing.

Still no red marker to show the apex and please show me a video of laguna seca glaring that much. I've never seen so much glare.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5WyU9mgQAw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3sWrA0dvPA&t=1m50s

Why dont you just say: "I dont like this track in this way". Instead of saying stupid things to dismiss the game.

 

[drugstore_cowboy]

I'm not starting something here but wasn't there some NOS related data buried in GT5?

Left over from a previous game or possibly cut from the final game?

 

[Red Chocobo]

This is more fun when it's just pictures and gifs

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3sWrA0dvPA&t=1m50s

Why dont you just say: "I dont like this track in this way". Instead of saying stupid things to dismiss the game.

In both videos there was very little glare. The track in now way reflect light like this:

Just curious - why do you care so much?

Because its unrealistic and something I have only seen in Forza.

 

[shinnn]

In both videos there was very little glare. The track in now way reflect light like this:

Because its unrealistic and something I have only seen in Forza.

now you changed the video? lol

Whatever. You can find the same lighting condition for the FM4 setting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f72pCucvPag&t=1m50s

 

[Gestault]

now you changed the video? lol

Whatever. You can find the same lighting condition for the FM4 setting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f72pCucvPag&t=1m50s

Wow. Fatality.

If I'm not mistaken, this now means that Pyscho_Mantis just spelled out a major visual shortcoming of GT5 by claiming he only sees that style of lighting in Forza.

 

[Risk Breaker]

Out of curiosity, do people in the Forza camp know that the true physics of GT5 are used in online mode (and maybe in offline races with fuel/tyre degradation, but I'm not sure)? It truly makes a difference compared to normal offline races. I wonder if people over at GTPlanet investigated the matter further. I'm curious as to what the differences are, or if it's only tyre temperature/degradation and weight of the fuel tank actually applying.

now you changed the video? lol

Whatever. You can find the same lighting condition for the FM4 setting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f72pCucvPag&t=1m50s

Camera adjusting to light duh!

 

[Red Chocobo]

Whatever. You can find the same lighting condition for the FM4 setting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f72pCucvPag&t=1m50s

That's just the cheap on-board camera blowing out the highlights.

GT is more what you see with your eyes.

 

[Aguirre]

lol this isn't need for speed underground

genuinely fun game. there. i said it.

 

[Cyberia]

So when should we expect the reveal of GT6?

 

[Red Chocobo]

So when should we expect the reveal of GT6?

Could be any moment now.

 

[AstroNut325]

So when should we expect the reveal of GT6?

E3 2013. Release for PS3 in 2016.

 

[Evolution_1ne]

genuinely fun game. there. i said it.

it was because of Samantha's hello kitty Honda Civic wasn't it

Spoiler

yes it was a very fun game

 

[Mascot]

Just fired up GT5 for an hour or so and holy fuck, the lighting is incredible. Blah blah screen tearing blah frame stutters blah kills me, but nevertheless, the image quality is staggering.

 

[velociraptor]

Just fired up GT5 for an hour or so and holy fuck, the lighting is incredible. Blah blah screen tearing blah frame stutters blah kills me, but nevertheless, the image quality is staggering.

I think GT5 looks impeccable on a plasma TV. On an LCD however... a bit so and so. Good in some parts, bad in other parts.

 

[SolidSnakex]

So when should we expect the reveal of GT6?

CV&G said that their sources said that it'd be revealed in the next few weeks. And Polyphony recently gave the Asian official GT sites a makeover while noting that they'll post an update when the same will happen to the western sites.

There are a couple possible unveiling points coming up next week. Famitsu has a reveal, Sony is holding an event in Brazil and Game Informer will unveil their new cover. All are possibilities.

 

[velociraptor]

It'll be a sad day when GT6 is announced on the PS3.

I'm secretly wishing for a cross-platform port.

 

[Cyberia]

CV&G said that their sources said that it'd be revealed in the next few weeks. And Polyphony recently gave the Asian official GT sites a makeover while noting that they'll post an update when the same will happen to the western sites.

There are a couple possible unveiling points coming up next week. Famitsu has a reveal, Sony is holding an event in Brazil and Game Informer will unveil their new cover. All are possibilities.

I see. Only a matter of weeks.

 

[Angst]

Out of curiosity, do people in the Forza camp know that the true physics of GT5 are used in online mode (and maybe in offline races with fuel/tyre degradation, but I'm not sure)? It truly makes a difference compared to normal offline races. I wonder if people over at GTPlanet investigated the matter further. I'm curious as to what the differences are, or if it's only tyre temperature/degradation and weight of the fuel tank actually applying.




Camera adjusting to light duh!

Lots of people playing GT5 don't know that the physics are different online. We had lots of first-timers in the NRL league claiming that they had practiced a lot only to have a horrible race and being utterly confused as why they couldn't go full throttle through corners and why having one wheel on the grass while braking sent them into a spin. Not to mention their first time in a LMP online...

Speaking of LMPs, pick the Mazda 787B, race hard tyres, online lounge with full track physics and Spa Francorchamps. Do ten laps and you will be sweaty and your heart will be beating.

If all tracks in GT6 has the same attention to detail as Spa, Nordschleife and Suzuka I will be in gaming heaven.

 

[Mascot]

I think GT5 looks impeccable on a plasma TV. On an LCD however... a bit so and so. Good in some parts, bad in other parts.

Yeah, was playing it on the Pioneer plasma downstairs, but upstairs on the old 720p Sharp LCD attached to the racing rig it still looks pretty fucking beautiful. I can't imagine what GT6 on PS4 is going to look like. True photorealism, perhaps?

 

[weekend_warrior]

One of these things is not like the other. One of these things is Forza.

I suggest you leave this thread now.

Forza has the wrong color bumpers, enjoy your inferior racing game!

 

[seattle6418]

I'm curious as to what the differences are, or if it's only tyre temperature/degradation and weight of the fuel tank actually applying.

Ding ding ding!

Tire wear and fuel are the differences. Those things are turned off on most a-spec races. People really are not used to racing with degradable tires/fuel. The physics system cannot be analyzed without turning those on.

 

[Gestault]

Forza has the wrong color bumpers, enjoy your inferior racing game!

Thread over

 

[Risk Breaker]

^^^ Thanks seattle, I trust your insight

Lots of people playing GT5 don't know that the physics are different online. We had lots of first-timers in the NRL league claiming that they had practiced a lot only to have a horrible race and being utterly confused as why they couldn't go full throttle through corners and why having one wheel on the grass while braking sent them into a spin. Not to mention their first time in a LMP online...

Speaking of LMPs, pick the Mazda 787B, race hard tyres, online lounge with full track physics and Spa Francorchamps. Do ten laps and you will be sweaty and your heart will be beating.

If all tracks in GT6 has the same attention to detail as Spa, Nordschleife and Suzuka I will be in gaming heaven.

Indeed. Those Caterham 7 races were something else online too. Damn, that was so fun.

And yeah, if the new tracks they are prepparing are as good as Spa... I won't care THAT MUCH if it's PS3 only. I just want more tracks, lots of them, I'm on the Amar side of tracks >>> cars

Also more online/tournament options and we're golden for another NRL season or two I really need to move somewhere I can have my DFGT when GT6 comes out

 

[TEH-CJ]

I fell asleep so I missed the discussion regarding the sound issues in gt5

did anyone clarify why the sounds in GT5 are so bad? was it due to the ram allocation?

anyone recommend a good sounding car in gt5 I can take for a spin? because I have only tested the R33 gtr and bmw m3 and both sounded horrible.

how is the online community? is it still active?

 

[FlyFaster]

I just want more tracks, lots of them,

I 2nd this. More tracks please.

Also, *gasp!* I'd like Bikes too. hey, it'd be a way to one up Forza 5 on nextbox. "GT6 has bikes" PD has models of them, so they've considered it in the past at the very least.

 

[TEH-CJ]

I think GT5 looks impeccable on a plasma TV. On an LCD however... a bit so and so. Good in some parts, bad in other parts.

should I force 720p for the 4xMSAA? or is it better to have it at 1080p?