the method they use for raising the slave army seems really inconvenient. First, you kill off 3/4 of your potential recruits during training, then every single one of them has to kill a newborn to earn their shield. How many did soldiers did they train, 8000 was it? They really must have an abundance of human 'material' to work with. I don't know if they got the memo, but in large-scale warfare mass > class
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Game of Thrones *NO BOOK SPOILERS* |OT| Season 3 - Sundays on HBO [Read the OP]
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
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They're all slaves. Nobody cares. There's more of where they come from.
Killing a Baby in front of their mother is their way to "deconstruct" the human being. If you have no emotion, you're a better killing machine.
There's a reason the place resides in the "Slavers Bay".
Weapxn
Mikkelsexual
They're basically perfect warriors though. They are 100% obedient. They do not question. They are highly skilled fighters. They continue to fight or otherwise obey orders until they are no longer capable of doing so (read: dead).
They're also completely expendable. The slavers can get more whenever they choose.
Wouldn't you rather have 8000 perfect warriors than 32000 "eh" warriors?
Shadow of the BEAST
Banned
most of the things outside of westaros sans the dothraki is really under developed and not as thought throught as the things in westaros.
most of the things in quarth was weak, same with this slave place.
most of the things in quarth was weak, same with this slave place.
still, that's a lot of slaves that you could add to your work force instead. So wasteful
nah, I'd take the 24000 (32000, actually) if they won't turn on me or run away on the first best chance
Basileus777
Member
still, that's a lot of slaves that you could add to your work force instead. So wasteful
They are slave merchants. What sells for more, unskilled slaves or highly trained and disciplined soldiers?
These 8000 can't feel pain and will do WHATEVER you tell them to do without questioning itstill, that's a lot of slaves that you could add to your work force instead. So wasteful
nah, I'd take the 24000 (32000, actually) if they won't turn on me or run away on the first best chance
Weapxn
Mikkelsexual
Rofl, welcome to basic math. #Fail
In 32000 you would have some of them run away or turn on you though. They would not all be trained to be completely obedient and not feel pain. They would not be perfect slave warriors.
Weren't all of the Qarth leaders killed? She could have taken their gold. The crazy magic dude and the vault dude killed the rest of the leaders, the dude with the vault was locked in there and then she killed the crazy magic dude. So she took all their money?
Loved the episode. Now I'm completely intrigued by Jon's arc, whereas last season I didn't really give a fuck about him or what was happening. Now I must see more!
Also hoping to see some cool rivalry going on between Margaery and Cersei.
My theory is that she's basically playing people like Xaro was. She did say she learned something from him.
Also hoping to see some cool rivalry going on between Margaery and Cersei.
My theory is that she's basically playing people like Xaro was. She did say she learned something from him.
Fun fact: That was actually Sansa's actress in Giant makeup at the beginning of the episode.
edit: wrong thread, I'll take my leave now.
that's nice I guess when you want a loyal personal bodyguard, but it seems like a complete waste of resources to me if you actually try to raise an army. War generally favors the side with the bigger numbers
They're not raising an army, they're building the perfect soldiers so they can sell them for a shitload of money out of a huge bed of eligible slaves.
They're basically Spartans. Except there are 8000 of them.
"The best" sells for a lot of money.
I'm sure her dragons are worth thousands of men each, so the combo would probably be pretty devastating.
Enosh
Member
yeah... looking at history, that's not really true
Daenerys's triple dragons are growing too slow, so she needs a small spartan army to supplement them.
Well, she is taller than pretty much everybody else on set, and it seems she didn't need that much makeup!
I kid, I kid...
Lennington
Neo Member
Pretty sure an army made up of 24000 or 32000 average joes would break and flee when faced with the exact military precision, mercilessness and efficiency of the Unsullied. The front line would be cut through like butter and panic would spread in no time.
no way, half of slave army would be dead from projectile fire before they even reach the enemy and the rest of them would be crushed by the masses. Load up Medieval 2 if you don't believe me!
Last Hearth
Member
Actually from what I know of warfare (based on reading) discipline if far more important than superior numbers.
gottdamn that Tywin monologue was brutal. Poor Tyrion
yea just watched it again and holy hell that said it all... he despises him and only accepts him as a Lanister because he cannot legally prove he's not his son... shit man
I don't think anyone is saying that the Unsullied ALONE are enough. They're just the best infantry in the Game of Throne's world which is a great start to building a good army.
In the Total War series having infantry that refuses to break against a charge is incredibly valuable. Poorly disciplined infantry breaks quickly leaving everything vulnerable in the those games. And heck take a look at the historical example of Roman Legions and Greek Hoplites. Infantry isn't as flashy as archery or cavalry but it's the core and bedrock.
there are plenty of cases where the outnumbered army was victorious, sure, but as a rule of thumb the side with more soldiers is usually far more likely to win unless they fuck up badly. That said, discipline seems to be of high importance as well. Someone more knowledgeable about the history of warfare may correct me, of course
Angry Fork
Member
No Arya... disappointing.
And I hate Daenerys so much, I hate her entire story arc and just do not care.
Glad the show is back though, I still miss Ned and wish there was a character like him around.
And I hate Daenerys so much, I hate her entire story arc and just do not care.
Glad the show is back though, I still miss Ned and wish there was a character like him around.
cutmeamango
Banned
Guess who is coming.
The other thing to consider is that the people of Astapor aren't a conquering people famed for their armies. They're slavers and their incredibly profitable premium 'product' are the Unsullied. They sell 'quality'.
Yeah, in retrospect, I would have liked to have seen the battle between the night watch and the white walkers. It's kind of a clash that's inherently built up in the lore and hype cliff hanger'd in the finale, but we got nothing in the premiere. HBO should step it up for this show while it's still hot.
Look we aren't going to come to a resolution on this through words. It's obvious what we must do:
All for the slaver army you will have until the end of the season to train 8 individuals to the utmost of their skill
All for quantity over quality you will get 32 people together the day of this battle.
We will have both sides fight to the death for our amusement. Whoever's side wins gets a free soda and a hearty handshake congratulating them from me.
All for the slaver army you will have until the end of the season to train 8 individuals to the utmost of their skill
All for quantity over quality you will get 32 people together the day of this battle.
We will have both sides fight to the death for our amusement. Whoever's side wins gets a free soda and a hearty handshake congratulating them from me.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
Skilled fighters are nothing without the tacticians and commanders to make use of them.
She now has two highly skilled soldiers to lead her troops so it looks like she might be okay on that front.
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
There was no battle. The Nights Watch ran away.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
It is somewhat difficult for two men to command 8,000 soldiers who only seem capable of following and not leading.
The 300 spartans that fought at Thermopylae "performed" well because of a tactical advantage, not just because they were phenomenal warriors. The same is true of the Romans; in 1st century England they lured Boudicca's army to London which gave them time to regroup and gain a tactical advantage. When the time came to fight, the Romans slaughtered every single one of them (thus destroying the celtic rebellion) despite being heavily outnumbered.
Westeros armies would have a tactical advantage. I suspect only the dragons would tip the balance in Daenerys Targaryen's favour.
I would hope if the Unsullied have been training since they were 5 that they would also be knowledgable in battlefield tactics. Especially if they are being touted as the most highly trained soldiers you can buy.
Well, judging by the beheaded crow in the beginning, there was some sort of confrontation.
Guess who is coming.
Not heard the other two speak, but Ygritte is really well spoken irl, she does a good job on the accent.
Forsaken82
Member
That was what the audio at the beginning of the episode was supposed to represent I think. I would assume budgetary as opposed to time.
kame-sennin
Member
There is no better army than the Dothraki. Nomadic horse riding steppe peoples are utterly devastating in medieval combat situations. The largest contiguous land empire in human history was ruled by the Mongols, a nomadic cavalry army from the Asian steppes.
The only reason those other cities in the show haven't been conquered by the Dothraki is because of their high walls. Robert Baratheon mentioned this to Cersi in season 1.
And the fact that you can't really siege a city that has a port in it.
Read: because everything the city needs comes through sea
4.4 million viewers achieved at the premiere, 6.7 million for the Sunday night!
http://insidetv.ew.com/2013/04/01/game-of-thrones-premiere-ratings-3/
http://insidetv.ew.com/2013/04/01/game-of-thrones-premiere-ratings-3/
Of course you can, you blockade the port with your own fleet.
The Dothraki have never set foot on boats. Except now, that Daenerys asked them to. But you're right.
I meant you can't land siege a port city.
Ninja Scooter
Member
I just rewatched S2 so I should know this, but Robb and his mom (and their people) have no idea about what happened at Winterfell, right? Did Theon go back home to his father after that?
No, they don't. Everybody at Winterfell is Scattered and/or dead. All the Ravens were killed, so there's no way to tell Robb what's happening. Everybody that could offer any kind of help is away with Robb on the army.
Something that I feel I can never quite grasp is where people are in the world and how long have they travelled. Robb, for instance, just arrived at Harrenhall, which is near the Island between the place "Riverrun" is written and King's Landing on the map posted on the thread earlier. He's really far away from Winterfell or the North overall.
Theon was knocked unconscious by the Pyke men that were under his command (but not really), bagged and took along when the Pyke men left Winterfell.
We don't know what happened after that.
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