Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
That set must get awfully interesting.
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Game of Thrones - Season 2 - George RR Martin's Song of Ice and Fire - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Cornballer
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That set must get awfully interesting.
bengraven
Member
I bet it smells wonderful.
brb, gonna do some research
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
They haven't found a graceful way to handle the number of characters this season, so hopefully they won't even try to deal with all the new characters. Cut the story to its core and expand on the core in a meaningful way.
(SoS)
I thought that was disappointing itself in the books. I never believed he had good cause to murder her. Even if she did testify against him of her own free will and wasn't pressured or threatened to do it by the queen. (Which is a possibility) His likability factor took a big hit for me, like to the point where I'm not that interested in what he's doing anymore. I'll be happy to see that scene go.
Killing his father is enough for him not to be an all-around completely good guy.
Killing his father is enough for him not to be an all-around completely good guy.
Eh, I could see a link there. Series
Particularly that Sansa is trapped, being 'used' much in the same sense Shae could feel she's been used or owned for most of her life. "You can't fuck your way out of everything" and her showing Sansa that blade hidden on her ankle are just a few more hints that this version of Shae is more a survivor than anything else. She could see that in trying to help Sansa learn how to survive as well.
Don't forget that Shae most definitely did not like her early on.
Betraying Tyrion is tougher, but part of that entire plotline is just how badly Tyrion is supposed to be damaged by her betrayal, and that's certainly in line with what's happening now.
Don't forget that Shae most definitely did not like her early on.
Betraying Tyrion is tougher, but part of that entire plotline is just how badly Tyrion is supposed to be damaged by her betrayal, and that's certainly in line with what's happening now.
T.M. MacReady
NO ONE DENIES MEMBER
I havent seen it discussed anywhere, but Lightbringer didn't bring any light or glow when Stannis was fighting with it. What gives with that?
The way I saw it while reading:
[ASoS]
Tyrion killed her not only because she betrayed him but also because he believed she truly cared about him even though he told himself numerous times not to believe what she told him. She was in his father's bed and he realized how stupid he was to believe anything she said so he killed her so he wouldn't make that mistake again. This also happened after Jaime told him the truth about his first wife. Having the audience also believe her love for him in the show will make her betrayal even worse and him killing her will be sweet. I hope they don't change any of it.
The Albatross
Member
On Lightbringer, encompasses some scope from all of the books but nothing that would ruin anything really (I suppose my own speculation, but I think most people agree with this statement):
Stannis is not the Lord of Light and Lightbringer is a bogus sword. I believe this is mostly revealed in Book 2, when Davos is like, 'well, sure, if you light the sword on fire it glows..' but in future books, other characters remark that lightbringer is not lighting up in Stannis' hands all that often
Lactose_Intolerant
Member
Couldn't afford it after wildfire. Lightbringer has been crappy all season so what can you do. Will have to wait for asos
Dondarrion to whip out his sword.
Pretty much. [SoS]
When he kills Shae, he kills his last shred of innocence. He won't trust anyone ever again, and this act of pointless violence really drives the point home.
Forsaken82
Member
I feel they can still make it happen...
I always felt a connection between tyrion and shae in the books too, but when it came down to it, Shae is about self preservation. She turns on Tyrion because he is no longer the one taking care of her at that point. He is currently giving her what she wants. She is basically a gold digger and when it comes down to turning on Tyrion or a short lived torture/certain death, She makes the decision that she thinks keeps her safe.
Related spoiler
It's not that she fucked Tywin, she's a whore and she obviously couldn't fuck Tyrion so whatever. It wasn't even because she testified, big deal the Queen could have killed her he would have understood. It was the mockery she made of him and the whole Lion/Giant of Lannister thing SHE said, but mocking him in front of everyone as if he was forcing her to say it? Fuck that end her sad little life.
Honestly I think lying to Jamie and saying he DID kill Joffrey was much more cruel/unnecessary than killing Tywin or Shae.
Honestly I think lying to Jamie and saying he DID kill Joffrey was much more cruel/unnecessary than killing Tywin or Shae.
ASOS:
I actually think it'll make her betrayal that much more stinging--Tyrion comes across as a bit of a dope re: Shae in the books, as she's a whore and doesn't display much besides (over-the-top) fawning affection for Tyrion. If she starts off as more sympathetic, mature person (which the show's version certainly is), then the showrunners will have to sell her betrayal harder. A combination of politics, threats from Tywin, and Tyrion's increased ugliness might be enough to explain it.
Sweet? That's kind of like sympathizing with a man murderering his wife because he caught her cheating on him. Killing her because she didn't really love him and was just doing what he was paying her to do makes him a monster. That's an even worse reason than doing it because she betrayed him.
Wanting a woman to be murdered because she embarassed someone seems to be a bit sociopathic to me.
I saw it as her doing what she felt she had to do to save her life. Perhaps she felt she needed to reveal what they privately talked about to make the story sound convincing. Totally understandable.
I saw it as her doing what she felt she had to do to save her life. Perhaps she felt she needed to reveal what they privately talked about to make the story sound convincing. Totally understandable.
Related spoiler:
I really don't want her threatened at all. I want her to betray Tyrion because of a bribe, kind of like what Bronn did.
I'm normally ok with them but this one was truly hilarious because of the obvious doll and managed to take me out of the scene for a second.
Duane Cunningham
Member
So how did Tyrion rig the boat to only start spilling wildfire after it got into position? Some kind of disintegrating corks or something?
Tim the Wiz
Banned
(ASOS)
You can't be serious, right? It's going to happen. I suppose the show made it visceral in a way the books didn't, but Shae never deserved to die. Betraying Tyrion was simply a means to survival, which is who she is at her most basic level: a survivor. And Tyrion killing her was part of his head-space at the time. Not only all that Tywin did to him, but that his father was a hypocrite in such an intimate way. It has to happen, because it's a crucial element in Tyrion's evolution; this isn't a missing nose we're talking about.
Moreover, I find this desire for Mary Sue characters "that I can root for" or "I can identify with in a ridiculously saccharine way" nauseatingly boring. Yes, what Tyrion did was fucked up, but that doesn't stop his POVs from being among the most compelling in the books. And I think cable television has moved past this mentality, with a slew of morally grey lead characters in recent history.
Moreover, I find this desire for Mary Sue characters "that I can root for" or "I can identify with in a ridiculously saccharine way" nauseatingly boring. Yes, what Tyrion did was fucked up, but that doesn't stop his POVs from being among the most compelling in the books. And I think cable television has moved past this mentality, with a slew of morally grey lead characters in recent history.
So true.
I disagree.
Someone betrays one of your favourite character in this show and you want them to pay. This would be one of the few times where the audience would get that payoff in this show and they wouldn't think he's a monster at all.
My guess is a really long piece of string that popped the cork once it got out far enough.
Heh, I wondered the same.
Of course not if she was just saying what she could to protect herself and believed Tyrion was going to die no matter what she said. Tyrion was my favorite character and I felt bad for her even as she was saying that stuff.
I didn't believe her testimony would have changed things one way or the other. She was just doing the smart thing.
I didn't believe her testimony would have changed things one way or the other. She was just doing the smart thing.
yeah regarding shae
In the book, I really didn't feel much after tyrion kills her, the book never made her come across as trustworthy or likable. Everything that came out of her mouth screamed "bullshit". The show has done a much better job of making her a likable character and appear to honestly care for Tyrion. Which is why her betrayal will have far more impact and it will be that much sweeter when the lying whore gets what she deserves.
I knew I wasn't the only one.
So just watched the episode.
It's funny how wonderful of a job they've done with Stannis and no small credit to the actor.
In the books I always hated him. But the Stannis in the show I'd totally get behind. The dude was total badass and wasn't afraid anything!
Renly had his peaches, Robb and Tywin were always strategizing, but Stannis, what a man.
"thousands."
That was too awesome.
It's funny how wonderful of a job they've done with Stannis and no small credit to the actor.
In the books I always hated him. But the Stannis in the show I'd totally get behind. The dude was total badass and wasn't afraid anything!
Renly had his peaches, Robb and Tywin were always strategizing, but Stannis, what a man.
"thousands."
That was too awesome.
Making her more likable is going to make it sweeter when she gets murdered? What?
It was bad enough in the books when she wasn't that likable. Now that she is nice and protectful of Sansa, it's going to make Tyrion seem as terrible as Joffrey.
It was bad enough in the books when she wasn't that likable. Now that she is nice and protectful of Sansa, it's going to make Tyrion seem as terrible as Joffrey.
Telosfortelos
Advocate for the People
ASOS
I'm worried they're telegraphing the Frey betrayal too strongly in the show. I hope it's still as impactful as it was in the books.
ASOS
He killed her.
Brian Fellows
Pete Carroll Owns Me
I still don't get why this is such a badass comment. I'm no badass and I would have no problems sending thousands of people to their death if it meant more wealth and power for myself. It just makes him seem like Zap Brannigan to me.
fifasnipe2224
Member
This page is such a minefield. Must not click the black rectangles!
Forsaken82
Member
Ehh... it may not be official till AFFC, but yes. (affc?)
don't recall if it was AFFC or asos, but basically shes strangled/choked to death with the chain stuffed down her throat. The details might not appear till Cersei's first chapter in Feast...
They could have a turn in her character to show that she isn't so nice after all. That she's just deceptive and doing everything for some hidden motives. Then people will be mad and feel Tyrion was just.
And if not, then we see Tyrion is a flawed person - like everyone else in the series. So I actually hope they don't do anything to make the audience think Shae deserves death. They should make it so we all disagree with Tyrion's decision to murder her.
Right now, Tyrion is being made the hero. He never does anything wrong and is brave and noble and etc, etc, etc. But no one in this series is without fault.
And if not, then we see Tyrion is a flawed person - like everyone else in the series. So I actually hope they don't do anything to make the audience think Shae deserves death. They should make it so we all disagree with Tyrion's decision to murder her.
Right now, Tyrion is being made the hero. He never does anything wrong and is brave and noble and etc, etc, etc. But no one in this series is without fault.
But he led the charge. Knowing that death will happen, he still leads the charge and is the first one off the boat and charging at the incoming arrows.
Because it shows perfectly Stannis's character.
He doesn't care if thousands die. Law says that he's the king. There's no retreating or regrouping. The law is the law and if thousands have to die upholding it, including himself he doesn't care.
Brian Fellows
Pete Carroll Owns Me
It still doesn't make him a badass. Now being the first to hit the shore and first up the wall did make him a badass.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Regarding Shae:
All they have to do is seriously play up the "Giant of Lannister" bit. Have her say it during the trial, make the laughter a complete uproar, make even Tywin laugh before turning cold, show the look between Tywin and Tyrion, completely break the father/son bond.
Then Tyrion goes to Tywin's chamber, Shae apologizes, Shae begs forgiveness, Tyrion accepts and embraces her because what else could she do? Then she says "My lion, my giant of lannister, I'm so sorry." And that's when he grabs the chain.
Done. It fits a perfectly disgraced Tyrion to a "t". It's not like Tyrion is afraid of hurting people, anyway, doesn't anyone remember the singer and For hands of gold are always cold, but a woman's hands are warm...?
Then Tyrion goes to Tywin's chamber, Shae apologizes, Shae begs forgiveness, Tyrion accepts and embraces her because what else could she do? Then she says "My lion, my giant of lannister, I'm so sorry." And that's when he grabs the chain.
Done. It fits a perfectly disgraced Tyrion to a "t". It's not like Tyrion is afraid of hurting people, anyway, doesn't anyone remember the singer and For hands of gold are always cold, but a woman's hands are warm...?
You better not. Go to the other thread.
Whether you intend to single me out or not, I haven't posted a single word in the non-spoiler topic which could spoil the series.
Yes, because when she betrays him, the sting of the betrayal will be that much more viscous. Book Shae was just some dumb whore who saw money bags in her future and came along for the ride, and telegraphed that fact with every word she uttered. Her death was shrug worthy. TV show Shay has convinced the audience she really does love Tyrion. So when it comes out that she doesn't actually love him, that it's just been a game to her and she doesn't give a flying fuck about him, her death will oh so very sweet.
Cornballer
Member
- EW.com: 'Game of Thrones' scoop: Season 3 character list revealed *spoilers*
Please tag and label any discussion. Thanks.
People will be pleased with a few names on the list:
Please tag and label any discussion. Thanks.
People will be pleased with a few names on the list:
Ooooooh.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Whew, the Reeds are showing up. Was wondering just how the hell they'd do that storyline without them.
And hell yeah Giantsbane, he'll probably be a minor role in the show but I hope they cast the loudest man alive.
Holy hell, they're really going all out, aren't they.
Cornballer
Member
I also cross-posted the full list in the A Song of Ice and Fire -- **Unmarked Spoilers For All Books including ADWD** if you folks want to discuss without spoiler tags over in that thread.
Neither have I but I no longer post in that thread.
Your (and others in this thread) future knowledge could colour your posts without your intention to.
Telosfortelos
Advocate for the People
Minor S3 casting spoiler
Giantsbane for king.
(SoS)
For this to be the case
that Shae has been phony the whole time... You'd have to come up with reasons why she would put a knife to a maid's throat to protect Sansa, why she told Sansa to be more careful about saying things about Joffrey, why she told Sansa to run to her room where she would be safe. I really think it would be better if they just changed that story. This Shae is a whole different character than book Shae.
Casting list
[ASOS]
[ASOS]
It seems kind of dumb that they're going to have Edmure Tully and the Tully stuff in S3 when they've completely cut out the Tully subplot for S1 & S2 and merged Edmure's role into TV Robb.
I know for the Red Wedding they need to have a wedding, but it's going to be weird to have the Tully's come in so late.
Same with Stannis suddenly having a daughter & wife when they cut them completely in S2 and made it seem like he had neither.
I know for the Red Wedding they need to have a wedding, but it's going to be weird to have the Tully's come in so late.
Same with Stannis suddenly having a daughter & wife when they cut them completely in S2 and made it seem like he had neither.
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