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GAF-HOP: New Official 2010+ Thread of "hiphop ain't dead"

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D

dskillzhtown

keep your strippers out of my American football
Ashhong said:
holy shit. they HAVE to do a video of that shit. its like free money for them or something, come on now.
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When they added the extra shows, I was thinking it had to be for video. Get several shots of the same performances to splice together the best footage. Has there been any reports of cameras in the stadium/onstage?
 
K

Kimosabae

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
Eh, every genre would meet the "tiring" content criteria you're labeling hip hop with. That line of criticism has never set well with me.

I realize the "trying to get out the ghetto, I want to do better things" thing has been done billions of times, but so have love songs and everything else. What makes songs stand out is the artist's personal story. Beneath the Heavens by Blu & Exile is full of introspective songs like this - and so is say, Resurrection by Common. But while both albums are similar in that regard, Blu and Common have different life stories.
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This may be true, but I don't see it. Admittedly, hip hop is all I know (and my knowledge of hip hop even pales in comparison to a lot of you). Other genres seem to be able to approach a wider range of topics due to more tolerant audiences. Rock, alternative and even general pop music often offer a wider range of subjects.

A friend of mine was playing a DVD of DMB's live performances and I was struck at the range and scope of their musical content. One song was inspired by Dave Matthew's personal observance and account of native south african tribes. I found that incredible. Not just the content, but the perspective. Were Dave Matthews a black rapper, the music would have likely been wrapped up in themes of oppression and black african pride. Not that I don't enjoy hearing about those things, but, variety is king.

Not every song has to deal with some grand topic. For all Def Jux's originality, there's also some pretty average rapping being done for the sake of being abstract.
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Okay, I don't know what this means.

"Abstract for the sake of being abstract" isn't even a criticism, really. The abstract is the highest expression of human consciousness. Tell a mathematician his formulas are "abstract for the sake of being abstract" and he'd lend you a puzzled stare. When it comes to abstract language in particular, that form of expression only adds weight and substance for the listener. This is good.

Employing the abstract for its own sake is a virtue.

Even still, most of the rappers of that camp some people like to call "abstract".... aren't even that abstract. Aesop in particular comes to mind. Obtuse, yes. Superfluous, yes.

Maybe abstract in the "hard to understand or interpret" sense, but hardly in the true, generality sense. People just started throwing around the word "abstract" because they didn't know what else to call it.
 
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K.Jack

Knowledge is power, guard it well
Kimosabae said:
Were Dave Matthews a black rapper, the music would have likely been wrapped up in themes of oppression and black african pride. Not that I don't enjoy hearing about those things, but, variety is king.
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Is it even fair to juxtapose the experience of rich, white rock guy with black guy rapper X, especially with that specific issue? Of course he comes away feeling differently.
 
S

siddx

Magnificent Eager Mighty Brilliantly Erect Registereduser
Man I hope they release the em/jay concert on DVD. The up in smoke tour dvd was endlessly watchable, this sounds just as amazing.
 
K

Kimosabae

Banned
K.Jack said:
Is it even fair to juxtapose the experience of rich, white rock guy with black guy rapper X, especially with that specific issue? Of course he comes away feeling differently.
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Income is highly variable between artists participating in both genres. Race, is also variable between artists participating in both genres. It's probably my own fault for using the descriptive "black" rapper.

Sure, I can't expect a minority rapper with energies invested in politically charged messages to interpret that experience and turn it into music outside that scope (Immortal Technique). But there are thousands of other artists without that disposition (not to mention the monetary means).

Does anyone know of the song I'm talking about? If so, could you tell me the name?

Also, could you imagine Jay-Z, Eminem, Kanye etc. talking about such a subject from a similar perspective?
 
H

HiResDes

Member
I don't know how to really argue against what you've proposed by any sort of objective means. I commend you for having such high standards, but I can't say I share them whatsoever. I just tend to look at rap/hip-hop differently and enjoy it for a variety of reasons. The only comparable genre really would be Punk. For example, if you know Punk you know that while there are a variety of artists that really engage in a social discussion (The Sex Pistols, The Clash, and the Subhumans but there are also artists that I love just as much that only really talk about crude things like sex, booze, drugs, and violence like say (Johnny Thunders, Circle Jerks, and the Angry Samoans...Many times the artists talk about the same type of shit, but I still find myself enjoying and head-nodding them just the same. It's that carnal energy that makes them so enjoyable. Is it sophisticated or complicated? No. But it definitely can be entertaining.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Kimosabae said:
This may be true, but I don't see it. Admittedly, hip hop is all I know (and my knowledge of hip hop even pales in comparison to a lot of you). Other genres seem to be able to approach a wider range of topics due to more tolerant audiences. Rock, alternative and even general pop music often offer a wider range of subjects.

A friend of mine was playing a DVD of DMB's live performances and I was struck at the range and scope of their musical content. One song was inspired by Dave Matthew's personal observance and account of native south african tribes. I found that incredible. Not just the content, but the perspective. Were Dave Matthews a black rapper, the music would have likely been wrapped up in themes of oppression and black african pride. Not that I don't enjoy hearing about those things, but, variety is king.
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It's not surprising that Dave Matthews, who grew up in South Africa iirc and traveled the world before forming his band, would have a more broad canvas of observation than some kid stuck in the ghetto.

Kimosabae said:
Okay, I don't know what this means.

"Abstract for the sake of being abstract" isn't even a criticism, really. The abstract is the highest expression of human consciousness. Tell a mathematician his formulas are "abstract for the sake of being abstract" and he'd lend you a puzzled stare. When it comes to abstract language in particular, that form of expression only adds weight and substance for the listener. This is good.

Employing the abstract for its own sake is a virtue.

Even still, most of the rappers of that camp some people like to call "abstract".... aren't even that abstract. Aesop in particular comes to mind. Obtuse, yes. Superfluous, yes.

Maybe abstract in the "hard to understand or interpret" sense, but hardly in the true, generality sense. People just started throwing around the word "abstract" because they didn't know what else to call it.
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MF DOOM and Ghostface, two very abstract, random rappers, are my favorite active rappers. I have no problem with free associative, abstract rapping. My point is simply that this form of rap is no more artistic or impressive than the more "standard" indie raps of Fashawn for instance. And I'd argue many of the most abstract rappers are quite average rappers in general.

There are so many types of hip hop, and at the end of the day each is being expressed by a separate individual. For me, lyrics and stories are quite important. Gangsta rap for instance has been done so many times it can be tiring. But when someone comes at it from an interesting angle, while rapping their ass off, I'm impressed; one of the reasons why Raekwon, Ghostface, etc are so good.
 
H

HiResDes

Member
Why the fuck are we talking about Dave Matthews :lol...Someone explain to me how Dave Matthews has any relevancy. Dude is just as boring as John Mayers...They might as well be categorized as easy listening in my eyes.
 
K

Kimosabae

Banned
I don't want to look like someone that doesn't enjoy entertainment that appeals largely to base impulses and emotions. I've been listening to Kanye's "Workout Plan" damn near non-stop the passed two-days (part of my enjoyment of that track comes from the sophistication found it its production execution, however).

I just think the balance is disproportionate in hip hop when it comes to vanguard, stimulating music. I'm hoping some one can prove me wrong. An "It is what it is" compromise doesn't sit well with me.
 
D

DirtyHarry

Banned
Kimosabae said:
I don't want to look like someone that doesn't enjoy entertainment that appeals largely to base impulses and emotions. I've been listening to Kanye's "Workout Plan" damn near non-stop the passed two-days (part of my enjoyment of that track comes from the sophistication found it its production execution, however).

I just think the balance is disproportionate in hip hop when it comes to vanguard, stimulating music. I'm hoping some one can prove me wrong. An "It is what it is" compromise doesn't sit well with me.
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I think Quasmioto is pretty damn good very ecclectic. It took me a while to get into his stuff but after a few listens, it grew on me and now I can't get enough. It's just some wild out crazy shit. Th beats, the wordplay, the flow.
 
H

HiResDes

Member
DirtyHarry said:
I think Quasmioto is pretty damn good very ecclectic. It took me a while to get into his stuff but after a few listens, it grew on me and now I can't get enough. It's just some wild out crazy shit. Th beats, the wordplay, the flow.
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What's up with your impromptu recommendations of shit that most have already heard.
 
D

DirtyHarry

Banned
HiResDes said:
What's up with your impromptu recommendations of shit that most have already heard.
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Nah, I'd say most people haven't heard of Quas. And if you want something that you probably haven't heard of, go check out some Hijack the Horns of Jericho.
 
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hie

Member
DirtyHarry said:
Nah, I'd say most people haven't heard of Quas. And if you want something that you probably haven't heard of, go check out some Hijack the Horns of Jericho.
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I would assume (or at least hope) that most are pretty familiar with Madlib in this thread.
 
D

DirtyHarry

Banned
hie said:
I would assume (or at least hope) that most are pretty familiar with Madlib in this thread.
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I'm sure Madlib is pretty well known but most of the people I've played Quas for people and they don't even realize it's one of his side projects. Seems way too niche for most peoples taste though.
 
S

siddx

Magnificent Eager Mighty Brilliantly Erect Registereduser
OrangeGrayBlue said:
So guys, new Atmosphere EP's next Tuesday. You excited? Cause I'm excited.
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I posted yesterday how orgasmically excited I was. I punched a fucking baby in the mouth I was so excited.
 
A

Ashhong

Member
spindashing said:
oh fuck. I thought that Cudi track was the Good Friday song. Oh God, if it's gonna be in the album isn't it. Let me stop playing it... :D
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oh god please be All of the Lights...he said on his ustream weaks ago that his next single would drop in about 20 days. its been over that kanye!
 
tsurugi no mai

tsurugi no mai

Member
DirtyHarry said:
You don't like that do you? The only good track Fiddy made was How to Rob and Steal. He actually had a nice flow at one point but for some reason, that kind of shit doesn't work in mainstream rap.
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Yeah, I actually like that song a lot. 50 Cent was good up until the point before he released Curtis.
 
D

dskillzhtown

keep your strippers out of my American football
Koroshi said:
Yeah, I actually like that song a lot. 50 Cent was good up until the point before he released Curtis.
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Agreed. That was just about when he got that Vitamin Water money. He is bored and rich now. I am encouraged that he did say on twitter that he last 2 albums were garbage and he won't be working with those producers again. We will see. Even if 50 doesn't do crap else that is worth a damn, his library is already more impressive than most rappers.

FYI - It appears the Jay/Em show was recorded last night. Not sure where it will end up, cable/blu-ray/ppv but a guy I talked to last night said there were plenty of cameras all around the stadium getting footage.
 
tsurugi no mai

tsurugi no mai

Member
dskillzhtown said:
last 2 albums were garbage and he won't be working with those producers again. We will see.
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His last albums weren't bad because of the production. They were bad because he's rapping about drug dealing and killing anyone who dares to cross paths with him, while he's sitting in a multi-million mansion with Ferrari's and exotic cars.

He needs to change his subject matter to something relevant to his life, because he's just not a thug anymore. Songs like "Smile (I'm Leavin')" are where he shines to me.
 
S

see5harp

Member
DirtyHarry said:
I'm sure Madlib is pretty well known but most of the people I've played Quas for people and they don't even realize it's one of his side projects. Seems way too niche for most peoples taste though.
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Most heads at the time knew. Everything Madlib was doing was doing getting crazy hype. The debut Quasimoto LP had to be one of the top reviewed albums of the year.
 
S

see5harp

Member
Kimosabae said:
I don't want to look like someone that doesn't enjoy entertainment that appeals largely to base impulses and emotions. I've been listening to Kanye's "Workout Plan" damn near non-stop the passed two-days (part of my enjoyment of that track comes from the sophistication found it its production execution, however).

I just think the balance is disproportionate in hip hop when it comes to vanguard, stimulating music. I'm hoping some one can prove me wrong. An "It is what it is" compromise doesn't sit well with me.
Click to expand...

I would say just branch out and listen to other genres. There is plenty to love in hip-hop but sometimes you just gotta take a break. Maybe check out producers like Jon Brion and see what he's worked on. Check out stuff that supposedly has inspired Kanye like Radiohead. Subscribe to the free The Fader Podcast.
 
H

HiResDes

Member
And now for some real rap:

cover.jpg

back.png


DL LINK Alternate Link

...Admittedly a very guilty pleasure, but I know there has to be someone out there interested in some ignorant ass shit.
 
S

soul creator

Member
so this just popped up on my facebook:

Common Whatever the opposite of writers block is, I HAVE IT! Day 3 in the studio with No I.D. I'm on a roll!! I cant stop writing.
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and then I clicked on view all comments and saw like 70% females, haha. Though hopefully Common and No I.D. together again means good things and not Universal Mind Control things
 
H

HiResDes

Member
OrangeGrayBlue said:
I'd hardly call him "fuckin crazy". He's decent at best.
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I'd much rather listen to Dom Kennedy, that's what I think every time I hear him...But he's pretty decent.

Dirty Harry - Do you only post random youtube videos?
 
T

ThePrivateCookie

Member
2065.jpg

"Love, Hate" - Lloyd Banks Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovLerfDwd6Q

He's really been stepping out of 50's shadow as of late, the 5 mixtapes he put out + His two dope singles "Beamer Benz, or Bentley" & "Any Girl" have really turned me around on him, he's improved alot, i'll be picking out his album when it drops nov 23rd over nicki minaj's for sure. :lol

And if you never listened to a Lloyd Banks mixtape i'd recommend "V5, & "Return of the PLK".
stand out tracks:

"Power Back"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dW636DsCE8
"Bully" (over the New Wu beat from Raekown's OBFCL2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwlnBysOVAg
"Rather Be Me"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CP31YR_8qg&feature=related
"We Remain"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5b-lobPU4IE&feature=related
 
G

ghostofsparta

Member
I have a good question.

Looking at the list on the OP Bone Thugs-n-Harmony aren't there.

How come they almost never get the recognition they deserve? Bone Thugs made fast rapping famous Bone Thugs invented the fast rap with harmony deliver, which has influenced many artists. Yet you hardly hear about them. It's just something that has always bothered me.
 
T

ThePrivateCookie

Member
ghostofsparta said:
I have a good question.

Looking at the list on the OP Bone Thugs-n-Harmony aren't there.

How come they almost never get the recognition they deserve? Bone Thugs made fast rapping famous Bone Thugs invented the fast rap with harmony deliver, which has influenced many artists. Yet you hardly hear about them. It's just something that has always bothered me.
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they haven't really done anything "relevant" (i hate using that term) in longtime, people kind of forgot about them.....
 
S

spindashing

Banned
ThePrivateCookie said:
they haven't really done anything "relevant" (i hate using that term) in longtime, people kind of forgot about them.....
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Which is sad because they recently re-united 100% didn't they? =(

Kanye where's our new track I'm itching all over I need my fix
 
D

dskillzhtown

keep your strippers out of my American football
ghostofsparta said:
I have a good question.

Looking at the list on the OP Bone Thugs-n-Harmony aren't there.

How come they almost never get the recognition they deserve? Bone Thugs made fast rapping famous Bone Thugs invented the fast rap with harmony deliver, which has influenced many artists. Yet you hardly hear about them. It's just something that has always bothered me.
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Bone Thugs are legends, IMO. But from what I heard they are about to do a full out rock album. Not sure they have done enough recently to be "hot". But they are in my Hall of Fame.


Love of money and this remix of Look into my eyes are me faves.
 
H

HiResDes

Member
I still feel like Devil Theory did an amazing job with the list he included....I'm impressed with it every time I look at the OP, but having said that where the hell has he been? :lol
 
MMaRsu

MMaRsu

Member
ghostofsparta said:
I have a good question.

Looking at the list on the OP Bone Thugs-n-Harmony aren't there.

How come they almost never get the recognition they deserve? Bone Thugs made fast rapping famous Bone Thugs invented the fast rap with harmony deliver, which has influenced many artists. Yet you hardly hear about them. It's just something that has always bothered me.
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Bone Thugs are legends, fucking love them.
 
E

exarkun

Member
On the topic of Lloyd Banks, his first album he was fuckin feisty. Liked it alot. Rotten Apple was garbage.

His newer shit makes me hope he went back to the old Banks. Would make sense since you know, money doesn't last forever.

50's problem is that after his second album (which wasn't even thhhat good) his regular cds sucked but his mixtapes were getting better and better. Which means something that I don't understand. Soooooooo fuck 50!

Hires, why did you change the avatar? Couldn't recognize you for a minute.

Sippin on some good bourbon and having a clove, listening to the DZA tape and Curren$y album. So good. Feel like I'm getting white boy wasted. :lol
 
H

HiResDes

Member
exarkun said:
On the topic of Lloyd Banks, his first album he was fuckin feisty. Liked it alot. Rotten Apple was garbage.

His newer shit makes me hope he went back to the old Banks. Would make sense since you know, money doesn't last forever.

50's problem is that after his second album (which wasn't even thhhat good) his regular cds sucked but his mixtapes were getting better and better. Which means something that I don't understand. Soooooooo fuck 50!

Hires, why did you change the avatar? Couldn't recognize you for a minute.

Sippin on some good bourbon and having a clove, listening to the DZA tape and Curren$y album. So good. Feel like I'm getting white boy wasted. :lol
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Dude I could no longer keep it. No one took me serious with an anime avatar, it detracted from nearly every serious argument I made somehow. :lol

...I did rock it for over a year though to support Scribblenauts. I'm listening to some older Devin The Dude and sippin on some chai tea...About to go to the bar in a little.
 
D

Devil Theory

Member
ghostofsparta said:
I have a good question.

Looking at the list on the OP Bone Thugs-n-Harmony aren't there.

How come they almost never get the recognition they deserve? Bone Thugs made fast rapping famous Bone Thugs invented the fast rap with harmony deliver, which has influenced many artists. Yet you hardly hear about them. It's just something that has always bothered me.
Click to expand...

I went through my personal list on top of ones I had just thought of; I didn't want to list absolutely everything, I mean it's pretty well assumed that everybody who listens to hiphop, or knows about it's history in the slightest, already knows about BT.

Edit: Yeah sorry I haven't been around much, things in the real life realm keeping me busy like job interviews and finally trying to pull some money in, I'm fairly behind on the mixtapes.

I did recently buy the Big Haz album, he sent it out from Australia and auto'd it for me. Cool guy, great album.
 
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