Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Again, Juicy J getting Miley Cyrus pregnant will have a deeper impact than that verse.
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GAF-Hop |OT9/9/99| African Substitute Teachers Run NY
- Thread starter IrishNinja
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Again, Juicy J getting Miley Cyrus pregnant will have a deeper impact than that verse.
I think Kendrick did have something to do with Pusha's album. (I think Pusha pushed his album back because of his reaction to GKMC.) Kendrick showed every rapper today that you can create a story/theme with a great album, where the singles don't detract from the experience, and reach platinum status. I feel that GKMC's impact is (was?/should be?) doing more than Control.
Basically, it all comes down to Kendrick as a person/rapper and GKMC and Control are just an extension to Kendrick's impact.
Sure, publications/radio interviews are still asking rappers today but I see it as them asking about it to maybe get a hot reaction from a rapper so they can get more hits for their ad revenues.
I just find the verse to be pointless because he wasted his time and my time mentioning those specific names. Everyone lost their mind because it was the first time a popular rapper didn't throw a subliminal and mentioned names. That was a bigger impact. A rapper claiming that he's the best isn't new and is par for the course.
And getting the reaction from social media instantly after the release of the song doesn't help. All it does is add more fuel to the overhyped fire.
Basically, it all comes down to Kendrick as a person/rapper and GKMC and Control are just an extension to Kendrick's impact.
Sure, publications/radio interviews are still asking rappers today but I see it as them asking about it to maybe get a hot reaction from a rapper so they can get more hits for their ad revenues.
I just find the verse to be pointless because he wasted his time and my time mentioning those specific names. Everyone lost their mind because it was the first time a popular rapper didn't throw a subliminal and mentioned names. That was a bigger impact. A rapper claiming that he's the best isn't new and is par for the course.
And getting the reaction from social media instantly after the release of the song doesn't help. All it does is add more fuel to the overhyped fire.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
That's what I meant. But it's been the first time in this new generation of rappers with any weight to his name.
CountBlack
Member
Christmas in Harlem
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
that isn't Christmas in Hollis....
PhoenixDark
Banned
The fact that we're STILL talking about Kendrick's verse right now, and the fact Meek brought it up this weekend during a concert (with Kendrick on the same bill/in attendance) tells you everything you need to know about its impact.
The irony didnt escape me breh. You know something will last to a degree if people continue to talk about the degree to which it is overrated or not.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
It's like two months old...
IrishNinja
Member
yes
having attended one, this is the kinda holiday us CAC's lack in our lives, and not just for the garb/wraps (sorry if im butchering the actual term), it was really cool.
related: dying to actually go south of the border for a dia de la muerte one year, that's gotta be somethin
Exactly. It's been a long time, maybe since ether, since a verse was talked about this excessively and brought this much hype to a rapper. If Kendrick had dropped another album 2 weeks after control it would have been massive. The actual quality of the verse, and whether it deserves all the talk is up for debate (I personally thought it was a great verse but nothing astonishing) but there is no argument as to the attention it has received.
IrishNinja
Member
^fuckin exactly
"hey ya'll let's stop havin these drunken origies by the fire out in the woods, wouldn't it be better to stand in a building for an hour, sing in latin and perpetually feel guilty? "
"hey ya'll let's stop havin these drunken origies by the fire out in the woods, wouldn't it be better to stand in a building for an hour, sing in latin and perpetually feel guilty? "
Byakuya769
Member
Whoo, that song goes.
The kind of lifestyle that drives a man to xtreme sports and disturbed cds.
No, it has merit and all, again, I'm not denying that his verse was a thing or had some provoking/controversial lyrical content, but it's just not as pleasing to my ears. I'd rather listen to the other two verses flow. Kendrick's verse ending sort-of anticlimactically with a pretty poor punch at the end also hurts it a lot in retrospect. It's overrated relative to the other verses, pretty much.
It will be a footnote. Any other verse that's come out in the past 5 years being more relevant or memorable? Nope. This was a moment in hip-hop. It was a landmark people compare things to before and after, and even though it's relatively recent, there's no real consensus against that, and it will also be forever associated with the ascent of Kendrick so long as he doesn't start doing twerk music tomorrow.
What does this have to do with anything? Apples and oranges.
See, most of your support for your argument here is hope and/or irrelevant. GKMC didn't really have much impact. It pushed Pusha's album back a bit but he's been pushing it back for way more reasons than just Kendrick, and Kendrick isn't even the biggest of them, so that's irrelevant. GKMC should've had more impact, but it really didn't. You don't see any artist giving it overwhelming praise, it's just "yeah, Kendrick's debut was dope."
Actually, I don't even think GKMC did anything for Kendrick in the mainstream outside of Swimming Pools. He's been bubbling before, had the Dre cosign beforehand which carried things, was featured on tracks with Drake, etc. Control was the execution to that set up really, and GKMC was a fragment of that. A part, but not really significant.
And also, you're acknowledging impact and then casting it off as meaningless because reasons, with respect to the bolded. The smoke exists as much as you want the fire not to be there, and it's still burning.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Name something else from two months ago that's relevant today, go ahead. You'll be able to say Drake/NWTS in about three weeks, at which point it'll be exactly two months since the album came out. Or not, considering the album doesn't seem to have singles like Take Care did.
Rap is fast food, shit comes and goes. Yet we're still talking about Kendrick.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
There are songs and albums from over decade ago people still talk about.. The word Ether became a verb.
There are plenty of songs from 2013 that get a lot of airtime, and mad love.. I don't really know what you are going on about.. In here alone we still talk about who won Jay-Z or Nas.. Biggie or 2Pac...
We talk about old beefs and whatnot always..
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Kendrick's verse on MADD City was better than his control verse..
Name them, or any in the past few years that got as much attention as Control. From the public, other artists, and the media.
The very fact that it isn't just some consumable song that people rock with just because it's hot to bump at the time is the reason why it outlasts everything else and had a bigger impact. There was weight in the content.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
You are changing the criteria..
But not it's not outlasting other music.. sure, people are talking about it two months later, but do you think it will be Ether, or No Vaseline?
It is a consumable song, I haven't listened to it in over a month, and nor have I heard on the radio or in clubs.. How is it not consumable?
CountBlack
Member
Yall not even gonna wait until Kendrick falls off to start hatin
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
I don't think a verse on a cutting floor track is the most earth-moving verse ever is hating?
PhoenixDark
Banned
Esch: the verses I remember completely taking over the consciousness of hip hop are Wayne on We Taking Over, Eminem on Forever, and Kendrick on Control. Not calling those the best three verses, just stating they're the ones that had everyone talking.
That's not the point. Modern hip hop is rather slim when it comes to "moments." I don't think Kendrick's Control verse was his best, or even the best verse of the year - but it clearly was the biggest, most talked about.
Typically modern hip hop moments, songs, and albums go through a boom/bust cycle. The single is big, the album has legs for a couple weeks, the video is big, the next single arrives, etc. 2 Chainz first album pretty much shut things down for a couple months, when you look at No Lie and I'm Different plus the album going gold. That was an undeniable moment of interest, even if you don't like 2 Chainz. Kendrick managed to get a similar moment/event with one verse. That's still being talked about months later.
That's not the point. Modern hip hop is rather slim when it comes to "moments." I don't think Kendrick's Control verse was his best, or even the best verse of the year - but it clearly was the biggest, most talked about.
Typically modern hip hop moments, songs, and albums go through a boom/bust cycle. The single is big, the album has legs for a couple weeks, the video is big, the next single arrives, etc. 2 Chainz first album pretty much shut things down for a couple months, when you look at No Lie and I'm Different plus the album going gold. That was an undeniable moment of interest, even if you don't like 2 Chainz. Kendrick managed to get a similar moment/event with one verse. That's still being talked about months later.
CountBlack
Member
But nothing been the same since they dropped control tho
I mean, all music is consumable, I'm saying it's not in people's ears and mouths because it's made for the club or radio or anything like that. You're judging whether this song got love or not by how much it was played in certain venues or for certain purposes while ignoring the venue that what made it as big and widespread as it is, which is the Internet. Control is above all that, it's relevance is in the discussion it stirred, not necessarily in the lines or the rest of the song itself (which to most people, doesn't even exist because of how big Kendricks verse is).
And I don't necessarily think it will become a verb or something, but I think it will definitely become a landmark in the history of hip-hop when people look at this era. It fits way too well with the direction mainstream hip-hop has taken between the more melodic and backpacker stuff and the rise of trap and the South. Will stuff change in the type of songs we see coming out or what artists begin rising in the mainstream? Maybe if someone who can compete with Kendrick rises, maybe everyone will suffer from subjugation, maybe nothing will change. That part of the impact has yet to be seen and relates back to what I said about a lot of it depending on how Kendrick carries himself from now forward too.
But you better bet your ass the next time Kendrick drops something people will be referencing Control still.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Things have been fairly par for the course...
like everything these days it had its moment and folks went back to business as usual.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
I can dig that
Kendrick had his moment when he released an album with mad legs.. The verse is just good PR
Club and airtime is something I look at.. It is not the only thing I look at.. but It doesn't mean I am incorrect to look at it.. I really don't feel like it will be a landmark in the history of hip-hop//
That will be a dark day in hip-hop. I don't want to hear those arguments, as much as it might be good for the culture.
It will really be Takeover/Ether arguments like every day just clogging Twitter.
Drake is feeling himself way too hard ATM to let that happen though. Dude basically only sees Jay Z being between him and being the GOAT in all respects.
I really feel both those two are irrelevant considering the purpose/fallout/message/proliferation of the song and everything. I've heard the song discussed on radio, but the radio (here at least) is pretty well designed and mandated find something new to talk about all the time, whereas you will see internet media continue to question and discuss the impact because of the relative freedom they have.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Control will matter less if Kendrick doesn't deliver next year. He has to hit his next album out the park on every level. I think it'll be more like Section80, which has a general concept but doesn't hold every single track hostage to the narrative like GKMC does. That alone would cause some to complain ("it doesn't tell a story like his last album!").
Kendrick needs some hits though.
Kendrick needs some hits though.
You need to listen to NWTS again. Its the most insecure album in rap ive ever heard that wasnt released by The Game, Blueprint 2 aside. Drake feels himself but his inner self is rotten at the core like an apple. I wouldnt be surprised if he's cried reading blogs of what people think of him.
He would definitely beef with Kendrick, in fact i wouldn't be surprised if he had some bars hidden away for the guy.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Forever got mad burn from the club as well as the Internet.. Still hear it from time to time..
Control didn't cross all the medias it needed to be considered an historical event
You're a fucking genius. I think you just resolved a personal complex: my inexplicable disinterest in GKMC in the face of a resolute love for Section .80.
CountBlack
Member
Fuck any ninja that's just talking to get a reaction, fuck going platinum I look at my wrist and its already platinum
BARS SON. BARS
IrishNinja
Member
i personally thought that verse was better than most of the stuff i heard in 2012...not to say it was a bad year, but i loved the shit outta that verse
its why i couldn't front like his BET cypher verse was nearly on that level, it was just kinda hype for the shot taken
was this a thing? i dont honestly remember hearing about it much, there were others that were better on that track
when Drake dies from a combination of hemophilia & carelessly stepping on a safety pin on his tour bus years from now, he will be retroactively crowned the GOAT faster than Pac and the control verse will be seen as 2013's "Who Shot Ya?"
I mean, he's pretty insecure yeah, but dude talks that way in interviews and shit. It's the two pronged attack which is what makes people (mostly chicks) idolize him.
I agree he's probably got bars locked away, but dude is too happy on his high horse right now. He'll be fine sending subliminals and letting people pump him up regardless because he knows Kendrick's ceiling is below him. Kendrick isn't a threat exactly. I think him not getting his just due with how people in general clown him is more threatening than Kendrick.
Good point I hadn't considered. You could argue that Control's relevance would be historic and exemplary of the changes in the business though, with more of it being online than ever with shit like spotify, twitter leaks, etc. That stuff is what enabled it to be as big as it is.
EDIT: Not just the business, but with how people listen to music and react to it in general.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Me and my brother were watching that video of Drake rapping off his iPhone. I just don't see someone like that (ie someone who couldn't even freestyle/recite a verse 3-4 years ago) trumping someone like Kendrick in a battle. Or Cole, let's be fair. They live/breath rapping, I don't think Drake does. And for all my Jay-Z shit talking there's no doubt that he once took rapping very seriously. Drake has been on top for a couple years and feels like he can just coast, modern Jay-Z style.
Now you just reminded me that Drake is the reason why the freestyle has lost most of it's meaning. Not that people haven't rapped written material before in freestyles, but they're glorified previews of mixtapes/albums now.
Now I'm sad.
Zeus Molecules
illegal immigrants are stealing our air
the best part of that rumor is Juicy J damn near started it himself.....
"you say no to Rachet pussy/ Juicy J can't"
IrishNinja
Member
tokus you brought up eatin ass & got the ball rollin so this is largely your fault dude
Tasting butthole
posting about it in gaf hop
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