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France legalizes gay marriage and adoption

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Arksy

Member
Australia's politics are a little aberrant in general when used as a comparative example, because its political culture is unusually reactionary and it has a pretty weird federalism. It was founded as a fairly loose, decentralized federalism but has slowly become more centralized.

Point taken, however, that the street between state legislation and public values goes both ways and barriers can be enacted between the two for either progressive or regressive ends. Having conceded that the road is bumpy and it's perhaps not as simple as I characterized it initially, I still think that on the balance state institutions are still a valuable asset for progressive social policy projects and in aggregate that's the way they've been used in the global north over the historical long haul.

Agreed, they are very valuable. I'm not really sure what you mean when you say that Australian political discourse is unusually reactionary, do you mean to say Australians in general are quite conservative?
 

Kurtofan

Member
And now the leaders of the anti-"mariage pour tous" calls for a "Civil War" and for "Blood". Thankfully, this is over now. The last vote next week will be a pure formality and the Conseil Constitutionnel will probably approve it. I just hope right-wing mayors won't be dickheads by trying to block same sex weddings, but I guess that'll be illegal.

Here is the politician that called for civil war:

NjMxsQMl.jpg


Christine Boutin, leader of the Christian Democrat Party (a small party thankfully)
 

Platy

Member
I'd rather not touch this subject with a 10 feet pole but in my opinion gay adoption is not all good. They are just as capable for raising a child but the society of today is way too anti-gay imo for this to work well yet. I can imagine kids with gay parents being bullied like crazy.

Marriage is a good step for France.

You can live perfectly in school with kids only knowing your dad and not your mom or vice versa.
I lived a GOOD part of my school days with my single divorced mom and there were lots of people who was SURE that I had a dad living with me.

Also, how can people acept gay adopting without gay adopting happening and being totaly normal ?
 

syllogism

Member
Actually it's probably quite incorrect to say the expressive/moral building function should never be the primary function, as symbolic legislation does have its place. For instance the ban on death penalty is probably primarily symbolic.
 

FYC

Banned
Excellent job, France! I will enjoy the rest of the day with a smile on my face because of this news.

Here is the politician that called for civil war:



Christine Boutin, leader of the Christian Democrat Party (a small party thankfully)

Good. I hope nobody does anything drastic, especially if she's 'calling for blood'.
 
I am not preventing anything from anyone. I am just saying I see where people are coming from with this mindset.
I can wholeheartedly assure you that most opponents of gay couples adopting children aren't against it in fear of kids getting bullied. (I guess it's reasonable to keep a healthy quota of orphans, though.)
 
I can wholeheartedly assure you that most opponents to gay couples adopting children aren't against it in fear of kids getting bullied. (I guess it's reasonable to keep a healthy quota of orphans, though.)

Well sure but I hope my point comes across. If you mean people that are against it because of a more anti-gay agenda I don't really have much to say about that.
 
Well sure but I hope my point comes across. If you mean people that are against it because of a more anti-gay agenda I don't really have much to say about that.
I'd imagine it wouldn't be that different than those who are against same-sex marriage, the root of their mindset being a religious interpretation that fits to their worldview--seeing such a relationship as being outside their range of what they consider "normal" and an unfit household for children despite all evidence pointing to the contrary.
 

Pacbois

Member
Good. I hope nobody does anything drastic, especially if she's 'calling for blood'.

This is mostly attention whoring, the opposition is a very loud, rich, organised and agressive minority. So pretty much everytime they open their mouth, the media goes crazy, whereas the pro same sex wedding crowd is just peaceful and also really funny, but sadly don't get much attention.

This is just rethoric, violent action will just totally discredit their cause. The only danger comes from far-right wing groups who support the opposition and might cause violence...
 
I'm not entirely sure how it works, so correct me if I'm wrong. I think it passed the first vote in February but it still has to pass at least another vote before it'll be passed as law.

Edit: grammar.

Well, the House of Lords can send it back to the Commons, but ultimately they can't stop it passing.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that even if it happens to land on the statute books later in the UK than France we still did it first! [/ruleBritannia]
 
This is mostly attention whoring, the opposition is a very loud, rich, organised and agressive minority. So pretty much everytime they open their mouth, the media goes crazy, whereas the pro same sex wedding crowd is just peaceful and also really funny, but sadly don't get much attention.

This is just rethoric, violent action will just totally discredit their cause. The only danger comes from far-right wing groups who support the opposition and might cause violence...

Man christian party calling for blood sounds hardcore :lol. We have an anti-gay christian party over here at Finland but they are pretty tame about it, certainly nobody calling out for blood.
 
Not allowing gays to adopt for fear of bulying is the same as the a court barring African Americans in the 60s fro having children because of racism towards the kids. Its a completely useless argument that holds no weight
 
D

Deleted member 20920

Unconfirmed Member
What do you mean by children's rights?

I think he means the rights of a child to not have gay parents perhaps? I remember one gays' adoption topic going towards that direction. A few people were going "but what about the rights of children to not want to face discrimination of being adopted by gays?"

Which I personally think is a ridiculous notion. That's like saying children should have the right to not be adopted by the poor or the ugly or the fat because they could be bullied for having poor, ugly or fat parents too.
 
Samuel Lafont, anti-gay marriage activist, was reportedly stabbed four times by a LGBT activist. It's on his Facebook page and I don't know more about that - so take it with a grain of salt - but don't expect the press to talk about it very much. The gay marriage debate is getting more and more violent... and shows the current state of democracy...

https://www.facebook.com/samuel.lafont.9/posts/10151617262824314

Also, several people got fined for wearing a 'Manif pour tous' t-shirt: http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/2013/04/08/01016-20130408ARTFIG00579-proces-verbaux-en-serie-pour-le-port-du-sweat-shirt-de-la-manif-pour-tous.php

This is really scary and shows the Thought police isn't as fictional as one may think.

Edit:Turns out it wasn't LGBT activists.
 
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