Support NeoGAF

[Dirk Benedict]

It's not a plan, it's a "Trojan Horse"

Cool. I wonder if I can somehow rack up this shit on my PSN?
Even if I haven't been on my PSN in nearly 3 years. =P

 

[Fabieter]

Who said they would buy a console over this?
No one is gonna go buy Ghost of Tsushima on PC and use the Playstation features and go "oh I'm gonna buy a Playstation"
But after about 3 years of this and they are so use to it and want to play some games now instead of waiting 2/3 years...

I'm not saying a massive migrate of PC gamer's buying Playstations and throwing away their PC's
I'm talking about PC only gamers being more warmed up to the Idea of splashing out some cash to play some games now and some that will never come, like Bloodborne.
Whether they do or not, Sony still makes bank.

Or people are warmed up with the idea thar playstation isn't needed anymore to play the games people like and they will buy pcs instead which gives them similar experience.

 

[rofif]

Oh, look Rofif bitching.

Glad to have you back.

Really? If that’s bitching then I can’t post.

 

[Fabieter]

I want this. PS trophies are better than every other achievement system out there, by far. So for folks who enjoy earning trophies and also game on PC, it's a big deal.

Ding ding ding I know people who own pcs and Playstations who buy games on Playstation because of trophies. This will make it easier doe people to make the full switch. People who ain't seeing what will happen with sony are either full pc or full Playstation fanboys.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

wait a fricking minute, it seems this news is producing a lot of drama online... interesting.

 

[yamaci17]

Oh, look Rofif bitching.

Glad to have you back.

practically proves that these people who complain about trophy cheaters are doing treasure hunting for thinking they're this elite group of "trophy hunters" and not for the fun of the game itself

people who treasure hunt for the sake of having fun dont even think about the possibility of some people cheating for trophies. I have a achivement hunter friend and he didn't ever hear about SAM. and even though I told him, he was like "why should I care lol does it affect me". that's the point anyways, it does not affect anybody. at best, achivement unlocker people amount to, what, maybe %0.5 of the total community.

 

[DenchDeckard]

You even have to have a PlayStation account.

"To make use of features like Trophies, Friends list, and cross-play, you can sign in with your existing account for PlayStation Network or create a new account. The use of PlayStation overlay is optional for both the single player experience and Legends mode. "

Ghost of Tsushima Director’s Cut PC cross-play and system requirements revealed

PlayStation overlay, cross-play, and Trophy support.

blog.playstation.com

Yup, this is 100% what xbox did when bringing their games to PC. Had to sign in with an Xbox account and then they started reporting MAU.

Sony walked into PC support for games but this is clearly a big step in the right direction of PSN account support on PC, it's awesome trojan horse every PC is a ps5 move. It's great to see they are investing this hard into getting their PC platform support up to snuff with the consoles. Lots of fresh MAU to report and more importantly ever closer to bringing games closer to day one on PC.

 

[Fabieter]

practically proves that these people who complain about trophy cheaters are doing treasure hunting for thinking they're this elite group of "trophy hunters" and not for the fun of the game itself

people who treasure hunt for the sake of having fun dont even think about the possibility of some people cheating for trophies. I have a achivement hunter friend and he didn't ever hear about SAM. and even though I told him, he was like "why should I care lol does it affect me". that's the point anyways, it does not affect anybody. at best, achivement unlocker people amount to, what, maybe %0.5 of the total community.

That logic would legitimate cheating in leaderbords and leaderbords on pc are absolutely miserable. Cheating is never fine and people should get permanent over cheating like actually identity banned on those platforms including steam.

 

[Soodanim]

Ding ding ding I know people who own pcs and Playstations who buy games on Playstation because of trophies. This will make it easier doe people to make the full switch. People who ain't seeing what will happen with sony are either full pc or full Playstation fanboys.

I think you are giving anecdotal evidence a bit too much credit. The full PS library doesn't come to PC so being a trophy hunter without a PS5 makes little sense. Even if a few oddballs do decide to do that, they are not going to be rare sorts.

 

[Kataploom]

Maybe. Depends which way you look at it, competitors are already doing it, Sony already do it for PS4/PS5, so maybe like they do for PS5 upgrades, you pay an extra £10 to get the other version too. I guess as it stands specific work is being done on these games for PC so it should be dedicated revenue, I don't mind paying for that, but double dipping at full price is a bit much, I end up buying Steam keys a few months later instead, not sure how much Sony would get off that. As a consumer I just like the idea of being able to buy a game once and be able to play it on every device it is compatible with, but maybe it is unrealistic. Maybe they don't fancy the thought of trying to compete with Steam on PC so this is the easiest path.

I think the difference is from PS4 to PS5 is kinda cheap or even almost free since it's the same dev environment (might be wrong), but for any other platform, the development cost is different and on top of base game so they have to charge in order to not report a loss.

 

[Kataploom]

I think everyone wins here except for Sony.

If they wish to decrease the value their brand while increasing the utility of my PC, more power to them. MS wrote a book on it I'm not sure why you'd want to borrow a page from.

IMO what we are seeing from PS is overconfidence while riding high. When Nintendo was at their lowest and most desperate they wouldn't put games on PC for a buck because they know guarding those IP are their only chance. Sony meanwhile puts games on PC to fill a gap in their lofty sales projection. It won't be as immediate as Xbox with day one games, but even holding them 2 years, I think over a decade IP creep will really ding the strength of the brand.

The actual solution would be to stop overspending on games but as soon as a game has small non-hyperealistic nose hair, PS fans will complain lol.

Well TBH that allows to every company on the industry except for those that don't rely on high tech to make temporal impressions, that's why you see too many devs trying to get into PC market, including Japanese devs which is a beautiful miracle.

 

[Fabieter]

I think you are giving anecdotal evidence a bit too much credit. The full PS library doesn't come to PC so being a trophy hunter without a PS5 makes little sense. Even if a few oddballs do decide to do that, they are not going to be rare sorts.

There is some bigger thing on the horizon. It won't end here.

 

[Senua]

Eh why not

 

[sendit]

PlayStation achievements being unlocked means you’re playing on PlayStation not PC. Sony you sly bastards, you found the perfect Trojan horse for cis scum PC gamers.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

How about Helldivers 2 Sony?

 

[YeulEmeralda]

Steam right now is Netflix circa 2008. Only big game in town, everyone coming for them. Failures at first, but eventually real, impactful competition.

Launchers that make a dent are coming.

For that analogy to work publishers need to pull their content off Steam. Are we expecting that?

 

[BlackTron]

A huge percentage of gamers are high school kids and younger who just wanna play Fortnite, CoD and FIFA. Their parents aren’t gonna run out and buy them $2,000 PCs. Just like the people with PCs aren’t gonna start buying 3rd party games on consoles. Thankfully Sony execs aren’t dumb fanboys.

Imagine if I told you Nintendo was making many mistakes with N64 or GC launch and your reply was "nonsense. There will always be people who buy consoles". Sure people bought both and they were still profitable, but they essentially ate shit while Sony expanded the market.

The console market has one more than one player in it; it can continue to lose people to PC and phones; the people in it can still shift habits within the console space; console makers can still rise or fall on their own decision-making. All other things being equal, the brand with true exclusive content has an advantage over a brand with IP that gets around.

 

[Lillie]

but no cross-save? boo

 

[DenchDeckard]

but no cross-save? boo

Oh, I thought there was cross save/progression?

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Steam right now is Netflix circa 2008. Only big game in town, everyone coming for them. Failures at first, but eventually real, impactful competition.

Launchers that make a dent are coming.

Some have tried and all have failed. I just don't see how Steam users would move out of there for another launcher.

 

[Fabieter]

Imagine if I told you Nintendo was making many mistakes with N64 or GC launch and your reply was "nonsense. There will always be people who buy consoles". Sure people bought both and they were still profitable, but they essentially ate shit while Sony expanded the market.

The console market has one more than one player in it; it can continue to lose people to PC and phones; the people in it can still shift habits within the console space; console makers can still rise or fall on their own decision-making. All other things being equal, the brand with true exclusive content has an advantage over a brand with IP that gets around.

Sony will learn it in time. Actually I think we already see the effect. Relatively good hardware sales with bad software sales speak volumes that alot of the userbase has more platforms now and just buys the stuff elsewhere.

People will blame it on changing market conditions but they are riddeld with bad descions.

 

[BlackTron]

The actual solution would be to stop overspending on games but as soon as a game has small non-hyperealistic nose hair, PS fans will complain lol.

Do you really think lower game budgets would curb the limitless expansion for growth? Sony made an asinine amount of money, they just aren't happy it wasn't more. Again, this is something N wouldn't do on their darkest day. Because they know it will erode the nigh priceless value of their console brand that PS is giving up for today's lunch money.

 

[Topher]

Yup, this is 100% what xbox did when bringing their games to PC. Had to sign in with an Xbox account and then they started reporting MAU.

Sony walked into PC support for games but this is clearly a big step in the right direction of PSN account support on PC, it's awesome trojan horse every PC is a ps5 move. It's great to see they are investing this hard into getting their PC platform support up to snuff with the consoles. Lots of fresh MAU to report and more importantly ever closer to bringing games closer to day one on PC.

Microsoft requires that you sign in with an Microsoft account, not Xbox. There is a difference. You know this. And no, this isn't some ricidulous trojan horse MAU move. I'm simply mocking the other thread.

 

[Kilau]

This overlay is exactly what I was hoping for with PS releases on PC. Hope they update the older games to include the option.

 

[Topher]

This overlay is exactly what I was hoping for with PS releases on PC. Hope they update the older games to include the option.

Hope third parties have the option to use it as well.

 

[DavidGzz]

I don't have to pay to play Legends mode and I can double dip on Steam chievos and PS trophys? The deal is getting better all the time.

 

[Topher]

Ding ding ding I know people who own pcs and Playstations who buy games on Playstation because of trophies. This will make it easier doe people to make the full switch.

Perhaps eventually, but I think for most this isn't going to be enough. PlayStation isn't just about first party games. I just platinumed Dredge on PS yesterday. I can't do that on PC even though Dredge is also on Steam. And I probably never will be able to. I said above that I hoped Sony would give third parties the option to do this, but I don't seriously think they will. Sony isn't going to do anything to encourage third party purchases on Steam over PS.

So we are really only talking about first party games. I don't see some massive exodus from PS for this. Just a few outliers.

People who ain't seeing what will happen with sony are either full pc or full Playstation fanboys.

It's just different opinions my man

 

[Fabieter]

Perhaps eventually, but I think for most this isn't going to be enough. PlayStation isn't just about first party games. I just platinumed Dredge on PS yesterday. I can't do that on PC even though Dredge is also on Steam. And I probably never will be able to. I said above that I hoped Sony would give third parties the option to do this, but I don't seriously think they will. Sony isn't going to do anything to encourage third party purchases on Steam over PS.

So we are really only talking about first party games. I don't see some massive exodus from PS for this. Just a few outliers.



I don't get the need to characterize people that way simply because they don't see eye to eye with your take on it.

It seems not worth to implement if they don't do anything besides 1p the but we'll lets see how it goes. Sony is a wildcard and I would expect everything at this point.

 

[TGO]

Or people are warmed up with the idea thar playstation isn't needed anymore to play the games people like and they will buy pcs instead which gives them similar experience.

I mean if they want a lite version sure..

 

[Fabieter]

I mean if they want a lite version sure..

For now! Besides on console we settle for lite multiplatform games for decades and no one complains .

 

[Topher]

I mean if they want a lite version sure..

How is the PC version a "lite version"? Not saying you are wrong. I just don't know the difference.

 

[Generic]

Makes perfect sense because it is about trophies and coop cross-play. Why is that hard?

Because it's lacking the most important thing: crossprogression.

Every other game that requires account linking has it.

 

[Topher]

Because it's lacking the most important thing: crossprogression.

Every other game that requires account linking has it.

Except this game doesn't require account linking. It is optional. I disagree that cross progression is the most important thing here. Most people are going to own the game on one system. Would it be nice to have? Sure. Would I rather have cross save than trophy integration? Absolutely not.

 

[Fabieter]

Except this game doesn't require account linking. It is optional. I disagree that cross progression is the most important thing here. Most people are going to own the game on one system. Would it be nice to have? Sure. Would I rather have cross save than trophy integration? Absolutely not.

I think sony hesitate with cross saves because it could easily hack the system.

 

[Skifi28]

Except this game doesn't require account linking. It is optional. I disagree that cross progression is the most important thing here. Most people are going to own the game on one system. Would it be nice to have? Sure. Would I rather have cross save than trophy integration? Absolutely not.

It's no issue for a game like this, but if they ever port over gt7 where I have a 500 hour save, there better be cross progression or heads will roll.

 

[yurinka]

How is the PC version a "lite version"? Not saying you are wrong. I just don't know the difference.

Most PlayStation games are 3rd party, and so far only 1 -and maybe the other ones in the future- first party games support this on PC. In addition to this, PS has tons of console only or PS only games from all generations not available in PC.

A number that keeps growing every year because every year there are more PS/console only games being released (even if they are temporal exclusives) than old games being ported to PC that same year. Meaning, year over year this number of games available on PS but not in PC keeps growing even if they port old PS games to PC or even if release some GaaS day one on PC.

And well, the console experience is pretty different from PC due to not having to worry about compatibilities/performance issues, viruses, etc. It's a way more plug and play experience.

I think sony hesitate with cross saves because it could easily hack the system.

Being a server based system they can block most cheating progression cases.

In any case, cheating progression on a single player game isn't an issue because only affects this player. Cheating in MP, server based games is more difficult because most games do and double check part of this process in the server side.

We also have to consider that nobody cares about the trophy progress of other players, and that only will affect a single game, and maybe most of the Sony games in the future, which are a small portion of the games available on PS.

But yes, if I was them I'd be extra careful with related cheating.

Regarding of why don't they implement cross-save now I think it's because implementing these PC+PS integration features requires time and job and their team implementing this stuff should be pretty small. Cross-save would be pretty likely implemented via cloud saves to do it in a safer way, and cloud saves are a PS+ feature.

Which means it also would affect PC PS+ stuff and change PS+ website, info, ads etc so may do it later once they add some extra PC specific stuff to announce the various changes together.

 

[Fabieter]

Most PlayStation games are 3rd party, and so far only 1 -and maybe the other ones in the future- first party games support this on PC. In addition to this, PS has tons of console only or PS only games from all generations not available in PC.

A number that keeps growing every year because every year there are more PS/console only games being released (even if they are temporal exclusives) than old games being ported to PC that same year. Meaning, year over year this number of games available on PS but not in PC keeps growing even if they port old PS games to PC or even if release some GaaS day one on PC.

And well, the console experience is pretty different from PC due to not having to worry about compatibilities/performance issues, viruses, etc. It's a way more plug and play experience.


Being a server based system they can block most cheating progression cases.

In any case, cheating progression on a single player game isn't an issue because only affects this player. Cheating in MP, server based games is more difficult because most games do and double check part of this process in the server side.

We also have to consider that nobody cares about the trophy progress of other players, and that only will affect a single game, and maybe most of the Sony games in the future, which are a small portion of the games available on PS.

I dont talk about cheating. I mean a modified save might help crack the console wide open, idk.

 

[Topher]

Most PlayStation games are 3rd party, and so far only 1 -and maybe the other ones in the future- first party games support this on PC. In addition to this, PS has tons of console only or PS only games from all generations not available in PC.

A number that keeps growing every year because every year there are more PS/console only games being released (even if they are temporal exclusives) than old games being ported to PC that same year. Meaning, year over year this number of games available on PS but not in PC keeps growing even if they port old PS games to PC or even if release some GaaS day one on PC.

And well, the console experience is pretty different from PC due to not having to worry about compatibilities/performance issues, viruses, etc. It's a way more plug and play experience.

Not sure how any of that answers my question about the PC version being the "lite" version.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

wait a fricking minute, it seems this news is producing a lot of drama online... interesting.

Xbots desperately view this as confirmation that PC will eventually be day and date with PS5 releases. To them this means that "Microsoft was right"
about putting games on PC and Xbox same day. Yes, we have really reached that point in shilling.

My view is that I expect that their top single player franchises will follow the normal model of a PC release a year or two down the line, but will come to Playstation first, while multiplayer/Gaas titles will follow the Helldivers model. However, I wouldn't be surprised if Sony tests the waters of a day and date big time franchise.

 

[Punished Miku]

Xbots desperately view this as confirmation that PC will eventually be day and date with PS5 releases. To them this means that "Microsoft was right"
about putting games on PC and Xbox same day. Yes, we have really reached that point in shilling.

My view is that I expect that their top single player franchises will follow the normal model of a PC release a year or two down the line, but will come to Playstation first, while multiplayer/Gaas titles will follow the Helldivers model. However, I wouldn't be surprised if Sony tests the waters of a day and date big time franchise.

It doesn't really matter if they are day 1 to me, personally. If they come eventually that's fine. I think what Sony is struggling with is the big difference in sales potential between day 1 versus day 365. None of that really has anything to do with Xbots.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

I think sony hesitate with cross saves because it could easily hack the system.

Cross saves have happened with CDPR games. I was able to switch back and forth between WItcher 3 on PC and PS5. Got trophies and GOG achievements at the same time. And yes, you can download saves, put them in your PC folder, upload them to the GOG cloud, load that cloud on PS5 and pop trophies.

I have no issue with this whatsoever.

There is the argument that devalues the trophy and achievement system, but if it's an option available to everyone, it isn't really cheating.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

It doesn't really matter if they are day 1 to me, personally. If they come eventually that's fine. I think what Sony is struggling with is the big difference in sales potential between day 1 versus day 365. None of that really has anything to do with Xbots.

That's why I think they might test the waters with a single player release. But they may not as it won't be a decision to take lightly. They have a lot of pride in their Playstation brand.

 

[ByWatterson]

Some have tried and all have failed. I just don't see how Steam users would move out of there for another launcher.

Think Sony would be playing for a "Yes, and" approach, standing alongside Steam.

 

[Fabieter]

That's why I think they might test the waters with a single player release. But they may not as it won't be a decision to take lightly. They have a lot of pride in their Playstation brand.

There wont be a going back to all of this if it fails.

 

[rodrigolfp]

not having to worry about compatibilities/performance issues, viruses, etc.

Ha ha ha...

 

[Topher]

Ha ha ha...

I'd like to say that one never gets old......but at this point.....its pretty old.

 

[Hudo]

And well, the console experience is pretty different from PC due to not having to worry about compatibilities/performance issues, viruses, etc. It's a way more plug and play experience.

Consoles are far from the "plug & play experience" they once were. You have to deal with a lot of unnecessary bullshit to get into a game on consoles as well. And you only can deal with it how the manufacturers want, so they are effectively just more restrictive PCs nowadays.

And viruses? It's not the early 2000s anymore. If you have a functioning brain, you won't encounter a virus. And for phishing and scam attempts, these also happened to me on PS Plus, where some people tried to chat me up for a "date" or other personal info. So that's not exclusive to PC, unfortunately.
As for compatibility and performance issues: There are multiple threads on this very forum bemoaning performance issues of console games and people jerking off over the concept of a "PS5 Pro" that may or may not achieve 4k@60 by just brute-forcing bad optimization away. Performance issues mostly arise due to bad optimization and affect both consoles and PC. It's a developer problem. If you give them a more powerful console, they will find a way to still release badly optimized games. As we have already witness a couple of generations already.

Look: Both consoles and PC have their pros and cons but the lines between both are fuzzy nowadays. Valve/Steam try to consolize the PC experience while consoles have "PCified" theirs. With varying rates of success. I'd buy a PS5 in a heartbeat if it were as plug & play as the PS2 was.

 

[TGO]

How is the PC version a "lite version"? Not saying you are wrong. I just don't know the difference.

Small Catalogue with a condensed version of PSN.
Lite.
That's what I mean

 

[AV]

One step closer to day one PC, every time something like this happens.

Might not be for several years yet, maybe not until PS6, but it's coming. The writing is on all four walls of the house.

 

[Kataploom]

Do you really think lower game budgets would curb the limitless expansion for growth? Sony made an asinine amount of money, they just aren't happy it wasn't more. Again, this is something N wouldn't do on their darkest day. Because they know it will erode the nigh priceless value of their console brand that PS is giving up for today's lunch money.

Well, I think once they see they can get more revenues with the same game, no, it won't suffice, but that's the reason they and Xbox started putting their games on PC, AAA games are too expensive to make and console market isn't growing fast enough