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[guest1321]

Some good/interesting news. I started to go for the World Tourer achievement a while back and made a Chart to keep track of which tracks I've raced on. Going through all the events I had done something in was a pain in the ass, but once I had finished I found I was missing races on 32 tracks.

I assumed that racing on the track included hot laps so I went through and did hot laps on all 32 tracks. No achievement! I researched a little bit and it turns out you need to actually race and that hot laps don't count.

I started working through the tracks with free play races and then I decided that as long as I'm racing I should make it count and do it in the event list. So I used ManteoMax's Forza Data chart to coordinate tracks, races and events.

Just tonight I got the achievement but the weird thing is, I am missing full races on several tracks (a good portion of FJ and most drag races and some others).

I wanted to see if anyone else had any experience with this and could offer any explanation for this oddity. I do recall someone getting the bucket list achievement after completing 98% of the event list, so maybe it is a similar thing going on...

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

I didnt want the El Camino, Typhoon or Cyclone to be eligible since the other ones are so heavy. I want some possible roll overs, which is why I chose Maple Valley. Hit some of those curbs wrong and you will be in trouble!

Oh, don't worry, the Typhoon will still roll over very easily. I almost took a picture for this thread as my turtled truck slid across the track.

I dont think I'd consider an El Camino a truck anyways. Its based on a car chassis.

Perhaps, but the game calls it an SUV. Near as I can tell you can only get it to A580ish and be heavier than 4000lbs, so I don't know how competitive it would be. Friggin' drift monster, though.

 

[Seanspeed]

I really wish acheivements were never invented. Doing all this crazy stuff seems like a huge distraction from actually sitting back and enjoying the game properly. I did a 10 lap stint today on the Nurburgring GP track with a Radical SR8 with the sound turned up extremely loud and it was so amazing. Turned in some good laps, learned some new tricks and just got enveloped in the experience. I find it depressing that others are instead trying to gift a group of cars to each other that just sit in a garage unused(and will be quickly gifted to somebody else) or just try and rush a lap/race on each track for some meaningless 'acheivement' points.

Sorry for the rant. I just dont like the way its changed people's gaming habits. Instead of actually enjoying a game, they make people do weird, pointless things for useless points.

 

[guest1321]

I really wish acheivements were never invented. Doing all this crazy stuff seems like a huge distraction from actually sitting back and enjoying the game properly. I did a 10 lap stint today on the Nurburgring GP track with a Radical SR8 with the sound turned up extremely loud and it was so amazing. Turned in some good laps, learned some new tricks and just got enveloped in the experience. I find it depressing that others are instead trying to gift a group of cars to each other that just sit in a garage unused(and will be quickly gifted to somebody else) or just try and rush a lap/race on each track for some meaningless 'acheivement' points.

Sorry for the rant. I just dont like the way its changed people's gaming habits. Instead of actually enjoying a game, they make people do weird, pointless things for useless points.

I see what you are getting at entirely. But at the same time I don't really let it distract me from enjoying the game. I honestly could give two shits about achievements but I've sort of gotten to a point where I don't really know which direction I want to take with the game (as far as what kind of races I want to do), so having something to guide me, or to force me to explore parts of the game that I otherwise wouldn't is really convenient. For example, I would have never chosen to race in the Hybrid Hustle event but because it contained a track I needed to get an achievement, I found it is actually really funny to race (a pimped out) toyota prius with a bunch of other hybrids.

Another example, had there not been an achievement for "fully inspecting a car in AV" then I would never have known that there is an option to start the car.

I suspect that since I spend a good amount of time on GAF I would have eventually got to that stuff, but for most gamers out there, I think achievements serve as guidance to a more in depth appreciation of the game.

 

[Seanspeed]

I see what you are getting at entirely. But at the same time I don't really let it distract me from enjoying the game. I honestly could give two shits about achievements but I've sort of gotten to a point where I don't really know which direction I want to take with the game (as far as what kind of races I want to do), so having something to guide me, or to force me to explore parts of the game that I otherwise wouldn't is really convenient. For example, I would have never chosen to race in the Hybrid Hustle event but because it contained a track I needed to get an achievement, I found it is actually really funny to race (a pimped out) toyota prius with a bunch of other hybrids.

Another example, had there not been an achievement for "fully inspecting a car in AV" then I would never have known that there is an option to start the car.

I suspect that since I spend a good amount of time on GAF I would have eventually got to that stuff, but for most gamers out there, I think achievements serve as guidance to a more in depth appreciation of the game.

But what is anybody getting out of this whole trading scheme y'all've got going on? Y'all aren't doing it because you want to drive all these Ferrari's(you can do that in HotLap mode). Its happening because you guys want these meaningless points.

 

[guest1321]

But what is anybody getting out of this whole trading scheme y'all've got going on? Y'all aren't doing it because you want to drive all these Ferrari's(you cant do that in HotLap mode). Its happening because you guys want these meaningless points.

Very true. But I suppose in this case it is another form of completion of the game. I personally think there are achievements that further drive to access content in the game, and then there are ridiculous ones the developers throw in there for the people who really want a challenge. But as with all challenges, everyone wants the reward without actually having to put the effort in, and thus a workaround is born.
So maybe that deteriorates from the game a little bit, but in the grand scheme of things, what is =< 10 minutes out of my free time a day (that I'm not putting into Forza) to set up a group to share cars so we can all feel another form of completion.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that in the case of achievements like these, I don't feel it takes away from mine or anyone else's ability to enjoy the game, and therefore isn't drastically changing what I would otherwise do if achievements were to not exist.

 

[kazinova]

Updated spreadsheet.

Missing cars are now in my possession. Sending on to the next person now.

Cars received, spreadsheet updated, LoveAndBeer has not accepted my friend request as of yet. What do we do? Give him a day more or move to the next person?

 

[Seanspeed]

Very true. But I suppose in this case it is another form of completion of the game. I personally think there are achievements that further drive to access content in the game, and then there are ridiculous ones the developers throw in there for the people who really want a challenge. But as with all challenges, everyone wants the reward without actually having to put the effort in, and thus a workaround is born.
So maybe that deteriorates from the game a little bit, but in the grand scheme of things, what is =< 10 minutes out of my free time a day (that I'm not putting into Forza) to set up a group to share cars so we can all feel another form of completion.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that in the case of achievements like these, I don't feel it takes away from mine or anyone else's ability to enjoy the game, and therefore isn't drastically changing what I would otherwise do if achievements were to not exist.

Maybe its not a huge timesink for everybody involved, but it sure seems like there's a fair amount of time and effort involved to get this whole thing organized and done properly. Seems like a massive waste of time to me and I dont feel y'all have 'acheived' anything more than I have.

You say you dont 'feel' its had any impact on how you enjoy the game, but I think its done exactly that. These acheivements have made people think that its somehow an important part of the experience, but its not. Real acheivements come from getting better at a game. From doing noteworthy things and learning to actually acheive things, not find workarounds just so something pops up and says you've 'acheived' something.

I really think its detracted from gaming this generation. If you guys wonder how somebody like me or Ox or SarBear get really good, its not from chasing acheivements, its from driving and the desire to get better.

I get that not everybody will play a game like Forza for the same reasons, but even if you just want to do car collecting or whatever, there's better ways to spend your time than chasing pointless Xbox acheivement points.

 

[guest1321]

Maybe its not a huge timesink for everybody involved, but it sure seems like there's a fair amount of time and effort involved to get this whole thing organized and done properly. Seems like a massive waste of time to me and I dont feel y'all have 'acheived' anything more than I have.

You say you dont 'feel' its had any impact on how you enjoy the game, but I think its done exactly that. These acheivements have made people think that its somehow an important part of the experience, but its not. Real acheivements come from getting better at a game. From doing noteworthy things and learning to actually acheive things, not find workarounds just so something pops up and says you've 'acheived' something.

I really think its detracted from gaming this generation. If you guys wonder how somebody like me or Ox or SarBear get really good, its not from chasing acheivements, its from driving and the desire to get better.

I get that not everybody will play a game like Forza for the same reasons, but even if you just want to do car collecting or whatever, there's better ways to spend your time than chasing pointless Xbox acheivement points.

Like I said before, it is an added sense of completion. Maybe not to everyone but to some. No one is playing any less as for those whose names just get added to the list, it takes them 10 minutes.

I don't really mean to call you out but it seems as if you are trying to say that you are btter than others for not having the same interest in achievements.

 

[Seanspeed]

Like I said before, it is an added sense of completion. Maybe not to everyone but to some. No one is playing any less as for those whose names just get added to the list, it takes them 10 minutes.

I don't really mean to call you out but it seems as if you are trying to say that you are btter than others for not having the same interest in achievements.

I'm not trying to say I'm better, I'm trying to say its an artificial way of making people think they're 'acheiving' something. The 'added sense of completion' is completely fake and unreal. If acheivements actually do get people to try new things or inspire them to get better, than thats cool, but from what I see, its not the norm.

I think people would actually get more out of the game if they ignored these things. But we've been trained to think its an important part of the experience.

 

[guest1321]

I'm not trying to say I'm better, I'm trying to say its an artificial way of making people think they're 'acheiving' something. The 'added sense of completion' is completely fake and unreal. If acheivements actually do get people to try new things or inspire them to get better, than thats cool, but from what I see, its not the norm.

I think people would actually get more out of the game if they ignored these things. But we've been trained to think its an important part of the experience.

Well I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. I see your point but I feel that is not the case 100% of the time.

 

[nagge]

Haha, did 3laps on Maple valley with a truck...flipped every single lap.

And just disqualify the camino from the race, no fun without flipping over

 

[2600]

Haha, did 3laps on Maple valley with a truck...flipped every single lap.

And just disqualify the camino from the race, no fun without flipping over

Something to keep in mind since it doesn't appear there's any way to flip your car back over yourself like in FM3. Once you flip, you're done!

 

[Muerte_X]

Something to keep in mind since it doesn't appear there's any way to flip your car back over yourself like in FM3. Once you flip, you're done!

You can flip yourself back over. Just hold the left joystick to the left or right. I'm not sure what to do if you have a wheel though.

I think its when sim damage is on that you're done for when you roll over and stop on your roof or side.

 

[saladine1]

"How would you make Forza a better game from a design perspective?"

If this question was posed to you, what would your answer be?

 

[2600]

You can flip yourself back over. Just hold the left joystick to the left or right. I'm not sure what to do if you have a wheel though.

I think its when sim damage is on that you're done for when you roll over and stop on your roof or side.

Oh, ok, I flipped during a retroBrand hosted race and I think he likes to turn on sim damage(?), so that could have been it.

 

[2600]

And here's a Furai shot for you Muerte. Should have gotten the lights...

 

[AMUSIX]

If this question was posed to you, what would your answer be?

Well, aside from the normal improvements in racing games (driver AI, physics, etc) I think I'd do some restructuring to the career mode, and set more defined racing classes. For instance, instead of just a "Class B Race" or "Supercar Invitational" have a full classes/circuits/seasons for Muscle Cars, Import Tuners, Supercars, ALMS, etc. As it is now, you've got a race or three for each, but it should feel like you're embroiled in a full calendar for whatever class you're currently running.

Hmmm, not sure if I explained that correctly. Lets say they added rally...I'd want to see a full season of rally events. Or, if I switch over to my ALMS, then a full season there. As it is, you're bounced around between cars and classes so quickly, you really can't settle in to any one of them well enough.

I suppose Career would show your current progression through each class's 'season'...or if you even have a car to enter into that class.


As for improvements to Multi, I'd work on the community feel of the game. Give it more of a graphical interface than just menus. Diners/drive-ins/show rooms/paddocks that act as lobbies where you drive up in your car. Meets are a huge part of car culture, and being able to show off your beauty before launching into a race would be a nice touch.

 

[Liquidsnake]

What is you go to car for online B500 races?

 

[Mascot]

If this question was posed to you, what would your answer be?

When browsing menus in the AH or storefront, he 'back' button should take you back ONE step, not all the way back through history to the dawn of fucking time.

 

[gragy10]

Bah - out of town this w'end but should be able to get back in time for some races.
One thing tho - as this is non-championship does this mean we can still use Maple Valley soon? Love that track and wouldn't want to see it wasted on an unofficial race!

 

[G Rom]

If this question was posed to you, what would your answer be?

Ok, I finally got time to do what I want with my list. I'm starting right away my document detailing the stuff I've put in it.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Something to keep in mind since it doesn't appear there's any way to flip your car back over yourself like in FM3. Once you flip, you're done!

Depends on your damage mode. In limited or none, you can roll the car back over with the left stick.

If this question was posed to you, what would your answer be?

Get rid of the stupid 'saving content' message and delay when you start a game; at least make it say 'loading'.

I would love, love, love, if different events in the career mode had specific requirements and you had to build a car to hit them, and so did the AI. If you're racing a pseudo-Trans-Am-prepared muscle car like we're planning at GAF, all the AI drivers would too. Stick a number on the side of their car. Not too hard to come up with basic livery components and preset their locations on cars.

Fix the borked UV maps— all the body panels should be at the same scale, and the same positions should work left/right on all cars (works like that on most cars). Makes painting some cars really maddening.

Why don't I have all the online custom-game options in split-screen mode? Why isn't their a replay option for split-screen mode?

 

[h3ro]

Seanspeed, people can enjoy their own videogame experiences as they like.

You don't have to "get it" or like it. Whether it's a "waste of time" or not isn't up to you to decide for me or for anyone else in this thread. Do your own thing.

 

[kazinova]

Me: But I have fun getting achievements.
SeanSpeed: No you don't.
Me: I don't?
SeanSpeed: Nope, you think you do, but really you aren't having any fun.
Me: So, the happiness and sense of accomplishment...?
SeanSpeed: Not actually being experienced. Construct of the Matrix.
Me: Oh...

"Real acheivements come from getting better at a game."
-SeanSpeed

 

[Seanspeed]

Well I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. I see your point but I feel that is not the case 100% of the time.

I suppose I should express my frustrations more at the developer than the gamer. They're the ones that come up with the time-wasting acheivements, after all. I wish they'd put a bit more thought into them. They seem like somebody comes up with them after a few hours instead of carefully designing acheivements to actually be acheivements. Although a small portion of blame should be put on the gamer that eats it up anyways. I dont doubt that they could make people stick a thumb up their butt and twirl around to polka music all at the same time for 50g. Beware Kinect buyers!

Me: But I have fun getting achievements.
SeanSpeed: No you don't.
Me: I don't?
SeanSpeed: Nope, you think you do, but really you aren't having any fun.
Me: So, the happiness and sense of accomplishment...?
SeanSpeed: Not actually being experienced. Construct of the Matrix.
Me: Oh...

"Real acheivements come from getting better at a game."
-SeanSpeed

You've clearly misinterpeted almost everything I've said. Or you've gone out of your way to misrepresent my position for a laugh. Either way, nice work.

This is getting a bit off-topic now, though.

Trucks on Maple Valley, huh? Somebody will need to ensure they save the replay.

 

[Shortt Sirket]

Haha, did 3laps on Maple valley with a truck...flipped every single lap.

And just disqualify the camino from the race, no fun without flipping over

That is a good idea. I thought making a weight requirement would do it for me. I will update the info to disqualify the El Camino, Syclone and Typhoon.

 

[kazinova]

If LoveAndBeer hasn't accepted my friend request by the end of the day I'll be passing the cars to the person after him.

 

[FunnyBunny]

I think the 458 may be my favorite car in this game; the way it handles, sounds and looks. Just sublime.

 

[LoveAndBeer]

If LoveAndBeer hasn't accepted my friend request by the end of the day I'll be passing the cars to the person after him.

Took the night off last night, will accept later this afternoon.

I'll go ahead and send an invite out to Union 360 as well when I get on.

 

[Muerte_X]

The trucks race is going to be crazy, if I take some turns too tight it flips over. I don't even have to touch the green bump strips, lol. I really want to use the Raptor, with the huge supercharger, exhaust, and motor swap it sounds amazing, but I might end up using something else.

For the Megane race, how are you going to verify that people are using the right mods? Send it to you and have you put it in the garage or something? Or are we just going off the honor system? I think not using all the race suspension parts would probably make you slower anyway...

Thanks for the pic, 2600. Yeah, I love the brake lights on that car, and just the way it looks in general. It's a blast to drive on top of it.

 

[Liquidsnake]

What is you go to car for online B500 races?

Excellent, thank you for all the input.

 

[LoveAndBeer]

If LoveAndBeer hasn't accepted my friend request by the end of the day I'll be passing the cars to the person after him.

Took the night off last night, will accept later this afternoon.

I'll go ahead and send an invite out to Union 360 as well when I get on.

Kaz request accepted and Union request sent.

Note: no email message of the friends request or anything showing up in the dashboard. Only found the request when I went to the guide button Friend list, rather annoying.

 

[kazinova]

Kaz request accepted and Union request sent.

Note: no email message of the friends request or anything showing up in the dashboard. Only found the request when I went to the guide button Friend list, rather annoying.

No worries, I'll get to this around 4pm EST. I understand that things are weird on the 360 sometimes, I just wanted to keep things moving for the people later on the list.

 

[LoveAndBeer]

I understand that things are weird on the 360 sometimes, I just wanted to keep things moving for the people later on the list.

Aye, no problem at all, I just love the 2 steps forward 1 step back update process MS has for the Dash. I'd never have known there was a friend request pending if I hadn't checked here and gone digging -- there was 0 notification in the 'default' friends view or in the status ticker in the upper right of the screen. Just seems, odd to me.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Excellent, thank you for all the input.

I don't have one; I have moods and I have cars better suited to long and short tracks. Sometimes I have a poor memory and pick something meant for the other.

 

[eso76]

holy shit.

HOLY SHIT.

I just just just noticed they fixed the interiors for the Citroen C4.

The wheel now turns the way it should, with the central part not moving as you turn the wheel. I am pretty sure it was still wrong when the game launched, it was probably fixed with the latest patch.

Well, now it's official. Forza 4 >>>>>> GT5 (which still gets C4 wheel wrong )

 

[G Rom]

No, I'm pretty sure the C4 was fixed since launch.
Myself, I was blown away yesterday by the active aero on NASCAR cars. I had never seen that it was working before.

 

[op_ivy]

No, I'm pretty sure the C4 was fixed since launch.
Myself, I was blown away yesterday by the active aero on NASCAR cars. I had never seen that it was working before.

i never knew the fucking el camino had active aero, lol

 

[Iknos]

Achievements are good in concept but the ones bantered about here are pretty lame. It should have been "buy every Ferrari from the dealership" now THAT is an achievement.

 

[G Rom]

i never knew the fucking el camino had active aero, lol

Yeah the Plymouth GTX has its air grabber as well. It seems surprising to see on old cars but when you think about it, not really. Active aero was already on old Le Mans racers like the infamous 300 SLR and their giant air brake.
Some car are still missing active aero though, the RCZ should have a raising rear spoiler for example.

 

[guest1321]

Percentage of Career Complete - 31.3%
Distance Driven - 4,154.27 miles
Time Driven - 48 h 19:28
Time Spent Editing Liveries - 2 h 52:04
Time Spent Tuning - 0 h 15:31
Time Spent in the Menus - 21 h 13:08

Highest Affinity Manufacturer and Level - Audi, level 50
Most Driven Car and Mileage - Audi RS3, 485.73 miles

Favorite Car, Any Class - Audi RS5 ; it was the RS3 for a long time and now having this car I don't think I could be much happier.

Favorite Circuit - Nurburgring Nordschleife

 

[kazinova]

Aye, no problem at all, I just love the 2 steps forward 1 step back update process MS has for the Dash. I'd never have known there was a friend request pending if I hadn't checked here and gone digging -- there was 0 notification in the 'default' friends view or in the status ticker in the upper right of the screen. Just seems, odd to me.

Cars are off, update the spreadsheet after you receive 'em!

 

[Gouda Jouji]

I guess i'll post my stats too:

Percentage of Career Complete: 96.8%
Distance Driven: 17,662.16 KM
Time Driven: 124 h 15:30
Time Spent Editing Liveries: 12:45
Time Spent Tuning: 00:08
Time Spent in the Menus: 17 h 18:28

 

[ruxtpin]

Is there any room in the GAF club at this point? Or does anyone have another active club going with room? I'm an amiable chap. I'm not able to play as frequently I would like, but I think that's pretty common.

My GT is ruxtpin

Thanks

 

[op_ivy]

I guess i'll post my stats too:

Percentage of Career Complete: 96.8%
Distance Driven: 17,662.16 KM
Time Driven: 124 h 15:30
Time Spent Editing Liveries: 12:45
Time Spent Tuning: 00:08
Time Spent in the Menus: 17 h 18:28

dayamn.

 

[LoveAndBeer]

Cars are off, update the spreadsheet after you receive 'em!

Cars received, achievements unlocked and spreadsheet updated.

Still awaiting accepted friend request from Union 360 (with a space!). Will give a day or so to accept then will move to next in line (I'll send a PM as well JIC).


Since I'm posting and still in gamehere are my stats:
Percentage of Career Complete - 11.4%
Distance Driven - 3,244.71 miles
Time Driven - 35 h 57:32
Time Spent Editing Liveries - 0h 21:02
Time Spent Tuning - 0 h 2:13
Time Spent in the Menus - 8h 33:42

Highest Affinity Manufacturer and Level - Audi, level 50
Most Driven Car and Mileage - Audi R8 5.2, 651.77mi

Favorite Car, Any Class - Audi R8
Favorite Circuit - Maple Valley, but have been very surprised how much I enjoy racing at Indy as well

 

[drugstore_cowboy]

I can no longer load any designs I've bought for some reason.

The game hangs on the saving screen, will clearing the cache help? I really don't want to fuck my save file up as exiting the game off mid-save can't be good for it.

Percentage of Career Complete: 19.4%
Distance Driven: 3,163.73 M
Time Driven: 39 h 00.55
Time Spent Editing Liveries: 36:10
Time Spent Tuning: 00:27
Time Spent in the Menus: 16 h 36:45

Highest Affinity Manufacturer and Level - Ferrari, level 24
Most Driven Car and Mileage - #83 F430GT, 1,473.10M

Favorite Car, 430 Scuderia
Favorite Circuit - Nurburgring GP

 

[twinturbo2]

I have never wanted to smash windows at EA HQ more than right this moment.

The 2013 Porsche Boxster. I'll be in my bunk.

Sigh, does anyone know if Turn 10 and EA are talking again? It's annoying not being able to have a Porsche fleet in my Forza 4 garage...

 

[2600]

So, how fast should these SUVs/Trucks get around Maple Valley? I had one SUV in my garage, so I went with that, the Jeep SRT8. I can get it around under 1:50, but wonder if I need to test out a bunch of the other options. What are you all going with? Any ringers in the bunch? I know this race will probably devolve into a derby anyway, but I'm just curious.