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GAF Indie Game Development Thread 2: High Res Work for Low Res Pay

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Ito

Member
Movies go along at 24 fps and there's a lot of blurring even when stuff isn't moving all that fast and that's the only reason you don't really notice how low the framerate is.

I think your animation has a decent frame rate. I don't think it needs that much blurring, it looks a little bit "overcompensated".

I'm not saying that you should remove it, I don't think it'll really be all that noticeable in-game (the character seems to be an NPC, right?).

I'm just saying that I don't personally like blurring when the motion is slow. I know you're going for a more natural result, but what I see is totally the opposite. It's like my eyes can isolate every single frame and spot the blurriness, instead of reading the movement as natural.

Maybe this is one of these hate/love things where you'll find a wide range of opinions.
 
I quite like the idea of blurring the feet a little bit when it's not pixel art, rather nice but minor effect that really helps IMO.

and I would say the frame count for that running animation is fine, I sprite stuff with 8 frames looped and it's always looked fine to me (at a speed of 6 frames per animation frame in a 60fps game)
 

dude

dude
I don't think the blurring looks bad, but it does look a tiny bit like the animation is slow motion. I think a side-by-side with and without blurring would go a long way to helping see what works better.

Animation looks awesome BTW.
 
Now available on Steam!
store.steampowered.com/app/444000

CYTBqVMWEAAWuTO.png:large

Will you work on Project Light after this?
 

Ito

Member
Lol I know, I haven't replied yet because I was afk :)

I was already around when that user (whose name I don't remember) ranted about the chromatic aberration in Ghost Song, so I understood the reference as the joke it is :)



If Mr. Spinach would please stand up and explain why would this be an insult, that would satisfy my curiosity xD
 

correojon

Member
We made bit of a stumble on Android launch of Power Hover. We launched the game couple weeks ago, after the launch it quickly became apparent that video advertisement model we tried for Android version wasn't really working, we were displaying decent amount of ads but in return we only got pennies, and the remove ads iAP wasn't really doing anything either.

So I did the math on the first weeks data and the numbers just weren't there, I guess ads only work if you have like millions to tens of millions of downloads.

So instead we changed the Android version business model. we got rid of the ads, and changed the game into Free To try:
Now you can play the first chapter of the game for free.
To access rest of the game you can unlock it with one time iAP.
(if you bought the remove ads iAP earlier that also grants full access to the game, same thing if you managed to get far enough with ads).

Anyways, it was all bit of a hassle, we should have just gone with this model in the first place. We were thinking about free to try model initially, but wanted to try out the ads model. blah. Luckily we were able to do the change this early on and managed to do it so that the players who got far or bought something in the earlier version were pretty much unaffected. Phew!

Now it seems that the numbers are bit healthier, now we can stand behind the product, we were kinda bummed out by the amount of ads and what that did to the game. Live and learn!

Here's a new gif from the upcoming content update level, exploring deep waters.. The update should be ready in couple of weeks!
giphy.gif

Lol, last week I told a coworker of myne about the game, right now he approached me and told me "Hey, didn´t you say this game was free with ads? it won´t let me get past level 9!". I told him about the recent change and let him play level 10 on my phone. I told him as well that new levels are coming. He says he enjoys the game a lot and that it´s very well done, but I couldn´t get him to buy it. Man, it´s only 3€!! Some people...
 
Ito, Jack seems to think this came off like some kind of weird insult against you. I assure you it wasn't. Was just a random joke.

Lol I know, I haven't replied yet because I was afk :)

I was already around when that user (whose name I don't remember) ranted about the chromatic aberration in Ghost Song, so I understood the reference as the joke it is :)



If Mr. Spinach would please stand up and explain why would this be an insult, that would satisfy my curiosity xD

I didn't fully understand it but I wanted to keep my bases covered =)
I read it as snark directed at Ito because the CA bit back then was lunacy. Probably not the best use of context, Matt. Didn't read like a joke because there is no vacuum.

That's why I asked you on hangouts and not here. I explained it in private for your benefit but here we are anyhow.
 

Ito

Member
That CA was crazy but I didn't take part in it (I was just a mere spectator), so I'm not gonna get offended.

And I do enjoy Matt's sense of humor, so don't worry Jack :)
 
Three weeks from today I'll be leaving my current job to go full into indie dev. It's a huge risk but I'll regret it if I never do it so I'd rather bite the bullet now then lose my chance later.

You'll probably see me post more here in the coming weeks. I'm prepping everything I need before I start and it looks like I'll be using GameMaker while doing my art in Illustrator and animating in Flash.

Does anyone know if Spriter or Spine animations can export as vectors and still be imported into GameMaker as vectors? Last I checked only Flash does this with GM (thus why I'm using Flash).
 

neko.works

Member
You still have at least 5 visibility rounds that can give you impressions in the main page, unless you are planning a big update you can always combine them with a discount to attract more people.

Yep, I might try that!

Will you work on Project Light after this?

I'm still working on porting Super Night Riders, currently on the Xbox One, and later on more. I will probably be quite busy with SNR on Q1. But yes, my next planned project is Project Light, which is now called Light Fairytale by the way :)
 
I try to focus on gameplay first, so ask yourself how will this affect gameplay. Did you plan some nice mechanics that won´t work in the side view? Or will the game allow for more elaborated mechanics on the side view? If there´s no difference in this regard then it´s just a matter of aesthetics and personal taste, so just choose what you think is best. It´s good to make a game with the main appeal in mind, but you´ll probably be more engaged (and thus, put more work into it with less effort) if you´re making something you absolutely love and can see turning out as something fantastic when it´s done.

EDIT: Also, write down your arguments for both sides, sometimes doing this will make you think about the decission in another way and make it clearer which one´s the better choice.

It's going to utilize randomly generated dungeons each time. So I think that ultimately will decide the fate of the GUI.

I also want sideview combat, sort of a Final Fantasy/Paper Mario transition. It's not unprecedented for games to have two different views.
 
That CA was crazy but I didn't take part in it (I was just a mere spectator), so I'm not gonna get offended.

And I do enjoy Matt's sense of humor, so don't worry Jack :)
It sounded like something I would say to piss someone off by conflating the two knowing what was said. Plus I'm outspoken as fuck.
 

neko.works

Member
Hi folks. I released PixelRender for Unity3D yesterday. It's a complete toolkit for realtime rendering of 3D scenes/meshs as 2D pixel art. Details and video at the link, hopefully it'll be of use!

PixelRender is also free to use for non-commercial purposes (commercial license are available from my online store).

http://kode80.com/blog/2016/02/23/pixelrender-for-unity3d/index.html

CaOWDsVUkAAN6cQ.png
UQgoELB.gif

Looks great! Loving the dithering effect.

I wish they made a 3D Parodius like this :)
 

Kalentan

Member
UMIb.png


Took a break from my menu to attempt to create my "Forest and Fields" tileset.

Despite this screenshot, it's kind of gone through phases. The grass was originally way more detailed but it didn't repeat nicely...

Shall work on it more later! :D
 

DNAbro

Member
I'm glad when school slows down for a bit so I can get back to working on my game. Finally got time to finish up the dialogue system. Mostly need to do animations, art touch ups, and polish next. I'm hoping to finish it over my spring break next week.

yay progress

edit: also a title screen. kind of important.
 

asa

Member
Lol, last week I told a coworker of myne about the game, right now he approached me and told me "Hey, didn´t you say this game was free with ads? it won´t let me get past level 9!". I told him about the recent change and let him play level 10 on my phone. I told him as well that new levels are coming. He says he enjoys the game a lot and that it´s very well done, but I couldn´t get him to buy it. Man, it´s only 3€!! Some people...

Haha, well at least you tried! thanks for that! :)
It seems these days, especially in mobile, asking even tiniest amount of money for a game is an impossible concept. But at the same time, there are those who are spending hundreds/thousands of dollars for F2P.
 

Lautaro

Member
Three weeks from today I'll be leaving my current job to go full into indie dev. It's a huge risk but I'll regret it if I never do it so I'd rather bite the bullet now then lose my chance later.

I'm in the same boat, the only advice I can give you is don't bet the house on it and have an emergency plan.
 
Yep, I might try that!



I'm still working on porting Super Night Riders, currently on the Xbox One, and later on more. I will probably be quite busy with SNR on Q1. But yes, my next planned project is Project Light, which is now called Light Fairytale by the way :)

Looking forward to it, I'm working on something similar to it. :)
 
Oop, not been in here for a bit, been too busy sleeping away whole days it seems o_O
I'm currently poking about for a part time job to bring in some cash while I wait for greenlight. I really need to get the game out to press in all honesty but there's some tweaking I want to do to make sure it's as intuitive as possible before I start throwing copies of it everywhere :p

About a week away from wrapping up development on GunWorld 2, then going into Cert for Xbox One. The last thing I'm doing at this point is finalizing sound effects and finally replacing placeholder backgrounds (like the one you'll see in the following gif).

Anyway, in honor of Screenshot Saturday, here's some GunHorse.

giphy.gif
Good luck with cert, I had to do a bit of it testing for that kind of stuff back in the day. I imagine it's slightly less silly now than it was back then or at least a bit less pointlessly arbitrary for indies (We had to make sure Crackdown could work with dance mats and guitar hero controllers... I can't imagine anyone actually playing it that way but it was part of the tests XD )
Also, the gunhorse takes me back to when I was lil and occasionally watched 'Bravestarr' as the baddies rode something like that minus the gun for a face XD Cool!

It's not shown in that gif but you can jump up from a ledge grab into the holes you see on the wall, but not high enough to grab the ledge above, I used to allow that but level design works better without it currently.

qxwjDJd.gif
.
Cool for getting into vent-like bits and whatnot but I'm somewhat curious what options you have to get out of there if you were to try and use it to help you scale stuff :eek:
She looks a bit uncomfortably cramped/trapped in there XD

Ooh! Congrats! :D

edit: question time!
I'm thinking of giving my game some sort of single player content / progression by locking the harder bot levels behind some progressive achievements (e.g. win 3 games against the easy bots as a solo player to unlock normal difficulty bots) Do you think that's a good idea or should I just keep the bot difficulties open?
Advance was designed first and foremost as a local multiplayer, but the bots got added to help me test stuff, take video footage without having to recruit people constantly to work the other pads and generally give people someone to play against if friends weren't available seeing as it doesn't have any online. I plan on making them pretty fun to fight and people already seem to enjoy tangling with them, but I don't know if I have the time/resources/ui flow to really accomodate anything too grandoise for single player beyond what I mentioned (aka having bots you can add and maybe locking the harder ones behind achievements as a form of progression)
 
Havent read all of your KS yet but this could be first indiedev iam supporting on KS since... Ghost Song? Why the low goal, if you dont mind me asking?

Simply put I do not need thousands, the asking money is enough to finish the game while affording to live, i'm currently with my parents so rent is cheap for the time being :)

My problem over the last two years was aiming too high, I dialed back a lot of ideas and such so I can finish a game finally.

Cool for getting into vent-like bits and whatnot but I'm somewhat curious what options you have to get out of there if you were to try and use it to help you scale stuff :eek:
She looks a bit uncomfortably cramped/trapped in there XD
Right now all you can do is drop out of the hole and maybe grab the ledge again, sometimes having limits helps the level design.
 

correojon

Member
Right now all you can do is drop out of the hole and maybe grab the ledge again, sometimes having limits helps the level design.
I couldn´t stress this enough. At least for me, having limits makes me grind my gears on how to do more creative stuff. At the same time not being confronted with a blank slate helps me a lot to focus and design levels with a clear goal from the start.
 
Right now all you can do is drop out of the hole and maybe grab the ledge again, sometimes having limits helps the level design.
Yup yup, as long as the limits are on the creator and not the player anyhoo :p
One possible use I see for this mechanic is avoiding stuff being shot up or dropped down shafts you're climbing at least :3
 

mabec

Member
Simply put I do not need thousands, the asking money is enough to finish the game while affording to live, i'm currently with my parents so rent is cheap for the time being :)


Cool cool, i totally understand that. You sound to honest and sincere its almost impossible not to pledge. Also that gorgeous pixelart and those animations makes my retrovein pump faster.
 

missile

Member
... Hmm, you make a compelling case!

To answer your question, yes I do dye my hair various shades of blue, but its vividness is exaggerated in my self portrait.
Sweet! :+


... PixelRender is also free to use for non-commercial purposes (commercial license are available from my online store).

...
UQgoELB.gif
Yeah, low-level-gfx-ftw! I find your approach bypassing the asset store and
offering separate commercial and non-commercial licenses very interesting.
Will you report back on the success of it in selling PixelRender that way?


Good luck Diablohead and mStudios for your Kickstaters!
 

kode80

Neo Member
Yeah, low-level-gfx-ftw! I find your approach bypassing the asset store and
offering separate commercial and non-commercial licenses very interesting.
Will you report back on the success of it in selling PixelRender that way?
I'm going to write a blog post in a month or so, detailing how it's going. I also have a volumetric cloud renderer for Unity3D that I'm intending to release the same way.

It's definitely a little nerve racking since I; a) don't have the promotional clout of the in-editor Asset Store/Unity and b) don't get the impulse purchases since I'm offering the non-commercial download up front. Hopefully word of mouth will help. I've been wanting to move to this model for a while now, I'm a firm believer in sharing code, but also in being able to eat. whynothaveboth.gif :D

Either way, I'm interested in how this experiment will play out!
 

Ito

Member
Hey guys, what do you think of my trees?

The first one actually has a character behind the tree, but you can't see them... I'm wondering if there is some way to make the tree top go transparent.

Are you using GM:Studio? If so, and you're using sprites for the trees, just lower their opacity whenever they're in contact with a character.

Another thing you can do is drawing a silhouette over the character and tree sprites, then trim it, but you would need to use surfaces for that.
 
So I want your game. What engine?

UE4

But tbh you don't want it trust me :D I haven't even got the core mechanics done yet, putting the inventory in has given me the challenge of remaking the whole way it deals with what weapon is equipped and what weapon anim state to use so!

Gunna be fun to try and work out
 

Kalentan

Member
Are you using GM:Studio? If so, and you're using sprites for the trees, just lower their opacity whenever they're in contact with a character.

Another thing you can do is drawing a silhouette over the character and tree sprites, then trim it, but you would need to use surfaces for that.

Currently I'm using tiles for the tree. Should I make an object that has it and do that?
 
So, for those messing with greenlight I did some skimming over projects that have been greenlit in the past and while just a cursory search I couldn't find any entries that had gotten through with less than 501 yes votes. The real mechanics of what gets in or doesn't is still some kind of dark magic as far as I'm concerned and it wasn't the deepest of searches, but if you're in greenlight or going into it, 501 yes votes probably isn't a bad goalpost to aim for first :3

Finished integrating the basics of the loot system :)

66a844ed41.jpg


ae40fc8ca0.jpg
Is that cardboard box armour? Awesome! XD
 
So, for those messing with greenlight I did some skimming over projects that have been greenlit in the past and while just a cursory search I couldn't find any entries that had gotten through with less than 501 yes votes. The real mechanics of what gets in or doesn't is still some kind of dark magic as far as I'm concerned and it wasn't the deepest of searches, but if you're in greenlight or going into it, 501 yes votes probably isn't a bad goalpost to aim for first :3


Is that cardboard box armour? Awesome! XD

Yeah it's the test items that come with it :)

I'm trying to figure out slots for weapons still though, which of the following do people prefer:

- 1 slot for each weapon type (1/2H melee and 1/2H ranged)

- 1 melee slot, 1 ranged slot

- one 1H slot, one 2H slot

- 1 of any weapon slot

- 2 of any weapon slot

If it helps the game has a strong survival flavour to it, not just loot loot loot
 

Ito

Member
Currently I'm using tiles for the tree. Should I make an object that has it and do that?

Yeah, that's the easiest way.

Instead of tiles, creat a sprite with the tree top, and make an obj_tree.

What you want to do is have the tree checking if there's something under it, and if so, lower its opacity at 50%.

Now, I wouldn't recommend doing this every step, since it's not that important. So you better use an alarm event and have the object check for characters every 5 or 10 frames.

You will also need a parent object (obj_character) whose children should be all those objects that should make the tree go transparent (just create an empty object, name it obj_character, and then set it as parent object for all your character objects).


Use the following code in obj_tree:


-Create Event-

alarm[0] = 10;


-Alarm Event 0-

if place_meeting(x,y,obj_character) image_alpha = 0.5;

else image_alpha = 1;

alarm[0] = 10



-Draw Event-

draw_sprite_ext(x,y,image_index,image_xscale,image_yscale,image_blend,image_angle,image_alpha);



If you wanna go for even more optimization, you can create a obj_tree_controller object that takes care of checking for characters. It's faster for GM checking for collisions like that.

Case you want to do this, the obj_tree object doesn't need code at all, except for the code in the draw event.

It would be the obj_tree_controller that would need the code in the create and alarm_0 event. However, the code in the alarm_0 event would be a little bit different:

with (obj_tree){

if place_meeting(x,y,obj_character) image_alpha = 0.5;
else image_alpha = 1;

}

alarm[0] = 10;
 
Sooooo... If a local multiplayer game has bots so it can be played solo, do you think it would be legit to include the single player tag on it in greenlight/steam? :p
 
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