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From Tupac to Rosa Parks: KY county clerk Kim Davis says "Only God can judge me now"
- Thread starter mj1108
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plagiarize
Banned
I don't want to see this woman in jail indefinitely. I respect that she is principled.
I do not respect her principles though and nor should I have to. I'm fine with the rules being changed to appease her so long as people wanting to get married can stroll into where she works and without jumping through any idiotic hoops, leave with a marriage license.
Honestly. I'm cool with that even if some people see that as a 'win' for her. No, the *win* is that people can get married without having to drive to another county because of someone else 'religion'. I don't need a pound of flesh.
That's what they should be looking to fast track. Change the rules so she doesn't have to sign any marriage licenses, but that they have to employee more than enough people who will to ensure people are not discriminated against.
In a few years, almost every churches will have stopped be filling peoples heads with this crap. It's going to be rough before we get there.
No one should have to plan when and where they get their wedding license around the potentially shifting religious beliefs of an elected official. NO ONE.
I do not respect her principles though and nor should I have to. I'm fine with the rules being changed to appease her so long as people wanting to get married can stroll into where she works and without jumping through any idiotic hoops, leave with a marriage license.
Honestly. I'm cool with that even if some people see that as a 'win' for her. No, the *win* is that people can get married without having to drive to another county because of someone else 'religion'. I don't need a pound of flesh.
That's what they should be looking to fast track. Change the rules so she doesn't have to sign any marriage licenses, but that they have to employee more than enough people who will to ensure people are not discriminated against.
In a few years, almost every churches will have stopped be filling peoples heads with this crap. It's going to be rough before we get there.
No one should have to plan when and where they get their wedding license around the potentially shifting religious beliefs of an elected official. NO ONE.
I agree. I am just saying due to how small this county is it may be a very long time before we see whether she follows the judges orders when he released her. And by that point this will be long out of national news potentially so we may never know nationally how it played it out.
Remember, she is not the only clerk who holds this absurd stance and is refusing to issue licenses it is just she is the only one who got the attention of the media.
Remember, she is not the only clerk who holds this absurd stance and is refusing to issue licenses it is just she is the only one who got the attention of the media.
Netherscourge
Banned
umop_3pisdn
Member
Whether other people judge her or not, she should probably exhibit more judgement in her behaviour.
And on the seventh day, she rested.
It still sets a bad example to let someone defy rulings that go all the way to the Supreme Court, while denying subordinates willing to perform the duty the opportunity.
They shouldn't change the rules to appease her, even if they could - she's been asked to perform a legal task by every level of court in the land, so she needs to do what she's legally obligated to do. If she allows subordinates to perform the duty without interference then I'd consider that to be acceptable, but the legislature should dock her pay by an amount proportional to the time she normally spends on processing marriage licenses. That won't happen, of course - she's probably got more support than opposition in their state legislature anyway.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Gonna ask my niece that question..she was born with it, thanks to her father. She was clearly complicit. That hetero bastard..
PeregrinSe7en
Member
his judgement is the only one that matters
hydrophilic attack
Member
One shot
Everything rides on to-night
Even if I got three strikes, Imma go for it
This moment, we own it.
The judgement of random people on the internet is worth about as much as the judgement of of a crazy person in an insane asylum. They could be right, but with their track record you stopped listening to them a long time ago.
aspiegamer
Member
In case any of InternationalGAF wonders why we have this crap in our country--
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesusland_map
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesusland_map
And here's an updated version from 2008 onward that's probably reflective of the electoral map until the Republican party stops advertising itself as Jesusland and Canada gets its shit together again--
Netherscourge
Banned
Well, she's 4 husbands deep in judgment at the moment.
And I saw her making googly eyes at Huckabee...
LudicrousSpeed
Member
On the contrary, I'd say we're going to know this very rapidly. She has to issue licenses ro anyone who fits the requirement, whether they're a resident of the county or not. If, tomorrow, a couple from New York shows up asking for a license, she's not allowed to object.
Since she made national news, I imagine there will be no shortage of people applying for licenses at her office.
Spladam
Member
If there were ever two people that deserved each other.... Match made in heaven, so to speak.
The judge is not a giant asshole that's going to be a stickler to the law. As long as the licenses are being issued from the appropriate office in that county, he will be satisfied. The problem was she was blocking the licenses from being issued also. Her making a good wage just doesn't factor into this.
Ziltoidia 9
Member
I know i shouldn't let it, but this lady and her followers really make my blood boil. Never seen such ignorance. This isn't commentary on her beliefs, its commentary on their ignorance towards not GETTING why she was jailed. Simple minds will carve complex things down to simple things. It will take embarrassment or someone doing the same towards her for her to finally get why public figures have to be impartial.
TheSpoiler
Member
I'd rather her not waste taxpayers money and have her sit in the office while gay people come in and get married while she can't do shit.
That's far more delicious - the fact that she doesn't have to compromise her morals or whatever, but you know she doesn't want gay people to get married at all. It'll eat at her.
That's far more delicious - the fact that she doesn't have to compromise her morals or whatever, but you know she doesn't want gay people to get married at all. It'll eat at her.
Survivor frontman Frankie Sullivan apparently doesn't want to be associated with Huckabee or Davis..
http://www.tmz.com/2015/09/08/kim-davis-eye-of-the-tiger-survivor-mike-huckabee-rally/
HA!
http://www.tmz.com/2015/09/08/kim-davis-eye-of-the-tiger-survivor-mike-huckabee-rally/
HA!
DragonSworne
Banned
Davis' attire always bugs me when I see pictures of her. Does her workplace not have a dress code standard?
God doesn't differentiate between individuals in a blood line when it comes to sin and punishment. Sins of ancestors affect everyone down the line. "Sins of the father" and such. Religion is great isn't it?
Fenderputty
Banned
Who's Kim Davis's Apollo Creed?
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
Hahahah she cried and then Huckabee started tearing up.
These people are so delusional and pathetic. I hope she go back to work and tries not to issue licenses again and is jailed again.
These people are so delusional and pathetic. I hope she go back to work and tries not to issue licenses again and is jailed again.
BertramCooper
Banned
Virtually the only music Republican candidates can use without seriously pissing off the artists is country music. And Meat Loaf.
Remember how pissed off Heart was when the McCain campaign was using "Barracuda" at Palin events? That was amusing.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Yeah. The greatest..fuck that kid.
We're at the point where as soon as I hear music at a GOP rally, part of my mind wonders about the rights, haha..
Fenderputty
Banned
And if it isn't a rights issue is a message issue as they tend to gloss over all the lyrics.
The Sum of Zero
Member
My eyes rolled too far back into my head, halp.
Spladam
Member
I was joking dude. I have the empathy skills to know where she comes from with this, and I think a large part of it is indoctrinated bigotry, which only serves to make her life more difficult. I don't hate, I just try to understand and wish we, as a whole and as humans, made more effort towards empathy and understanding of others and their ways.
plagiarize
Banned
I think some punishment is warranted. I just can't agree to 'prison until she agrees to resign or sign the licenses' and then justify her indefinite imprisonment with 'well she obviously *wants* to make a martyr out of her self'.
I can't know if she is a bigot who was attracted to a denomination she could hide behind, or a true believer of what her church spouts.
But in my eyes, once you start talking about 'they shouldn't change the rules to appease her' you start sounding bitter. There is an issue if you are locking someone up indefinitely because they find it impossible to go against their religious beliefs. In this case that issue is very simply solved by changing a law below the federal level.
I don't care if she walks away feeling like she won or not, so long as people can get marriage licenses. If I knew her personally and felt her to be excusing her bigotry with religion I might feel different.
But that's between her and her God.
We *know* that people will literally choose death over renouncing their religious beliefs.
And we know that there is an issue when there is nothing the court can do but put her in prison over this. It's not the sort of crap you should be throwing people in prison for.
I firmly believe in separation of church and state, and Kim Davis should definitely ask herself if she can work for the state when she puts religious law over federal law... but there is no law that can *force* her to make that choice currently.
If Kim Davis's local church didn't happen to push this stuff, maybe this never happens. Neither of us can weigh that up. If 20% of the people who used to be against gay marriage ten years ago are now for it, were they hateful people using their religious beliefs to excuse their bigotry? Or were they just people taken in by what was being preached from the pulpit.
And what's being preached from the pulpit will change. It might take a while, but it will change. The death blow has been struck on this issue. There will be push back. There will be clawing of teeth. There will be the agonizingly slow drawn out death rattle... whether we put Kim Davis in prison or not.
You want to keep martyring her and sending more and more people rushing to her defence? You want to make it a regular fixture of stump speeches for someone who could just be one Democratic Party scandal away from the white house?
Knock yourself out. Tying your self to your principles, no matter what... doesn't sit well on Kim or anyone else. Religious freedom is hugely important to me as an atheist. Just as people ask of the religious 'Would you be okay with Kim Davis if she was a Sunni refusing to help someone that wasn't wearing a hijab?' I can ask you 'Would you be happy to see someone thrown in jail for their Atheism, or Judaism?'.
I'm not okay with either... and I'm not okay with how much support the so called 'religious freedom laws' which are anything but, have bolstered as a result of all this.
Let her not have to sign the licenses. Make it so that they have to have someone there who will whenever she is working. Let people get their marriage licenses from wherever, whenever. I'd have zero expectation as a straight person that I could march into a town hall and demand for any specific person to sign the license. But I should be able to go into any town hall and get a signed license.
If you can swallow 'Kim Davis getting what she wants' there are ways to ensure that people can get married, and that people can still feel free to attend Church's like the one she does. And you can take solace knowing which direction the country is headed and the picture history will paint.
Putting her in prison has let her draw parallels between herself and Rosa Parks and MLK. We didn't put the bus driver in prison for demanding Rosa Parks move. Nor did we put the CEO of the bus company in prison for it.
It didn't save their reputations and it didn't prevent the civil rights movement from marching forwards.
DragonSworne
Banned
What Davis wants is to ban gay marriage. Spending time and money to rewrite local law to appease a bigot will only strengthen her resolve. Giving into her delusions will make her even more intractable and cause her to become the beacon of hope to all those that also want to bam gay marriage.
So no, I completely disagree with you. She should continue to be jailed if she continues to refuse to do her job.
The latest poll from Rasmussen out this morning shows that the public is against her, 66-26.
She can grandstand and attempt to draw all the civil rights parallels she wants. Thus far, after all of this media coverage, it is not working - the general public is not buying the sob story she's selling.
If anyone has trouble with how the marriage licensing process works in Kentucky, it might behoove you to direct your ire towards the entities responsible for setting-up the process: the legislature and governor. The judge had limited options.
She can grandstand and attempt to draw all the civil rights parallels she wants. Thus far, after all of this media coverage, it is not working - the general public is not buying the sob story she's selling.
If anyone has trouble with how the marriage licensing process works in Kentucky, it might behoove you to direct your ire towards the entities responsible for setting-up the process: the legislature and governor. The judge had limited options.
plagiarize
Banned
You have no proof that she is a bigot.
I know that her imprisonment has brought more people rallying to her cause.
You see a bad person with bad beliefs and you want to see them punished. I don't care how many beacons of hope people who want gay marriage banned have. I want gay marriage to remain legal. Making it so that Kim Davis no longer has sole authority over who can get marriage licenses in her jurisdiction *facilitates* marriages. Just let it go.
Maybe she's a bigot. Maybe she's just a religious nut. Whatever.
We don't need more people in jail for frivolous reasons, and it's been rather odd seeing so many of my fellow liberals suddenly drop that valid goal. Stop looking at it punitively. That is how conservatives look at things. Look at it from a social perspective.
Get this woman out of the news and get the marriage licenses flowing.
But she was up 1 - 0 when the polled Jesus.
Spladam
Member
To be honest, I think if Jesus came back today, he would publicly put her and Huckabee in their places. With well chosen gentle words, of shame.
DragoonKain
Neighbours from Hell
Reading stuff that Huckabee and Cruz said about this, it's scary how such imbeciles can be in power. My goodness.
I don't know if it's fair or doable, but IMO a law that states people who base their day-to-day lives and day-to-day principles on religion should not be allowed positions of power would make this country better off. I don't know how someone's level of faith could be proven or measured, to do such a thing. It may be impossible.
It's just dangerous, because otherwise, you are essentially absent common sense and logic with decision-makers, and you have these decision-markers wanting to enact their own sense of warped morality based on some ancient book whose "teachings" are subjective, and whose authors nobody met.
I don't know if it's fair or doable, but IMO a law that states people who base their day-to-day lives and day-to-day principles on religion should not be allowed positions of power would make this country better off. I don't know how someone's level of faith could be proven or measured, to do such a thing. It may be impossible.
It's just dangerous, because otherwise, you are essentially absent common sense and logic with decision-makers, and you have these decision-markers wanting to enact their own sense of warped morality based on some ancient book whose "teachings" are subjective, and whose authors nobody met.
BertramCooper
Banned
She wasn't in jail for "frivolous reasons," or for purely punitive purposes. She was in jail because she wasn't going to stop preventing her staff from issuing marriage licenses.
I don't want Kim Davis in jail. I really don't. But if putting her in jail is the only way to stop her from blocking her employees from issuing marriage licenses, what other choice does the judge have?
Gentleman Jack
Member
She got up on stage after a train of people with a history of comparing gay people to everything from nazis to pedophiles and said "I love you all." And they cheered loudly.
She chose jail over allowing gay marriages to go forward. I'm not sure what more you're looking for.
It's not something that matters much anyway. She's perfectly free to be a bigot in her heart as long as she allows her deputies to continue to issue licenses.
Vicetrailia
Member
She went to jail for a good reason, because she had no intention of letting any marriage licenses flow thus breaking the law.
I have a hard time seeing the justification for changing state law to accommodate her. She's the boss of her office and was always completely empowered to design accommodations for herself with respect to conflicts between her religious convictions w/r/t her duties. She can't make a government office act illegally because she doesn't like the law, and at some level push has to come to shove. Otherwise we would call them "Court Suggestions".
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