CrunchinJelly
formerly cjelly
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Forza Motorsport 4 - The Floodgates Have Opened...
- Thread starter G Rom
- Start date
Yeah, I'm not losing my shit over it. Hopefully they'll push for full framerate when there's no other cars on the track or something.
I'm sort of on the fence regarding the traffic during the Rivals races, too. I don't enjoy the fact that they can get in your way at potentially any part of the track, but it feels like it's forcing me to learn how to take a less-than-optimistic line without the stress of having to come first.
Also, for the first time the driving model feels so satisfying that I'm actually enjoying driving with almost all assists off. The BMW is a bit of a bitch in that regard but incredibly satisfying once you nail a corner while teetering on the edge of traction.
One more thing... really enjoy the PGR-esque skill notifications on the left-hand side. No doubt there'll be challenges related to those but even just in regular driving it's cool to know if you've taken a corner well (according to the game) or overtaken someone incredibly closely.
I'm sort of on the fence regarding the traffic during the Rivals races, too. I don't enjoy the fact that they can get in your way at potentially any part of the track, but it feels like it's forcing me to learn how to take a less-than-optimistic line without the stress of having to come first.
Also, for the first time the driving model feels so satisfying that I'm actually enjoying driving with almost all assists off. The BMW is a bit of a bitch in that regard but incredibly satisfying once you nail a corner while teetering on the edge of traction.
One more thing... really enjoy the PGR-esque skill notifications on the left-hand side. No doubt there'll be challenges related to those but even just in regular driving it's cool to know if you've taken a corner well (according to the game) or overtaken someone incredibly closely.
Shaneus said:
keep in mind, in the full game, traffic mode is just another type of race to compete in. it wont be exclusive to rival mode, nor will it dominate it like it seems to in the demo. i find it a ton of fun, but at the very least i think most will like additional race modes in the historically tedious career mode.
and on this topic, FM4 seems to be handling different events in style. i didnt expect to love the traffic races like i do and on top of that i expect to adore autocross events. then there is the random top gear stuff (star in a reasonably priced car, bowling, and soccer at least).
MrTroubleMaker
Gold Member
Its going to be great when the OT goes up in a few day's. Is G Rom doing it?cjelly said:
Big Takeover
Member
I've gotten several PGR vibes from the demo.Shaneus said:
Rivals mode kind of seems like a natural progression of scoreboard/ghost racing in PGR2. You might even say that Bernese Alps has traits to it that you'd find in a PGR game - the huge speed and good looks that can wow the more casual player.
It just seems less buttoned up in general. More inviting.
Yeah, it's really only dominating to show that it can be done with different classes of cars as the traffic and to show that they can choose even whether to have traffic or not.op_ivy said:
Personally, like I said it's a great way to kind of "force" me to learn less than optimal driving lines for a course. Great challenge.
Absolutely agree with you there. I'm not sure whether they poached anyone else from Bizarre other than Wiswell, but it sure seems like they've borrowed a lot attitude-wise from them to make it more casual. A very British aesthetic which I've really only seen from Bizarre and Psygnosis (and perhaps a few others that don't immediately come to mind). Even the intro movie from the demo is using a rocky, commercial backing track instead of the almost clinical, lab-like one from FM3. Very reminiscent of PGR4.BCD2 said:
This sounds like something that I've mentioned in another thread, though... maybe the PGR appreciation one. But the point still stands.
Yeah saw the steering assist for myself. It is a ridiculous assist that makes things harder to drive if you know how to drive.
This takes the game into arcade territory. Physics are one thing but when the game drives for you and you can never turn that off it is another.
To do well in this game I'll have to unlearn how to drive a real car and learn the arcade tips and tricks to do well here.
An example is when you need to counter steer in real life you turn towards where your car is headed. Not in 4za. You have to turn in the opposite direction but only a teeny weeny bit because the game multiplies your steering by 4 when the tires lose grip. In many ways they made "simulation" feel harder than it is supposed to in real life. A real driver will never be able to catch a slide because of the crazy way this game handles it.
This is a slap in the face of racing fans who have invested hundreds in a racing setup. This is a slap in the face to Thomas from Fanatec because he invested in 4za and is taking a risk on the game.
To those that want to know more about the assists in "sim" mode there are a few at play. there is an extra assist in sim mode if you use a controller.
1) steering still twitches. For one reason or another your steering column has a heart attack when cornering and countersteering. Drive in external view while cornering and looking backwards in the 458 and you will see your tires move like a glitchy kinect avatar.
2) when countersteering to save a skid your steering input is multiplied by four or five times so you only need to turn the wheel 15 degrees to get a full lock in the opposite direction. The faster you go the easier it is to countersteer.
3) controller only: the same neutured steering when traveling over 90 km/hr assist exists in 4za. With a wheel I am able to fly down a straight and turn to lock and the game reads it and understandably understeers. Can't do that with a controller.
All of these are easily noticeable with a controller off the bat and the first 2 are noticeable with the wheel.
As a result the driving does not seem natural with a wheel.
This takes the game into arcade territory. Physics are one thing but when the game drives for you and you can never turn that off it is another.
To do well in this game I'll have to unlearn how to drive a real car and learn the arcade tips and tricks to do well here.
An example is when you need to counter steer in real life you turn towards where your car is headed. Not in 4za. You have to turn in the opposite direction but only a teeny weeny bit because the game multiplies your steering by 4 when the tires lose grip. In many ways they made "simulation" feel harder than it is supposed to in real life. A real driver will never be able to catch a slide because of the crazy way this game handles it.
This is a slap in the face of racing fans who have invested hundreds in a racing setup. This is a slap in the face to Thomas from Fanatec because he invested in 4za and is taking a risk on the game.
To those that want to know more about the assists in "sim" mode there are a few at play. there is an extra assist in sim mode if you use a controller.
1) steering still twitches. For one reason or another your steering column has a heart attack when cornering and countersteering. Drive in external view while cornering and looking backwards in the 458 and you will see your tires move like a glitchy kinect avatar.
2) when countersteering to save a skid your steering input is multiplied by four or five times so you only need to turn the wheel 15 degrees to get a full lock in the opposite direction. The faster you go the easier it is to countersteer.
3) controller only: the same neutured steering when traveling over 90 km/hr assist exists in 4za. With a wheel I am able to fly down a straight and turn to lock and the game reads it and understandably understeers. Can't do that with a controller.
All of these are easily noticeable with a controller off the bat and the first 2 are noticeable with the wheel.
As a result the driving does not seem natural with a wheel.
Sorry to make a double posting but I have troubles editing my posts in my phone.
Just wanted to add that te graphics are technically impressive and the lighting and cars look impressive too. 60fps no slowdown or tearIng that I've seen so far. The background looks impressive but some aspects are still cartoony I can demonstrate what exactly with screenhrabs later. Still for a fantasy track it's very impressive.
Sounds are good too.
Just wanted to add that te graphics are technically impressive and the lighting and cars look impressive too. 60fps no slowdown or tearIng that I've seen so far. The background looks impressive but some aspects are still cartoony I can demonstrate what exactly with screenhrabs later. Still for a fantasy track it's very impressive.
Sounds are good too.
soundscream
Member
I know it picks up when I am using the speed wheel, as opposed to my fanatec, but whether it is actually changing how it controls in game I'm not aware. I really hope its just a bug because it makes no sense for it to be in there. Perhaps someone could do a lap with both normal and simulation steering and see if the wheel behaves the same in both settings.Shaneus said:
Dash Kappei
Not actually that important
This is truly terrible. :/Iknos said:
Definitely waiting for sim reviews before buying it now, sure hope it's not there on the final game but somehow after FM3 I'm on the pessimistic side.
Shogmaster
Member
shinnn said:
Fuck me those are reDONGculous...
nismogrendel
Member
I wish T10 would add some mode where I can populate races with cars from my garage.
It would be fun to max out an A class Skyline, Camaro, Mustang, etc and then have the AI drivers drive the cars that I created.
It would be fun to max out an A class Skyline, Camaro, Mustang, etc and then have the AI drivers drive the cars that I created.
p3tran said:thats why I said you figure out the road and your window of opportunity to pass, and anticipate ai moves.
ex. if three cars are fighting for position side by side for the upcoming turn, better slow your pace for a couple of secs, even enter the turn a bit slower for max speed out so as to pass them after they enter it and make up for loss.
for sure, you dont have to ram themeventhough if replay was available I would put up some incredibly tight passes between two cars in very-very high speeds.
I like this game mode. its great fun!
I'm loving the traffic mode. The randomness of the AI cars adds to the excitement: if they were in the same spot on every corner every time then they might as well be bollards. Sure it can be frustrating at times (especially when there's a rolling road-block in front of you on the final bend) but the risk/reward feeling has never been greater in a Forza game. It's thrilling when you nail a good clean lap.
I selected the top guys as Rivals and tried to keep up, but couldn't even manage it for more than half a lap racing dirty..! :lol. They did seem to be racing on an empty track though, using perfect racing lines. Lucky traffic placement?
arcade territory? like what?Iknos said:
woa!! I tune cars for a living, I drive them fast too.
I guess I must stop playing forza (or any other game for that matter) else I will crash and burn and have a horrible death
CHILL!!
Steering in the f4 demo is much improved over f3 full game. lets wait and see what happens in the full release, and take it from there.
Pepto said:
That definitely isn't the case in reality. I had the rear tires break loose at over 90mph going into turn 9 on the big track at Willow Springs. Turn 9 is infamous - it's a tricky, high speed right hander. In order to 'catch' the car and straighten it out I had to flick the wheel to the left. It's just counter steering. Of course too much counter steering and too much speed means you might start oscillating like a pendulum until you either slow down enough or you spin. Good times.
I spent a while looking at the steering assist last night..
I just don't get why T10 didn't remove this when set to simulation, I'm hoping it's a bug, because with a wheel, all 3 modes of steering seem to behave the same...
The test and isolation of this was quite easy once I saw what people where posting as proof..
Set the wheel to 900 degrees, and using the throttle, only apply about 45 degrees of lock in each direction as you pendulate, when you have enough rotation, you'll see the steering input 'jump' and hold at a a much higher steering angle, just hold the 45 degree real steergin angle and watch as this suddenly snaps back when the rotation decreases to a threshold.
Just to point a few things out. (All IMO)
1. It doesn't wildly auto-correct, but as people are saying, it does jump /amplify your countersteering to give a larger input. On a 270 degree wheel, it's not so much an issue, you naturally put in quick/large countersteering inputs anyway as you don't need to turn the wheel that far.. But in 900 Degree mode, if you deliberately only put in some small token countersteering input, it will be amplified to give 3/4 lock (To save the slide), you still have to countersteer, it doesn't steer the wrong way or anything like that.
2. It puts in a fixed level of counter-steering, if you hold the wheel (as someone mentions this above), you can see it jump back to the correct 1:1 position when the slides is arrested or speed decreased to some threshold. The oscillations are still there (The original believe auto-assist), but as before, it's not the oscillations that are the issue, it oscillates in lots of situations (some weird artefacting).
3. It does still do it on a 270 degree wheel, but most people aren't going to notice, as you automatically give it a reasonable amount of counter steer very quickly, only if you do the isolation tests with very small deliberate inputs can you see it still does it.
4. Whilst drifting the M5/Zonda a lot last night messing around looking at this, I couldn't feel any difference from all 3 steering modes, they all seemed to behave the same, so I'm hoping it's a bug..
I noticed within 5 minutes of playing the demo that the new physics are really really good, but there was still a slight softness to it (forgiving), I guess some people have (quite rightly for them) an issue in accepting the assists being visible and it ruins it for them..
If T10 just hid all this further down like most physics engines do, then more people would no doubt be happy, they'd notice it's slightly more forgiving nature in this one instance of driving and accept it's T10's design decision..
Apart from RacePro, I can't think of any console games that you can't pendulate a supercar side to side with relative ease.. none seem to want to take it to iRacing brutality.. which is a shame, because simulation steering I thought would cater exactly to this..
Just go and set a fast time on the leaderboard where you will never encounter this issue, and then say the physics are 'arcade' and you need to unlearn how you drive..
Or point me in the direction of a console game that doesn't flatter you in a way you know it's softened and assisted low down? (Except Race Pro, I think that is about all I can think of)..
I just don't get why T10 didn't remove this when set to simulation, I'm hoping it's a bug, because with a wheel, all 3 modes of steering seem to behave the same...
The test and isolation of this was quite easy once I saw what people where posting as proof..
Set the wheel to 900 degrees, and using the throttle, only apply about 45 degrees of lock in each direction as you pendulate, when you have enough rotation, you'll see the steering input 'jump' and hold at a a much higher steering angle, just hold the 45 degree real steergin angle and watch as this suddenly snaps back when the rotation decreases to a threshold.
Just to point a few things out. (All IMO)
1. It doesn't wildly auto-correct, but as people are saying, it does jump /amplify your countersteering to give a larger input. On a 270 degree wheel, it's not so much an issue, you naturally put in quick/large countersteering inputs anyway as you don't need to turn the wheel that far.. But in 900 Degree mode, if you deliberately only put in some small token countersteering input, it will be amplified to give 3/4 lock (To save the slide), you still have to countersteer, it doesn't steer the wrong way or anything like that.
2. It puts in a fixed level of counter-steering, if you hold the wheel (as someone mentions this above), you can see it jump back to the correct 1:1 position when the slides is arrested or speed decreased to some threshold. The oscillations are still there (The original believe auto-assist), but as before, it's not the oscillations that are the issue, it oscillates in lots of situations (some weird artefacting).
3. It does still do it on a 270 degree wheel, but most people aren't going to notice, as you automatically give it a reasonable amount of counter steer very quickly, only if you do the isolation tests with very small deliberate inputs can you see it still does it.
4. Whilst drifting the M5/Zonda a lot last night messing around looking at this, I couldn't feel any difference from all 3 steering modes, they all seemed to behave the same, so I'm hoping it's a bug..
I noticed within 5 minutes of playing the demo that the new physics are really really good, but there was still a slight softness to it (forgiving), I guess some people have (quite rightly for them) an issue in accepting the assists being visible and it ruins it for them..
If T10 just hid all this further down like most physics engines do, then more people would no doubt be happy, they'd notice it's slightly more forgiving nature in this one instance of driving and accept it's T10's design decision..
Apart from RacePro, I can't think of any console games that you can't pendulate a supercar side to side with relative ease.. none seem to want to take it to iRacing brutality.. which is a shame, because simulation steering I thought would cater exactly to this..
I understand any knee jerk anger, but that is just so wrong..Iknos said:
Just go and set a fast time on the leaderboard where you will never encounter this issue, and then say the physics are 'arcade' and you need to unlearn how you drive..
Or point me in the direction of a console game that doesn't flatter you in a way you know it's softened and assisted low down? (Except Race Pro, I think that is about all I can think of)..
evil_as_skeletor
Member
I hope I am not being Captain Obvious, but demo is up (AUS).
Downloading now.
I had to back door it as it does not appear on the front page of newest demos (eg game demos>a-z>forza 4>get trial).
Downloading now.
I had to back door it as it does not appear on the front page of newest demos (eg game demos>a-z>forza 4>get trial).
evil_as_skeletor
Member
BahahahahaMascot said:
CrunchinJelly
formerly cjelly
Demo http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/Product/Forza-Motorsport-4-Demo/66acd000-77fe-1000-9115-d8024d5389f0?cid=SLink
let the puddles of car porn induced jizzum commence!
time to buy shares in kleenex tissues!
let the puddles of car porn induced jizzum commence!
time to buy shares in kleenex tissues!
Diablohead
Member
I knew it!cjelly said: