Support NeoGAF

[Supermanisdead]

Melisandre is amazing. I was afraid they'd wash out the red colours because the other characters' clothes are so washed out, but they made her really stand out.

lolwut

holy shit. i died.

 

[Anton Sugar]

Because I don't make a habit of looking at others without clothing? Natural human state, etc, whatever. I live in a society where people don't parade around without clothing and so seeing others without clothing isn't comfortable.

Do you make a habit of watching violence?

Snark aside, I can see where you're coming from with the sex scenes, but I think getting uncomfortable with nudity (particularly in an HBO series) is silly.

 

[Zeliard]

Because I don't make a habit of looking at others without clothing? Natural human state, etc, whatever. I live in a society where people don't parade around without clothing and so seeing others without clothing isn't comfortable.

Spoken like a true American. And if you're not, well, consider yourself an honorary American. :>

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

What purpose do they have?
I'm serious. I want to know. What am I missing in my uncomfortability? And is that meaning not able to be portrayed in a non-intercourse manner?

Most are information dumps. They use the sex to give them something to do. I'm sure if they tried they could do other activities.

 

[Zeliard]

- Alyssa Rosenberg @ ThinkProgress: A (Partial) Defense of Nudity in ‘Game of Thrones’

Read this article for examples on how the nudity actually adds to the characterization.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

My only problem with the nudity is that it's having an unintentional comedic effect on me at this point.

 

[endre]

Book spoilers:

Spoiler

The maesters are the magic killers in Westeros. What does book learning do you when you can just magically heal someone up? Magic hinders advancement. I mean, the people on Westeros have been there for like 8000 years or so and they are just now at the middle ages basically. I could be just making shit up but I believe its even hinted at that they were the ones that killed off the dragons.

We don't even know if god's exist. It could just be magic. The people just have to give them some sort of deity to worship.

Spoiler

I really hope its not going towards evil scientists vs magicians. That would be very lame.

 

[frequency]

Do you make a habit of watching violence?

Snark aside, I can see where you're coming from with the sex scenes, but I think getting uncomfortable with nudity (particularly in an HBO series) is silly.

No actually, I don't make a habit of watching violence. I play games that have violence, but it's all colourful and cartoony stuff (JRPGs, platformers like Mario, etc). I don't really play stuff like CoD and GTA because the violent content gets to me over so many hours.
To me, ASoIaF is great for the characters and intrigue, not the sex and violence.

And like I said, I can live with the nudity even if it makes me uncomfortable. It's just that almost all the nudity in this is followed by sex.

Spoken like a true American. And if you're not, well, consider yourself an honorary American. :>

I'm not American. Nudity isn't a regular thing in most cultures that I know of. So I'm not sure why that's apparently an American view.


But anyway. I guess most people here aren't as bothered by the sex as I am. I don't mean to create some debate about it (I'm sure that's already happened earlier in the thread). I just wanted to say it bothers me.

 

[ido]

I don't think HBO shows are for you.

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

I don't think HBO shows are for you.

a man has to have a code

 

[jett]

lolwut

hahaha rickon wuz here

poor bastard, not a single appearance this season yet

 

[Steelyuhas]

lolwut

"Rickon wuz here"

LOL

 

[Supermanisdead]

hahaha rickon wuz here

poor bastard, not a single appearance this season yet

they better show him or else he'll grow up on them and they'll have a walt situation

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

I want CG Shaggydog.

 

[KingK]

I don't think HBO shows are for you.

Dunno why people keep saying this. The Wire has nowhere even close to the amount of nudity GOT has.

I don't have any problems with nudity in concept, but GoT goes a little over the top sometimes and some of the scenes (read: Ros scenes) usually just end up feeling extremely unnecessary and time wasting, as well as poorly acted. Again though, this season hasn't been quite as bad as last season with in regards to unnecessary nudity. The standout scene to me is still that fucking ridiculous 7 minute finger fucking scene.

 

[Zeliard]

I'm not American. Nudity isn't a regular thing in most cultures that I know of. So I'm not sure why that's apparently an American view.

Because this country (the U.S.) has long been amusing with the general view here of nudity/sex versus violence. The former is viewed as far less appropriate, despite sex and nudity being a natural, healthy part of life, and violence very much not.

But no, silly puritanical sentiments clearly aren't exclusive to American society.

 

[Steelyuhas]

they better show him or else he'll grow up on them and they'll have a walt situation

His cast picture on the HBO website isn't a scene that I remember from season 1, so I think it's safe to assume he'll show up this season.

Major ACOK spoilers

Spoiler

He has to, so the Miller boys can "replace" him.

 

[Rentahamster]

What's the purpose?

It sets the tone of the setting and provides insight into characters and the world in general. Give me a scene that in your opinion has no purpose, and I'll tell you what purpose it has.

 

[ido]

Dunno why people keep saying this. The Wire has nowhere even close to the amount of nudity GOT has.

That's not why I said HBO shows were not for her. She mentioned that she also did not like watching violence on top of nudity, thus my comment.

 

[jett]

they better show him or else he'll grow up on them and they'll have a walt situation

DID SOMEONE SAY WALT

 

[KingK]

That's not why I said HBO shows were not for her. She mentioned that she also did not like watching violence on top of nudity, thus my comment.

Oh, I see. I kinda just walked in on the middle of the conversation without properly catching up. My bad

 

[frequency]

I don't think HBO shows are for you.

Maybe not. I like ASoIaF though so I'm going to try to stick through it.

Because this country (the U.S.) has long been amusing with the general view here of nudity/sex versus violence. The former is viewed as far less appropriate, despite sex and nudity being a natural, healthy part of life, and violence very much not.

But no, silly puritanical sentiments clearly aren't exclusive to American society.

Oh yes. I think that's silly.

Violence is way worse than sex. Sex is generally a good thing. Violence is never good. Excess violence actually makes me queasy.

I think the reason I'm not uncomfortable playing the games that I play (besides the art style/no gore/etc) is because violence is so far from me that I'm just not connected to it. But sex is a very intimate thing and seeing it just does something to me.

It sets the tone of the setting and provides insight into characters and the world in general. Give me a scene that in your opinion has no purpose, and I'll tell you what purpose it has.

I feel a lot of those scenes can be done without sex. A lot of them are building character or it's exposition or whatever. Talking. That talking can occur during many other things - dinner, play, etc. It doesn't always have to happen with a woman moaning and/or panting heavily.
For example, in this season there was a scene in Littlefinger's place. It was after the baby thing and before he talked to the crying woman. The talk kind of gave us some more insight into how much of a jerk Littlefinger is, but the scenes before that didn't really need to happen. We knew where the setting was even without them.

 

[Zeliard]

Violence is way worse than sex. Sex is generally a good thing. Violence is never good. Excess violence actually makes me queasy.

I think the reason I'm not uncomfortable playing the games that I play (besides the art style/no gore/etc) is because violence is so far from me that I'm just not connected to it. But sex is a very intimate thing and seeing it just does something to me.

You should check out that article I linked to. The writer (who is a woman, if it matters) makes some salient points about how the sex and nudity actually aids in the show's characterization, for both the males and females.

 

[ido]

Maybe not. I like ASoIaF though so I'm going to try to stick through it.

You should, absolutely. It is weird, though, now that you mention how much excess violence affects you that your first complaint was about sex on GoT.

I will say to try to not let it bother you, because the show is really, really great.

 

[petethepanda]

DID SOMEONE SAY WALT

WHERE IS MY BOY

 

[frequency]

You should check out that article I linked to. The writer (who is a woman, if it matters) makes some salient points about how the sex and nudity actually aids in the show's characterization, for both the males and females.

Oh sorry, I didn't know that post was directed at me/about this topic. I'll definitely read it. Thanks.

You should, absolutely. It is weird, though, now that you mention how much excess violence affects you that your first complaint was about sex on GoT.

I will say to try to not let it bother you, because the show is really, really great.

There isn't that much violence in the show. It's mostly characters talking and stuff. And most of the violent scenes couldn't really be done without it.
I did feel unwell at the wine thing with Ser Dontos and the nameless knight who fell to his death prior to that. The Joffrey scene I had to mute it. Some of the imagery in the Rob battlefield aftermath scenes get to me too - like when they pan over that man with his guts hanging out. The bucket+mouse torture scene was another one I had to look away from.

 

[Supermanisdead]

WHERE IS MY BOY

how hard is it to lose a 7 foot 15 year old :lol

 

[Zeliard]

Oh sorry, I didn't know that post was directed at me/about this topic. I'll definitely read it. Thanks.

Yeah I just posted it for people to check out in general since the nudity has been a hot topic - teehee - for quite a while now. There's been lots of back-and-forth about it, both on forums like here and in the media.

 

[Fuzzy]

how hard is it to lose a 7 foot 15 year old :lol

That's why Sansa is stuck in King's Landing. How can that giant sneak away?

 

[LuchaShaq]

When you don't have many forms of entertainment, sex becomes a larger part of your life.

THIS THIS THIS.

When the power was out in our house for 2 weeks me and the gf had more sex than ever purely out of boredom. The house was also much cleaner.

 

[ido]

THIS THIS THIS.

When the power was out in our house for 2 weeks me and the gf had more sex than ever purely out of boredom. The house was also much cleaner.

Indeed.

Without electricity, imagine the possibilities. Shit would actually get done.

 

[ezrarh]

What purpose do they have?
I'm serious. I want to know. What am I missing in my uncomfortability? And is that meaning not able to be portrayed in a non-intercourse manner?

Well, it depends on what scenes you think is worthless.

The Viserys/Doreah scene? Tells us a little bit about dragons. Personifies Viserys outside his interactions with Dany.

Renly/Loras in S1? Tells us about his ambition which leads us to the situation in S2.

Ros/Littlefinger fingerbang scene - in the background was him telling us his motivations for what he does, sure it was distracting but it did have a point

I could go on but I don't think I'm wrong to say they have a point besides just sex. What you can argue is that, would it have been more effective if they did something else for said expositions? That is up for debate but we've had this discussion numerous times. For me it doesn't matter because they get some exposition out of the way and we get to see how sex is used in this society, which is important.

 

[Big-E]

How nudity and sex is uncomfortable with a fan of the books is pretty irrational. The whole fucking city of Qarth has every woman with a breast exposed so walking around Qarth you see half the titties of the whole city. The Theon/Saltwive seen in the book is described in more detail than what we saw. It is just completely irrational to be put off by nudity when the books describe this in more detail than what we see. HBO has toned down the sex in my mind compared to the books.

 

[suzu]

They just need to get rid of Ros. lol.

How nudity and sex is uncomfortable with a fan of the books is pretty irrational. The whole fucking city of Qarth has every woman with a breast exposed so walking around Qarth you see half the titties of the whole city. The Theon/Saltwive seen in the book is described in more detail than what we saw. It is just completely irrational to be put off by nudity when the books describe this in more detail than what we see. HBO has toned down the sex in my mind compared to the books.

Well Theon and the captain's daughter was fine. Qarth booby fashion is fine. It's the excessively long or loud scenes (Littlefinger's) that were uncomfortable to me. It had a point, but it didn't need to be that long.

 

[Supermanisdead]

How nudity and sex is uncomfortable with a fan of the books is pretty irrational. The whole fucking city of Qarth has every woman with a breast exposed so walking around Qarth you see half the titties of the whole city. The Theon/Saltwive seen in the book is described in more detail than what we saw. It is just completely irrational to be put off by nudity when the books describe this in more detail than what we see. HBO has toned down the sex in my mind compared to the books.

reading "naked" or "fat pink mast" is not the same thing as seeing as seeing it. hbo should cater to my personal situation of watching with very conservative parents who are in it only for the story

 

[frequency]

That article actually brings up a lot of good points and convinced me of some things.

The stuff about Ros/Daisy particularly. The recent developments with them kind of do justify the season 1 scenes.

I'm still uncomfortable watching them, but I see the argument that they have purpose.

I would feel just as disgusted of Joffrey was torturing two random women though. But we'll see where that sub-story goes when Tyrion finds out.

How nudity and sex is uncomfortable with a fan of the books is pretty irrational. The whole fucking city of Qarth has every woman with a breast exposed so walking around Qarth you see half the titties of the whole city. The Theon/Saltwive seen in the book is described in more detail than what we saw. It is just completely irrational to be put off by nudity when the books describe this in more detail than what we see. HBO has toned down the sex in my mind compared to the books.

Reading and viewing are totally different things.

 

[ido]

My wife is very slowly listening to the Roy Dotrice versions of the audiobooks while at work and is finally past the shadow baby part, so we can now watch Episode 4 together. Dunno how watching and listening/reading isn't confusing the shit out of her.

I was surprised how hard she took ACoC

Spoiler

the death of renly

, and I absolutely cannot wait until she reads the ASoS

Spoiler

RW

.

 

[rar]

That article actually brings up a lot of good points and convinced me of some things.

The stuff about Ros/Daisy particularly. The recent developments with them kind of do justify the season 1 scenes.

I'm still uncomfortable watching them, but I see the argument that they have purpose.

I would feel just as disgusted of Joffrey was torturing two random women though. But we'll see where that sub-story goes when Tyrion finds out.

maybe if either of them was actually interesting or likable it would add something

 

[Big-E]

Reading and viewing are totally different things.

So what are you doing in your mind when you read fat pink mast and when the saltwive mentions that it is salty? Do you just shut it off in your mind? Both a novel and film are suppose to create pictures. One does it physically infront of you so you can use your eyes, the other does it through words so you can do it with your mind.

 

[Harry Potter]

Best map I've seen yet

 

[Rentahamster]

For example, in this season there was a scene in Littlefinger's place. It was after the baby thing and before he talked to the crying woman. The talk kind of gave us some more insight into how much of a jerk Littlefinger is, but the scenes before that didn't really need to happen. We knew where the setting was even without them.

Segue transition from the previous Theon/Capt. daughter fucking to show contrast and comparison with Littlefinger's brothel fucking.

Theon's insecurity and domination fucking vs. fucking for money. Illusions about who is in control and who just thinks they are in control. Theon thinks he is in control via sexual dominance but is he really? Brother customers think they are in control but are they really? (Littlefinger is).

Layers of complexity. Things are not always as they appear. People are used.

Initial brother fucking -> voyeur getting a blowjob -> Littlefinger watching. Layers of reality, control, power. Littlefinger is always watching, and potentially, so can others.

We can be told what the setting is, or we can be shown. This is showing.

Cum on the face and then kissing another dude 2 seconds later: it invokes a strong reaction in most audiences. Quite suitable to show the level of depravity as intended by the creators. Littlefinger's command to Aremka to take care of the customer shows Littlefinger's quick thinking and utter disregard for that customer. It also shows yet another example of deception, or leaving out whole truths in order to accomplish goals - a common theme.

The customer also notes that Littlefinger charges twice as much as other brothels. The previous actions clearly show how Littlefinger can accommodate so many different tastes and is justified in commanding a high price.

Kinda hard to show this extent of setting and character of a whorehouse and its patrons without titties and some sex.

 

[Fuzzy]

Best map I've seen yet

It's in the OP but the one you posted is bigger.

 

[apana]

hahaha rickon wuz here

poor bastard, not a single appearance this season yet

[ACOK/Season 2 spoiler]:

Spoiler

The actor who plays Rickon said he had one line that he really enjoyed for season 2.

That's why Sansa is stuck in King's Landing. How can that giant sneak away?

Hodor is Sansa's real father, it is known.

 

[Lothar]

Just wondering, is magic forbidden in the Faith of Seven? It would be another aspect analogous with the Catholic Church. That might explain why the Septons can't do magic...

Another question to think about: Even if Melisandre's powers really do come from her god, how do we know this god really is "good" (whatever that means). Maybe the holy books are just Rhillor's "propaganda"...?

I think Melisandre making demon babies makes it pretty obvious this god is nothing good.

 

[Lothar]

Well, it depends on what scenes you think is worthless.

The Viserys/Doreah scene? Tells us a little bit about dragons. Personifies Viserys outside his interactions with Dany.

We've been over this. This scene is totally 100% worthless. It added nothing to our knowledge about dragons besides their names. Everything it told us about Viserys was told better elsewhere.

Ros/Littlefinger fingerbang scene - in the background was him telling us his motivations for what he does, sure it was distracting but it did have a point

I think you misread her post. She said this sentence "And is that meaning not able to be portrayed in a non-intercourse manner?" Could Littlefinger's point have been made without the finger banging? Of course. It was distracting and really ruined pretty good Littlerfinger dialogue.

 

[Zabka]

Maybe someone will make a CleanFlicks cut of the show for the more delicate fans.

I think you misread her post. She said this sentence "And is that meaning not able to be portrayed in a non-intercourse manner?" Could Littlefinger's point have been made without the finger banging? Of course. It was distracting and really ruined pretty good Littlerfinger dialogue.

The fact that Littlefinger had two beautiful women going at it in front of him and only wanted to talk about Cat was one of the points of the scene.

 

[ezrarh]

We've been over this. This scene is totally 100% worthless. It added nothing to our knowledge about dragons besides their names. Everything it told us about Viserys was told better elsewhere.


I think you misread her post. She said this sentence "And is that meaning not able to be portrayed in a non-intercourse manner?" Could Littlefinger's point have been made without the finger banging? Of course. It was distracting and really ruined pretty good Littlerfinger dialogue.

She said they had no purpose. Which isn't the case. Could/would it have been better without the sex involved is where it's up for discussion, which I mentioned in my previous post. And there are definitely some scenes that could have been better without titties but my main point was that they still had a point. Whether they were effective or not, I won't debate because that's up to the person and has already been discussed to death.

 

[StriKeVillain]

Man, this thread really falls apart in between Sundays.

That map posted earlier is awesome though. Spent like 20 minutes staring at different locales. :3

 

[Lothar]

She said they had no purpose. Which isn't the case. Could/would it have been better without the sex involved is where it's up for discussion, which I mentioned in my previous post. And there are definitely some scenes that could have been better without titties but my main point was that they still had a point. Whether they were effective or not, I won't debate because that's up to the person and has already been discussed to death.

She was right. The only purpose they have is to show sex. Telling us the names of the Dragons and Littlefinger making a ridiculous analogy between power and sex isn't needed and was there only to justify the existence of the sex, not the other way around.

Just cutting out the sex would leave behind for the most part a bunch of unimportant boring scenes. Cutting out every scene involving Ros entirely would make for a vastly improved show.

 

[Bigfoot]

She was right. The only purpose they have is to show sex. Telling us the names of the Dragons and Littlefinger making a ridiculous analogy between power and sex isn't needed and was there only to justify the existence of the sex, not the other way around.

Just cutting out the sex would leave behind a bunch of mostly unimportant boring scenes. Cutting out every scene involving Ros entirely would make for a vastly improved show.

Many disagree, especially about the first scene. But even if the only purpose they have is to show sex, then so what. Nothing wrong with that and not every scene has to have a "purpose". Also, as it has been established, HBO and sex is a given.