I honestly can't believe that some people can't believe that other people are still talking about this.
From Software responds to Dark Souls II graphics downgrade concerns
- Thread starter Poetic.Injustice
- Start date
I honestly can't believe that some people can't believe that other people are still talking about this.
Do you really think they will be willing to do it? especially after what we got from them today?
They'll hide that version as long as they can and after releasing it on steam they'll just act as if they don't care.
Watch it... thread whining is a ban offense.
I don't have a card in this game until the PC version comes out though.
Paracelsus
Member
You are not gonna gawk at the hamburger, you're not gonna date it. You have to eat it, if it tastes good and it doesn't contain cyanide then it's all fine and well.
They are called videogames because are visual things you interact with. Graphics DO matter, and people who said they don't are the main reason developers can get away with this crap.
These are the platforms that brought us Gears of War and The Last of Us, there is no excuse except one
Sorry, but we are working on the same budget we had since Demon's Souls
That's it, shift the blame on Namco.
GreatestHits
Member
I will never buy a From software title at full price again. Will buy them all used. Just goes to show any developer is capable of committing deception no matter what you think of them, and sadly i will never trust them again save for some miracle. Great game
, shitty company
on PC
I guess neither of us are following NeoGAF's tag line!
I don't think I'm the one whining. You guys can have your thread, that's awesome, that's what GAF is for. I'm just allowed to think its crazy.
I'd love to see the jury for this case
"Uhhh we can't tell the difference"
plus the game wasn't advertised as being what it is because of graphics so I probably wouldn't put lawsuit in the same sentence
BossLackey
Gold Member
Way to not answer any of the concerns. Ridiculous.
Lawyers taking up a class action suit doesn't mean anything actually 'went to court' mind. Also, Colonial Marines' ship state is not comparable to Dark Souls II as far as what was shown, what was known, and what shipped.
A consumer is always challenged with searching for the most rewarding gaming experience, delivering continuity in graphical quality, gameplay dynamics, and balance within the game's price. The 75% off version of Dark Souls II displays the culmination of this delicate balance and i'm very proud of the positive economic turnout of my patience.
Sorry but no.
it's From doing, all this is in the hand of From (IP owner and developer) not Namco. Namco don't have magical wand that changed the game or From decision, IP owners have full control over their game.
it's From lies and they are the one to blame. they are not the innocent kitten here.
Doesn't hurt to keep trying.
And that's why I would like someone who is actually knowledgeable about common-law and who could explain to me a few things, since it doesn't work that way in France. Class-actions don't exist here, though our law system is really interested by this, and it's highly probable that it will be possible to initiate something similar in the future.
The beta was different too. I just did that area last night and it's a pretty staggering change.
Thanks, I didn't know about this. Glad to see it happened.
It's a good idea, but I'm expecting the worst.Let's get this started again and try to get some information for the PC version of Dark Souls II!
Either retweet this, or create your own. Publishers thrive on our ignorance, lets team up to try to shed some light on this upcoming release.
https://twitter.com/Grief_exe/status/446344154788806656
If you are not aware, the PC Trailer shown at TGS has the exact same textures/geometry as the retail console build, but amazing lighting and graphical effects not present. There are some minor geometry differences between the two versions, but the majority of assets are the exact same.
Some screenshots from this area would give us some definitive information to work with.
I was one of those people as well, but that was only my disbelief that things could actually look that bad.
But my personal expectations do not bear relevance to what a developer actually puts out. In this case, the fact that I expected better doesn't mean that them not delivering better was misleading or 'lying' on their part. That's on me. I was given direct evidence that the game wasn't going to be pretty and I dismissed it and ignored it.
Its true that the demo is of obvious higher quality. That's misleading. Its not lying at all, but its misleading because they obviously couldn't deliver on that for the whole game. I don't think that's because they were *trying* to be misleading, but because they technically couldn't do what they were trying to do.
Personally, I think that since Microsoft's reveal of the Xbox One, people have gone crazy over 'consumer rights', at the complete expense of basic respect, understanding and appreciation for developers and publishers who actually make these games for us.
Downside of consumer rights craze: people who get paid to make things have their feelings hurt
Upside of consumer rights craze: consumer rights
(They don't make these games for us. They make them for MONEY.)
DrROBschiz
Member
They are in the other thread, differences between the network test and console release are minimal.
Some lights no longer cause dynamic shadows and the brightness has been turned up across the board.
We're too cool to follow the crowd.
BS, I still #BELIEVE (with what Grief has been saying).
You make good points, I'm inclined to agree, I just wish we could get some info or footage on the PC version. If it was for performance reasons and nothing more, PC should at least be on par with the TGS build (reveal was obviously just a demo). And since it's the lead platform, they can't even say they just ported the final build or something like that.
martino
Member
Surprisingly accurate avatar.
As a fan of the soul games and someone who like to feel at some level they have principles I'm not rewarding them with my money. Maybe i'll just get it used years from now.
Uh, no. Downside: Companies go bankrupt and can't make the games you like anymore because of bullshit lawsuit or companies stop giving you any information/media about their games before release.
Not that I think there is any chance of the former happening. The real downside is the latter: companies going "Fuck this, you won't see our game until it's done." Because demanding detailed accounts of a game's development and the features that are added or taken away from various builds is not worth that kind of hassle. It's better if they simply don't show you guys anything except CG cinematics and mock up bullshit clearly labeled "not representative of final gameplay." Because apparently a lot of people aren't adult enough to accept that there are different versions of a game that differ drastically and that particular builds during development may differ greatly from the final game.
This is exactly the reason developers keep stuff close to their chest and don't show their games. This kind of bullshit.
Is it crazy to try to get answers on a PC version that has been kept in the dark? A version that is currently on sale at every outlet that sells PC games?
The majority of these threads are less about whining, as performance concerns are a reality of this industry, and more about getting information.
Other than that, there are some legitimate arguments towards false advertising. There are many sections from the initial reveal used in promotional material that do not exist in any way, shape, or form in the console release.
CountAntonius
Member
What answer would have satisfied people in this thread?
Visuals were done to satisfy performance concerns on the consoles, PC version will have the missing effects.
Garcia
Member
Which wouldn't take place at all if such companies hadn't bullshitted their potential customers with false advertising.
This. FROM desperately needs to hire new programmers. They have good art direction and put together interesting pieces but the engine is always dogshit.
"Not representative of final gameplay" is pretty easy, dude. Developers have pretty thin skin if that sends them over the edge.
No gaming company has ever gone bankrupt due to lawsuits.
Metroid-Squadron
Banned
Then they can stop using pre-downgrade footage in promotional material, like in the Steam page for example.
DrROBschiz
Member
Look at these two vids from Jan 29-30th 2014
Playstation Access
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3MdOBH-jDc
IGN
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNlPl6Cfe7c
One of these is clearly retail review copy. One is clearly the damn TGS build or something
Both claimed to be console.
Someone dropped the ball somewhere
Playstation Access
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3MdOBH-jDc
IGN
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNlPl6Cfe7c
One of these is clearly retail review copy. One is clearly the damn TGS build or something
Both claimed to be console.
Someone dropped the ball somewhere
Different crowds around here, but for me personally, I wanted to know where that puts the PC version. It was supposed to be the lead platform for the game, so if it was only cut because of performance reasons on consoles, the PC version should still be intact, right? I don't mean April Reveal intact because that was obviously just a perfectly crafted demo to show the game for the first time, but TGS build intact should be achievable.
If the PC version also suffers from those downgrades, it doesn't really make sense. Also, I'm curious to know more about this, of course I don't think I'm entitled to it, but a more specific example could be a interesting read, since we have footage of a supposed PS3 version that runs and looks great. Now that I think of it, it would be interesting to get a framerate analysis of the same parts as the TGS demo. If they are locked 30 (or at least pretty close to that), then we can assume that it just ran better in that area so they could demo it with all the PC tech before they were sure if they could get the whole game running like that.
But again, different crowds, I'm not part of the "pre-order cancelled" crowd here, I actually just pre-ordered the PC version today because I really want to play the new Souls game, I really want the artbook and soundtrack and the price, at least in Brazil, is more than enough to justify buying it despite some concerns I had about the actual game and despite how it looks or plays in dark areas.
CountAntonius
Member
So to any industry insiders. Who handles PR? Who hands out the stock footage that is used by websites and thrown over interviews. Who handles hands on gameplay previews?
Who would ultimately be to blame for advertising with old footage? From or Namco?
Yep. I mentioned this in the other thread. This was an advertising blunder because footage was used at random. If they were trying to hide the retail build they did a poor job of it cause that was the footage that was in every preview late January early February. The retail footage has been out mixed with footage from early builds.
Who would ultimately be to blame for advertising with old footage? From or Namco?
Yep. I mentioned this in the other thread. This was an advertising blunder because footage was used at random. If they were trying to hide the retail build they did a poor job of it cause that was the footage that was in every preview late January early February. The retail footage has been out mixed with footage from early builds.
pretty done
Member
That's always been the case. Demons Souls is ugly and has a shit framerate, Dark Souls PS3 is ugly and has a completely garbage framerate. I dunno what you guys were expecting (on consoles)
It would be so strange.
From does all this work on the engine to create these specific lighting effects, graphical effects, and, on top of all that, creates the entire torch/sconces mechanic.
From/Bandai are just going to throw out this entire investment? Implementing, the now almost useless, torch/sconce mechanic must have been incredibly expensive on its own. Animations, textures, placing them throughout the game, balancing, etc.
Ingueferroque
Banned
I'd say Namco, since From would be too busy to develop the game being a small team, and I'm sure all of their PR is going through Namco. They were probably under a lot of pressure to provide footage/demo material for trailers/events, and had to branch development for that. Just guessing.
DrROBschiz
Member
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Z2OVha_hno
Launch Trailer appears to show footage from all 3 versions. WTF
Should we be excited for PC or not?
Launch Trailer appears to show footage from all 3 versions. WTF
Should we be excited for PC or not?
From Software could have done better PR. They could have easily said that while those effects worked fine on the demos on the final game it was affecting the performance and they had to tone them down in order to put the game into optimal conditions and people wouldn't be so bothered. Now let us wait for the PC version to see if the effects are not there either.
Krusenstern
Banned
Standart PR non-response.
At least they're aware of it. What interests me is what FROM really thinks about this downgrade thing behind the scenes. Do they regret it to some degree? Do they aknowledge they did things wrong? Or do they really not care?
I liked how FROM apologized repeadetly for the sub-par Blighttown performance and how they would tell us in advance that the PC port of their first game was going to be pretty bare-bones.
But this response here doesn't seem like them. Or I just misjudged them.
At least they're aware of it. What interests me is what FROM really thinks about this downgrade thing behind the scenes. Do they regret it to some degree? Do they aknowledge they did things wrong? Or do they really not care?
I liked how FROM apologized repeadetly for the sub-par Blighttown performance and how they would tell us in advance that the PC port of their first game was going to be pretty bare-bones.
But this response here doesn't seem like them. Or I just misjudged them.
TheFNEffecT
Member
Why not? It's still a souls game at heart no matter what it looks like. Unless this is your first Souls experience you want to have, then maybe there's some other factors that will play into your excitement.
They also told us that we would be very satisfied with the PC port of Dark Souls II, foreshadowing?
Why hire new programmers when you can pay millions of dollars for Blur Studios to make a long CG trailer for you?
CountAntonius
Member
I hope this doesn't make them regret developing on PC's first. To me that was the real issue. That they started with great hardware and had to keep cutting and cutting and cutting till the game was playable on current hardware. If all this backlash means they will avoid the drama and start porting porting to PC again...*shakes fist*
It's Dark Souls II at 60fps. Please be excited.
I hope we'll get mods with PS3 buttons for this one too :3
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