Ros8105
Member
Seriously? You're going to stop watching because a few people don't like it?
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Game of Thrones is bad. Like, really bad. Here's why. (Spoilers)
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Chuckie
Member
In the book he hears that his brothers got murdered and Winterfell burnt to the ground. In a moment of weakness he has sex with Jeyne Westerling.
To protect Jeyne's honour, he then marries her.
She was also not at the Red Wedding and not pregnant as far as we know.
Edit: Beaten like Stannis by 20 good men.
well, to awnser your questions 1- kinda. 2- yes. 3. yes. The show is not terrible, it just becomes dumb at times and really predictable alter on, Anyways, It has great production values so it creates a nice spectacle so keep watching, specially since you can go episode after episode.
Imo the show has consistently gotten better every season, with the exception of season 5 having a dip in quality.
S6 > S4 > S3 > S2 > S5 > S1
It's all good though. Some appreciate the smaller scope and slower pacing of S1, and the fact that it has very few fantasy elements. The show starts to open up in S2 though, and S3 is when it really starts to get going. That's where it felt like it started to become the global phenomenom it is today.
Hyperactivity
Banned
Robb, following a battle and injury, has sex with minor lady who tending to him as a nurse. He refuses to just take her virginity and not marry her (which would've socially disgraced her), and thus marries her.
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
I've just come to accept the immense stupidity in the show and can enjoy it. It's not the quality show I expected from HBO, but it's entertaining trash.
There is, just not in English. And with less gore and more romance I suppose. If you're looking for scheming and politics with fabulous costumes and sets, Chinese dramas got those in spades lol
IdreamofHIME
Member
OP doesn't like hipster writers messing with his rapist badboys.
Back-In-Black
Banned
I'm just going to quote the video below like 5 times because it does a MUCH better job at explaining what OP is trying to say which is that the show gets the "spirit" of the books wrong. If your curious as to why people who have read the books are especially turned off by the show then please watch.
Watch out everybody OP has a hot take
Just stop right there.
I like how the OP writes out and fleshes out his controversial opinion, it's not really that controversial, and instead of people actually discussing the points in the opening post, they post some glib gif response or a simple no as if they're somehow clever instead of just shitposting. This is a bad thread and it has nothing to do with the OP.
Well anyway I just want to discuss this point. I generally don't like the show but feel show Cersei is overall better than book Cersei, primarily because show Cersei isn't so over the top insane. Her paranoia has been dialed down to more realistic levels and while her motivations aren't as clear cut as in the books, her actions aren't as extreme either.
| Praxis |
Banned
That's how I have come to see it.
Blows my mind when I see it referred to as a masterpiece though, especially over things like The Wire, Deadwood and The Sopranos. It's actually insulting.
Now this is absolutely true. You really can't argue against this. The show was much better at depicting travel times early on, when it was more in line with the books.
He wrote out and fleshed out his opinions so no. Just because you don't like the contents doesn't make it clickbait.
> Claims not to be a book purist.
> All complaints center around how the show is different from the books.
Okay.
I mean, I thought the show was shit from episode one, so I get your point, but you aren't going to convince anyone when your argument boils down to 'but the books tho'
> All complaints center around how the show is different from the books.
Okay.
I mean, I thought the show was shit from episode one, so I get your point, but you aren't going to convince anyone when your argument boils down to 'but the books tho'
Paltheos
Member
I haven't watched the show much. I've really only read the books but... like, what is GAF being so outright dismissive about? All of his criticisms seem pretty valid. Maybe the conclusion is wrong (maybe it is much worse than the books but still not bad), but outright dismissing everything he said with simple 'no's is pretty dick, GAF.
Did you miss the part about how problematic the show is? No one seems to have rebutted the sexism, racism or homophobia yet.
He doesn't consumate the marriage because it it would be rape. In the book Tyrion is much younger than Peter Dinklage. The scene could never play out the same way. Tyrion jokes about raping Cersei ONCE. I doubt he would actually do it. Same with Tommen.
He is severely whitewashed though. Its disappointing.
She offers Ned sex in the show too. It seems they completely removed her sexuality after Season 1. How many people even remember she fucked Lancel? It seems out of character now. It sucks indeed.
Yeah, this is kinda how I feel. It's a good show, a fun one with some great moments, but it doesn't really hang with the best of the best the way (some) people say it does.
Moff
Member
The most important reason why this show is so popular is that GRRM wrote a great story with great characters. All the changes for the show, some mistakes some necessary changes, could not ruin that so far, which is why I still think the seasons have reflected the quality of their repective books pretty well. I agree with some of your points but some are really dumb, like Tyrion planning to rape Sansa.
I consider myself a fan of ASOIAF and at the end of the day what really matters to me is that season 6 surpised us all after the subpar season 5, which gives me hope for both TWOW and season 7.
I consider myself a fan of ASOIAF and at the end of the day what really matters to me is that season 6 surpised us all after the subpar season 5, which gives me hope for both TWOW and season 7.
Ocarina_117
Banned
I think of it as popcorn television. The sets design, acting, costumes - all round production value are like nothing else on television.
The writing is awful. Just don't think too much about it.
The characters drove the plot in the books, they feel organic and everything they do is natural. In the show the plot line is to get frim big moment to big moment.
The handling of characters such as Sept Meribald, Stannis, Loras, everything Dorne, Yasha, Euron, The hound (I could go on) has been amatuer.
Yes things need to be adapted for the screen. But look at The lord of the rings as an adaption which successfully carries the themes of the book into the screen.
A lot of Haha no comments ITT as expected, which is a shame. OP took time to write out an argument but comes across as aggressive. Someone put a YouTube video in this thread which goes into greater detail.
The writing is awful. Just don't think too much about it.
The characters drove the plot in the books, they feel organic and everything they do is natural. In the show the plot line is to get frim big moment to big moment.
The handling of characters such as Sept Meribald, Stannis, Loras, everything Dorne, Yasha, Euron, The hound (I could go on) has been amatuer.
Yes things need to be adapted for the screen. But look at The lord of the rings as an adaption which successfully carries the themes of the book into the screen.
A lot of Haha no comments ITT as expected, which is a shame. OP took time to write out an argument but comes across as aggressive. Someone put a YouTube video in this thread which goes into greater detail.
darkazcura
Member
Most of your explanations are actually reasons I enjoy the show more than the book to an extent, heh. Different strokes.
Mr. Giggles
Member
Ahhh good then. onwards I go.
I've been burned by shows that should have ended in 1-2 seasons before, never again.
MrOogieBoogie
BioShock Infinite is like playing some homeless guy's vivid imagination
Totally agree, OP. I really don't think the show is very good at all, save a few episodes.
GAF A60-Rim A
Banned
I know this isn't the best way to judge, but I watched that British 5-season recap (if you know what I'm referring to), hoping that it would make me want to watch it.
It all seemed so lifeless, and so... slow? Even with all the events crammed together... nothing really seemed to happen?
A few people went here... some moved there gradually, with some dragons... some stern conversations were had... and... I dunno... apart from the sheer scope, epic nature, and chilling production design, what am I truly missing?
It all seemed so lifeless, and so... slow? Even with all the events crammed together... nothing really seemed to happen?
A few people went here... some moved there gradually, with some dragons... some stern conversations were had... and... I dunno... apart from the sheer scope, epic nature, and chilling production design, what am I truly missing?
The first 3 books, yeah. It goes downhill after that.
Hyperactivity
Banned
Again, it's not that the show is different from the books. It's just that the show's creators, every time they try and go off on their own, throw off the characterization that they had been drawing from GRRM's writing. When they do these weird character differences that make little sense with how THE SHOW ITSELF up until that point has portrayed the character, it's stupid.
If the show is just going to go off by itself, then it should do that. Except in season six, the show does that, to its benefit compared to season 5, but the show writers also basically have the characters do the "here's what Jon/Arya/Dany/etc. would do if I was them". It becomes fanfiction like really quickly. If it wasn't season SIX from the show, after having done a pretty good job with building up many of its characters and giving them a motivation and visible paths that the character might follow, this wouldn't be as much of a problem.
Even if you treat it as a new show entirely, without thinking of previous characterizations for the different characters (Jon *cough cough cough*), then yes, it is disappointing, but then the show shouldn't have anywhere near the prestige it has. It's a decent show at that point, but only if you come in with a lowered expectation and idea for what the show is supposed to be.
Idk, in the books, every character added develops, isn't portrayed in some black&white manner, adds something new to how the world develops and how the puzzle pieces all fit together. In the show, it feels like they add characters just to either add characters or catalyze certain plot developments sometimes.
Basically this. It's entertaining more than anything else, but give up on the show being some greater spectacle, and stop treating it like it should be considered as one.
If the show is just going to go off by itself, then it should do that. Except in season six, the show does that, to its benefit compared to season 5, but the show writers also basically have the characters do the "here's what Jon/Arya/Dany/etc. would do if I was them". It becomes fanfiction like really quickly. If it wasn't season SIX from the show, after having done a pretty good job with building up many of its characters and giving them a motivation and visible paths that the character might follow, this wouldn't be as much of a problem.
Even if you treat it as a new show entirely, without thinking of previous characterizations for the different characters (Jon *cough cough cough*), then yes, it is disappointing, but then the show shouldn't have anywhere near the prestige it has. It's a decent show at that point, but only if you come in with a lowered expectation and idea for what the show is supposed to be.
Idk, in the books, every character added develops, isn't portrayed in some black&white manner, adds something new to how the world develops and how the puzzle pieces all fit together. In the show, it feels like they add characters just to either add characters or catalyze certain plot developments sometimes.
Basically this. It's entertaining more than anything else, but give up on the show being some greater spectacle, and stop treating it like it should be considered as one.
Ocarina_117
Banned
Rape in the show was used in a strange way. It seems to be used for shock value to keep people talking about the show for a week.
In the books rape is fucking terrifying and revulting. A moment from the clash of kings involving the mountain had me put down the book for a month when I first read it. It's also used to show a darkness to Tyrion's character absent in the books, it comes to the fore more after Tyrion kills tywin.
Are you really surprised by the responses when the OP is so inflammatory and hyperbolic? That's not how you start a reasonable discussion.
I hate that they turned Loras into such a idiotic weakling. Stripping Cersei of her sexuality feels weird, like it couldn't be reconciled with her being 'powerful'. I feel like thats why they made Yara gay too. Like she couldn't be a badass warrior that also enjoys being submissive in bed. That would have been different and interesting.
I came to read critique about the Game of Thrones TV show, what I got was book vs TV comparison. Something that is entirely pointless. There are no mentions of acting, cinematography, the sets and costume design, make up, music etc. in the OP. You know things that matter in a TV show.
wesleyshark
Banned
Hottest non-politics related take of 2017 so far, easily lol.Watch out everybody OP has a hot take
Actually the OP has a pretty large section dedicated to the poor writing on the show that has nothing to do with the books. (well, it compares to the books but only to show how it could be improved.) That's one of the criticisms I completely agree with. The writing in the show is very haphazard with no regard for what's come before or any thematic ties.
My guess with Cersei was this direction for the character was pushed by Lena Headey. Interviews around the time of her Walk of Shame seemed to imply that anyway.
And this is something that people often forget when critiquing the show. TV is a collaborative medium. The writers aren't the be-all, end-all when it comes to story and character decisions on the show.
Ocarina_117
Banned
Read through the thread. There's a lot of well explained criticisms of the writing of the show. Most people consider the bolded to be important in a TV show. But at the end of the day the writing matters a lot more, no?
What's to rebut? A main female character gets bent over and raped,on camera, in tears, in the first 30 minutes of the show. This was when I noped the fuck out. Always amazes me when people bring up the "problematic" aspects of the show, 5-6 seasons deep like that shit wasn't there day one. No one seemed to give a shit till it happened to Sansa.
Those are all criticisms directly pointed at the television show by itself. Westeros having warp points isn't a remotely new criticism and it's a serious problem with the show. There's little sense of how large Westeros is as a country and how big the world actually is because when you having characters pop up in different parts of the country even inside the same episode, it makes the world feel like a smaller place.
Garrett Hawke
Member
Correct.
The show runners have very little faith in their audience being intelligent, and instead ramp up everything to pornographic levels to seem "adult" and "mature".
Terrible show tbh. Nice sets and costume design though.
The show runners have very little faith in their audience being intelligent, and instead ramp up everything to pornographic levels to seem "adult" and "mature".
Terrible show tbh. Nice sets and costume design though.
Maybe Season 5 and 6, but it's still 10x better than TWD, for example.
Honestly, I love the show, especially Season 1-3. The dialogue is fantastic, the show has great characters, it's a great production, the plot is interesting, etc.
Oh, I agree. But people in this thread are defending the writing and so on but dancing around this topic. I guess because it's pretty unavoidably problematic.
But she DOES offer Ned sex and we have a scene of her and Lancel pretty early too. Its clear that they didn't know what they would be doing five seasons later.
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