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Forza 4 |OT| Where Porsche Are Driven

M

Mascot

Member
EA keeping Porsche for a few months worked out pretty sweetly for Turn 10, didn't it? A bunch of content that was originally going to be included in the price of the original game, and that forms but a very small fraction of the overall content of said game, will soon be released at a price higher than you can now buy the original game for.

I guess I'd be feeling a little less violated if there were a couple of, like, new tracks included in the astronomical asking price.

Seriously, it's great to have Porsche back in Forza - but if EA had been a little more gracious six months ago we'd have had them all on day one at no extra cost. Why are Turn 10 or Microsoft charging so much for them when they wanted them included in the original game?

I really think we are being taken advantage of here.
 
D

DasRaven

Member
Mascot said:
EA keeping Porsche for a few months worked out pretty sweetly for Turn 10, didn't it? A bunch of content that was originally going to be included in the price of the original game, and that forms but a very small fraction of the overall content of said game, will soon be released at a price higher than you can now buy the original game for.

I guess I'd be feeling a little less violated if there were a couple of, like, new tracks included in the astronomical asking price.

Seriously, it's great to have Porsche back in Forza - but if EA had been a little more gracious six months ago we'd have had them all on day one at no extra cost. Why are Turn 10 or Microsoft charging so much for them when they wanted them included in the original game?

I really think we are being taken advantage of here.
Click to expand...

Why don't you just wait for the Ultimate Collection/Platinum Hits package to come out in October?
You might even get some bonus content therein for around the same price as the Porsche DLC.

BTW: I suspect that part of the price is to offset whatever ransom EA asked for the sublicense.
 
Shortt Sirket

Shortt Sirket

Member
DasRaven said:
Why don't you just wait for the Ultimate Collection/Platinum Hits package to come out in October?
You might even get some bonus content therein for around the same price as the Porsche DLC.

BTW: I suspect that part of the price is to offset whatever ransom EA asked for the sublicense.
Click to expand...

This is my guess. I have a feeling EA was in on the timing and the price of this pack since there is a good chance they are getting a cut of it. I could be wrong, but I just feel like that is something EA would do.
 
M

Mascot

Member
DasRaven said:
Why don't you just wait for the Ultimate Collection/Platinum Hits package to come out in October?
You might even get some bonus content therein for around the same price as the Porsche DLC.
Click to expand...
Oh, I'll probably buy the Porsche DLC. But it'll be through gritted teeth and with an overwhelming sense of injustice and buyer's regret. I get the same feeling every time I pay £3.50 for a pint of beer.

Turn 10 know this. Every developer knows this. Episodic content is the future of videogames whether we like it or not. Our hobby just got a lot more expensive than it used to be.
 
N

NullPointer

Member
Mascot said:
I really think we are being taken advantage of here.
Click to expand...
I'd be more hyped but then I remember that I still have to virtually buy the cars AFTER I actually pay money for the DLC. That's the part that always rubs me the wrong way.

I honestly think its a fucking horrible way to do things. If I spend real world money on a car I want to be able to use that car in all modes as soon as I've bought it.
 
M

Mascot

Member
NullPointer said:
I'd be more hyped but then I remember that I still have to virtually buy the cars AFTER I actually pay money for the DLC. That's the part that always rubs me the wrong way.

I honestly think its a fucking horrible way to do things. If I spend real world money on a car I want to be able to use that car in all modes as soon as I've bought it.
Click to expand...
Good point. I wonder how much in-game credits all of the Porsches will cost?

I've never understood why they don't chuck a million credits in with each DLC car pack.
 
G

G Rom

Member
Yeah, I really hope they give one or two millions with the Porsche Expansion Pack. I mean they're adding a lot of stuff (relative to other FM titles) in this pack, why not drop some money for us peasant who can't paint ! :D

Jamesways said:
NOW, we're talking. Aboot time they make more use of that ALMS license. Love it!
Click to expand...

Wait, what ? They've constantly added ALMS cars in car packs. They have a very good part of the field covered now thanks to DLC (I'm talking about individual cars, not duplicates obviously).
 
S

Seanspeed

Banned
Mascot said:
EA keeping Porsche for a few months worked out pretty sweetly for Turn 10, didn't it? A bunch of content that was originally going to be included in the price of the original game, and that forms but a very small fraction of the overall content of said game, will soon be released at a price higher than you can now buy the original game for.

I guess I'd be feeling a little less violated if there were a couple of, like, new tracks included in the astronomical asking price.

Seriously, it's great to have Porsche back in Forza - but if EA had been a little more gracious six months ago we'd have had them all on day one at no extra cost. Why are Turn 10 or Microsoft charging so much for them when they wanted them included in the original game?

I really think we are being taken advantage of here.
Click to expand...
Because Turn 10 still had to pay EA for the licensing deal and then had to model all the cars(Dan has said they were all remade for this pack) just like with any DLC. The event listing does suggest they wanted them in the game, but creating events for them is probably just a bit of coding while creating the cars themselves actually takes work. I mean, I'm sure Turn 10 has wanted ALL the cars we've seen in DLC so far. Does that mean that all the DLC should be free or cheaper?

Blame EA if you like, but Turn 10 are doing what they have to do to try and make back some money on the deal. The alternative was them just forgetting about Porsche and never having the option in the first place.
 
M

Mascot

Member
Seanspeed said:
Because Turn 10 still had to pay EA for the licensing deal and then had to model all the cars(Dan has said they were all remade for this pack) just like with any DLC. The event listing does suggest they wanted them in the game, but creating events for them is probably just a bit of coding while creating the cars themselves actually takes work. I mean, I'm sure Turn 10 has wanted ALL the cars we've seen in DLC so far. Does that mean that all the DLC should be free or cheaper?

Blame EA if you like, but Turn 10 are doing what they have to do to try and make back some money on the deal. The alternative was them just forgetting about Porsche and never having the option in the first place.
Click to expand...

But didn't Dan say that Turn 10 were fighting right up until the last minute to get Porsches into the game, but EA wouldn't let them?
This suggests:

1. The cars were already modelled and ready to be included on the disc on release day.
2. Any payments due to EA for the Porsche licence were already factored into the development costs of FM4.

The delay gave MS/T10 an opportunity to farm some extra cash from DLC, and as businesses they would be mad to pass that opportunity up. I just think it would have been nice if the loyal fans didn't have to pay quite so much for content that we were reasonably expecting (right up until the last minute) to be already included in the game.

I'd feel exactly the same if Amalfi Long or New York were released as paid-for DLC.
 
T

twinturbo2

butthurt Heat fan
BADNED said:
1995 Porsche 911 GT2 (993)

uIyQ2.jpg
Click to expand...
Sweet. My Scud Race set will be complete soon.
 
Jamesways

Jamesways

Member
G Rom said:
Wait, what ? They've constantly added ALMS cars in car packs. They have a very good part of the field covered now thanks to DLC (I'm talking about individual cars, not duplicates obviously).
Click to expand...

Yep, they've added some cars over some of the packs, but only having 4 out of 9 tracks (10 if you count St. Pete's last year) and advertising as "The Official Game" of the ALMS, they could utilize more of the license IMO.

But regardless, I'm very happy this Porsche is in. Any additions to their ALMS offerings or motorsport in general, I'm all for.

I foresee a lot of FIA GT3 paints a'coming from this.
 
S

Seanspeed

Banned
Mascot said:
But didn't Dan say that Turn 10 were fighting right up until the last minute to get Porsches into the game, but EA wouldn't let them?
This suggests:

1. The cars were already modelled and ready to be included on the disc on release day.
2. Any payments due to EA for the Porsche licence were already factored into the development costs of FM4.

The delay gave MS/T10 an opportunity to farm some extra cash from DLC, and as businesses they would be mad to pass that opportunity up. I just think it would have been nice if the loyal fans didn't have to pay quite so much for content that we were reasonably expecting (right up until the last minute) to be already included in the game.

I'd feel exactly the same if Amalfi Long or New York were released as paid-for DLC.
Click to expand...
Depends on what they mean by 'last minute', obviously. For a developer, 'last minute' may have been January or March or June or who knows. These guys have deadlines to meet and it seems likely that when they say they fought til the last minute, they mean the last minute of decisions on deciding the content of the game.

In the end, we paid for a full game. If you want to argue that Forza Motorsport 4 lacked content, by all means, keep going this route of argument. But I'd say it was still a full-featured game that packs in more content than you get from 95% of games these days and that while not having Porsche was a disappointment, it sounds like pure entitlement to say we should be given stuff for free or a discount just cuz some of you still expected Porsche to be in the game, especially considering there was word quite early on that made it pretty obvious we probably wouldn't be seeing them.

As for Amalfi Long or New York being paid-for-DLC, the fact that they aren't tends to tell me that they weren't included for genuine reasons and not because they are out to jip us. There were probably legitimate issues with the lighting or time constraints or whatever that meant these tracks didn't get included. And if they did bring out these tracks later on as DLC, you wouldn't have anything but a conspiratorial hunch that they did it to take advantage of us and not because they had to spend time after the deadlined game was finished which requires extra time and effort that they need to be compensated for.

By all means, though, vote with your wallet if you're that unhappy. Just realize that the only thing you'll be telling them is that they shouldn't bother doing this sort of DLC at all.
 
S

saladine1

Junior Member
Mascot said:
But didn't Dan say that Turn 10 were fighting right up until the last minute to get Porsches into the game, but EA wouldn't let them?
This suggests:

1. The cars were already modelled and ready to be included on the disc on release day.
2. Any payments due to EA for the Porsche licence were already factored into the development costs of FM4.

The delay gave MS/T10 an opportunity to farm some extra cash from DLC, and as businesses they would be mad to pass that opportunity up. I just think it would have been nice if the loyal fans didn't have to pay quite so much for content that we were reasonably expecting (right up until the last minute) to be already included in the game.

I'd feel exactly the same if Amalfi Long or New York were released as paid-for DLC.
Click to expand...

Apparently, there's over 40 different Porsche folders included on the disc according to the modders. Now, I don't know if that includes any new cars but they are there nevertheless..
 
M

Mascot

Member
I have a query: I know that with normal car DLC packs, when you download the 'free' car you can see the rest of the pack (instead of a generic grey box) if other people are using them in multiplayer. Does doing this also populate the AI cars in normal career races? Assuming there's a free Porsche, would downloading it mean I will occasionally race against all the other Porsches in singleplayer?
 
G

G Rom

Member
Pre-order cars were populating races when I only had one so I guess that it would be the same with Porsche.

BTW, I don't get this sudden backlash for the price. It has been known since they announced the thing two months ago...
Also, you can see it that way, if Porsche had been in the game from the start, we may have lost 30 other cars that we would have ended up buying as DLC. You also seem to forget that some DLC cars have been known to be completed for FM3 DLC but only ended up in FM4 DLC, should those cars have been free as well ?
Beside, it's very unlikely that Porsche would let their cars be released at a reduced price, don't think they would see it as a good thing for their brand.

So yeah, I do think the price is a bit high (1200 MSPoints/15$ would have been better) but I also think that Turn 10 are genuinely trying to do their best with all this licensing mess that EA created.
 
X

Xanadu

Banned
G Rom said:
Pre-order cars were populating races when I only had one so I guess that it would be the same with Porsche.

BTW, I don't get this sudden backlash for the price. It has been known since they announced the thing two months ago...
Also, you can see it that way, if Porsche had been in the game from the start, we may have lost 30 other cars that we would have ended up buying as DLC. You also seem to forget that some DLC cars have been known to be completed for FM3 DLC but only ended up in FM4 DLC, should those cars have been free as well ?
Beside, it's very unlikely that Porsche would let their cars be released at a reduced price, don't think they would see it as a good thing for their brand.

So yeah, I do think the price is a bit high (1200 MSPoints/15$ would have been better) but I also think that Turn 10 are genuinely trying to do their best with all this licensing mess that EA created.
Click to expand...

all DLC should be free, ask valve ;)
 
M

Mascot

Member
G Rom said:
You also seem to forget that some DLC cars have been known to be completed for FM3 DLC but only ended up in FM4 DLC, should those cars have been free as well ?
Click to expand...
I never said the Porsche pack should be free, but you can buy the full game for £19 in the UK now. I think 1600 MS points is around £15-£16? To me it does seem a lot by comparison for 30 cars and some new events.

I dunno, maybe I'm still smarting from the 'value' I got from buying the FM4 LE and the last season pass.
 
BADNED

BADNED

Member
Mascot said:
I never said the Porsche pack should be free, but you can buy the full game for £19 in the UK now. I think 1600 MS points is around £15-£16? To me it does seem a lot by comparison for 30 cars and some new events.

I dunno, maybe I'm still smarting from the 'value' I got from buying the FM4 LE and the last season pass.
Click to expand...
Well it offers more content and still costs less then three car packs!
 
O

op_ivy

Fallen Xbot (cannot continue gaining levels in this class)
-MikePriester- said:
He's feeding you, just ignore him ;)

I've been on search for Forza Horizon tid bits about, but can't find anything worth anything, maybe I'm not looking hard enough. :(
Click to expand...

leave it to the professionals, game journalists. its their job to put their nose to the grind stone, hit up sources, fact-check, and bring us inside scoops on things publishers dont want you to know.
 
S

saladine1

Junior Member
Shortt Sirket said:
Dude who does mods created an anti-lag system for the Scooby: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcMq22KYlh8&feature=g-all-u

I would seriously kill to have options like this in the next Forza. I want more engine management stuff!
Click to expand...

They will. I hope they will. I think they will. Won't they?

Imo, the anti lag isn't needed until Turn 10 actually simulates lag better then it currently does now. As it stands now,whacking a monster turbo on a 1.2 L vehicle doesn't generate the same affect of it's real life counterpart.
I mean, my old R31 Skyline had a massive turbo installed onto a 3.0 motor. That thing had monstrous lag. Nothing,nothing,nothing,boost..change gear...it was ridiculous.
And we are talking about a 3.0 here with heaps more torque than this pissy little 1.2 used in my example yet the FM4 equivalent drives off like it has an anti lag system already fitted!
 
Shortt Sirket

Shortt Sirket

Member
saladine1 said:
They will. I hope they will. I think they will. Won't they?

Imo, the anti lag isn't needed until Turn 10 actually simulates lag better then it currently does now. As it stands now,whacking a monster turbo on a 1.2 L vehicle doesn't generate the same affect of it's real life counterpart.
I mean, my old R31 Skyline had a massive turbo installed onto a 3.0 motor. That thing had monstrous lag. Nothing,nothing,nothing,boost..change gear...it was ridiculous.
And we are talking about a 3.0 here with heaps more torque than this pissy little 1.2 used in my example yet the FM4 equivalent drives off like it has an anti lag system already fitted!
Click to expand...

Yeah, I would love for us to be able to pick more realistic options with the turbos. I am tired of all this "Stage X" shit. Give me compressor sizes or at least the names of the turbos I am using. Let me mix and match compressors/turbines so I can get something like the Disco Potato. I want to see an actual difference between one massive honkin turbo and a twin turbo set up. I want to feel the crazy lag and then the rush of power when it finally spools up.

I really am tired of all the Stage 1, Stage 2, etc stuff. Give me real information. Give me REAL specs and car terminology. Stop dumbing it down.
 
U n i o n 0015

U n i o n 0015

Member
Anyone trying to do Landin's Community Bounty over at the official forums? Man, I am turrible at drifting. The best I can do--with a custom tune from the storefront--is 34K points or so. No Top Secret S15 for me. Waaaaaah.
 
Z

zorbsie

Member
Has it been confirmed that the 20 new events aren't on a new track? Is it new race types on old tracks? Or just "80s Porsche Event" on old tracks. I've got the points card ready to redeem either way.
 
X

Xanadu

Banned
op_ivy said:
same model from the first huh? welcome back to the forza thread
Click to expand...

this is new to you? of course there are much more polys but the actual design of the car is inaccurate, the most obvious case is the ferrari f40 which i have spoken about before
 
G

G Rom

Member
The 959 seems to look much better. It was probably the worst looking Porsche in FM3 as it had polygonal bugs around the rear wheel arches inherited from the FM/FM2 days...
I think what gets me the most hyped for the Porsche pack is the sound. I can't wait to hear Nick's work on the famous flat 6 note or the amazing high pitched V10 note of the Carrera GT. :)
 
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