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[SteveWinwood]

It's something you ask after getting to know someone, not a question asked right off the bat.




Maybe.

Yeah but hes not looking to get to know you.

All this talk is making me want to get an okc account.

 

[Zoe]

Okay girls, hopefully one of you can explain this to me.

At my previous job and now at my current one, there's been at least one lady who does not lock the stall in the bathroom. Why would someone do this?

 

[H.Protagonist]

So I got on OKC for match lulz, listed as seeing someone but I guess it's assumed I'm trying to trade up or something. The messages I've got so far range from hilariously inane to fucked up. My most recent fucked up one:



Fucking really? Really?

Haha. I do think most people on OKC are just looking for hook-ups and thought that was the reputation of the site, to be honest. Not sure what a better one might be, though. Have you tried Match or eHarmony (<-- but I heard this one was Christian)?

Dunno, I had a (ten foot pole) girl message me recently with "I want you to show me your jiu jitsu." Was flattering if anything.

Some people, men and women, are just looking for casual hookups and forego the pretense. I don't see anything wrong with that when you have an active profile on a dating site, can easily be ignored. Not like it's creeper behavior or anything. "Do you have any naughty pics" is admittedly a not very good pickup attempt though!

Admit it, you were tempted. Just a bit.



EDIT: Have either of you had much success with dating sites? I was tempted to try one before, but never made the leap.

 

[EviLore]

Nothing so far, have only used OKCupid and only started recently. I was supposed to have a date tonight actually, but she never confirmed the time of the meetup so that seems to be off the table (she rescheduled prior to this, not going to keep chasing). I've sent maybe ~20 messages, personalized and personable, to various high match percentage girls in the last month with something like four of them responding. I'm sure part of it is how competitive Austin must be, and I don't have a fauxhawk or two sizes too small Affliction t-shirt to make the ladies swoon ;b.

As a woman you'll get 10+ messages a day from what I understand, most of them crap like Devo's getting, either casual encounter requests or aspy basement dwellers writing you crowns of sonnets, and you'll need to weed through those to find the vaguely well-adjusted types. You'll be able to sit back and relax and just look through your messages, though, and won't have to actively search through profile listings unless you want to, as opposed to the guys.

 

[SRG01]

Nothing so far, have only used OKCupid and only started recently. I was supposed to have a date tonight actually, but she never confirmed the time of the meetup so that seems to be off the table (she rescheduled prior to this, not going to keep chasing). I've sent maybe ~20 messages, personalized and personable, to various high match percentage girls in the last month with something like four of them responding. I'm sure part of it is how competitive Austin must be, and I don't have a fauxhawk or two sizes too small Affliction t-shirt to make the ladies swoon ;b.

As a woman you'll get 10+ messages a day from what I understand, most of them crap like Devo's getting, either casual encounter requests or aspy basement dwellers writing you crowns of sonnets, and you'll need to weed through those to find the vaguely well-adjusted types. You'll be able to sit back and relax and just look through your messages, though, and won't have to actively search through profile listings unless you want to, as opposed to the guys.

From my understanding (based on my friends' experiences and asking my dates), decently attractive women are usually bombarded with so many messages that they actively ignore most of them. Whether or not you establish a connection with a woman is simply by chance.

My experience with online dating has not been so great; I get plenty of dates out of it, but nothing that lasts. If anything, online dating should be a complement -- and not a replacement -- to your existing social life.



Oh, and H.Protagonist: if you are thinking of doing online dating, it really helps to not put up a profile pic. Most women I've talked to said that it was really helpful in keeping the creepy messages away.

 

[Zoe]

I'm sure part of it is how competitive Austin must be, and I don't have a fauxhawk or two sizes too small Affliction t-shirt to make the ladies swoon ;b.

Stick to north or west Austin. We're more normal when you're forced to own a car

 

[H.Protagonist]

Nothing so far, have only used OKCupid and only started recently. I was supposed to have a date tonight actually, but she never confirmed the time of the meetup so that seems to be off the table (she rescheduled prior to this, not going to keep chasing). I've sent maybe ~20 messages, personalized and personable, to various high match percentage girls in the last month with something like four of them responding. I'm sure part of it is how competitive Austin must be, and I don't have a fauxhawk or two sizes too small Affliction t-shirt to make the ladies swoon ;b.

As a woman you'll get 10+ messages a day from what I understand, most of them crap like Devo's getting, either casual encounter requests or aspy basement dwellers writing you crowns of sonnets, and you'll need to weed through those to find the vaguely well-adjusted types. You'll be able to sit back and relax and just look through your messages, though, and won't have to actively search through profile listings unless you want to, as opposed to the guys.

Sounds like the whole process takes a fair bit of sifting and a sense of humor, but it's reassuring to know that normal/cool people use these things too. My sister was convinced that only those who want sex or potential killers use matching sites, but I don't think those same motivations are that far removed from say, guys you meet at a bar. At any rate, I like the idea of meeting gentlemen based on our matched interests/outlook much better than calling a number off a beer-soaked napkin and hoping for the best.

As for your own scene, Austin sounds like it might be a bit of dry town in that respect. :/ Heck, every time I've been to Texas, be it Austin, Dallas or SA, the guy/girl ratio has been way off (but this may just be the night crowd). And, personally, I think it speaks in your favor to not have said fauxhawk and/or skin-tight t-shirt. Your awesome peacoat is far superior.

From my understanding (based on my friends' experiences and asking my dates), decently attractive women are usually bombarded with so many messages that they actively ignore most of them. Whether or not you establish a connection with a woman is simply by chance.

My experience with online dating has not been so great; I get plenty of dates out of it, but nothing that lasts. If anything, online dating should be a complement -- and not a replacement -- to your existing social life.

Oh, and H.Protagonist: if you are thinking of doing online dating, it really helps to not put up a profile pic. Most women I've talked to said that it was really helpful in keeping the creepy messages away.

Really? I mean, I get that creepy messages are probably going to happen (that's what the ignore/delete button is for), but it seems disingenuous to not at least put yourself out there if the guys have to do it.

 

[keeblerdrow]

I've had a lot of success with OKCupid in finding real and lasting relationships. I'm coming up on 2 years with my girlfriend and we messaged and met her first week on the site. From talking with the girls I've met off there, there's a pattern that exists for new women on the site. First, it doesn't matter if you advertise that you're single or you're taken, you're going to get messages anyway, so it's best just to be honest about it. Second, you're going to go through a month-long period when you first get on there of the hookup people bombarding you. Take this period to get some good laughs and occasionally sort through them to see if a genuinely nice guy has decided to message you somewhere in there as well. After that first month, you'll still get the hilariously bad messages, but typically they'll be from newer assholes or the people that message literally anyone who has updated their profile in the last day and isn't a hairy troll.

Match and eHarmony are not worth the money. OkCupid wrote a great article on why you should never pay for online dating... but then it was taken down when match.com bought them. Why You Should Never Pay For Online Dating Everything they say there is true. Almost all of the people you see on pay sites are either not there to begin with or cannot message you back because they aren't paying for this either.

Your experience with OKC is going to largely depend on your area. I've heard of vastly different experiences from people in different parts of the country. Where I'm from, you can get a date. You can enjoy your time with the people you meet there. Hell, you can get a significant other off there. All pretty easily if you just have an open mind about it.

Fun anecdote: I made a few friend on OKC over the course of my time on there so since I started my last relationship, I switched to "Seeing Someone" and I've been using the site to try and find friends or people with similar interests in my area. That means I turned on the option to have both guys and girls pop up in my feeds on my homepage. Since then, I've felt at least a portion of the girls' pains on the site. There's this one guy that no matter how many times his profile has been banned, he's right back on the next week with his pictures of his penis outlined on his ultra-tight underwear briefs. It's gross but I have to admire his tenacity. And I've also never seen so many pictures of guys with their shirts off collected in one place.

 

[tuna on toast]

I don't have a fauxhawk or two sizes too small Affliction t-shirt to make the ladies swoon ;b.

You do now, bro! Pussy magnet, baby!!!!!

(Am I banned now?)

 

[Devolution]

Oh, and H.Protagonist: if you are thinking of doing online dating, it really helps to not put up a profile pic. Most women I've talked to said that it was really helpful in keeping the creepy messages away.

Creepers gonna creep. Seems kind of silly though to go without pics.

 

[Lissar]

I don't think I could do online dating actually. The pressure of meeting all these new people with "expectations" would get to me I think. Much prefer the natural evolution of friendships to something more.

 

[Dice]

Natural evolution to something more? I guess I can see how some women could maintain that illusion in their minds.

 

[Lissar]

Natural evolution to something more? I guess I can see how some women could maintain that illusion in their minds.

What, because men start out wanting you from the beginning? I'm not going to say that's not true in a lot of cases, or that it hasn't been true in all of my relationships, what I'm saying is there was never any pressure that I might be expected to make it into that sort of relationship from the start. Online dating seems very aware that that is what both parties are after from the beginning, and it is too much pressure for me.

 

[Dice]

Pretty much. It seems to be the unanimous report of men that having the perspective or intention of friendship at the beginning guarantees that it will amount to nothing more than friendship. Successful initiation of romance requires focus and intention from the very start, even if that isn't how you play it. Yet with your elaboration I feel like we aren't disagreeing, just that you're describing the lovely social facade explained here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-son3EJTrU

 

[Inanna]

Natural evolution to something more? I guess I can see how some women could maintain that illusion in their minds.

Well, all my relationships started that way. Become friends first than move onto the "I like you more than a friend" phase and than the dating phase. I don't think I could go straight into dating myself, either.

 

[H.Protagonist]

Pretty much. It seems to be the unanimous report of men that having the perspective or intention of friendship at the beginning guarantees that it will amount to nothing more than friendship. Successful initiation of romance requires focus and intention from the very start, even if that isn't how you play it. Yet with your elaboration I feel like we aren't disagreeing, just that you're describing the lovely social facade explained here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-son3EJTrU

So men never actually initiate 'friendship' because they want to be just friends (they want sex/relationship) or is this just in the case of guys who want a relationship that are failed to never have one if they start with 'friendship'?

 

[Professor Beef]

I don't think I could do online dating actually. The pressure of meeting all these new people with "expectations" would get to me I think. Much prefer the natural evolution of friendships to something more.

It can work (it worked for me, kinda), but I can also see the advantages of knowing a friend first.

 

[Lissar]

So men never actually initiate 'friendship' because they want to be just friends (they want sex/relationship) or is this just in the case of guys who want a relationship that are failed to never have one if they start with 'friendship'?

I've definitely had guy friends who were just friends (on their part I should say.) Since with a few of them I liked them more than a friend, but they weren't into me that way. After I got turned down I couldn't see them in that way at all!

And I've had friends where we both had no interest one way or the other. It's nice.

 

[Dice]

So men never actually initiate 'friendship' because they want to be just friends (they want sex/relationship) or is this just in the case of guys who want a relationship that are failed to never have one if they start with 'friendship'?

My meaning was the latter, that if they decide they are interested after things are already established in pure friendship, nothing more will come of it. And to be clear, I carefully chose those words "unanimous report of men" because I clearly don't have objective knowledge on how every relationship in the world has developed from the perspective of both parties, so I'm making no such claim. All I am saying is that the only times I have heard someone say it is possible and happened for them was from women. Every single guy I know has said the contrary, and that is enough evidence for me to assume that the statistics are so wildly out of men's favor in the issue that intentionality is the only sensible approach.

 

[SRG01]

My meaning was the latter, that if they decide they are interested after things are already established in pure friendship, nothing more will come of it. And to be clear, I carefully chose those words "unanimous report of men" because I clearly don't have objective knowledge on how every relationship in the world has developed from the perspective of both parties, so I'm making no such claim. All I am saying is that the only times I have heard someone say it is possible and happened for them was from women. Every single guy I know has said the contrary, and that is enough evidence for me to assume that the statistics are so wildly out of men's favor in the issue that intentionality is the only sensible approach.

I am a guy, and I have to say that I have witnessed many many many relationships flourish from very innocent friendships. I think it's a very common crutch to refer to ladder theory or something similar, but it's very inapplicable to the real world.

As humans, both genders will experience many things, including changes to their feelings and behavior. What's key to everything is for both to have genuine interactions with others. Ulterior motives (ie. wanting her in secret) make for very poor friendships -- or relationships (ie. pity dates) for that matter!

Really? I mean, I get that creepy messages are probably going to happen (that's what the ignore/delete button is for), but it seems disingenuous to not at least put yourself out there if the guys have to do it.

Creepers gonna creep. Seems kind of silly though to go without pics.

Well, it's certainly effective in cutting down the sheer volume of messages -- one girl once told me she was getting at least 10-20 (unsolicited messages) a day. And most guys don't bother to read profiles. Having no profile photo increases the chance of a guy actually reading your profile and showing some interest. Not guaranteed, of course, but it works from what I've heard.

Plus, it creates a better overall experience for the women involved.

 

[Lissar]

I am a guy, and I have to say that I have witnessed many many many relationships flourish from very innocent friendships. I think it's a very common crutch to refer to ladder theory or something similar, but it's very inapplicable to the real world.

As humans, both genders will experience many things, including changes to their feelings and behavior. What's key to everything is for both to have genuine interactions with others. Ulterior motives (ie. wanting her in secret) make for very poor friendships -- or relationships (ie. pity dates) for that matter!

Let's not talk about that again! D:

 

[Dice]

As humans, both genders will experience many things, including changes to their feelings and behavior. What's key to everything is for both to have genuine interactions with others. Ulterior motives (ie. wanting her in secret) make for very poor friendships -- or relationships (ie. pity dates) for that matter!

I agree with this, which is why I think being forthright is the best. Most people avoid it to avoid awkwardness, but I don't see how that needs to pop up unless someone is assuming something or being a jerk. If you like someone, what does that mean? It means you enjoy their company. That's a compliment. It doesn't necessarily mean that all required to be interested is there. Yet if one is interested, why should that add pressure? Is the interested party impressing their will on the other? That's inappropriate and also ridiculous because you should only desire that the other person freely choose you of their own accord. Still, the interest is a separate thing from that inappropriate attitude/demeanor and by no means requires that they act like that.

Of course, even aside from all this, I suppose some people interpret unfamiliarity differently. "Trying out" different ways of relating can be awkward if it's too fast or you don't have good chemistry, but some people find it more thrilling than awkward or just count awkwardness as a part of life that comes with anything new, not a big deal. Even openly acknowledging that something was awkward can be endearing and a source of bonding. Much of the concerns that hinder romance are worries that the other person will think something means more than it does. That is solved by honesty. They could also be worried about hurting the other, yet that almost always comes from lack of information regarding how the other person interpreted things.

If both parties are honest and communicative and don't assume themselves upon the other, it can be a free situation where the offer to experiment and discover just how well you can get along is out there. If that offer is taken up, it's not a contract, it's a journey of discovery. If real bonds are made and/or exclusivity becomes desired, those can be communicated along the way. Having music theory explained to you doesn't make music less beautiful, and in the same way having open communication doesn't kill romance.

Still, I suppose most are more comfortable with dancing around desire and intentions in ambiguity and trying to treat romance like a happy accident. I don't mean to insult anyone by this, but my conviction anymore is that such relational dynamics are immaturity. Too bad most only break out of it by being embittered. Jaded hearts aren't the most fun to openly share with.

 

[scitek]

Ha, I'm done forever with this kinda stuff. I'm the worst.

 

[bluemax]

I don't think I could do online dating actually. The pressure of meeting all these new people with "expectations" would get to me I think. Much prefer the natural evolution of friendships to something more.

If you live in a city as big as Los Angeles this sort of thing is nigh on impossible once you're out of college.

 

[scitek]

If you live in a city as big as Los Angeles this sort of thing is nigh on impossible once you're out of college.

Yup. I'm practically a recluse in the shitty hick town I live in. I swear there's not a woman here 25 or older without at least one kid. Kids immediately mean "off-limits" to me. I doubt you'll find another gaffer in my age range that's been single as long as I have.

 

[H.Protagonist]

My meaning was the latter, that if they decide they are interested after things are already established in pure friendship, nothing more will come of it. And to be clear, I carefully chose those words "unanimous report of men" because I clearly don't have objective knowledge on how every relationship in the world has developed from the perspective of both parties, so I'm making no such claim. All I am saying is that the only times I have heard someone say it is possible and happened for them was from women. Every single guy I know has said the contrary, and that is enough evidence for me to assume that the statistics are so wildly out of men's favor in the issue that intentionality is the only sensible approach.

I imagined so, but wanted to check because I often hear the former from guys, and I find it a bit depressing/(hopefully) false. I also have to agree with you on the 'friends first' approach not working as it has never, in my experience, led to more. My male friendships are something I really hold onto because I don't find I have much in common with other girls, and I don't want them spoiled by 'romance' that leads to weirdness later on.

I am a guy, and I have to say that I have witnessed many many many relationships flourish from very innocent friendships. I think it's a very common crutch to refer to ladder theory or something similar, but it's very inapplicable to the real world.

As humans, both genders will experience many things, including changes to their feelings and behavior. What's key to everything is for both to have genuine interactions with others. Ulterior motives (ie. wanting her in secret) make for very poor friendships -- or relationships (ie. pity dates) for that matter!





Well, it's certainly effective in cutting down the sheer volume of messages -- one girl once told me she was getting at least 10-20 (unsolicited messages) a day. And most guys don't bother to read profiles. Having no profile photo increases the chance of a guy actually reading your profile and showing some interest. Not guaranteed, of course, but it works from what I've heard.

Plus, it creates a better overall experience for the women involved.

It can spring from just friendship, but that seems like the most circuitous route which tends to end more often in the guy watching helplessly as the girl falls for another. There's also the added rub that she won't want to give up her 'safe' male friend either. I'm not saying friendship is the worst approach ever, but being direct gets more results and less confusion.

As for the profile picture thing, I like the idea, but I also think not many guys will respond to a faceless girl messaging them regardless of how many interests they have in common.

Ha, I'm done forever with this kinda stuff. I'm the worst.

What kind of stuff? Match sites?

 

[Stet]

Yup. I'm practically a recluse in the shitty hick town I live in. I swear there's not a woman here 25 or older without at least one kid. Kids immediately mean "off-limits" to me. I doubt you'll find another gaffer in my age range that's been single as long as I have.

Not many as deserving of it either.

 

[scitek]

Not many as deserving of it either.

So glad you know me enough to make that call. Is it because I won't hook up with a woman with a kid? FYI, it's not because I don't like kids, or think any less of a woman with one, but because I'm in absolutely no position financially or even mature enough to take on that kind of that responsibility.

What kind of stuff? Match sites?

Anything, really.

 

[Devolution]

Protag/Scitek can we not discuss this in here. I hope I'm not the only one uncomfortable with discussing a GAFfers hard up luck with our gender, letting this become yet another "why can't I get with the wimmenz" thread. Can the discussion move to LadyGAF or something?

 

[Kisaya]

Protag/Scitek can we not discuss this in here. I hope I'm not the only one uncomfortable with discussing a GAFfers hard up luck with our gender, letting this become yet another "why can't I get with the wimmenz" thread. Can the discussion move to LadyGAF or something?

Yupp I agree. Out to LadyGAF please~ Or girlage. Not here

 

[H.Protagonist]

So glad you know me enough to make that call. Is it because I won't hook up with a woman with a kid? FYI, it's not because I don't like kids, or think any less of a woman with one, but because I'm in absolutely no position financially or even mature enough to take on that kind of that responsibility.



Anything, really.

I'm pretty sure Stet was just employing his usual trenchant sense of humor (unless you two have some kind of history?). ^_^

As for dating life, we all have dry spells. Maybe you need to get out of your town? Try something/somewhere new?

EDIT: Best to take this to Lady Gaf Advises Man Gaf.

Protag/Scitek can we not discuss this in here. I hope I'm not the only one uncomfortable with discussing a GAFfers hard up luck with our gender, letting this become yet another "why can't I get with the wimmenz" thread. Can the discussion move to LadyGAF or something?

Yupp I agree. Out to LadyGAF please~ Or girlage. Not here

Sorry. This had stemmed from your own comments about dating sites, Devo. Sorry it got off topic.

 

[Devolution]

Sorry. This had stemmed from your own comments about dating sites, Devo. Sorry it got off topic.

Discussion is cool, I just feel like the thread doesn't need to turn into some dude's girlage is all.

 

[H.Protagonist]

Discussion is cool, I just feel like the thread doesn't need to turn into some dude's girlage is all.

Fair point.

 

[scitek]

Protag/Scitek can we not discuss this in here. I hope I'm not the only one uncomfortable with discussing a GAFfers hard up luck with our gender, letting this become yet another "why can't I get with the wimmenz" thread. Can the discussion move to LadyGAF or something?

Absolutely.

On-topic, I totally get the appeal of dating sites, but have never tried one. I've been on a couple of blind dates, though. Those are odd.

Discussion is cool, I just feel like the thread doesn't need to turn into some dude's girlage is all.

It wasn't ever going to turn into that. All I was saying is it's tough in big cities to meet anyone once done with school, or really any place where you aren't regularly meeting new people, but it also applies to smaller communities where there's literally no one around that appeals to you.

 

[noah111]

Anything, really.

I know they look the same, but they are indeed different.

 

[scitek]

I know they look the same, but they are indeed different.

Drop it.

EDIT: And H. Protagonist asked a question, I was just answering it.

EDIT2: Wait, Girl-age got moved to Community, too?

EDIT3: Wait, the Sonic Generations thread got moved to Community, too?

 

[PhoenixDark]

Hi, Girls (and guys) who play games. I'm TheyTookOurJobs, aka Beefy Hits aka Greg.

Let me introduce myself. I'm a 35 year old gamer who loves games traditionally loved by women. RPGs, Puzzle, platform, and old school games are my passion. I also love to play Rock Band 3, as well as Dragon Quest.

Right now, my current gaming poisons are my 3DS (I carry it with me everywhere love those virtual console games and Mario Kart) along with Fortune Street, and Zelda Skyward Sword. I'm also a big pinball nerd, participating in local, REAL tournaments all the time and playing Pinball FX 2 and Pinball Hall of Fame: The Williams Collection. I'm really stoked for the Pinball Arcade in March. I also play Cooking Mama lol

I'm currently unemployed, but am keeping busy by doing collages, playing games, taking care of my Mom who got cancer a year ago, and renovating the basement of my new house I purchased in Minneapolis in June. The goal is to have 3 TVs downstairs so I can have gamer parties and people over to play systems from the NES-Wii. Newer systems will be upstairs in the living room. I'm also shooting for having a Neo Geo 4 or 6 slot in the basement as well as a Terminator 2 and Johnny Pneumonic pinball machine in my basement.

Feel free to add me on the various systems if you want. please leave a message saying you're from NeoGAF

Xbox Live Beefy Hits - . My friends list is full I've gotta prune it lol
PSN - Beefy_Hits
Wii - Please PM me if you're interested in adding me and we'll exchange friend codes. I'd really like to play Fortune Street with people.
3DS - Again, please PM me
Apple iPod/iPhone iOS - Beefy Hits

hi greg

Do you have any pics of yourself?

 

[SRG01]

hi greg

Do you have any pics of yourself?

Dammit, stop shitting up the thread already.

 

[jaxword]

Spoiler

personaly i think it miss a shirt ... but the rest ...

You shouldn't do this, male or female. Sitting on your foot like that is bad for the spine and also the knee. You should get a proper long chair and sit with feet on the ground, and avoid hunching.

 

[Inanna]

I don't get people who say that girls and guys are EXTREMELY different, like they are polar opposites of each other and that they would NEVER EVER get along with one gender as opposed to other. I hear so many people say that they would never be friends with other women/men because they are polar opposites or don't share same interests and I find it really weird because imo no one person is the same no matter what gender they are. People wouldn't have the same interests depending on gender.

So what I am trying to say is that people who dismiss the entire gender based on the preconception that women and men are supposed to be polar opposites and should have completely different interests are, in most cases, wrong. I've heard some girls say such nasty things about their own gender and generalize like nobody's business. I am quite skeptical of females who cant get along with other women, a huge character red flag for me.

 

[Devolution]

I don't get people who say that girls and guys are EXTREMELY different, like they are polar opposites of each other and that they would NEVER EVER get along with one gender as opposed to other. I hear so many people say that they would never be friends with other women/men because they are polar opposites or don't share same interests and I find it really weird because imo no one person is the same no matter what gender they are. People wouldn't have the same interests depending on gender.

So what I am trying to say is that people who dismiss the entire gender based on the preconception that women and men are supposed to be polar opposites and should have completely different interests are, in most cases, wrong. I've heard some girls say such nasty things about their own gender and generalize like nobody's business. I am quite skeptical of females who cant get along with other women, a huge character red flag for me.

Pretty much agreed. I also don't like when someone thinks a woman or man has to be extremely masculine or feminine because their insecure in their own identity. I've run into women who are insecure if a guy isn't a dudebro and I've run into men who are insecure if a woman doesn't ascribe to feminine tropes.

 

[Inanna]

Pretty much agreed. I also don't like when someone thinks a woman or man has to be extremely masculine or feminine because their insecure in their own identity. I've run into women who are insecure if a guy isn't a dudebro and I've run into men who are insecure if a woman doesn't ascribe to feminine tropes.

I have known girls who dislike men that are sensitive and in touch with their feelings and they view that as a sign of weakness, I guess. They go for the more "Dudebro" type. People don't really dislike girls that are tomboys as much though. Our society judges men more for showing their feelings and whatnot than women who are, essentially, tomboys.

 

[Devolution]

I have known girls who dislike men that are sensitive and in touch with their feelings and they view that as a sign of weakness, I guess. They go for the more "Dudebro" type. People don't really dislike girls that are tomboys as much though. Our society judges men more for showing their feelings and whatnot than women who are, essentially, tomboys.

Yeah, but there are still those who are intimidated by tomboys.

 

[CleverGirl]

Yeah, but there are still those who are intimidated by tomboys.

I think there is a perception, by some girls, that tomboys are being sneaky somehow. There is a feeling that, to a degree at least, those girls are faking their interest in the more boyish activities so that they can get close to guys.

 

[Professor Beef]

I think there is a perception, by some girls, that tomboys are being sneaky somehow. There is a feeling that, to a degree at least, those girls are faking their interest in the more boyish activities so that they can get close to guys.

It's still preferable to the cliche "LOOK AT ME I'M A GIRL GAMER" personality.

 

[Dice]

A tomgirl can easily find plenty of people who are totally cool with whatever. Will there be some negative response? Sure, and especially in romance probably a sizable demographic that would be completely turned off. Now, a guy who likes, say... doing this is going to have trouble. He may get flak from family, friends, random people, turnoff girls, and have a really hard time finding someone IRL to share his interests with if he's not in a big city (he moved to NYC). That may partly be from much of what he does being specifically intended for girls, but honestly don't think it would change much if he only covered male dances. It's artistic, expressive, emotional... but why? Not anger, not angst, not competition, not heartache, but simply feeling just to feel.

Yeah, apparently that's not something guys are suppose to do. I say this as a guy wold could easily enjoy it the same, but doesn't do what he does. I'm sure part of that is from the aforementioned negative responses, but another side is that it doesn't call to me strongly enough to learn dance on my own. Okay, so how about with someone? There isn't a social outlet for this near me because society frowns on this and I'm in a small town. Thus, dance is out and I focus on music in general; far more socially acceptable, yet even with that apparently there is some music guys aren't supposed to like or perform. It's ridiculous, and I wonder how many other dudes in town are, as I am, just ignoring stuff they like.

And that is my post for girly-age to ponder.

 

[Moobabe]

A tomgirl can easily find plenty of people who are totally cool with whatever. Will there be some negative response? Sure, and especially in romance probably a sizable demographic that would be completely turned off. Now, a guy who likes, say... doing this is going to have trouble. He may get flak from family, friends, random people, turnoff girls, and have a really hard time finding someone IRL to share his interests with if he's not in a big city (he moved to NYC). That may partly be from much of what he does being specifically intended for girls, but honestly don't think it would change much if he only covered male dances. It's artistic, expressive, emotional... but why? Not anger, not angst, not competition, not heartache, but simply feeling just to feel.

Yeah, apparently that's not something guys are suppose to do. I say this as a guy wold could easily enjoy it the same, but doesn't do what he does. I'm sure part of that is from the aforementioned negative responses, but another side is that it doesn't call to me strongly enough to learn dance on my own. Okay, so how about with someone? There isn't a social outlet for this near me because society frowns on this and I'm in a small town. Thus, dance is out and I focus on music in general; far more socially acceptable, yet even with that apparently there is some music guys aren't supposed to like or perform. It's ridiculous, and I wonder how many other dudes in town are, as I am, just ignoring stuff they like.

And that is my post for girly-age to ponder.

There is a lot of negative responses - I've had so many looks and comments since I started dancing. Questions of manliness, I need to be "manlier" apparently, but the one that grates the most is "you're gay" "you look gay" etc Dance is a female dominated practice, certainly, but I'm not ashamed of it. I dance because I enjoy it, it keeps me fit and dancing is BADASS.

I know this isn't the Dance |OT| but just go for it - even if you're scared to go alone, I did, I had never danced before and I just rocked up and one year later I've joined a company , done performances in front of hundreds of people and did a flashmob. If for no other reason; do it so if I do make a Dance |OT| I have someone else to talk to...

 

[Prax]

I don't get people who say that girls and guys are EXTREMELY different, like they are polar opposites of each other and that they would NEVER EVER get along with one gender as opposed to other. I hear so many people say that they would never be friends with other women/men because they are polar opposites or don't share same interests and I find it really weird because imo no one person is the same no matter what gender they are. People wouldn't have the same interests depending on gender.

So what I am trying to say is that people who dismiss the entire gender based on the preconception that women and men are supposed to be polar opposites and should have completely different interests are, in most cases, wrong. I've heard some girls say such nasty things about their own gender and generalize like nobody's business. I am quite skeptical of females who cant get along with other women, a huge character red flag for me.

Totally agree with you. But on the other hand, I have a few really close friends that have the "hates-most-other-girls" character flaw. I think it's mainly because they are socially anxious and generalize that other girls overly judgemental though. True that girls can be pretty tough to one another, but I don't feel it's really something bound to gender. Guys are just as judgey. Just maybe in a different way due to socialization, but you see all the dudebro posturing and wang-wagging and it's similar enough (plus add in the generally higher level of physical violence).

A tomgirl can easily find plenty of people who are totally cool with whatever. Will there be some negative response? Sure, and especially in romance probably a sizable demographic that would be completely turned off. Now, a guy who likes, say... doing this is going to have trouble. He may get flak from family, friends, random people, turnoff girls, and have a really hard time finding someone IRL to share his interests with if he's not in a big city (he moved to NYC). That may partly be from much of what he does being specifically intended for girls, but honestly don't think it would change much if he only covered male dances. It's artistic, expressive, emotional... but why? Not anger, not angst, not competition, not heartache, but simply feeling just to feel.

Yeah, apparently that's not something guys are suppose to do. I say this as a guy wold could easily enjoy it the same, but doesn't do what he does. I'm sure part of that is from the aforementioned negative responses, but another side is that it doesn't call to me strongly enough to learn dance on my own. Okay, so how about with someone? There isn't a social outlet for this near me because society frowns on this and I'm in a small town. Thus, dance is out and I focus on music in general; far more socially acceptable, yet even with that apparently there is some music guys aren't supposed to like or perform. It's ridiculous, and I wonder how many other dudes in town are, as I am, just ignoring stuff they like.

And that is my post for girly-age to ponder.

Ah yes. It's sad. I want for guys to also just enjoy what they like! It's just like in the LadyGAF advice thread, where I was surprised SO MANY responses from guys were that they couldn't fathom the thought of dancing because it was "for girls" or seen as too flamboyant or gay and they wouldn't want to "look like a fool". There's a high level of insecurity for both genders, but males seem to be more afraid of coming off as weak, while girls are more afraid of not being accepted by their in-group. Or so is my opinion!

 

[Devolution]

I think there is a perception, by some girls, that tomboys are being sneaky somehow. There is a feeling that, to a degree at least, those girls are faking their interest in the more boyish activities so that they can get close to guys.

Maybe. But I've definitely felt the sting of both genders having issues with my tomboyishness. The issues with my own gender were mostly in grade school. The issues with boys came after grade school, there was definitely an intimidation factor, and some of them never told me their feelings till later. I know for a fact I definitely put some men off when I cut the hair short.

 

[CleverGirl]

Maybe. But I've definitely felt the sting of both genders having issues with my tomboyishness. The issues with my own gender were mostly in grade school. The issues with boys came after grade school, there was definitely an intimidation factor, and some of them never told me their feelings till later. I know for a fact I definitely put some men off when I cut the hair short.

Ah yes, the hair. My grandmother has always nagged my sisters and I to keep our hair long, even though I don't have the hair for it. The reason? "Men prefer longer hair" she told me.